Office Hours: Made-For-TV Golf Events

Kevin Van Valkenburg joins host Michael Wolf to unpack the experimental history of made-for-TV golf events, which have produced some of the silliest moments in pro golf.

Office Hours is presented by Holderness & Bourne: https://holdernessandbourne.com/?utm_..

Chapters:
00:00 KVV and Michael Wolf intro
03:20 Holderness & Bourne Ad
04:25 How Made for TV Golf works
05:50 World Series of Golf
07:30 Hero World Challenge
11:10 Mike Ditka cameo at the World Series of Golf story
14:20 Experimenting with different formats
20:10 Shark Shootout
22:10 Grant Thonton Invitational
23:30 JCPenney Classic
25:50 The Skins Game
28:15 Gary Player-Tom Watson incident

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Oh but Jack Nicholas and Arnold Palmer said it was absolutely fun and I don’t know why we’re making this an [Applause] incident hey everybody welcome back to another episode of office hours I’m your host Michael wolf today in the class we’ve got uh we’ve got really the professor kvv making his first appearance in office hours it’s a little this feels KBB this feels a little bit

Like uh at the end of the school year when your uh your teacher’s been wearing jeans all all year and just kind of coming in and then all of a sudden he shows up with a clip on tie on and you notice that the uh the principl in the

Back of the room just kind of checking on things before they renew the contracts for next year so uh welcome to office hours I’m a little nervous uh having the professor here but uh glad to have you in what I got to ask you spent

11 years at ESPN you’ve won a number of awards uh why are you on office hours what brings you here today well Wolfie I love the D dbest parts of golf I think that it it brings out uh sort of a quirky side of things uh so whether it’s

You know the the battle at the Big Horn uh which I remember well when they lit up the course and or the thing with anuka and tiger uh and Deval and and Ki Webb uh but one of the things that I’ve always loved one of my favorite

Incidents in the history of golf is the 1983 Skins game when Tom Watson accused Gary Player of cheating and Dave Anderson of the new York Times uh put a little thing about it in his column it didn’t seem like it was going to go you

Know if you could go viral in the day uh but when Dave Anderson dropped it a note in his column that he heard uh Tom Watson say I’m sick of this Gary I’m not gonna let you get away with it uh and it became a big cruffle that I still think

About every time now like when they do the ceremonial t-shots at Augusta like there has to be this like this 50 years of tension running through the air between those two so come on KB don’t tease us give it to us come on we want

To hear it Gary you know I think uh I’m not sure did you use your rain jacket in that bush to give yourself a better lie than you should have had there oh but Jack nichas and Arnold Palmer said it was absolutely fine and I don’t know why

We’re making this an incident it’s absolutely disgraceful that Tom would come at me like this that leaf was unattached to any stems of all a plus that’s there you go you’ve already you’ve already earned your keep uh thank you for that um you know I’m with you

Man the weirder it gets the more Awkward I mean if you’re going to put Peter Jacobson in a you know in a director’s chair watching Greg Norman Jr hit flop shots I’m all for it I mean sign me up that’s I will take that over you know

Watching uh you know watching a 72 hole stroke play event in the middle of July the issue I think or one of the things I wanted to really talk to you today uh as we move through some of the events and talk about them is I think sometimes the

PJ tour in particular likes to have their cake and eat it too as far as are these exhibits are the exhibitions are these uh serious golf should they some of these things be awarded uh FedEx Cup points or God forbid official world golf rankings that’s it didn’t seem like a

Big deal now the sudden it you know uh it may be exhibit you know number two in a lawsuit or something so uh I’m glad to have you around and maybe a little bit of a voice of reason on some of these things would love your opinion before we

Get to any of that though um I gotta say the fall it’s the best time of the year uh for golfing it’s the best time of the year for the golf close uh that leads me into uh the sponsor of this which is holderness and Bourne I’m wearing my

Anderson shirt and I’m wearing my ward sweater um NE told me the ward sweater is the number one selling item on the no laying up Pro Shop so um as you can see it’s kind of a little quilted look to it but uh not enough to be crazy it’s

Understated you can wear this uh you know wear this to your uh father-in-law’s house you can wear this to uh you know whever you want it fits in everywhere you could wear it uh you know on the course off the course we at the church I have the maroon version of

That and it’s very very crispy looks excellent Yeah couple new uh couple new colors I just saw came out this week too so head on over to the pro shop and pick up your W sweater for uh for the fall and really even uh around here at least

