WHAT HAPPENED TO SCOTT POLLOCK? How To Run a Football Club Ep4

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Hashtag Academy winner Scott Pollock returns to catch us up on his career so far, from winning YouTube’s biggest football talent search, to the Wembley Cup and League One football, and facing off against the likes Steven Gerrard and Wayne Rooney. What has he learned, and what is next?

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If you read this, type “Remember the name Scotty Perkins” in the comments.

Scott Pollock remember the name Scotty P is someone that will always be a huge part of hash history the first ever Academy winner aged just 16 he bagged man of the match at the Wembley Cup going toe-to-toe with Steven Gerard when I was subed on I was like right this is it no need to be nervous anymore but his prodigious Talent wasn’t appreciated by every ex-professional he faced up against and he basically lost his head with you cuz you were too good and he didn’t he like either he elbowed you I’m pretty sure he elbowed you after hashtag Scott signed Pro terms at Northampton Town faced Wayne Rooney in the FA Cup won the club’s young player of the season and helped them to League one his journey then took him to the highest tiers of non- League scoring for fun at Boston and securing a deal at an ambitious YoVille town but all wasn’t as it seemed being really honest the club made it sort of aware that we don’t think it’s going to be sustainable with speculations over different ownerships and stuff you you don’t know where your where your job lies cuz suddenly go part-time it’s not enough money then you’re going to have to get another job yeah it’s probably one of the trickiest situations I’ve been in as a player in my career with injury issues behind him Scott is raring to go again eager to prove he’s got what it takes to make it back to the football league but what has he learned in his early years in football and what lessons can he share as a young player making his way in the game how does he think a football club should be [Music] run all right mate how you doing and welcome back to how to run a football club I got a very special guest with me today not to say that my brother Seb isn’t special he’s more of a regular but the man next to him Scott bloody Pollock is back remember the name if you don’t know and you would have seen a little bit about Scott’s career and our little opening there this man is a man that’s very close to our heart Seb Absolut we found him on the streets of riger the faas what was it actually was London really wasn’t it was a trial you came to in London yeah yeah the back Streets of London back of something like South London or somewhere I think it was and uh 16 years of age and and won the Academy series which is like one of the best projects we do but also that first year was probably the best year of it we had like 20,000 applicants For That season um which is mad and so many good players probably that I didn’t even invite to trials CU I just couldn’t go for them all um but obviously Scott not only came down impressed it impressed us won it and then you know not just because of that but because of the talent this young man has since then has gone on to to create an honest little football career in professional football and uh we want to talk about that basically I want to do a little bit of a recap in everything that’s happened post hashtag we’ll talk a little bit about the Glory Days I like to call them and really the lowest level of football you have ever played and will ever play but for me they’re the glor highest we play the same team all of us abolutely he’s mad and uh that’s the beauty of football isn’t it but uh yeah and then just find out you know this is ultimately how to run a football club so as as much as I want to catch up with you I also want to dip into what you’ve learned about good football teams because you played for a few now in the sort of last four five years and what makes it good from a player perspective you know it’s our first active you know contracted player here on the podcast we want to have a little chat but first things first how the hell are you I’m all good it’s good to be back to be back good to see you both absolutely I’m doing okay you’ve never really been away from hashtag you’ve been very good at that I have to say you’ve always come back and supported us you know whether it’s at games you came back and helped us in the other hashtag Academy series as well which is massive because you were a massive you know like example for those people that are entering I basic want to be the next Scott Pollock and we we have milk that haven’t we how many times have we gone like be the next Scott Pollock I mean we might have many other Youtubers with some of the titles and thumbnails over the years as well you’ve been in some big YouTube videos not even associated with us as well like you do some massive stuff as well which is great um so okay you’re currently this like we’re going to go like in Chron chronological order at some point but just to give a overview of the current situation YoVille she’s a massive Club where you’re currently playing uh National League South right right now top of it you’re currently injured at the moment you haven’t played this season but what’s the current situation yeah so some people probably would have seen on my insta gave a little update about five weeks ago I had um surgery on my knee to get rid of a little floating bone which was causing me quite a bit of pain so how does that happen like how did when did you find out there was a floating bone in there and how does that even become a thing fair not for a while really yeah yeah after the season finished I was like right I need to get this sorted we’ll have an MRI yeah seen a specialist didn’t get picked up they didn’t see it they didn’t know no didn’t tell me and then seen another specialist didn’t tell me you just assume don’t you that you see a specialist and they’re going to sort you out that’s been the most frustrating thing is that Scott you know has not been able to play much football this year as he obviously wants to and all because of this little bit of bone you just don’t know it’s there you go and see people you think you’re going to come up with injuries some people think you know what’s going on with this NE what’s happening with it then you get the MRI all clear what the hell’s going on then yeah and eventually to find out there’s just this tiny bit of bone quite a simple procedure you had as well yeah well they just went in took it out took this bone out and then just side you up and that’s sort out he did say it was going to be a bit more complicated but it turned out it was easier than expected so recovery time probably two or three weeks less than what it would have been okay yeah I’m fascinated with with the act of buying a player or being sold or whatever and what you go through in that you know so I mean Seb I know you’ve been a big part of it so how did it all happen yeah well look Scott was abs absolutely smashing it at Boston and there’s a lot of interest in Scott go and move on to a higher level and plays opportunities all over the place international offers as well really yeah it’s very exciting time I mean Scott was playing in Midfield and he was top goal scorer at one point in the league for Boston I mean I’ve got the stats stats unbelievable 16 goals in 32 games like that is outrageous for a striker really and you weren’t a striker like and you you’re on set pieces I you got a good free kick on you as well you taking penalties pens as well does help help stat it’s the guy you want your F to now he’s the first name of the team sh in that um so yeah there’s a lot of interest and um y obvious been a massive Club they it looked very much as though they were being taken over by the own and the ugler family were to be taken over at YoVille yeah so there was an agent who’s representing YoVille looking to buy some players in YoVille sort of towards the relegation Zone looking to sort of solidify their league position and we’re looking at Scott as one of those players our first thought was look could be unbelievable but should and see how they get on and make sure they stay up first you enjoying it at Boston doing really well Boston didn’t want to let you go towards coming towards the end of the season as well so it didn’t F at the right time but then there was let’s be honest about it there was an opportunity that came in from yville there was just probably like an amazing opportunity to join a massive Club be a part of something new ownership Yo’s history I mean we know a little bit about it through through um Nathan Smith yes yeah we have y’s record appearance maker at hashtag right now you know um and he’s been unbelievable this year naan at the time I spoke to him I said like would he said amazing Club amazing people great place he obviously knew a lot about it um so it seemed like a really good time