The Godfather of the #Seahawks beat sits down with Jacson and Mike to break down what Mike Macdonald’s impact on #Seattle’s future is (8:03), forecast who their offensive coordinator might be (28:23), and chop up the #SuperBowl matchup between the #Chiefs and #49ers (54:10).
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The Super Bowl is just days away as the Chiefs look to defend their title against the 49ers meanwhile Seattle’s first new head coach in 14 years is preparing to build out the rest of his staff esteemed beat reporter Bob Koda joins us to preview the big game and
Lend his insight into the new era of Seahawks football let’s light him [Applause] Up I’m Jackson bevans and this is cigar thoughts welcome back to the Cigar Lounge I am Jackson bans and along with my vascular Producer Mike barwin this is the cigar thoughts podcast Mike how we doing today doing great man doing great man it’s Super Bowl week we’re drinking
The haterade we’re ready for an awesome unbelievable match up and the Seahawks are filling out their first completely top down new coaching staff in 14 years so lot going on how are you my friend ah I’m doing great man it’s exciting times as a football fan it’s exciting times as
A Seahawks fan and I cannot wait to talk more about it with Bob but first if you’re listening or watching us right now it’s hopefully because you like the show and if you like the show there are a few ways you can support it if you’re on Apple podcast or Spotify take a
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Nfl.com now you know last week Mike you and I got to react on the show shortly after the news of Mike McDonald’s hiring broke and it ended up being one of our most watched episodes the feedback was great and I really enjoyed getting your thoughts on the matter but we were
Missing a key ingredient and that was the perspective of someone from inside the building today we Rectify that situation as we welcome The Godfather of the Seahawks Beach he is one of the most prolific reporters in the sport with his name appearing in hundreds of by lines per year for the
Seattle Times he is Bob Koda Bob thanks for coming in sure yeah how you guys doing we’re great man better now that you’re here how’s uh how’s the last week been for you yeah I mean the whole last month really was kind of crazy with uh um you know really starting the last
That last Sunday I mean I can’t say any of us knew for sure that was going to be Pete on the way out but there was you definitely knew that it was a a better than zero chance down in Arizona that when they didn’t make the playoffs that
Something might happen and uh you know so from that point until I guess Thursday when they introduced Mike Mike McDonald you know it’s just kind of been um your life’s on hold a little bit the whole time because you’re waiting first to see what see what they’re going to do
With Pete and then when they do that then you’re waiting to see who they’re going to hire and obviously the NFL rules um made it um you know I i’ never covered an NFL head coaching change before because Pete so long and you know if you cover Jacksonville or something
This is like something you do every year but uh Jaguars C start the show try to think yeah Carolina I guess Carolina has been doing these left and right um but uh I but I covered University of Washington for a long time but during that time they did but those
A lot of times College searches like theirs this year took what about about 12 minutes from when dor left to when they hired uh uh you know you can do that in college and you’re sort of you sort of need to because of recruiting but the NFL it’s a little different you
Don’t necessarily have to rush your coach higher and the NFL doesn’t want you to so yeah I was kind of a kind of a a long month there um just kind of looking at your phone constantly to see what’s going on yeah yeah you know uh I
Actually do want to rewind a month to to New Year’s Eve when the Seahawks I don’t know how else to put it certainly on defense just got embarrassed by the Steelers with a playoff birth essentially on the line and I think for Mike and I that’s when our antenna
Started go up that you know maybe it’s not going to be Pete’s call about his future because I’ve long operated under the assumption that you know Carol’s going to coach in Seattle for as long as he wants to and and that clearly wasn’t the case you mentioned that you know
After that Arizona game you started to kind of wonder what gave you that sense is it just hey they missed the playoff so he’s vulnerable or was there something else that you were picking up on well no I agree with you about the Pittsburgh game I mean the Pittsburgh game I thought
Changed I mean I don’t know if anybody would ever say that quite that L but I thought the Pittsburgh game changed a lot because up until that point you know you could you could excuse a lot of you know they’re not better than the 49ers and and Baltimore and stuff like that
Some of those other losses you could sort of excuse a little bit um but you know when they won those back-to-back games against Philly and in Tennessee and I thought man if they get to 10 wins and they make the playoffs you know that’s that you can’t really argue that
So yeah the Pittsburgh loss so I I am kind of meaning more that I guess but just but just definitely at Arizona you know there was just sort of that you know he’ll if you’re going to make a change um you know this might be a time
That it makes sense to do it and is everybody getting a little bit Restless here that they seem to they seem to have plateaued this year as opposed to last year they didn’t take that step forward so it was more just that um um they basically lost that Arizona game so by
All intents and PR no for sure yeah yeah they didn’t play better yeah no that’s that’s a really fair point that in a game they they you know I mean I think they felt I think everybody was feeling fairly ominous about that like the be you know the Packers aren’t losing but
But still uh you know the Seahawks as they all said we got to go take care of our business and they didn’t look like they were doing that for most of that game you’re right and and Arizona Arizona kind of just you know Arizona that I mean that’s what Arizona’s been
Doing a lot the last few years but and then and then you know Matt Prader of all people I mean one of the better kickers in NFL history and that F dual accounts leing soon so for sure I it was it was a weird vibe all the way around you know in the
Cigar smoking thing afterward was just kind of strange too it just um it just felt it just felt it just felt kind of weird there and as everybody pointed out you know we all played the clip of Pete and I think he said for now right when
He was asked how he felt about coming back yeah um you know Pete Pete was always weird about his contractual situation even going back it’s easy to forget the Super Bowl year uh you know he was going into his the next year was going to be his last year and so even
During the when they were winning the Super Bowl it was sort of a tiny bit of an issue because he only had one year on his contract and um even then he was always squirly about talking about it so part of me didn’t know well maybe that’s
Just peteb and Pete or was that really a I don’t know what’s going on but you know when they didn’t schedule their end of the year press conference by Wednesday I think we all sort of knew something was happening and exactly what that something was um we didn’t know for
Sure but uh uh I kicked myself a tiny bit I should have written a story for that Wednesday maybe saying that but it’s still hard to know I you know I maybe they didn’t schedule the press conference because Pete had to have go to the dentist or something so you never
Knew for sure but but I I will say my own antenna yeah that Tuesday night when they didn’t when we didn’t get a yeah we’re going to talk to Pete tomorrow kind of thing because you know how you know how it always was with Pete they’d
Have the the meetings and then he would head head to Hawaii and you know and he would always talk about during the press conference like you guys got like 10 more minutes and in six weeks or whenever the combine rolls around and you know it just felt different this
Year totally totally well you know I I want to transition to the lead story here you know Mike McDonald’s taken over for Pete carrols the head coach of the Seahawks this was to the Delight of most Seahawks fans but what was your initial reaction when you heard the news and how
Surprised were you that it ended up being Mike MCD well it’s another thing that I wasn’t nois at all by the time it happened I wasn’t surprised just because of the the the route that it all took and that they were waiting and you know
If it was going to be Dan Quinn it could have been Dan Quinn you know two weeks earlier or whatever so you know once it kind of wasn’t that and you knew they were really casting a broad net um you know you got the feeling much more that
You know maybe that was part of the thing here was to um really take a shot on kind of a you know a younger not unknown but certainly unproven from a head coaching standpoint you know you never know for sure what you’re going to get in a coach that that U um hasn’t
Coached and so we still don’t know but I think that I I think maybe they felt like that was the time to do something like that you know maybe you really do get the next you know that obviously defensive guy so the comparison isn’t exactly exactly the same but you know
The next Sonic V or Kyle Shanahan or whatever that that guy who just sort of the the prod the the young Prodigy who can uh who can completely remake one side of the ball and um you know so the longer it took the the the less surprised I was by by that standpoint