You can get away with wearing this thing through the winter without a coat and I like that yeah should we roll it back talk a little bit about these yeah tell me how did these events get their start like what is the Genesis of of these things becoming a reality you know I

Think it’s a it was a couple of factors um TV was definitely one of them right you’ve got um the rise of IMG uh Mark McCormack Arnold Palmer uh Jack You Know Jack Nicholas and just the marketing of it and um and I think there was also you

Know the rising popularity of Television uh 1960s 1970s they were looking for inventory as hard as it is to believe now um football wasn’t always the king of Television um right you probably remember I mean the NCA TV contracts they were allowed to show one game a

Week and then eventually it it got bumped up three games a week and four games a week but a lot of this stuff around especially around the holidays they were looking for just you know inventory to fill and as as incredible as it seems now um golf did a pretty

Good job before anybody else in realizing that like hey a lot of people are going to be home uh the Friday after Thanksgiving a lot of people are going to be home the weekend after you know between Christmas and New Year’s and they’re going to be looking for

Something to watch on television well they fall asleep in recliners yeah yeah right and so let’s let’s Market to these people and the advertisers went along with it because it was you know it was a good demographic that that that would turn into golf and so that’s really how

It happened I think uh a lot of people be pretty surprised that um it really goes back um quite a ways um all the way back to the World Series of golf um which eventually became the PJ Grand Slam so World Series of golf started in

1962 um it was a one-day event it was on Memorial Day um and it was run by the PG of America and it was it was the four major championship winners and if two guys if somebody had won two majors of one year then they would fill the the

Extra spot with whoever had the highest combined finishes in the major championships the previous years it goes all the way back to 1962 originally like I say it was Memorial day it kind of transitioned it moved to keer Lake from 1986 to 1990 then it moved to poo Bay

1994 to 2006 that’s I think that’s when I first remember it um you know as a golf fan was they would always show it live they moved it to New Year’s Day once they moved it out to Hawaii and our remember tiger just beat the out of

Everybody in this thing he won seven of them um most of them weren’t even close I think maybe one of the issues with um why this thing isn’t around anymore was because they were so with only four players uh and and the way they chose the four players being the major

Champions you could have somebody like Rich beam that got hot for a week or whatever and by the time they got around to New Year’s Day playing this thing it was uh you know he he could throw an 84 on the board and and you know tiger

Shooting 66 or Phil Mickelson in 2004 shoots a 59 there were lots and lots and lots of lopsided results so um but I think world series of golf should probably get the credit for being you know one of the first ones that came along and really for uh taking a chance

On a little bit of a different format and a different uh you know different timing for this thing I could see tiger killing in this format now like one round you know just a sort of a A Silly Season course like that would be that would be kind of sweet this they could

Even bring the live guys into this Wolfie yeah so the hero um it began in 2000 um the first 13 of them were played at Sherwood out in uh out in California since 2015 it’s been in Albany um down in the Bahamas it’s got 20 players in

The field this year um I guess technically it’s supposed to be the four major championship winners it’s uh the top next top 11 in the owgr defending champ and then uh tiger you know obviously gets a spot himself and I think tiger gets kind of pick the uh the

Other three even though they’re technically called sponsorship spots but um pluses and minuses I don’t know how you feel about this one something about this one for me it’s never quite worked you know I it’s big names I mean it’s definitely of all the made for TV events

And the Silly Season events it’s always got the best feel but it just never quite clicks for me it other than like Patrick Reed uh you know digging sand castles into the sand like it doesn’t really feel like it’s had a lot of memorable moments uh you know tiger maybe hitting that one

Shot off his knees that one year I mean it’s just like it’s kind of just a blah thing other than like Tiger’s only ever story that sort of matters which I guess is speaks to a larger problem in golf in a lot of ways this is maybe exhibit A2

In the whole idea of um you know we complain all the time that we want different formats um you know the the whole discussion of designated events and and you know there’s only 20 guys out there that move the needle this is a prime example where they’ve got those 20

Guys but this still isn’t really moving the me needle is it because of the format is it because you know as viewers we sense that these guys maybe don’t really give a as much as you know we wish they would when they’re playing their you know their what essentially is

Their their friends on tour um you think that would they’d want to win this one more than the other ones but it certainly it doesn’t cross come across on television anyway wasn’t it this also the uh was the year that Stenson and spe played the

Wrong te’s that one time uh that was in the hero that that was other one of the very funny think that I remember just their kind of like discussion about yeah how badly they effed that up so it’s short St an interview and then and then Jordan’s standing right next to him like