there’s a amazing opportunity to go down there uh for Scott to play for a huge Club amongst this period difficult period in the club’s history but on the dawn of this new new world yeah they’re spending a lot of money exciting project to be part of thinking about getting back into League 2 maybe and all that like not that year because it was a relegation crap at that point but the season after that what goes through your head when I mean people don’t know you’re like Northampton based like born and bred like sort of area MH um obviously Boston what was the journey to Boston like were you were you you don’t staying in Boston were you no no we’re part-time so it was two nights a week training and obviously game on a Saturday so it was a bit of commuting today what was what was the drive about an hour and 40 to the stadium okay and then they trained up in Doncaster right couple hours yeah okay and then what Happ so when you’re suddenly when YoVille come in the conversation was there ever conversation about whether you could do that staying at home is know you need to mve to overal what does that look like what that would be your first experience for that for you because obviously youve been at Northampton before it’s down the road yeah I know you kind of take it for granted when you’re at Northampton and I’m 15 minutes away from the training ground and you got players coming in from everywhere and they’re moaning about the traveling and you’re thinking but yeah when they’re obviously a full-time team like YoVille I know that it’s a commitment yeah to have a move down there or even go down there Monday Tuesday come back on your day off right you know you’re down there early on a Thursday yeah and a Friday so yeah it’s a lot to a lot to think about when you’re still quite young like myself and you’re moving away from home does the club help with stuff like that like do they is there like digs you can go in or is it like they might say here’s a good area you should look into or you some players you could live with or something like that yeah to begin with they were helpful with getting me a place with a couple of the other new boys assigned as well at the same time so get a un but not having do any of the work you get like a reloc allowance as well within a contract and that’s the biggest thing is that that because Scott did have a number of opportunities to where he could go because of the size of the club and because of how exciting you know the expectation was what was going to happen this big influx of capital into the club and get the club right back up the league system and Scott to be like a big part of that the new owners like really wanted him like made a real be line for Scott to be part of that team um but all wasn’t as it seemed sadly um because despite the fact that the new owners were like unveiled at the stadium like we went down there met them all like they in the director’s room the actual transaction never got completed and this fascinates me because absolutely you know we talk so much about how we try and run hashtags super sustainably and like we you know we’d never do anything like that would just be a bad use of money basically like how does someone and this is my understanding tell me if I’m wrong but how does someone that’s going to potentially buy a club start spending money at that club without owning the club isn’t that just Madness I mean I don’t know the answer to that question we should probably should maybe he’s up for it cuz you know he’s likes going on socials and stuff and you know he’s obviously now gone on well we’ll come on that in a minute I guess but basically the there was something that happened like there’s a lot of people that tried to buy y in the past it seemed as though there was some detail around one side of the contract to do the stadium that just didn’t got something like that I don’t know the ins and outs of it so it’s not fair for me to speculate but like the ugers are going to game they’re making multiple signings they’re in the office every day they’re they B fans clapping them at games and stuff they they’re running the club right and they’re spending money uh so Scott Signs goes down pass his medical signs on the dotted line starts going to training like it’s all happening and then all of a sudden you start hearing these things on social media that you’re still waiting for the previous owner to release something it doesn’t release and all this stuff you’re like what’s going on and then one day it just turns out that the deal’s off that they’re not buying the club anymore um so the person that’s bought you to the club the person that sort of sold not sold you the dream but like sort of said to you this is the project got be said that as far as I understand it that was not they doing they actually down there spending the money spending their own time and effort so it seem as though the previous owner who’s no longer the owner to make it more complicated basically stopped that deal going through so therefore the ugler family had no alternative but to move on they lost the investment that they’ve spoken about they’ve spent um and the club’s left now with an owner that was trying to sell with new owners that are not buying it Scotts just got to sign for the club what’s going through your head at this point Scott because you you were playing at this point that results weren’t going the way you needed in terms of the team to stay in league and you’ve you’ve like the guy who’s bought me here is not here anymore what where does that leave me sort of thing yeah it’s probably one of the trickiest situations I’ve been in as a player in my career because at the the business end of the season yeah with all the stuff going on above you with the managers and with the owners and stuff like that it’s it’s hard to focus on on what needs to be done on the pitch and it does reflect what happens on the pitch there a lot of chat about it training and stuff every it’s hard not to well it’s hard to just ignore what everyone’s thinking and you kind of have to get on with it but at the same time it’s hard to just focus on your football when other stuff’s going on yeah and the have massive there’s a massive uh ramification of a team getting relegated from that league as well which is a lot of teams don’t stay Pro when they drop into the National League South yeah so what’s the status of of Y overo now in terms of the amount of training you’re doing yeah they’re still fulltime still fulltime so how many teams you reckon a full-time in that league right now I think National League South is probably only maybe three or four because a league we know quite well because so we’ve got ay who’s women’s uh landlords um we used to been in the same league as them and the men they’re in that League they’re going quite well they in the playoff spots got champs for City in that League who’ve got Germaine Francis and Ben Brooks now got brain tree who we beat in the S6 cup also knocked us out the FA Cup a few years ago we got bit Revenge there and there’s quite a few teams that came down from that League into our League this year like d haml Concord Rangers and that for me has always been the big step up like we kind of always aim to get to step three and then sort of reassess cuz we know how much more expensive it gets but then you go from National League South to National League where most teams are pro yeah and it’s like it’s basically the fifth professional league isn’t it that’s like so when you come down out of That League it’s a massive change like you know it gets talked about in the Premier League when teams get relegated it’s the same for every League people are going to lose their jobs you know who’s it’s not just the players it’s coaches it’s people at the stadium so what is that like going for a relegation yeah it’s a different one with that obviously like you say it’s it’s a massive step down and as a player you don’t know whether you’re going to be part-time or you’re going to have to get another job yeah obviously a lot of the boys contracts ran out that season as well so it’s always more difficult to get another contract somewhere else when you’ve just been relegated from a national league and with speculations over different ownerships and stuff you you don’t know where your where your job lies if it suddenly go part-time and it’s not enough money then you’re going to have to get another job yeah so new so a new owner comes in so then another so another local businessman comes in and does buy the club uh although we’re led to believe and we haven’t got a chance to get to know him that well sadly um is that it’s not going to be the same level of resources made available to YoVille and then Scott’s been put on this contract from a in a different regime as well as a few other players and being really honest the club made it sort of aware that we don’t think it’s going to be sustainable um so look Scott might might need to find another club you know and the shame is there