But yeah I I can’t say on the day it happened that I thought it was going to be him although we did include him I think you you know Five Guys that could be kind of thing or whatever I mean his name was kind of out there the whole time
Obviously sure sure and this is not uh hold your feet to the fire question here but you know did you get the sense that it was McDonald the whole time as like this is our number one with the bullet or is it like either him or Ben Johnson
CU he was kind of the other one that teams were waiting on and they kept winning and so everybody else was kind of filling out their spot and this is something we talked about last week week I think one of the benefits uh to Seattle when it came to this coaching
Search is most teams that are looking for a new head coach don’t have a general manager that’s been in place for 14 years and as a result these other teams are having to figure out okay how are we going to approach free agency how are we going to approach the draft we
Got to get the staff in place so that we can put together a game plan whereas nothing about this process is going to be new for Seattle even with the new head coach outside of you know maybe different priorities in terms of what type of players that are bringing
Brought in so they they had the luxury of being able to wait much like the Colts did you know I was always really impressed by how the Colts approach it last year they were willing to wait for Shane Sten did you get the sense that it
Was Mike McDonald the whole way or was there a sense that you know what maybe it’s Ben Johnson or someone else that we’re waiting for too yeah well to your point you’re exactly right and that’s where the comparison between like the NFL and college and you had Jon and the
Personnel team they’re they’re there the whole time so they’re doing all that they’re doing all their you know they had guys down at the Senior Bowl while while all this was going on you know who are doing the regular work that needs to be done this time of year which is the
Kind of work that uh Pete Carroll wasn’t you know the the head coaches don’t necessarily always do that or whatever so um but you know they had other people that were there to do that so you’re right they had that luxury of time um you know it’s interesting there were
There were the eight jobs but then you know two went immediately you know I mean the Raiders and Patriots just hired in house and you know I I think John read that part of it quickly that um you know who is like just kind of like your
Draft board of who are these other teams going to hire and once you realize you know we can tell all these that some of these other teams are going to hire this other guy that we’re not going to hire anyway and so that’s when it does come
It’s the two or three of us that are left hiring the the same going after the same two or three I sort of felt going into that last week that Dan Quinn was just sort of I don’t mean this to sound the way it might sound but he was sort
Of the whole car the guy you knew I think you could get the whole time so like the worst you were going to to do was Dan Quinn and that’s where you waited um with Ben Johnson and Mike McDonald to be able to talk to those
Guys and really give it a fair shot and to look at those guys and you’re taking a little bit of a gamble there with Dan that someone else up up would up and hire him or whatever if that really was your was your thought but I think they
Felt um just kind of reading that between the lines it just sort of felt that way that that was what they I think thought they could always sort of do is fall back to that if everything else sort of fell through so I think they really wanted to take uh have a fair
Look at uh at each of those guys so I I I I you know John it was interesting to me how Frank John Schneider was about saying well we wanted both Detroit and Baltimore to lose so we could go talk to both these guys I think they wanted to
Talk to both of them I think I think uh um you know they hadn’t talked to Mike McDonald yet at all and so I don’t think they probably you know why they wanted both of them to lose is I don’t know that she wanted to hire maybe Ben
Johnson or make a hire without ever being able to talk to Mike McDonald so timore had won um but then same thing um you know they at that point they hadn’t talked to Mike McDonald yet so so you might not want to go the route of um
Being able to finally talk to Mike McDonald but then having to wait two more weeks before you could talk to Ben Johnson um in person if that was what you wanted to do so um I think they I think they were pretty open to to both
Of those guys I mean it sounds like you know by all accounts it happened pretty fast with McDonald after they talked to him but which leads me to believe while it was still kind of open with him that whole time it really wasn’t until they talked to him in Baltimore that I think
They really got to the whole point of yeah you might be the guy we want and vice versa yeah well tell me about now now that he’s been here for going on a week what are your first impressions cuz to me this feels like a Paul Allen
Higher you know when Paul Allen was running the show he wasn’t afraid to take the big swings he went out and he got Mike holgren when he was essentially the Andy Reid of 20 years ago and then he he took the big swing on Pete Caroll
And got the hottest college name uh in the game to come here and I was wondering okay Jody is at the end of the day pulling these strings is she going to take the big swing or you know play it safe Dan Quinn kind of being the
Placeholder for the guy who’s been there done it before is familiar with how Seattle operates all that kind of stuff talk to me about your first impressions the weekend to Mike McDonald being here yeah well what’s interesting obviously I mean if you look back through the entire history of the franchise though they’ve
Always sort of Taken big swings but on sort of proven guys right even go back to Chuck Knox who was like a three-time NFL coach of the year honor and you know Dennis Eric Tom Flores who’d won Super Bowls Dennis Ericson who was coming off a couple of college national titles and
Was a really popular name locally um you know because he was from here and he cach at Washington State and stuff like that and then holgren and then and then Pete um you could hardly have gotten kind of the bigger name more uh of who was logically available at the time they
Made those hires you know those were as big of guys as there was that was available at those times so this is a little different from that standpoint it’s a little bit more of a gamble with the guy who’s never been a head coach before um you know the only guy who’s
Never been a head coach in team history other than you know Jack Peta the first guy they hired sure um but uh yeah he um you know we actually got we got we obviously got the the podium session that all you guys saw and then they
Actually had about a 10 or 15 minute session that was sort of off the Record but where all the beat Riders got to go just talk to him for about 10 10 minutes or so after that um and which was interesting cuz he you know does he have
A good handshake uh yeah he does yeah he does appear to have one although I think he did it right-handed because there’s been all this he signed so I asked him about that and he’s like goofy handed like he does some things left-handed and some things right-handed and he was
Trying to trying to explain it so he’s uh so I think he signed his contract with his left hand and everybody saw that but he throws a football I think with his right hand um and uh but you know uh yeah he struck me as very uh
Kind of self- assured and and um uh you know I think very business-like you know I think that’s one of the things they really like about him is I don’t think there’s any concern at all about uh how what his approach to this job will be and sort of putting in the necessary
Effort and all that kind of stuff you know I think they feel like this is a guy who’s really proven that you know that he’s kind of a coaching lifer and a grinder and all that as a head coach but um but yeah he uh you know when we did
Get a chance to talk to him a little bit uh separately you know he just um he he came off his very sort of down toe is you know and he was just kind of like okay you got you’re the ones I’m going to have to be you know we’re going we’re
Going to be together an awful lot you guys are the ones who are going to be out here every day and and all that and it just it was interesting you know that that uh um just kind of from a few of those interactions with him and and from
Other things you hear about him just uh you know this is a guy I think he was sort of Born to coach and um that’s that’s sort of come through in the really rapid rise he’s he he’s been able to make from you know I mean it’s crazy
That you know basically he’s coaching he’s coaching high school kids on a on a or on a volunteer basis in college and then you know while Pete Carol’s winning the Super Bowl with the Seahawks you know he’s he’s in college himself right at the time and and doing that and and
Uh you know being a graduate assistant at Georgia and everything I mean it’s it’s it’s really happened fast for him so um but uh yeah I you know it’s impossible to really judge much yet from like coaching or how he’s going to interact with players kind of standpoint
Other than what we’ve seen other places but that’s always the you know everybody will tell you that’s the biggest change you make it’s from coordinator to head coach and uh um you know every other step of the way uh the responsibilities change a little bit here and there but
When you go from coordinator coordinator to head coach which is every once in a while someone does it without being a coordinator but typically that’s what you do right and uh you know that that’s that’s the biggest you know kind of Challenge and difference and how you