Watching him like he was watching comedian like he was waiting for the punch line cuz he knew it was coming and then Stenson delivered yes so was just to go back and reload and uh but it was it was only two shots each so it wasn’t

A big deal and um other than I don’t I don’t know if you remember when this event got owgr points uh but that’s always like the big contention with the live guys of like saying like oh limited field no Cuts whatever the hero does it uh and you know Sol’s explanation I

Think has always been a good one is that it took like 20 whatever years for that to kind of unfold I don’t know if you have any insight into sort of you know that owr discussion whether it’s yeah what the hell they got points for the first time in 2009

Um I so it did took him a decade it it is 72 a stroke play um you do have to qualify for it you know that it’s four guys out of 20 so you you that get the spots so it’s you know it’s only uh you

Know 20% of the field I don’t like that they give everybody gets points all the way to the bottom that seems a little you know I mean essentially three guys get handpicked who are going to earn world ranking points for doing nothing I mean you can finish last place there’s

No cut uh it’s real golf I guess I I and you know as I’ve said before on different formats uh the guys are trying while they’re playing golf how much preparation are they putting in in the week or two leading up to it I think is

The the question back back to the World Series of golf real quick and talk I seen in the notes here that you have a fun fact here that Mike dika played in place of Curtis Strange please tell me as a quasi Bears fan please tell me all

That you know about Mike dika playing in this event sure so the year’s 1999 it’s still the event is still being held at keer Lakes just outside of Chicago um there’s only four players in this and and it’s being shown on TV so the difference between a three player field

And a four player field is is a problem um not just for you know U the competition but actually the the pace of play and the moving the cameras around everything that you know when they’re when they’re televising these things folks obviously you know we don’t think

About it while we’re watching but it’s not like a major championship where they got fixed cameras and they’re like waiting for the players to show up they’ve only got a certain amount of cameras and they’re kind of sprinting to follow the players around the most famous example this used to be when they

Would hel have the Shell’s Wonderful World of Golf uh matches between like two guys and they would they’d be playing in Argentina or they’d be playing in Brazil or someplace um they they would have one guy would hit a shot and then they would have to like drive

Over and set the camera up in soad these matches would take like eight hours and and there’s or they would like they would hit a shot and the camera wouldn’t catch it and the guy would have to rehit the shot and so when you’re watching the shells Wonderful World Golf there’s that

Is not what actually happened that day uh they played plenty of those shots because like they didn’t catch it the first time or they didn’t have a camera position or whatever so that seems unfair to let Ben Hogan take two cracks at uh at some GRE you know it does um so

Did 1990 um Curtis Strange is battling uh stomach issues digestion issues and apparently it’s been a problem All Season it it sounds like in doing some research this was not like a one time of thing where he agreed to play in this and then he backed out the last second

He he was having some genuine uh problems uh below the belt little ibf yeah little ibf stuff going so he calls him uh he calls the night before in the middle of the night and says I can’t do it I I I cannot I cannot go out in front of a

Crowd and play golf tomorrow like I that I can’t do that and so they’re struggling to find somebody it’s Chicago not a lot of PJ players hanging around Chicago I guess Jeff sliman wasn’t available or uh or FY hadn’t arrived yet in town and so um they make all the

Calls and now the clock’s ticking the crowd’s starting to show up I got to find somebody Mike didga had come out to the event he was just there he’s a six handicap wow I mean that’s you know a six I would have thought never guessed

That Mike was a six they asked di do you want to you know are you willing to do this and dika says sure I’ve you know he’s played in Pro AMS he’s you know he’s done this before so he’s not that nervous in in some ways getting an

Athlete or you know that that at least is you know foot is not gonna freak out over that stuff Plus and maybe not be Star Struck plus um you know he’s a local and he’s a CR you know 1990 he’s he’s riding pretty high as far as his

Reputation in Chicago so uh yeah he goes out he shot 42 on the front nine uh picked up a few holes in the back nine de posted a big dnf no card but uh yeah he did it you know they asked him and he

Did it so uh all right will V this we said you mentioned that the hero is 72 holes a stroke play snooze uh what other formats have they tried here you know tell tell me a little bit about some of these other approaches that they’ve tried to drop up interests during the

Silly Season yeah so the we had the PGA World Cup golf which like we talked about is uh it was it was just 18 holes um they would show nine holes each day but they filmed all 18 in one day they they transitioned that to two 18 hole