that Scott really at that point is thinking right where it’s annoying but going back down to you know still a decent level get a chance to be the hero be the man get the club back to where he just come down from um and then with the current injury has not been able to do that and so frustrating isn’t it CU even though you’ve gone down it’s like right I’ve just scored 16 goals in this level the year before not even a full season like let me at them sort of thing I’ll show you we’ll get back up like no problem yeah yeah hold my beer but the injuries that’s what happens right when you get an injury and then especially it’s a time of turbul turbulent time at the club of transition where there’s you know new owners coming in whatever all you want to do is get on the pitch and just show them what you can do do yeah you know especially it’s so much more annoying I imagine when the person who knows what you can do is the guy who bought you to come because he’s the fan obviously the ug guy because he must have been like seeing what you’re doing at Boston and he’s not there anymore yeah so like you haven’t been able to almost that’s thing obviously what happened there was must been a very difficult time for everyone involved in the club and I think a lot of the people that were brought in from that era that brief period where the ugers were there sort of gets put in a different box to the club it’s like oh you know gets a little bit there’s a little bit of arms length between it I think there’s been a factor of that this year as well um the ugers have gone on and and bought a new club now they running York City okay um but we’ve not had any discussion with them really ever since that period the focus has always been on Scott just doing what he want to do play football right just want to go play football I think that was what was most frustrating is I guess people didn’t understand this kind of what injury it was you see me playing and then see me playing one week it’s like Well it can’t be anything too wrong with you because you’re playing one game 90 minutes and then you’re not playing the next so are you just like picking and choosing when you’re playing or is it ging injury yeah that’s the worst thing about football right is that the fans are often the most uninformed people they care the most they don’t know the most and so they’ll be like they don’t know if it’s like a a character thing or it’s which obviously we know it isn’t because we you know Scott and never would be that case but people haven’t got any information so they just guess they just make stuff up and it’s like okay that’s why I things like this are good for now this one of the big things that’s changed in football I’d say in the last sort of 10 years is footballers can just come and tell you how it is you don’t have to be hiding behind the whoever like the club or whatever so I think um that’s good and you know the good news is it seems like the lights at the end of the tunnel this injury is going to be over pretty soon and you can get back to playing which we all want to see um let’s talk about some of the your earlier playing memories and like I want to go through your career because it is it’s still a long hopefully long career left to go and a lot more trials and tribulations but what you’ve done already is amazing especially if you think about the kind of inception of it because like so you were academies growing up weren’t you but you were a goalkeeper yes that right yeah so never like officially like signed as an academy player okay so like players when they’re like six and seven they actually get signed and yeah progressed through the whole years of Academy but I was never one of them so you were like just Sunday league but weren’t you involved with something with leester at yeah yeah so that was they had like an academy and then they got like an elite yeah the elite the elite underneath which I was 12 12 13 as a keeper both so wow well combo I know some some days because it’s it’s obviously not the academy and it’s not as professionally run still like very good level and obviously these players have kind of maybe been atmy before and they’ve not resigned with something so you get a good mix of players yeah but some uh games because you have games like every half term on Saturdays and Sundays and sometimes the keeper wouldn’t turn up see to go so I think the coach knew I was kind of like a bit of both I’ve seen weird you know he’s the sort of guy that’s just good at everything taken up golf a little bit in the last few years he played together he’s decent at that compared to how new he to the sport I remember the moment where I knew he just one of them guys you know where it was Jersey about back flips yeah it’s soak King down pissing with rain we’re going for why did we go for what we went for walk like five or six of us and you just stood on this like wall in your slippers slers and you did a what so many things could have gone wrong there I was just like he’s just one of them guys that can just do stuff I was just like okay no I mean that for me that’s one of the things that separates like the the elite uh athletes when the people that are just like half decent is they just can do it I mean Alex’s brother’s the same you know he’s in he was in the UFC but he’s so good at everything you know any sport he’s really good at football and he’s never played football like it’s just so annoying so annoying but um but yeah you you’ve certainly got that trait and we were always so impressed with you but I think what’s really interesting is first of all the fact that you weren’t in those acmy growing up right like it’s a massive uh like B of Mo motivation for people watching out there AB that you don’t you know if someone hasn’t believed in you yet or given you that opportunity don’t stop because 16 you say it’s fairly late really to sort of come into it and it wasn’t a straightforward path either so you applied for this this series come down MH I mean you were the best player on the first day we all knew it I don’t think we necessarily knew you were definitely going to win the show on the first day do you think you did say remember the name Scott po famously name wrong yeah I had a friend so rememberable the reason being I don’t if I’ve ever spoke about the reason being is that I played all for a union of a guy called Scott Perkins of course you did um shout out Scotty Scotty Perkin and Scotty Perkins was also called Scotty P when I got the interview I first said I remember the name Scotty Perkins I was obviously talking about Scott but I said Scotty Perkins thankfully we cut that bit out the Ed we got might have we might have I don’t know if rush if we do we put in yeah um yeah it was just stand out wasn’t he the from one of the youngest in competition of if not the youngest yeah and the other thing cuz we did a couple trial days I think it was the first day you came down we had done some of the others yet so we didn’t know who else we were going to find but then we get like later on in the series we start doing the sort of physical and Technical tests and you just start scoring free kicks and things we’re like okay this this guys built different um the back flips in the quter yeah and then obviously there was a whole we we won’t get into that series it’s all on YouTube you want to watch it forget it’s actually on my channel not the hashtag channel so the same channel you’re watching this on um series one but there was a whole with your your your your co- finalist Jack Durkin and this whole press UPS thing and that probably actually took a bit of the Shine off cuz you you would have won anyway I think but no disrespect to Jack I think that the fans knew you were that level yeah but because he had this whole thing about his press ups and nonsense it took a bit of the Shine off it I think which is a shame but certainly didn’t long term off the back of that you come and join our first team it’s worth saying we took about seven or eight players from that Series in the end because like you didn’t have to be as good as Scott to improve our team yeah yeah and but so people ask me a lot about you they say like did we know you were that good and I always say like I knew you were way better than anyone else we had play for us for sure but I don’t think any of us could known what level you go to because it’s such an opinion based thing it’s about opportunities right I think you know we we certainly helped with that but I never take credit for it because you have to go and perform and do the things you do and you’ve there’s loads of other routes which will get on down to you’re doing off your own back as well but for me the big one that I was thinking about is the wemy cup you know we had this massive game 34,000 people the biggest wom cup that ever was third one uh and you know I’m make this a little bit about me here because I like to it’s my claim to fame when it comes to you Scott is I made the decision not to start you in the game I