Approach things that you have to make and that’s still kind of an X Factor where you never know for sure how a guy’s going to do that but certainly just from afar just the way he handles himself um you know again you know he seems like a very organized kind of
Detailed guy which in football is so important um you know he seems to definitely kind of check all the boxes in all those ways yeah you know you you mentioned that initial Podium session he had what stood out to you about his opening press conference cuz from my standpoint it definitely didn’t come
Across as a bunch of canned responses like this is what I’m supposed to say as a first-time head coach it didn’t seem like he played it safe no I would agree with you um yeah I thought some of his answers were were interesting that way
Um you know and in terms of not I I thought one of the things that struck me a little bit was how openminded he seems to be you know a lot of times guys could maybe like this is the scheme I know worked where I was and so that’s this is
Exactly what we’re doing and he was much more of you know you have to tailor the scheme to to your players or you know to to to to your playing each week and all that kind of stuff and I I thought a lot of that was was sort of interesting
Because a lot of times guys are sort of maybe trying to sell themselves in in those situations and and you know like this is why I’m going to be the good hire and I didn’t get that sense from him at all that like he was trying to be
Up there and justify why he got the job or anything like that I I thought he was just sort of answering the questions the way he knew how to answer them and uh you know there wasn’t any sort of a um um kind of chip on his shoulder or
Anything like that in that way I just got the sense that this was just kind of who he who he was and that’s how he was presenting himself as that um but I thought you know like his opening statement again to go back to that I
Thought it was very you know there were obviously some people he wanted to think and some things he wanted to say and some things he wanted to get across and and it seemed in that standpoint that you know that’s I mean in his case this is the first time he’s ever had
Something like that really as a coordinator you usually do kind of an opening press conference but it’s not nothing like that um and uh you know again it seemed like he he you know it was It was kind of well thought out and Oran organized what he what he wanted to
Say and the points he wanted to get across and all that and um you know it wasn’t like a real super rambling kind of thing or anything like that no no it it felt like he had a game plan and and you know when you hear about his former
Players and and people that coached with him the thing that stands out to me as a consistent when they talk about what it was like working with Mike McDonald is attention to detail and so to me that was consistent right like that’s what we saw in that press conference is he had
Really detailed answers they weren’t vague they weren’t big umbrella type statements like yeah we’re here to win and inst instill a culture and all that kind of stuff that you might expect especially from someone that’s a first-time coach he he had some really specific answers to some of your guys’
Questions and I think you know just as telling as what McDonald said were some of the things John Schneider was saying and you know at one point he said Schneider said two things that really stood out to me one was talking about his his feelings after the Baltimore
Game right and talking with players who were just like what the hell just happened and feeling like I mean he didn’t say this explicitly but the sense I got was saying we were out coached in that game like we didn’t have answers in that game and look 37 to3 or whatever it
Was you know obviously a little little self-reflection there he said something else though uh talking about Marty Schottenheimer telling him you know you shouldn’t coach in you know in any place for more than 10 years was that a bit of a a slip or an illusion to do you feel
Like John schneer feeling like maybe Pete was there a little too long yeah I I mean I wrote about both those things fact I I sort of let off my story the next day with kind of the whole Baltimore anecdote and and tried to follow up with John a little bit about
That because that definitely that definitely struck me when when when he said that about that and um that was a day I mean you’d never really ever seen a Carol team look like that ever in in the 14 years he was here maybe other than that first year but you know even
Things like that Rams game that was so bad in 2017 but that was like some fluky plays and you know I mean it ended up looking bad but it wasn’t they didn’t just seem like you said no answers to anything but yeah that Baltimore game it just the Baltimore you didn’t even think
Like felt like they played that well through some of that game and yet then you know they win 37 to3 and it’s 515 yards to 151 and all that so um there’s no doubt I I think um I think looking at that I I think he did feel little bit
Like you know with the talent he feels like I that they’ve put together it shouldn’t look like that at this point in time um you know I’ve heard other coaches say that before uh uh you know other people in football say that there is just sort of sort of a a little bit
Of an expiration date on how long um what you do works and how long your your message Works obviously this team’s had so much turnover so the whole thing about is the message getting old I I wasn’t sure I bought that with this year’s team at all I mean there’s so
Many young guys and pretty younger over yeah I don’t know that anybody was like tuning peed out I mean a lot of these a lot of these guys have only been here a year or two but um but just in general um you know can can the rest of the
League catch up to you a little bit in terms of what you do and is that just when the FR you know your team just kind of needs a new a new voice and every way or just a new way of doing things I that can be true in a lot of different
Businesses if you know not just coaching but yeah it was it was interesting when when John said that because I I think I I felt like that was what that was about the biggest uh uh you know he he evaded a question basically when he was asked
Like why did you do this but then he did say that in another in one of the answers and um I thought that was kind of his answer to that a little bit like you know um don’t they don’t want to dump on Pete in any kind of way but just
More that maybe they just run its course and we just kind of did finally feel like you know this was the end of the end of the road so given that I mean most teams that are hiring a new coach have not won 18 games in the previous
Two seasons right so it it does make this a uniquely I guess attractive situation in that sense that a lot of the new coaching hires this year are going to be able to build the whole thing in their image for better or worse whereas there is a culture in place in
Seattle there are winds in place in Seattle there’s not a ton of starting spots necessarily up for grabs next year given all of that given that Pete’s DNA was so closely interwoven into the DNA of this franchise does Mike McDonald feel like the right fit and if so why
And if not why not well and that’s an interesting point because I think in one ways when you ask why why they make the change because it’s the old saying of you can’t change all the personnel and then as you rightly point out they do
Have an awful lot of people in place in spots and especially if they can resign some of their guys where it’s like we don’t want to you know don’t we don’t want to change all the Personnel so the one thing you can change is is the coaching um I I you know McDonald
Obviously got a week to to look especially at the offense anyway to look at Seattle’s offense so the one value of them having played this year is is uh you know he he would he obviously would have had a pretty good you know and that
Was in November as well so that you know pretty much the team that it was at the end of the year so he did get a look at the SE spend a week kind of looking at him that way the way the coordinators do so he does sort of know what he’s
Stepping into here a little bit personnel-wise um I I don’t profess to be such a big X as an O’s guy that I can tell for sure that what he did with Baltimore is going to be a better look for what they do here um but I do just think that having a
Fresh set of what what I sort of feel like is having a fresh set of eyes on a lot of these guys I think that could really help um you know I think uh one of Pete one of Pete’s strengths was um the way his sort of the way he uh could
Attach to these guys emotionally and mentally and things like that but but I think that was always the thing sometimes of you know it can be hard to let go a little bit too maybe right like you like you really like this guy personally or you know so and so has
Done so much for you as a player and things like that and and um when you just have a new guy come in and kind of look at everything uh um in kind of a fresh way but then he’s also coming from what’s a very successful program in
Baltimore so he so he knows so knows sort of a he has a background in an NFL setting that has worked really well but then he’s also coming at it from the outside and he’s not emotionally invested in anybody on the team um I feel like that’s something that could
Probably be really healthy for this team right now is just sort of taking a a real fresh look at a lot of different things that way and that’s why I’ll be really curious to see what kind of moves they make Personnel wise between uh you know that nothing would happen I don’t