Rounds um that actually just made it more lopsided and and you know gave tiger a better chance to run away with it but they they have tried some other stuff over the years with different events uh you know if we start it kind of at the bottom uh one of my favorites

Of which was just um you know a hot mess I think from day one was the old ADT skills challenge I don’t know if you remember this one so this tell me all about it so so this was the weekend after Christmas I I think they figured

Out hey we got we got the uh Skins game it’s a big hit it’s on Thanksgiving let’s do the same thing and run it back except during Christmas Peter Jacobson uh I believe it was his production company that uh ran this and and for those that don’t know Peter has made a

Lot of money on the golf course and he’s made a whole lot of money uh outside the golf course being involved in stuff like this um he won the first two um that were held um it was essentially they had these different skills so they would

Have like a long Putt and a short Putt and longest drive and straightest drive and approach shot closest to the hole and they would have these different categories and then you would get points for for each category depending on how high you finished and then I believe

There was like a bonus like so if you won a category you got like a check for $50,000 for winning the category but you got points and then you would have like the overall winner it was supposed to test in theory like who had the best

Overall game in reality it was just a chance to get like eight guys together my favorite part about it was with they put them on these director’s chairs so they’re like their their feet couldn’t touch the ground because most of these guys are like 5 foot n it’s like it

Wasn’t until you saw that that you realized like oh yeah these guys are really some of these guys are really short including Greg Norman was much smaller on the director’s chair than you thought he was gonna look they put their names in the back of the director’s

Chairs the other thing that this thing exposed like you realize for me like as a kid watching this for the first time um other than that was OB pretty quickly obvious it was a money grab was like how unfunny these guys are or like how in the right environment like playing in a

Proam with people that are excited to play with them it’s they can be entertaining when they’re telling golf stories to Golfers I think it’s pretty entertaining when they’re trying to be like funny funny they’re not entertaining and and they maybe they think they are or they’re used to people

Laughing at their jokes but that was always the main take take away for me was uh how how bad like the Pinter patter was uh when they weren’t walking and they weren’t talking about golf shots they were just like making small chat while they’re waiting for the next

Uh skills challenge to be set up it’s what makes me worried about this um this this um evening Football League that tigers or uh uh Golf League that Tigers formed where they’re going to hit balls into the screen and all that stuff um to me um you know that they’ve promised

Some pretty cool techn technology type stuff but um they gotta find a way to keep our attention span and I you know is it just running in pton Manning and Charles Barkley and and getting people that are funny to carry it or you know How’s that gonna work say what you will

About Phil like Phil Phil was right Phil was wrong this and that nobody’s ever been like better at selling this BS than Phil like he is the ultimate proam person he’s the ultimate Silly Season like hey I’m gonna play with Tom Brady or PT Manning or whoever and I’m gonna

Give just enough ribbing and just enough weird like kind of watch this is for you uh in a workday kind of comments that that he’s it’s a shame that Phil can’t be involved in these going forward okay let me give you some fun we can’t get out of the skills challenge

Without some fun facts so um they started to struggle it turned into a mule Fest uh you know was Peter Jacobson and essentially his friends um shark was really the one that kind of was you know the biggest name that was that would have anything to do with this I think

They started bringing in non-golfers um most famously Mark Maguire in 2003 shows up he wins the longest drive 319 yards in 2003 uh you know good on marku and by the way he was the only W was not overseeing this competition Willie yeah he was the only non golfer in the field

Uh so he beat seven guys in longest drive my other fun fact Greg Norman his partner that he chose in 2008 when you could bring a partner or you could bring a caddy you could bring your caddy with you it was supposed to be like all the

Caddies like laava and and you know all these guys Norman no no he brings his son Greg Jr uh this is 2008 Junior wins the event um for his dad by hitting uh the short iron approach um which is the last category he hits a shot to one inch

And the uh Norman and Norman win the 2008 um ADT skills challenge my my other favorite uh fun fact from this event Rocco he he brings his caddy uh Matt AZ uh Matt chips holds out the bunker shot to help Rocco win it they win four out

Of eight events and they win like $230,000 and Rocco Pays His caddy the normal 10% so they don’t split at 1550 he just like gives him the he’s like C like you wouldn’t be here if you weren’t my cadd so like you’re getting the caddy money not the uh not the

Golfer money despite the fact that it was Mr AZ that H out the bunker shot in one Roo’s got some alimony to pay I think you know maybe a second condo that he’s leveraged on needs to make sure he takes care of his budget we’ve also got