remember the conversation people ask me about this so they’re like why did you not start Scott poock in that final bear in mind you know it’s not you know there’s so much riding on these games I know it isn’t a professional football game but for us it’s like our lives like we don’t yeah we’ve got all these people watching you millions of people in the we don’t want to lose we want to win why did I not start our best player cuz you were our best player and I even said to you when I didn’t start you you our best player yeah and it was basically a combination of um people have been there longer which is like half of it and it’s like the whole you do the right thing by the players we had a sort of set we had we played our very functional 442 and like that we didn’t really know where your best position was at that point we knew we could play you anywhere it wouldn’t be a problem I was like who do I bring him a Scott and I thought actually you are also 16 years old and there’s also 34,000 people out there and weirdly I’ve actually played at Wembley a couple times at this point and I was probably I I’m not saying for any second you were nervous but I can imagine a world where you would be quickly proved he wasn’t exactly clearly what I thought is take the pressure off him let’s set the boys out there and then use Scott as I knew we were going to do roll and roll off as well and you know we had Martin Kean as our manager and I said to Martin look there’s a few funny stories there I was telling him to get Robbie Fowler off ASAP for Dan Brown and he was like Robbie Fowler I was like it’s D brown but I said to him listen get this kid on as soon as you physically can don’t wait just get him on as soon as a good time to do it he’ll win us the game and I pull Scott to one side and I knew Scott wouldn’t be like annoyed CU he’s Pro and he’s very good attitude but I wanted to make sure you didn’t think it was an oversight and I was having a stink I was like no I think I know what I’m doing this SC I said look and I hadn’t said this to him before and I don’t think I said it in any videos at this point but I said Scott look you’re our best player everyone knows it you’re going to win us this game you’re going to come off the bench really soon you’re going to win us the game like don’t worry about not starting there’s a sort of idea there and then you know what happens he comes on gets three assists man of the match so you’re welcome basically is what I’m saying no what’s your memory of that the same as I remember I was fuming abely I was like I’m leaving this club I can’t seie Don where they wer even born them were they no they were around they were around there for sure no no back then I was like yeah I wasn’t even thinking about to be fair I probably turn up on the day not expecting to start anyway fair I was 16 I was like just enjoying the day yeah probably could have paid played 10 minutes and been what M that would have been ke probably done it as well if I hadn’t insisted he was getting a bit power hungry I was like you don’t know any of these players mate just let me tell you who’s good anyway but what was the actual day like for you in terms of when you did come on because it must have been amazing yeah okay there’s there’s a there’s a myriad of levels on the pitch you know it’s not you got I’m on there you got YouTubers who are just you know basic footballers but then you’ve got Steven Geral and Steven Geral I think quite quickly worked out you were a problem for them and he was trying to get near you like he was and and this wasn’t step jard now this was Steven jard like 6 months postretirement and he was Unreal a um but like you have to pinch yourself cuz you just like you’re what probably six months prior to that you never you just watched a few of us on YouTube sudden you’re playing at Wembley yeah it is weird to think obviously how quickly it kind of just all developed but I’ve always said I was more nervous the moment we went up to went out to warm up then actually me coming on all the people there I don’t know why it was just surreal like actually being on the pitch yeah warming up and kind of seeing all these Pros or ex pros and then when I was on I was like right this is it yeah no need to be nervous anymore it’s like you also have seen everyone else you like this won’t be a problem but yeah I mean what a moment like one one of my most proudest things that we get to do in YouTube is when we get to find people like you like and that’s what one of the reasons we did that series like we want to make a good series obviously that’s what we do really that’s what I do I tried to do on YouTube I knew we could make our team better but the most important thing was I wanted to we were only getting to do this ridiculous stuff because of the viewers so I was like I actually want it wasn’t actually the second and third series cuz we found you second and third series turned into like let’s really find some talent and we’re now non- League team let’s get better but the first Ser was really about rewarding our viewers we didn’t know who we were going to find and it’s like let’s get some of them to come on these trips with us you know you came to Spain with us we got a great story we should talk about what happened in Spain with Scot actually um I if you remember it but I remember it and then I’ll bring up in a minute but then um uh yeah it’s the idea it’s like we talk about Stampy works here now he came from the same series as you you know he’s work with us for like four or five years and there’s a load of other people that have come through oh the Riff thing but yeah so I’m really proud of that so fast forward let’s talk about Spain so we do a little La Liga tour we go and play Rao Vio and iar’s staff teams you know again real mix of some of them coaches maybe a couple ex players in there but also like the social media guys like we won both games fairly comfortably you know it wasn’t it was a good level of opposition we had picked him well Saidi um but do you remember what happened in the iar game we played iar and they had an assistant manager or assistant coach whatever he was who’ played a proper level he played La Liga he was maybe pushing I don’t know he was in between 40 and 50 somewhere I’d say he wasn’t under 40 but he wasn’t over 50 let’s say 45 and he basically lost his head with you because you were too good and he didn’t he like even he elbowed you I’m pretty sure he elbowed you yeah vaguely remember some between yeah probably yeah well I mean we can choose over Rel this in the video or not but at the time we were trying to look after relationship so we we took it out the video cuz it was it wasn’t just that he elbowed you there was like it all went mad everyone kicked off they were basically saying that we were too good I think and we’ bought two good players for it he was like your eyear you could turn up with anyone we don’t know if you turn up with your Academy boys you know it happened in Atlanta in America they turn up with their under 23s and started killing us so we we’ve just bought our Sunday league boys basically plus this kid we found but yeah it kicked off and they they absolutely lost his head their guy I can’t remember his name if I can remember we’ll get it up now and name and shame him and we had to take out the video because um made him look bad basically it was a La Liga sponsored thing and they were like this makes eyb look terrible but that’s another case of you getting people’s heads from I think was it him that was like few I me took his shirt off and then threw we probably had the footage somewhere just lost the plot I do remember it a little bit Yeah but it’s not about him it’s about Scotty P this episode so post that you actually only played I think 13 games for hash which is mad you know you’re a club Legend and until you actually have dropped out the Hall of Fame now I think there not the Hall of Fame sorry the the best 11 we do and that’s purely on appearances I think you’d be in there on Mobility for sure fa as fan voted I think you’re on the bench I I don’t think I made the first te um but any of us are in yeah I think you’re on the bench to be fair seie definitely on but um obviously we got players who play like 100 our games now but it says a lot about it that you were in the first uh fan voted best 11 for 13 games to your name and there’s people that have played 8090 that weren’t in there um but you only played 13 games and I your debut was at the Emirates I think was your first game yeah yeah which is again amazing and um then what was happening simultaneous to this which people may not know people outside of Northampton might not know this is you were enrolled in the Northampton football and education program yeah so what is that tell us what that is yeah so when I was or when I first joined hashtag is it May June time yeah it would have been 2017 GCSE year I think or year after gcse’s so I was like Sunday league and hashtag that was it Sunday League hashtag