Think in the next few weeks but you know before free agency and you know so that kind of that couple week period between the combine and free agency to me it will be really interesting to see if they if they make some significant moves at that point totally and and you know
No one’s going to hold you Ultra accountable to whatever your opinions on the higher are before they played any games but you know being head coach is more than just the X’s and O’s stuff like you talked about I mean you are the deao CEO of A5 billion do
Corporation where even CEOs of Fortune 500 companies aren’t necess neily subject to the scrutiny week in and week out that head coaches are I truly believe it’s one of the most challenging positions in the country one of the big decisions he’s going to have to make is regarding offensive coordinator you know
McDonald men mentioned in that initial presser that he’s going to start calling out the plays you know he’s going to start out by calling the plays on defense and won’t really consider delegating that until he feels supremely comfortable in whoever his defensive coordinator is and that makes it a
Little easier to get a sense of the int ended identity for Seattle on that side of the ball though he was careful to acknowledge that he’s going to figure out what the team strengths are before full implementation of the scheme and I and I actually like that he wasn’t just
Saying like yeah this is a one for one what I do works and we’re going to make that happen the the illusion to I’m not necessarily going to force you know a square peg into a round hole was encouraging for me but that leaves the vacancy at offensive
Coordinator as the next big plot development for the Seahawks offseason what are you hearing about that aspect of the search and do you get a sense regarding what type of offensive approach McDonald and Schneider or after yeah well and I’m glad you mentioned Snider there because you know John did
Make clear to us that you know he sort of now has final say on the coaching staff as well which is not something he had prior so I don’t think he would um you know I don’t think you would hire Mike McDonald and then say I’m going to
But you’re going to have to take whatever coordinator I want regardless of of if you like it I think it’s fair to say it’s rare for a GM to be the one filling out the coaching staff right I mean a lot of times the head coach has
The bigger influence on who’s going to be coaching with him yeah but it but it it did kind of strike me a little bit when he said that because I guess you you wonder somewhat about some of the coordinator hires maybe they’ve made the last few years that maybe John maybe
Wanted to go a different direction or something like that and and especially obviously you know as we saw with with with the defense they always just sort of promoted from within large and which I think was you know kind of Pete being being really loyal to his
Guys and stuff like that a little bit so um uh I mean as we’re as we’re doing this I mean I don’t know any names other than the two that have kind of been out there you know Ryan grub and Tanner angrand and um you know the Ryan grub is
Obviously a really interesting name um and and we all saw locally what he did but there’s always that question of you know the college to the NFL um how much is that work and then kayin dbor obviously he kind kind of a real offensive guy himself so there’s always
That question of separate separating the coordinator from the head coach in those kind of situations of who you know whose system is it really and who’s really the guy calling the shots obviously someone has to call the plays on game day but um you know that was always a thing with
Pete I thought with Pete the defensive coordinators with the Seahawks it was always a little bit hard to know of exactly how much how much Freedom the coordinator really had on on anything because I think the perception was always yeah that nothing happened with the defense that Pete didn’t wasn’t
Ultimately signing off on um but uh uh and then Tanner angsten is an interesting guy because you know by it sounds like you know they just kind of there was a big assumption in Detroit that Ben Johnson was probably going to get a head coaching job and then he was
Just going to be promoted to be the offensive coordinator to take his place um and so now maybe he’s looking around to uh to to to potentially uh be leaving a little bit but that’s the same thing where you know he’s the passing game cordinator there but obviously working
For an offensive coordinator who’s getting a lot of credit so you know um how much how much responsibility or say has he really been having in things but you know he has a tie of the Harbaugh family from way back from having coach under Jim Harbaugh so um so that’s where
You know the he the kind of some comfort with McDonald I’m sure would would would fit in there in terms of having uh having that exper the you know kind of that background so um you know both of them would be interesting choices obviously Ryan grub would be very
Interesting just because we we did get to know him well you know from a football standpoint watching what he did at Washington the last couple years and just kind of seeing if if he’d be able to kind of translate that to the NFL level yeah you know you before this show
Mike and I were were chatting about the potential offensive coordinator candidates and and maybe there’s some names outside of this list that are being considered that we need to be more aware of but you mentioned two of them with Ryan grub and Tanner angrand the other two that kind of seem to be
Floating around are are Chip Kelly and Eric benmy and Mike I’m actually curious Mike Mike has this really good intuition with the Seahawks it’s one of the things that I really appreciate about doing the show with him Mike as you look at those four coordinators and I know that you’ve
Done some real leg work on each of them who kind of stands out to you and and what do you like or not like about each of those four guys I’ll preface this by saying that uh the New York Giants blocked the option of another Mike at OC
For the Seahawks which is kind of a bummer can’t let team Mike get too strong exactly we were we were amassing uh a lot of power within the organization so they had to put a stop to that but I mean like like Bob said you know Tanner angsten uh he started
Out as I want to say a graduate assistant at University of San Diego before ascending to assistant head coach and play caller there um Ryan grub he’s been with Caleb de War for a long time he is the only guy that in 25 years of calling plays in kin deor career and
Grub is the only guy that he’s felt comfortable handing off those play calling duties to so a lot of us had a close-up look at grub in his time at Washington Chip Kelly is an odd one because Chip Kelly and Eric benmy are the only two guys in that group of four
That have NFL experience calling plays uh Tanner angsten he uh was an OC like I said at San Diego but also in the XFL with the DC Defenders with Cardell Jones but outside of that he’s just been you know game planning pass game coordinator uh for the Lions and tight
Ends coach and Ryan grub hasn’t taken the leap to the league yet what a meteor Ascent that would be over the last few years for him if he ended up as Seahawks OC but Chip Kelly uh he was fairly successful in Philadelphia as a head coach for a couple of Seasons before the
Power struggle with Hoy Roseman ultimately was lost and then his one forgotten season in San Francisco after Jim Tom Sula uh and then Eric benamy it’s kind of the same thing that Bob was saying where you’re trying to try to uh divide up credit because he was with
Andy Reid and Patrick Mahomes you know how how much of the pie goes where and so I I think Chip Kelly might be more of a player than people want to believe right now um may be biased I really like the idea of grub and I think something
That we need to consider also is Mike McDonald saying that similar to the way that he’s going to call the defense where he’s going to assess the roster and the players that they have before building the system around that I don’t think that he wants any of these guys or
Schneider for that matter to come in and say I run this type of offense I run West Coast or I run like these air raid Concepts I think Mike McDonald made the statement that they want to build up a new sort of synthesized offense together and have that be something that builds
And grows throughout time for a long time in the Pacific Northwest so how I don’t think that he was saying that they were necessarily uh putting NFL experience as a premium in that search either which is interesting totally and it’s something that I certainly respect you know McDonald being a defensive guy
We’re we’re at this interesting Crossroads philosophically with him because traditionally defensive coaches have wanted ball control offenses right they don’t they’re defensive guys right they care about the defensive stats they don’t necessarily want to be playing 13 or 14 possessions on defense so it seems like pace is something that’s always
Been really important to defensive-minded head coaches we saw it with Pete Carroll the Seahawks were bottom fifth in plays run every single season even when they were winning a bunch they didn’t run a ton of plays on offense they were slow getting out of the Huddle they were all about extending
Drives and winning on third down and all of these different things and you know Chip Kelly for example Eric benmy too famous for being fast right minimal time in between plays embracing no huddle and and being really really aggressive on offense Bob do you get any sense yet
From Mike McDonald in terms of what it is that he’s looking for there uh not really uhuh it was interesting the answer he gave you know I would preface that by remembering the how the question was phrased and the question was phrased that way of you know is is NFL play