So so getting to kind of you know a little bit closer to relevance I guess um another one that they would always have was the shark shootout um you know speaking of Greg Norman um the shark shootout was you know it was a Twan event it was uh different um formats as

Far as the scoring and things like that they switched around a lot this actually ran a long time it ran like 33 years um it was um it was only called the Sherk shootout for a little while I I don’t I always thought it was like that was

Always the name but I guess Norman was not involved all that much um it was you know I guess for like a decade he was involved but but after the WGC uh issues um he was um he was Shuff Out The Branding was just too strong to keep

Calling at the shark shootout yeah something like that um it was at Sherwood it was another one that was at Sherwood from ‘ 89 to 99 it was three days 54 holes um it had Partners you know this is another one where you know obviously this event is kind of

Transition to what today is the the Zurich down in New Orleans with with points and everything but even the Zurich even with giving the FedEx points to me they’re still something missing with um you know they they they do the alternate shot they they they alternate between alternate shot and um and beste

Ball um still not catching on I don’t know why but as a you know I love golf I like the PJ I love golf I like the PJ tour um this is one of those for me that in theory I should like but I just it

Just does have my attention span and I don’t know if that’s the participants or why but uh I don’t know how you feel about that one but um this is one to me that just never quite got there yeah I always wondered if maybe they could do

It like the the LPGA Crown thing where it’s like you know divided up into countries and maybe there’d be some sort of Allegiance for for each Squad uh that you would you could find yourself I want to root for South Korea I want to root for you know South Africa or Australia

Or United States and this I if you’re listening you know J Monahan like taking IDE IDE is I’m sure I’m high on your list of people you want to listen to but uh but that would be my my push all right um well let’s let’s jump over then

And talk about the the other event on the PJ tour calendar um that’s still on there um speaking to Jay manahan listening or at least somebody um you know they’ve called for a long time um you know we we’ve asked for it um we’ve always said you know mixed event with

Men and women they used to have one why don’t they have one they’re going to try it again this year they’re going to run it back so um first time in um quite a while we’re going to have um we’re going to have the it’s it’s going to be called

The grant Thorton from December 8th through December 10th it’s um 16 teams of uh one guy one girl um PJ T LPGA um co- sanctioned I guess you would say or co- uh co- bless seems pretty interesting $4 million purse it’s going to be played down at tiberon which is

Another one of those that it seems like tiberon and uh is always uh involved one way or another with with some of this stuff um the format um this year it’s going to be um Friday is going to be a scramble um Saturday’s going to be alt

Shot and Sunday’s going to be modified four ball now when they say a scramble what what are we talking about scramble here this isn’t like why I play buddy with my buddies in scramble where we yeah it is yeah so they’re both gonna they’re both gonna hit t- shots they’re going to pick

Which one they want to play they’re both going to hit second shots they’re going to pick which one of those they’re going to put the little te down and both putt from the same spot so uh wow I didn’t even know this was a possible in professional uh events I’m I’m excited

About that it this actually so so we’ll back up a little bit mixed events started um all the way back the JC Penney classic all the way back in 1960 um I didn’t realize it it went back I knew I knew of it um but I didn’t know

It went back that far until um doing some research for this so it began in 1960 it lasted in one form or another all the way through 1999 so almost 40 years um that there was a um a co-sanctioned event between the two tours um most famously probably was um

Tiger did play in it um 199 96 that fall he played in it with Kelly Cooney um little fun fact for you any idea who won in 96 tiger and Kelly Cooney did not win oh 96 I I do not know who would that be Mike Halbert and Donna Andrews

Captured the 1996 JC peny yeah wow tiger must still be stewing over that one yeah i’ would love to have tiger dropping Mike hbert references well yeah Mike hbert really really beat me up him down yeah uh another little couldn’t make any putts just couldn’t make anys another

Little fun fact for you about the original JC Penny classic um only one team ever won it twice uh Davis Love and Beth Daniel um they they teamed up uh two different times to win um you know scrolling through it I mean this never really had the biggest big names of like

Jack Nicholas um Arnold Palmer those type guys it had decent Fields it would kind of EB and Wayne um it it definitely seemed like the ladies were into it more than the than the men were were as far as you know wanting the exposure and stuff like that it was always tape

Delayed when they showed it so that probably didn’t help things either but um it’ll be interesting to see you know that it didn’t work the first time around is is has enough time passed and enough things changed in the world golf from 1999 to now to make it work all