that’s my football and then obviously I needed to do something after after school so in the summer I applied for this football and education program it’s basically like football and college which is a dream really you play football every day with your mates and you still get a B Tech degree out of it so yeah I was doing that uh then the preseason with them which is all under Northampton as well so you’re still associated with Northampton but you’re just basically the level below the youth team yeah so it was a dream for me it was like right how they pitched it as well was you can get into the youth team yeah and I think a lot of other people were like okay I just want to do this because I don’t know what else to do where I saw that that stood out to me I was like right here’s a pathway into the youth team yeah which is what I want stay with Northampton smash it here and I can get into the youth team that was my that was my main aim because that’s the thing with that we we actually were going to do one ourselves and we only didn’t do it because of covid unfortunately we couldn’t do the trials we needed and it kind of got parked after that but ultimately often those things do sell that dream to players don’t they go I wantest to come in a role and you might play for us one day 99% of the players are never going to do it and I don’t think anyone had ever done it in Northampton before no but you again just like you gave us this you could be the next Scott Pollock you gave Northampton and probably every other the same sort of Education Program around the country the perfect poster boy like you could be the next Scott poock again come and do our course and you might play in League two League one like not just the you to be going so ended up that’s what I’m saying yeah yeah you you surpassed their their best dreams of just getting into the youth team you ended up as a fully signed pro at Hampton you you were there coming through League two they got promoted to League one you know I mean let’s talk about your time at Northampton in general because we were just so proud weren’t we seeing all that kickoff and the main one for me was was the FA Cup against Derby yeah Wayne Rooney and Scotty P Sharon the two of remember the name remember the name collaboration yeah what was that like playing against Rooney yeah that was another surreal sort of that’s playing against Pro like we’ve played against the pros like when they’ve washed up no it’s harsh not washed up when they’ve retired some of them washed up some of them most good uh whereas Rooney was literally it was still a joke yeah Less in the home game at Northampton I guess replay yeah played him twice the first not leg as such but the first game was at home at Northampton and he kind of he didn’t shine too much then but the second leg he was like back to his usual self CU he would only been about 33 cuz he retired fairly young really I think about 33 34 the time so what year was that that game 2020 early 2020 2020 okay so I’m trying to work so it’s like less so it’s like two and a half years since you applied for hasht Academy and did all those YouTube games you’re playing against Wayne Rooney and you’d have been what 19 18 19 was 18 then that’s crazy is it wild what what a trajectory and it’s so fascinating the fact that this has come about late really like it is late isn’t it like you know do why do you think teams hadn’t looked to you do you think you improved late do you think you blossomed late like why weren’t you in Academy s man dog just rubs off on you he taught me a lot to be fair yeah shout out man yeah I don’t know it is cuz I’d never say I just suddenly became like good at everything in football it was always like a slow progression were you were you playing the school level like I was always playing you the best player in the year would you say well I was football was never like the main thing when I was like really young like Primary School it was just enjoy sport I like Sport and that was it it wasn’t all them other mates in Sunday League teams I never played Sunday League till I was 11 okay so that’s probably part of it then cuz the kids get snapped up so young now don’t they if you’ve been playing I wasn’t in the shop window for any club no unless someone’s filming me in my back Garden or something like that’s the only way they’re going to see see me play yeah cuz that’s all I do I get home from school train in the garden that was it it’s mad you got good from that yeah because I mean it’s not quite the same but we’ve got a go plays for our women’s team now Malika she’s unreal player and she didn’t play uh like organized football until she was like 20 she just played in The Garden of her family yeah and then you know okay women’s football like maybe you can have a slightly faster trajectory there’s less levels to to to climb but like she not only turned up just a joke but she was like got better so quick as well cuz you got so much room yeah to grow because you haven’t had all that training yeah you feel like you can still obviously you’re going to still improve anyway you’re not anywhere near your Prime yet but do you think you can improve quicker than other people your age because of that definitely years ago it was like CU a lot of people just start an academy at 6 and they get to 16 they they’ve done 10 years of like not full-time football but pretty much full-time football in a professional environment yeah they get to 16 it’s like it’s basically you’ve had a career yeah had a 10year career and it’s either make or break and then when it breaks and they drop a couple of levels the motivation isn’t there to like yeah to go back up non league litat with players I’ve seen a lot of players do that where they drop off they like oh my god I’ve dedicated 10 years of my life for this they not made it where I was on the up like start at 11 enjoyed Sunday League literally no pressure just enjoying Sunday league and when it gets to that which even in my mind it wasn’t make or break it was just make like yeah it wasn’t break for me it was like all right I’ll just go you said your identity wasn’t wrapped up in football and that’s like I think we look at it probably now as like parents as well Seb we think about you know what if our kids are going to do any sport and stuff and you know if you’re if you’re desperate for your kid to be a footballer you might make them start doing silly amounts of hours from 3 four years old yeah project like if you’re if that’s your thing if you’re like you know Richard Williams I think his name is the Serena and Venus’s dad like you’re you you make you make a whole 50 page dossier about their career and had them grinding hours and hours a day the thing that scares me about ever doing that with my kids is like if they don’t make it you’ve taken their childood away they never make movies about them ones do they no that’s the thing how many children’s lives have been Shattered by false self-esteem because they’re pushed into something how many people didn’t become tigerwoods or Venus Williams or Ser Williams and the route you took if you designing it would be the perfect route for your child to do but the only problem is you’re relying on your kid being just like a natural Talent which I think is what I would class you as like not I don’t actually believe in natural talent in the sense of you’re born of it but I think you have basic things like coordination and things and you work on that and and some people have an ability to sort of compound that really quickly I think 10,000 hour thing comes to right so these kids that you’re talking abouty olds they’ve done their 10,000 hours by 16 you definitely wouldn’t have certainly not in an organized environment so that means you wouldn’t be classed as a child prodigy in these Wayne Ries that do what they do at 16 but it does mean you can Peak late and you can keep going and I think the mental part of is huge yeah so that’s the plan yeah that’s what we do but I mean listen we’re so excited to see where you go next you know you you were you were at Northampton you you got loaned out a couple times times didn’t you or you went to stots stot neots I’m saying it right stot stot yeah St neots stot yeah which at the time were a step three Club yeah so the same level hashtag at now that was on loan from Northampton yeah that was with the youth team you at the youth team so towards cuz how it works with the youth you play a season August till Jan right as the Merit league as it’s called and then it splits so the top six going to meet the other top six of another area but a lot of the time clubs will put pretty much their second years out on loan okay give them experience and then see if they’re good enough for a contract was that the year that you were absolutely tearing it up in the in the academy numers were just crazy top scoring that as well weren’t youa 16 goals as what position were you playing Midfield yeah yeah it’s just yeah yeah remember all that and we saw some