Calling experience important to you and it might have been asked by somebody who had an idea that Ryan grub might be a uh might be a candidate for this so um you know I so um always worth keeping that contact somewhat in in mind there Chip
Kelly the one reason I I I would be somewhat skeptical of how much that might be a fit here is simply because of who he is and kind of what a strong personality he is and with a with a 36y old guy who’s never been a head coach
Before being the head coach that that might be an interesting Dynamic um obviously they brought in Leslie Fraser to be the assistant head coach and I think you know I think that that might have been something that they sort of knew might be in the works when they did
All this as well when they hired McDonald and they might have had a had a had a decent feeling there that they could they could get that done with Leslie Fraser and sort of understand we’ll bring in somebody who has been a head coach and and uh um you know kind
Of has that has that background while we’re hiring a head coach who’s never been a head coach before um throwing Chip Kelly into that would be you know he’s he’s an interesting and pretty strong personality and it would be it would be a really interesting fit but
You’re right there seems to be this um uh the this idea that he just you know he’s down in UCLA and it’s it’s gone okay there but not incredibly great they did end they ended the year nicely with the the win over us C and all that but
That you know maybe he wants out of college football with just UCLA’s move into the Big 10 and and he’s been pretty open about what a mess he thinks college sports is so um you know maybe he’d be willing to take with to kind of looks on
Paper like a step down but I haven’t you know as we’re doing this I haven’t heard anything connecting him to the job and I I I’m sure John knows him from uh from his his NFL days and scouting and stuff like that but I I don’t know how I’ve
Never heard that they have a particularly strong relationship at all um you know Eric Bey yeah you’re you’re 100% right I mean that and I think that was part of why um um you know he kind of ended up going to Washington this year was that idea maybe from from both
Sides that it was time for him to sort of go off on his own a little bit and and see what he could do on his own and then you know um as could have maybe been predicted with the way the Washington franchise has gone that didn’t that didn’t last real long and
Washington sort of starting over there but uh he would be an interesting choice obviously with with with that background of what he has um and uh and seeing and seeing where that would go but yeah I you know especially with John Schneider sort of overseeing this a little bit I
Mean you take the chance of a firsttime head coach and a first-time offensive play caller kind of all at once um yeah I obviously McDonald call the the defensive plays for three years if you include the Michigan year but you know that’s a that goes from a really super
Experienced uh head coach and and kind of overall staff uh to to one where where you’d have a lot of a lot of newness to it but you know everybody every great play caller offensive play caller you know Sonic VY Kyle Shanahan whoever had a had a first game where
They’d never called plays before so uh you have to start somewhere so uh um it will be really interesting to see what they do there but I you know I think schematically I mean if you commit to Gino Smith and I you know I don’t think they’ll hire a coordinator without
Knowing what they’re going to do with that obviously that’s the February 16th day when they have to guarantee his base salaries coming up um you know I imagine they’re going to do that and he’s going to be on the roster I I would would if I
Had to bet that’s what that’s the way I’d bet but if you’re going to have goino Smith as your quarterback you know that that dictates quite a bit of what you’re going to do offensively I mean you know you’re going to I I don’t know how how totally different you could look
Uh other than what the Seahawks did in general with him obviously there’s a lot of different plays and stuff like that you can do but I mean you know you’re not going to start running the Lamar Jackson offense or something like that with with j at this day so well let
Let’s talk about that a bit I’m actually glad that you you brought it up because it is something I wanted to talk with you about with John pulling the final string now do you get the sense that because okay actually I’m going to back up one one step here when it came to
Personnel decisions and let’s just use goino Smith’s starting quarterback as a microcosm for this what really was now it’s in the past what really was that relationship between Pete Carol and John Schneider when it came to Personnel decisions I mean I think uh for 99% of
Them and on a regular day-to-day basis I think it was I think it was as collaborative as they as they said but I I think there were some times when I think Pete wanted um some things done sort of philosophically in some ways you know there was sort of the idea that
After a couple of the drafts where maybe they took a lot of risk on some guys Pete wanted to re that in a little bit and be a little more you know let’s make sure we’re getting guys who can help us immediately um and I think there was
Always a little bit of a thought that that Pete might have leaned a little bit more on U on Veterans um like let’s like say trading for Carlos Dunlap at mid-season instead of just letting a young guy kind of take take those um you know I think Pete was always sort of the
Win now guy and uh you know so I I think Pete I think Pete would would sometimes push things in that direction of you know I I don’t care I don’t care about three years from now so you know the the draft and and developing guys um I care
About putting the best team we can on Sunday and that’s always but that’s that’s always the thing in the in all pro sports is is the organization can often look more more big picture with the people who know they’re going to be around longer where the coach is always
Like you know if we lose Sunday I might TI I’m so glad you touched on that I’m so glad you touched on that because I think something that gets lost in the discourse is just how little job security almost every coach has right like Andy Reid has earned himself a Down
Season hell Bill bellich earned himself three down Seasons right like once you get to a certain level John Harbaugh could win five games next year and probably earn benefit of the doubt Mike Tomlin a few of these guys but most coaches are coaching for their livelihoods you know this is
Life-changing money every year that they’re a head coach in the NFL they are setting their families up for success in a way that not being a head coach in the NFL does not allow them to do whereas the GM has to be thinking two three years down the road and then you step
Even further back from that you look at ownership and my thought is when it comes to looking at who your general manager is if you can’t see them being the GM in three years then they shouldn’t be the GM for this year because they are going to be you know
The prism that they’re the the lens they’re looking at their decision- making through can’t just be about winning right now or else you get yourself in a position that’s completely unsustainable I’m curious you know one one of the things that I think might make this a really good marriage is Mike
McDonald just got a six-year contract he is not necessarily coaching for his job next year in fact I would venture to say he is definitely not coaching for his job next year now they go three and 14 or some outlier thing okay maybe it’s a Jim MOA Jr situation you say all right
One year this isn’t working I don’t don’t think that’s really the case here it’s got to be a little bit refreshing to Schneider to have head coach that can also take a long-term view yeah well in John’s contract so you know to remember goes through the 2027 draft so
Essentially three three full season so that’s how I view it for sure is that this is this is it for three years is these two guys together running it and um and obviously also the Jody Allen will see or won’t see sell the team eventually thing but two or three years
Probably is yeah that’s the thing behind the curtain yeah is um um you know sort of a a maybe a little bit more of a realistic timeline there too it’s nothing’s going to happen immediately but you know it could say in three years so um that was sort of the sense I got
Was this was sort of putting it together for that and so I view it as for sure you’ve got two seasons I think where just about anything maybe could happen and and everything’s fine but that you know by that third by that 2026 season let’s say when joh would would be
Entering the final year of his contract you know at that point you’ll have a pretty good idea how this is working and that’s when you kind of maybe make more decisions about uh about where you’re going you know do you do you keep sticking with with kind of the team
That’s in place or or what do you do there but yeah um I I do think that allows them a little bit more because that was going to be if Pete had come back that that was definitely going to be the theme of next year was they’ve
Got to do something a little bit more right you know p73 and he’s tire and his and so in some I I feel like you know they might have just headed that off by doing it now you know instead of having what could be a
Little bit of a of a year where it’s just going to be a big referendum and this is this is kind of just a weird an analogy as well but I think a little bit I think they felt that way with Russell like they should have just traded him a