Right well if we bring us full circle I want to talk about the Skins game just at the at the end here just because I brought it up in the beginning you know was the Skins game just a cash grab for like the olds uh I remember I I like I

Remember Lee trino and like Freddy Couples cleaning up in skins games over the course of my young life my dad was always like oh watch this this putts worth a $100,000 which seemed like an insane amount of money uh back when I was just starting to get into golf yeah

So so your memories right on Freddy Couples um so Skins game was around from 1983 to 2008 um it had a great um format right it was pretty easy to understand and it was also like I think like it was the right time and the right place it

Was always on Thanksgiving weekend that they showed it um the NFL always kind of deferred a little bit on that weekend I think to where like that was when a lot of the big college games were and so if you weren’t necessarily a fan of Alabama

Or Auburn or Ohio State or Michigan it gave you something else to watch especially kind of late afternoons and it I think it really just kind of struck gold too in the timing right it was like those early ones like in 1983 84 885 I mean it was Jack Nicholas it was Tom

Watson Arnold Palmer and they were still good enough that as long as playing against each other you know they looked they looked like pro golfers and and they weren’t really playing against guys that were driving it 50 yards past them so it was kind of inspired I think it

Was also the format was pretty easy to explain like to your mother or to your aunt who was like helping cook the mashed potato you know uh you know uh bake the pie for Thanksgiving dinner and and uh you were kind of ducking in and

Out and watching a little bit of a time it was really easy to explain to people um how it worked uh your memories are correct Freddy coupel dominated this thing he he made 11 appearances he won 77 skins and $4.4 million and those are all like high water marks in the 25

Years uh little little fun fact for you best year that anybody ever had Greg Norman 2001 he won all 18 skins oh wow all million dollars he got all 18 of 2001 that was the year that they tried like a validation type rule by 2001 they

They were fiddling a little bit with the rules and trying to keep it relevant and that year you had to like you had to validate your skin so if you want skin I think you had to like at least make a par on the next hole or you had to give

Back all your skins that may have F played a role in it but yeah old uh the great white shark uh swimming in deep Waters 2001 he wins all 18 skins my other uh thing that I remember about this was that tiger was always terrible

In him like he was it seemed like in some of the other formats he could he could either um just because of his competitiveness or whatever but but whether it was the format or the uh other guys kind of needle him a little bit or just uh you know whatever it was

Uh he played in six of them and he was bad in all six and uh and and some of the ones he played at too were kind of while he was at the peak of his powers and it just seemed like his uh you know the switch was not turned on for for

Tiger for these so well I will forever uh love bringing up the Gary Player Tom Watson incident uh particular because the Tom wat’s actually quote actual quote which I’m reading from The Washington Post uh recounting was I’m accusing you Gary you can’t do that I’m tired of this as if though perhaps Gary

Player’s reputation was playing a factor in Tom Watson watching him closely uh Gary won $150,000 that day which was the biggest like pay payout of his career shows you how different money money was back in the day so it’s fascinating with those guys I mean the uh especially kind

Of with the IMG and and Mark McCormack and I mean they they would tra they had to travel together so much to play exhibitions th you know those guys were were such big names compared to everybody else in the sport I think and they uh you know

They traveled the world together and and had to spend a lot of time um you know not just at major championships but a lot of silly events in one- day exhibitions and stuff and uh you know they had to be I guess friendly like on the surface level but uh because you

Can’t you know but uh yeah apparently some uh animosity behind the scenes so great stuff there I think it’ll be interesting it’s uh it’s something to do right it’s uh you know it’s it’s this is probably for sickos only some of this stuff but uh you know it it’s fun to see

It’s also maybe a little revealing of what some of these guys are like um you know away from their standard like I say 72 hole tour life same events every week um chance to see some different courses and uh you know um you got to kill some time somehow before uh the football

Comes on so for sure for sure well that’s what we got coming up thank you for the the trip down memory lane stuff well kbv thanks for thanks for coming by and uh you know adding some gravitas to this uh to this classroom wow I don’t

Know about that but thank you for having me it’s always a pleasure to you know I love these uh these look backs through history kind of strolls so uh thank you for for leading the way Professor well come back soon and uh and thank you again to holderness and Bourne um we

Appreciate it those are guys that are not silly um the stuff that they uh make is fantastic um and uh we appreciate all their support this this season so uh we’re looking forward to a good uh interesting and maybe a little silly end of the year thanks everybody for watching