clips and stuff from it and it was just like okay so they probably thought right we need to get you out adult football men’s football just to see in there I don’t know but in their mind they might have thought okay we’re going to give him a contract but let’s just check couple of months he’s good enough so what was that like CU you’ve gone now from playing Sunday football like you say hashtag like with a load of random guys then you’ve gone to northampton’s sort of Academy setup suddenly you’re in a non-league environment very different right I remember the first game and very mind there was only probably 700 people there it’s not bad we’ll take that day still all right but I remember we scored a last minute goal to win 1 nil and that was the first time I get that like buzz of oh my God looking at the fans like means something hugging me they don’t even know me yeah like debut this game yeah debut on this game and they’re hugging me and like I can see the the happiness it brings and that was step three yeah I think they were like mid-table or towards the bottom so it was a massive like result and that was the first time I felt oh my God like this you were what 17 18 you 17 17 yeah you’re probably youngest player there yeah basically what Ted C is for us now 17y old and um what were the players like did they welcome you yeah yeah good good lads yeah like was it cuz I mean I don’t know what was like that club but a lot of non- League clubs sort maybe less so now I think players are a bit more serious with athlet athletic Behavior but earlier years it was a lot of drinking culture and stuff and you weren’t even been old enough to do that so you was wondering these youngsters come in like how how much can they get involved but they looked after you yeah yeah I think a lot of older Lads are always wey like this youth team’s coming in from a big like Northampton like he’s going to take my place all right’s see what he’s see what he’s about out and then as soon as I think the whistle went a couple of nice touches passes few dribbles and then I think they they were like okay this is where I do think hashtag D should get a little bit of credit here because so many and I know this for a fact so many players at your AG would not have ever played adult football yeah and even I’m not saying the standard was anything like step three but you had done that with us not only a handful of times but still you’d gone up against people double your age in in we played in M played out wide played you a couple positions and like again things like the wem cup like yeah they’re all adults again not all that level but if you can handle that 30,000 people you can handle 700 yeah and I think that that is just I as a region pochettino’s no trusting us with Ted isn’t there yeah it’s a great opportunity especially now like so I think that is you’re right I think there is a great what he been able to um create is that environment like what a great opportunity for us to play in front of 34,000 people I’ve still got bloody pin tweet I probably would have the rest of our life those things but for you at 16 to get a taste for that and then to build on that platform cuz one thing we’ve missed very quickly Mark brigh was commentating that day presenting it he been involved in Palace he spoke to the guys at Crystal Palace this guy got you want to check him out it started before that this is another base of evidence of how much I backed you before that game is so markb commentates theot the games like you say and I’ve known him quite well by this point because he’ done three of them so he would always ring me before and ask me who to know who he should know about cuz he wouldn’t be familiar with the YouTube players and I’ll be like oh yeah Chris MD’s got a bit and all this sort of thing and I go but you only need to know one name I say you need to know name Scott Pollock and he was like all right he was rolling his eyes I was like no listen you know I I’ve never told you like any of these guys are serious players I’ve never said this YouTube is going to go pro or whatever I’ve always told you they’re good relatively speaking I said but this kid like actually could and I said if you’ve got anything about you you’ll invite him to trial Crystal Palace he was like okay got anything about you honestly me and Mark me and Mark talk all the time right if you’re watching this you know and then obviously you do what in the final he Rings me up and he goes yeah we should talk about that Tri yeah I remember in the in the interview the man of the match interview he was like he was kind of asking a few questions like oh you so you playing for anyone how old are you again like and I don’t think he said then but after he was yeah obviously Bri is a palace Legend he’s very involved over there he’s big part of the club especially with the academy he is a great guy but um what was that process like so you went down there again You’ been 16 yeah what did they do you’re on trial what does that even mean like yeah so there was a few other trial um invited for that week but they had a they had a big Squad at the time I think the 18s were with it was like the 17s and 16s cuz when I was there it was like halterm as well so a lot of the 16s were there which I guess helped me kind of integrate a bit better cuz a lot of them were like two or three years older than me yeah so it was even hard enough impressing a Premier League club yeah Premier Leagues with 18s and 19s and I think even one of the trial games it was like 21 22 year old that people six years older and I’m trying to impress yeah over them so you got goal and assist in you in the first yeah yeah that’s the thing I knew that jump was I mean that’s the thing we’ve got to be realistic as well right because like we know a lot more now and I certainly know a lot more about the levels through what we’ve done the last five years of hashtag and I did then but we’re talking about literally non not even non- league and a not in a league team to the top tier league in the world it’s a massive jump so you could have gone in that trial and you could have come back and you could have gone like oh mate they were so good and I’d have been like fair enough let’s see where else we can PCT you in but understanding is you did pretty well in that trial like and I don’t know if we can find it cuz it’s years ago but we actually sent Lewis down with thing we got some footage so what was your impression post that like you know I I can’t relate to the football terms but one thing we thought about I was thinking about when we were talking about what you did at the wemy cup is I was thinking about how I used to do stand-up comedy and how I always think that was the best preparation for me to do all this stuff because if you can go and do stand up in front of people and try laugh and you learn more from the bad gigs than the good gigs when they don’t laugh and you’re like you want the world to swallow you up if it didn’t happen much but if if you can do that then everything else is easy it comes to presenting it’s like I Ive never been nervous for presenting ever cuz I did that so think the same for you when you’ve done wembly cup 34,000 people yeah what 700 the same for this it’s like this trial reminds me a little bit of like some of the auditions I used to go on and you you think audition to be a presenter or audition to be whatever and you think oh I nowed that I you know you get your hopes up maybe like actors go through this all time and you don’t get the phone call you do get the phone call it’s bad news like did you leave thinking something was going to come of it I think I probably didn’t grasp the whole situation as much as I should have okay well in terms of how you in terms of I was still wanting to like impress and I was hungry for it but I remember a few times I took a little bit of a back off I was like okay some of these are right some of these are really good and they’ve been there for years and I think even being like a London team you get a lot of like more hungry players than you on the pitch okay and coming into a new environment it was like you’re not scared or like not too nervous but you’re like okay well I don’t want to you maybe showed him a bit too much respect a little bit too much respect yeah and so is that would you say that’s a regret I mean not to you say you should have a regret because you gone on another career but do you think it could have been different if You’ done something different yeah not a regret because I still enjoyed the experience and like you said with your standup that was probably my stand up for traling with the youth team when it came to traling with the youth team I wasn’t nervous it was like all right yeah everyone else here even though you’re already part of the academy I’ve got an equal chance to as well so stepovers with ankle weights on you take him off and he’s like I think it’s such a good advice for anyone watching this not even football related like go and try