Year earlier instead of going through that last year with Russell and you know it’s the old then like the bill bich that was always the whole thing of cut a player a year early instead of a year late um that you’re better off doing it
That way and so I think a little bit of this with with Pete was probably that like instead of entering a year where that’s going to be the focus of everybody in the offseason of you know especially let’s say the 499ers win the Super Bowl and suddenly the Seahawks
Look like they’re you know and the Rams sort of look like they’ve rided this the ship a little bit and so going into this year that would be you know that’s what everybody would be is the referendum on that and you know if they started 0 and3
Or something next year we’d all be SP don’t sleep on the Cardinals over the next couple of years either yeah yeah but I’m just saying you know it’s say next year gotten off to a bad start that you just spend the whole rest of that
Season just sort of is Pete going to be back and talking about all that and you’ve sort of headed that off now by making the move now that’s right you know now it is just sort of tur into the future and so everything now is about
The next few years and kind of and uh you know and kind of building it up that way so um you know maybe they made this move a year earlier than they they might have had to or than they might have needed to but I think I think there’s
They might have felt like there’s some value in doing it that way um and uh uh but yeah I I I the I think that does allow them a little bit to play a little bit more that way too instead of feeling like um you know if you get to week
Seven next year or whatever and suddenly you suddenly that sort of decision comes do we turn this position over to a rookie or do we go sign some guy that’s at least played for five years like same with Jason the Jason Peters thinging this year um you know you go literally
Signing the most experienced offensive lineman you could have found um you know and and I don’t know if he was a whole lot better than stone foresy or whatever um uh you know but you could have just said hey we’ll just play Stone fory um the rest of the year or or Anthony
Bradford or whatever in some way they were a victim of their 5-2 start I think this year yeah but uh but yeah I but you know you say that about head coaches but assistant coaches are even more so I mean you know you talk to assistant coaches sometimes and the whole idea of
Well let’s you know let’s let’s groom guys for the future and they can be like man my future is not secure past January or whatever so you know why do I care that much about about doing things for you know a future I may not be here for
Um you know I it’s always just such a a window now I mean all pro sports are really that way obviously but you know I uh you know they they they all know that um it’s just such a what have you done for me lately lately league and so as
Fans sometimes you do look at it more as like you know doing that kind of putting the team together for you know let’s make sure we’re were’re getting these guys experience for two or three years down the road and that is what the as you said that that’s sort of the job of
The front office to do that the coaches us you’re looking at you know I’m the one who’s going to be standing there in the rain on Sunday or whatever you know for losing 40 to nothing the camera’s panning on me as sort of the guy who’s
Failing here and not and not the people in the front office who are up in the luxury boxes away all that’s an important distinction man that’s an important distinction I’m glad you mentioned it you know uh you you obviously cover the NFL for a living you’re clearly aware there’s a big game
Coming up on Sunday and I want to get your thoughts on that here in a second but before we transition out of you know Seahawks Dum and before we zoom out there are a couple of other recent coaching decisions that I think are are worth getting your opinion on one is
Bringing in Leslie Frasier as the assistant head coach and someone that McDonald has you know considered a mentor for a while they also hired Jay haror you know one of one of the things about Mike McDonald is that he’s a Harbaugh guy he has coached for both harball
Brothers and turned around both of their defenses this is something Mike and I talked about last week you know Mike acutely pointed out the incredible statistical Improvement that both Harbaugh uh teams Michigan and Baltimore saw once he came on board in in in terms of points allowed yards allowed things
Like that uh but now you got lesie Frasier coming in and Jay Harbaugh as the Special Teams coordinator how much should we look into that you know those two hires in terms of you know the the worldview and and the game plan that Mike McDonald has yeah well I mean I
Think Leslie Fraser was really brought in um in part as sort of that that sounding board that older that old older sort of guy who can who’s been through just about everything I think that the NFL can can hand you and so he can be
That guy that uh you know can just kind of guide McDonald in a lot of ways that way um and but yeah I you know I hadn’t really realized how how close they apparently got but I think it was the 2016 season when um Leslie Fraser was
The defensive backs coach there and then U McDonald was U was sort of his assistant and kind of really putting together that secondary um and they felt like they they really made a big turn and and um you know I saw some quotes from Leslie Fraser talking about that
About he gave a lot of credit to McDonald for um helping him with all that so even though he left after that year for Buffalo but that uh you know apparently they forged a really close relationship there so so obviously you know he’s hired a lot of guys so far he
Has a he he has some relationship with um Jay Harbaugh had obviously had been in Michigan so and obviously obviously he’s a Harbaugh so but um but then and then oliv a who’s apparently coming in as the linebacker coach they they’ve got some uh some crossover time as well um
So you know so far he does seem to be putting together a staff that does include some people that that he knows and has has worked with before and obviously feels comfortable with um yeah the Special Teams thing is interesting you know Larry ISO I thought did a did a
Really good job um in general you always just sort special teams coaches always probably rightly or wrongly get judged so much by how how well the field goal kicker does so obviously Jason my’s had a few misses this year but you know that’s so out of the Special Teams field
Goal kicking is so out of the special team’s hands I mean you just you sign a field goal kicker and you know the um the Green Bay laflor got all the there was all the crap about the quote he gave but I think he was just uh uh or I’m
Sorry it was a u yeah it was it was Green Bay right where he said he said every time he kicks it I pray or whatever but I think that’s how most coaches are with field goal kickers it’s like a closer in baseball I mean you
Just sign a guy and you got to ride it with him typically and the closer baseball is the is the perfect thing like yeah great if you can get Justin Tucker AKA Mari but for the most part you’re just hoping Bobby Ayala can get it game to game you know there’s still
Coaching kickers I mean you coach the whole team but in terms of the kicker himself I mean you know you’re not the special teams coach isn’t telling the kicker during the week how to kick the ball I mean you sign one of those guys and hope for the best but my my point
There was is though you know they’ve been they’ve been really good in general I mean the punting team was has been good their coverage has been fine and and you just have to take the the return stuff in the context of nobody’s returning great anymore with the way the
Rules are but they’ve been you know they’ve been above League average the last few years and a lot of those things so um you know to I I I thought ISO might be a guy who had a chance to come back actually but but uh it’s kind of
Interesting you know like I say bringing in Jay Harbaugh as a guy he knows well plus when has a harbot ever succeeded as a special teams coach in the NFL name once you can’t in all seriousness I mean I know I know that J harba has been
Pretty successful uh in his time at Michigan but the the second to last game he played that road bow against Alabama is one of the most hilariously awful special teams performances in totality that I’ve ever seen in my life fa so that’s fair yeah you know I I I think to
Me and and Bob can correct me if I if I’m off base here but it feels to me like the harbaughs are the first family of football right now right they’ve won at every level everywhere they go they are synonymous with winning if I’m a Chargers fan I’m absolutely thrilled to
Get Jim in there I think John is a top three head coach in the NFL and so some of that’s just got to be about bringing in winning DNA and and tapping into that especially since Mike McDonald speaks the Harbaugh language but you know I I
Mentioned a minute ago and and I do want to zoom out a little bit and talk about this game on Sunday we’re recording on Tuesday which means that in five days Kin City Chiefs will play in the Super Bowl for the fourth time in 5 years having won two of their previous three
Appearances is and one of those wins came against the San Francisco 49ers they’re back for Revenge after consecutive come from behind victories in the playoffs now traditionally the Chiefs have gotten here on the back of their prolific offense while the 49ers playoff runs over the last what 15 years
Been hallmarked by Elite defense now it’s not like Casey’s offense is bad per se and San Francisco’s defense has been very good but neither of those are the main reasons they’re back in the big game the Chiefs defense has been ridiculous the ners are breaking the mold for offensive efficiency Bob when
You look at this game just as a football fan that is blessed with the knowledge that you get from covering the sport for a living what stands out to you the most when you look at this game well one of the interesting things to me about this
Is it feels like these are two teams that showed a lot more vulnerability during the year than you often get I mean so many times in a Super Bowl there’s some team that just you know they kind of obviously got there they just kind of cruised to it but you know
You forget the SE the 49ers had that three game losing streak and the Seahawks were in first place in the NFC West going into going into no before that game at Baltimore they were they were in first I mean it was kind of a semantics because it was by a half game
Because they hadn’t had their buy at um um the 49ers have played one more game or whatever but uh uh but still uh you know they they kind of looked suddenly real vulnerable there and they had some injuries and then the Chiefs you know they spent half the half this year with
You know kind of what’s wrong with the Chiefs offense cuz it doesn’t look as good as it had had in the past Mahomes wasn’t putting up quite the same numbers and all that and um you know if the if the Chiefs really uh you know got this
And won two in a row they would they would seem like one of the Le least impressive teams to ever win two in a row when you when you think about all the teams that have the um you know like the the going way back like the Dolphins
Undefeated undefeated team or the those you know the Lombardi Packers and some of these um you know the the the Cowboys the you know the Jimmy Johnson era Cowboys and stuff like that and uh these Chiefs don’t necessarily seem like they’re quite that that level of historical dominance which is part of
Why I’m thinking the 49ers are going to win cuz I just sort of feel like uh um you know maybe it finally is their time I know they haven’t looked great in the playoffs um but they did get there and they wouldn’t be the first team ever to
To maybe not be super dominant in the in the playoffs and then get there and and uh and and win the Super Bowl once they got there so I don’t know I sort of feel like it’s their time but uh that’s where the quarterback match up this is such a
Fascinating quarterback match up between m Holmes who I I don’t think anybody questions is going to go down is one of the top five or 10 quarterbacks of all time and then Brock pie who a lot of people now aren’t even sure he’s one of the best 10 quarterbacks currently in
The NFL um um you know that he’s just kind of riding the coattails of the offense so um um it’ll be incredibly interesting to see it that way but uh um yeah it it I I think it’s a fascinating matchup in a lot of those ways because
Of uh kind of the narratives that that each of these teams sort of brings into the game and and and a little bit of the uneven Seasons um you know like the the Chiefs lost to the Raiders on Christmas day right I mean they kind of they he
Didn’t look very good in that game at all probably got an Antonio Pierce hired by the by the Raiders with that performance but you know then go on the road and win those two games the way they did um suddenly looked like that so maybe they’re one of these teams that’s
Kind of these veteran Super Bowl teams that’s uh turning it on at the right time but um but I’m going to go with the 49ers to win it I just kind of feel like maybe they’re they’re they’re sort of do to win it with uh and when they played
Well this year which they didn’t always do um but I thought they had stretches where they did look like the best team in the NFL for some significant stretches a time no question and if they if they play like that I think that’s I think they’re the better team okay yeah
So so um I’m curious so you you’ve got the 49ers the way the way that I look at it actually before I tell you the way that I look at it I want to get your your thoughts on this when you look at the matchups here what do you think the
Chief’s best matchup in this game is and what do you think the 49ers best matchup of the game is like if you were putting together the game plan for each team what are you trying to lean into well and what’s interesting is you know the Seahawks were pretty open later about
What the one matchup they thought they had on the 49ers was their receivers against the 49ers Corners they thought the 49ers Corners were you know the the kind of the one vulnerable part of that defense and that was why you know Pete was pretty Frank afterward about kind of
The protection issues and if we just could have protected a little bit better you know they thought um they could get they could get DK and Smith and jiga and Lockett and stuff like that and in some good positions to really take advantage of some things and so I would probably
Lean on that a little bit and just think that that’s you know if you can block just well enough I think Mahomes throwing the ball against some of the guys um against some of the guys in the San Francisco secondary I think that’s that’s a matchup I would like for them
Um and uh San Francisco’s best uh you know I I think getting getting mcaffrey going and Kansas City’s defensive line obviously has played has played really well at times and and they just did it it was it was uh almost inexplicable how little in some ways Baltimore tried to
Attack it with the run but I think San Francisco is going to do that in this one and try to you know work all the all the different Avenues of their running game not just mcaffrey but you know the stuff they do with Debo Samuel and stuff
Like that and try to get Kansas City um off their game a little bit there so that would be the one thing to me that that I I I know there’s always the whole you know you only end up rushing for a lot of yards if if you’re doing well
Anyway but I do feel like this is one of those games where the 40 uniters get to that like 150 yard rushing Mark or something like that if they’re proving that they can do that then you know I think that’s a real key for them because
I don’t think you know despite U I kind of think Brock p is better than a lot of people do but I still don’t think this is a game where you want Brock pie having to win it for you well yeah yeah that that’s just it so followup question
Does this strike you was a high scoring game or a lowc scoring game I think it’d be a medium scoring like 24 to 20 24 to 20 that sort of thing I don’t even know what the over under is I guess I should know that so I don’t know if that I
Don’t know if like 44 would be um where where that stands on that but uh um but I would it strikes me it’s going to be that it’s not going to be like that Patriots Rams one I don’t think it’ll be that I I think there’ll be some points
Scored in this but I don’t think it’ll be like the the the the Eagles Super Bowl the Eagles Patriots Super Bowl or whatever I think it’ll be somewhere in between those cuz I I you know each of these obviously are are good defenses in general and and you know the 49ers uh
They front seven which another thing that’s been you know mysterious at times that the 49ers haven’t been a little bit better with their front and again I know that was one of the things that disappointed the Seahawks because they did feel like that was I think they
Thought they could have held up a little bit better against the 49ers front to to get The Passing game going a little bit more in those games which um you know I think there was some question at times with with Seattle’s game plan on those
But I think they did really want to try to throw the ball against them and uh but uh but so I I I think the Chiefs will have some success moving it but I I think it’ll be somewhere in that yeah if I had to pick I’d say something like 24
To 24 to 20 409ers yeah and and look you’re you’re right in the vicinity the over under is 47 and a half I think the average NFL game this year at 45 points so they’re they’re expecting just a a touch over that you know it’s it’s so interesting because I actually think the
Chiefs Defense matches up against the 49ers offense really really well and and look we’ve just seen stev’s bolo’s defense shut down the best offenses all season long and you know they’ve had some hiccups but the 49ers have really struggled against the best defenses in the NFL this year they did not play well
Against Cleveland they did not play well against Baltimore did not play well against Cincinnati you know these These are the teams they struggled against and cheap defense is every bit as good as all of them and and they’re healthy the one big weakness that the Chiefs have
Had in fact the only thing that I’m aware of that they are near the bottom in the NFL at is defending Zone scheme running I think they’re like 31st out of 32 teams in terms of Defending that and that’s obviously the shanan system is is Zone scheme running you’ve got the best
Running back on the planet uh taking all those those carries the question for me is can Kyle Shanahan resist the urge to pass a bunch because he’s gotten himself in a hole in each of the first two playoff games by passing a lot by putting the ball in Brock P’s hands and
Saying go get us a lead and he hasn’t been able to do that then of course you know down the stretch that all clicked I don’t think you know I don’t think the Packers or lions defense are in the same universe as the Chiefs defense in terms
Of pass you know covering the pass and and putting pressure on the quarterback I I think the way the 49ers win is if Shanah Han can stay disciplined and just Hammer The Rock old school football right you know the the the type of football that makes my dad happy is what