and do the hardest thing you can think you could ever do the thing that scares you the most and the rest of your life yeah everything will be easy that that probably helped me get into the academy it was I remember a friend of ours mutual friend of ours you played with him at hashtag uh real name husin Isa but Tea’s Guru as we used to know who’s now by the way set peace coach at Arsenal which is so cool right and diding a very good job from what I hear he knew the guys at Palace or some involvement with Palace and he said to me before you went there they ain’t going to take him because they only take massive physical guys yeah and I was like well that’ be a shame if that and I’m not saying that’s true by the way like but that was on the impression they had a bit of a reputation for that was how they recruited and I think there’s a lot of teams that have done that famously did you feel that I was probably the smallest there really okay interesting well I think there was like either the extreme of tiny really technical ridiculously technical or massive big units but you were 16 and there was Lads older than you as well you’ve grown since then that’s where I probably gave him a little bit too much respect like okay looking at the size of everyone else yeah yeah yeah maybe I don’t fit in here right okay interesting Yeah well yeah so kept bounc back from that obviously went did your stuff at Northampton got through there went to on loan came back they like say got promoted to League one had the game against Rooney some epic stuff how do you sum up your time at Northampton because it is like your Boyhood Club in many ways isn’t it like I think you’re a Leicester fan as well though aren’t you family yeah like actual Club Le in terms of supporting a club Leicester when they won the league always yeah northampton’s your local team and you got to play for them yeah like and so how did that come to an end at time at Northampton what was what was the process uh so yeah the the last season I was was there I didn’t play too much okay it was kind of new manager coming which was actually my youth team manager so a lot of the time you expect all right like you’re young like youth team manager comes in had a good relationship and stuff like that you just expect to play which is obviously not the case in when it comes to professional football it’s like people’s careers on the line no friends no first managerial season for him as well so it’s obviously a lot of pressure but also what a massive change from being a promotion chasing team yeah when you can try things like try youngsters out and give them a chance to suddenly every game you lose you could get sacked like you know it doesn’t allow for experimentation does it yeah so after that season it was kind of um didn’t play as much as I’d like to still started a couple of games and scored a goal um yeah scored a goal that season but just didn’t get remember you scored that goal and you got into the side yeah and it looked like you were going to get a running the team and playing well and then you got that like that wound didn’t you got like a stud on your ankle was it uh that was season before that season before was it okay it seems to me that you got like unlucky with like he’s in the team now and then some would come back and time that like the CO as well yeah ex had a great run just before Co happened and there was a few injuries and we had forest green on the Saturday and then I was like well I’m going to start we’ve got no midfielders fit and I’ve played like the last three games and then got announced on the Friday right everything shut downed I mean K’s got a lot to answer for um with football young footballers for sure because a loot of footballers that just that was the period where they got released and they didn’t get to play for a year and he just killed their careers like luckily it didn’t do that for you so so your contract came to an end at Northampton and so you you’d been on loan at Boston already hadn’t you yeah in Fe feed March Time they’ loaned you out to Boston who were National League North at that time as well and you’re obviously impressed there because when they got the chance to they snapped you up on a on a permanent transfer yeah so what so first loan when you went there did you think this might be somewhere that I’d come back yeah I remember the first game out on loan it was like a bit of a relief I was starting it was a great ground there good fans decent level as well and it was a bit of a derby match Boston versus kin so it was like I think there was probably 3,500 or something there like massive game wow and I’ve waited a long time to actually get the opportunity to start a game so literally first 10 minutes I think AC cross came in header scored already on my deut I was like okay this is this is nice like loves it man for the bigas end up winning the and they’re pushing for promotion as well so I was like this is a good club I felt quite respected there and it was a good time then I got recalled four weeks later back to Northampton to start because they had a few injuries so that’s where it first came about with Boston it’s worth pointing out for our American view as well this is not Boston in America this is Boston in England every chance Boston in America was named after Boston in England to be honest like you know so just don’t know your role but um yeah I think when I watch this stuff from afar like you know ni obviously keep up to date with your career and we chat every now and then but it’s so nice when I see like Scott Pollock on on the score sheet and stuff and we just think everyone’s getting to see what we know so for you you’ve you’ve played in Northampton in the in the efl you’ve come out you’ve gone on loan and then permanently signed National League North yeah you’ve then had an unbelievable season National League nor we’ve almost caught up now to how you went to yal but my question for you is because you’re still young right and you haven’t had like enough time in terms of multiple Seasons back to back of playing loads of games to know really where you level out like and you probably are going to still get better when you get those games under your belt so like what’s your ambition like what is you’ve played the levels you know when you came out of efl and you’ve went we we’ve seen the goals the stats don’t lie so like you’re not I I know you’re not a national league North player like or South player you’re definitely seedings higher because what you’ve done now things happen in timings you had your injuries and whatever but what what’s your aim I think obviously after this injury have a good full season again of playing yeah that Boston one was probably the first time I’ve played I think it was like 42 games even with the injury 42 games of like 90 minutes competitive football so another season like that or two and then take me to back to the efl I think yeah he got a bus he played there at a younger age yeah not now have the chance to improve since then get run of games I think you’ll find that I wouldn’t want to put a level on you m to be honest I would definitely I think when you shown that as a younger man you being competitive in a very good Northampton side and you’ve got so much bigger physically since then really grown up strong I remember one time I had seen you in a few months like Jesus Christ there’s like another of you where you all a sudden just manned up sort of thing just found his man strength so yeah I think definitely but um it’s very exciting mate like so good now to be feeling at that point where finally got to the bottom of what this silly bit of bone was to have you now so close I mean as we film this now you’re going back down to y tomorrow see the physios down there and finalize that plan to be returned to to full fitness and whether it’s going to be y or another club like there’s there’s an unbelievable player that someone’s going to get and I’ll say this even next to me but it’s not just about a player when I’ve spoke to various clubs it’s it’s it’s the man you’re getting as well which is so key there’s so many players that have got the talent but then let themselves down with their application or their attitude that’s one thing you can’t really teach you you look at some of the players that you know hasn’t worked out for like the likes of like Ravel Morrison The Unbelievable Talent Alex fergon saying he one of the best players ever had but just wasn’t able to apply that Talent we know you’ve got the talent You’ proved it but one thing you’ve definitely got mate is you’ve got the most unbelievable at and your your dedication to your craft like I know how hard you work in between when you’ve had these these injuries to get yourself in that condition the way you look after your diet all these different things so I’m very excited about the future mate yeah and also to add to that I know it’s like been quite difficult for you to get the help you need in this injury I know think St George’s