I think it’s going to take because at the end of the day you do have Brock pie and and he’s such a lightning rod for discourse on quarterback play and and that’s its own conversation we could do a whole show on that but it’s Patrick Mahomes on the other side you know what
I mean like there’s a huge Delta there I don’t I don’t think anybody even the most Die Hard 49er fan is going to argue that there’s a big Delta in pure talent between Patrick Mahomes and Brock pie at the game’s most important position the way that I look at games and the way
That I approach betting on football is I do a likelihood quadrant right like okay yeah sure you might have a a a medium uh score differential where it’s somewhere in that 6 to 10 point range but generally speaking you’ve got four outcomes you’ve got a close 49ers win a
Big 49ers win a close Chiefs win and a big Chiefs win and I think the likelihood of a close 49ers win is a little bit more than the likelihood of a close Chiefs win just because I think they have a better roster I do think it’s more likely that the Chiefs win big
Than it is that the 49ers win big and I think that does come down to the intangible Championship mentality knowing how to win I think it actually helps the Chiefs that they actually have lost to Super Bowl and bookended that loss with Super Bowl wins I think a huge
Huge under discussed uh variable in that Chiefs Super Bowl loss was what happened with Andy Reid’s son a day or two before the Super Bowl right he had a a drunk driving incident that I believe took a life um dealing with that they also dropped nine passes in that game which
Was insane I mean momes momes had the best nine-point game of any quarterback in NFL history in that game and and they made their adjustments the the Eagles defense was exceptional last year and they dropped 34 on them so um to me I I do think it’s the Chiefs I you know
That’s where my money will be but I don’t you know I would say you play this game a 100 times the Chiefs win at like 52 of those times and and I’m going to lean on that but if I were to say that you had to bet
$110,000 of your own money right now on who wins the game even money you’re putting it on the 49ers yeah I guess so um um you’re you’re making me qu question myself there no with all that but uh um good hey man we can have we can have opinions evolve in real time
Here yeah no I uh yeah I think I would but I I was thinking why you were saying that I we all know the whole Shanahan you talking about Shanahan staying disciplined with what he does and we all know the other key with the Shanahan is that that whole scripted play thing and
You know if it’s 15 or 20 or I don’t think he’s ever said exactly how many how many it is but there’s no question I always watch these Seahawk games and and some of my co-workers because I’d always be like what the 40 the 49ers are going
To gain like 180 yards in the first 20 minutes of every game they ever play against the Seahawks the question is whether the Seahawks force them to kick field goals or maybe even as happened with Garoppolo all the time they would get an interception or two here or there
And if you could if you could hold that off and not Trail 21 to nothing or whatever at the end of that at the end of that thing because it always felt like clockwork in in Seahawks games where the 49ers were put up they would just drive the field the first three
Times they got the ball but but it but but it was how many points they got out of those drives and if if you could survive that a little bit it always felt like the game evened out a little bit in the second half obviously the playoff
Game a couple years ago was not that way um where the where the Seahawks had the lead or um uh I think in the third quarter if I recall right in in the well yeah yeah they had that long DK Mecha touchdown right before the half they
Were up 1716 and then just got the doors blown off in the second half but a lot of these other ones you know it always felt like if you could just kind of weather that storm a little bit it would even out somewhat and so I think that’s
Really huge in this one because um you know again for all for all those reasons you know the Chiefs are the team that you know since you’ve won since you’ve won a couple Super Bowls you’re playing on house money a little bit I mean it’s not like every guy’s sitting there like
Oh man if we don’t win this one you know what’s our Legacy GNA be or whatever I mean Travis Kelce and Mahomes and all those guys have won already have a few rings so um you know and it’s the 49ers who were kind of a little bit more at
The other end of that where um you know they’d been to the conference title game three straight years right and then this the first time they obious got over the hump to at least get into the Super Bowl so um you know they they maybe feel like
The team that’s got a little bit more to lose and and the team that’s got to do some things early to you know they were able to come back against Detroit I mean they had all that same stuff kind of I I guess going through their minds I’m sure
At halftime of the Detroit game and they were able to come back against that one but that was against the team that you know won one playoff I just don’t see the Chiefs make if the Chiefs get a lead the way that the Packers and the Lions
Did the Chiefs aren’t aren’t wired to cough that up they’re not going to be dropping passes they’re not going to be dropping interceptions they’re not going to be making dumb coaching decisions you know the way that I think the Lions and the Packers did well that’s that’s
That’s just it man but I will say you know I’m fond of saying on this show I’m a football fan first a Seahawks fan second and as a football fan man this is a great Super Bowl I mean just a great Super Bowl yeah no I agree with you I
Think it’s a fascinating matchup for all those I I thought any of the four anything that could have come out of those four I thought was going to be really good I I thought it was I thought I thought the championship uh Sunday was really fun both those games I was really
Looking forward to them all week and and and kind of just watched every play of both those um very intently um because I thought uh that both those matchups were really were really fascinating to me if you got you know Buffalo and Detroit finally Detroit obviously finally in
There at all but Buffalo you know we all know they tortured history so if they if they somehow gotten in there and um you know Baltimore with or not I’m sorry Buffalo wasn’t in the time but I just mean the playoffs as a whole but Baltimore um you know with Lamar and and
Them not having um I guess you know I think kind of feeling a little bit like they haven’t taken full advantage of everything they’ve they’ve sort of been able to put together the last few years for variety of reasons and so them not getting there so um I thought it’s it’s
Been a fun playoffs getting to this point point so I agree but you know I I I think in general these are Baltimore sort of look like the best team uh in the NFL for for but otherwise I feel like these are two of the three other
You know I kind of felt like there were maybe three obvious the three teams that sort of felt like they spent parts of the Year being looking like the best teams in the NFL maybe and I think these are these are two of those three I’m I’m
100% with you man like I said as a football fan this is a beautiful matchup and I do think there are some real legacies on the line here listen b this has been awesome man I know you tried real hard to join us last week when the McDonald news broke but obviously
Something like that throws your schedule into a blender so we are super grateful that you made the time yeah no thanks yeah know I felt I felt bad I just was uh there was so much going on it was going to be hard to hard to know I could
Just just devote devote an hour in where I was some of those moments so but uh yeah I’m glad things slowed down enough we were able to do it well listen an hour a year time talking balls worth its weight and gold so we really really
Appreciate it before we let you get out of here just last thing where can the folks listening who for some reason don’t know where they can find more of your stuff where can they get it yeah I it’s pretty easy these days just uh you know Seattle times.com um and everything is
Everything is there I know they we have H several different subscription models or whatever so there’s there’s a lot of different ways you can get our stuff but obviously we obviously we cover a lot of everything but you know and then Twitter as well I I always try to link to
Everything um I do there so you know Twitter is just bandot so BC n do OA so everything else is there so that’s that’s about the only two places I really we we really put everything anywhere all right y’all that’s going to do it for today as always you can find
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7 Comments
Both Russ and Pete ended their Seattle careers in State Farm Stadium. That damn place, man 💀
So Macdonald is ambidextrous. Gotta mean hes hella smart right???
This was a great listen
It does seem like JS and Chip Kelly do have a good relationship – JS has mentioned all the insights he got from CK that led them to grab Charbonnet and especially Jake Bobo. CK kept telling JS he was a practice monster and it led to them grabbing him.
Jacson- As always, I love your guest interviews and the new insights. Have you considered having a short opening segment with you Mike before each interview? I really enjoyed the synergy between the two of you during the mid-season mailbag and last week’s show .
I want the final score to be 2-0 Chiefs. The game is scoreless until the last 10 seconds when kc fumbles and the 49ers scoop the ball and run the wrong way for a safety
I finally get to see a face with the name usually called out first at press conferences