Park you’ve been down to a bit PFA so like shout out to them by the way helping players when they need it it’s really important and um yeah like I can imagine a lot of people would have just gone like you know I can’t bothered of this like it’s hassle like your work ethic is clear to see even little things like obviously I’ve got a twisted view on it but even when we do things like the next level league and Scott would come down to play in that like he was always there when people needed him so listen we’ve got very high hopes for you I do want to still pivot this in the direction of what this podcast is supposed to be about which is how to run a football team so I want to pick your brains like you’ve been at a number of clubs you don’t have to name the clubs or anything but like what are some of the the best environments you’ve been in why are they good like you know what are the factors as a player that make being at a club fun I think a lot of it comes from like the manager’s culture okay and when I was young at Northampton I probably didn’t realize at the time how good some of the cultures were with especially the older players the way they speak to as well as a young player I Now understand it being a bit older what they’re trying to do yeah because it it might seem that they’re being quite harsh on you yeah which is kind of going out the game a little bit but if they are more harsh than you it’s probably because they like you they want you to do well if they see a player in the light right he’s not going to make it they’re not going to waste their time on him no Dev says the same thing he always says if I’m criticizing you it’s CU I think you can be good yeah yeah exactly they’re wasting their breath on you to develop yeah yeah yeah if they couldn’t be B like with your career and stuff they’ just leave you alone and you think when you talk about the manager’s culture how important is having the right players in the jessing room that and do you think like sometimes managers just get lucky or do you think it’s like almost an exact science where they go right I need a player who’s bit more of a leader I need a player who’s you know bit of a joker and gets everyone happy like how important are those Dynamics i’ say under my my first professional contract was under Keith curl okay who for me was a great manager for me as a youngster gave me a lot of chances and he brought in a few of his players that’s been at his clubs before so he knew how they’d run the dressing room yeah they knew his ethics and stuff stuff like that so he knew that they were going to buy into his philosophy and then he brought in a couple of old players one of them like Nikki Adams who was great to have around the dressing room especially for the youngsters as well so they kept everything in check yeah and that’s probably why we went up that season what do you think is more damaging for a team a say bad manager say manager the bad but the wrong manager at the wrong Club but with a great dressing room yeah or a good manager but the dressing room is a problem he’s lost it or there’s a there’s a toxic person in there like what’s going to affect things more do you think cuz there’s a bit of a school of thought in the modern sort of data Le approach to football and I’ve read a lot about this like with exceptions obviously where you got top tier like worldclass managers but often there’s a lot of statistically that managers don’t actually make that big an impact and obviously they do on a personal level which is why where I think managers are super important with like the way they make the players feel who they want to work for and how they how they uh address issues that come up as well I think massive part of it but statistically like when new managers come in you get the new manager bounce all these things like it’s just levels out across clubs and it’s actually just a handful of people of geniuses really that actually change the club overnight but if you get the wrong player in there it can undo all that good work can’t it yeah I’ve seen it a few times with players not getting on board with the manager and it it does rub off on a lot of other players especially when everyone’s not like United together some players their own thing and then other players feel like they can get away with that and then if the play if the manager is not being strict on the players for doing that it kind of loses a bit of that’s what we got like with tenh at United now he’s trying to throw the book at people like Sancho because he’s kind of questioned his authority but then like if Sancho doesn’t play ball he just doesn’t play and then you got a problem you got this guy on loads of money he’s not playing because he’s got an attitude issue at least a clash we don’t know if it’s Sancho or ten hog really but that sometimes it feels like becomes untenable for the manager to the point where he starts losing he’s going to go because the players on these contracts there’s so much player power now right like you didn’t grow up in that era we grew up in the era where like maybe you got the back end of it where like SRI Ferguson was hair dryer treatment kicking boots at Beckham and like didn’t get in trouble nowadays he’ probably go he’ probably go to court minimum he lose his job he lose a job but like that was normal there’s some amazing videos I can’t remember the manager’s name Neil KN might remember who’s that manager who was like you can bring your dinner John S John S he’s late in or wasn’t he he late there’s a manager a great video on YouTube if you haven’t seen it he’s literally offering all the players out saying I’ll fight you all yeah and like you just I’m not saying that’s good or bad but there used to be a lot more manager power and players were basically scared I think now we’ve probably gone the other way which is managers really probably can’t do what they need to do sometimes to get Authority yeah is what is the right balance there I’d always say when whether they mean it or not but if a manager acts like shows their confidence in all their players they’ll get the best out of the team okay when they’re not as honest and they’re kind of a bit half-hearted of telling the truth it’s kind of like you lose a bit of that respect yeah so if a manager like just says it how it is but still in a way that gives the team confidence then you’ll get a lot of the players on board consistency in what he’s saying approach and not doing one thing for one person yeah I think that’s really good point and then what because obviously a lot of this podcast going to be about like uh board level stuff you know we talk to owners of clubs and things like that how much does that impact players on the pitch like are you aware do you have relationships with your owners at the clubs you’ve been at like you know obviously hashtags I’m very Hands-On and I’m literally commentating in the stands and the players all know me but professional clubs yeah it’s not quite like that is it really the ones I’ve been at they the chairmans and the owners have been quite like social with the players and stuff especially at Boston the uh the chairman there would come in after the game it’ sort of greet all the players as we’re having like our postmatch food and stuff yeah and they come down in the bar and have a chat and talk about the game and stuff which is nice to feel like you’ve got a connection with them yeah and at Northampton the chairman there uh was you just think he’s like a normal kind of guy you wouldn’t think he’s like too like a big ego or anything or too much of himself like to just not see the players and that he would talk to you like a normal person CU I I always think the way it should work is like the chairman or the owner they work with the managers right or whatever higher maybe you got directors of football and things but not so much non league and like that’s where that communication happens and that’s where the analysis and the any criticism whatnot has to happen and then everything beneath that should be the manager which actually allows the owner to have those relationships with players and to be that guy because you’re like well I don’t need to discuss anything like critical or anything with you because I talked to manager about that and that’s why manager sometimes the bad guy and sometimes takes the brunt of all the blame things or whatever but um have you been you’ve been at a club where managers have changed you mean sacked and yeah like so new manager just come in yeah so like how important is like that first day a new manager do they have to sort of really say you know this is me this what I’m about authoritatively or can it be like so bad that if they get it wrong early doors it’s they can’t come back from it well I think what I’ve experienced is they well the best way of doing it that I’ve experienced is coming in and not being it sounds weird not being too like authorative with what their things are to begin withing okay I remember I think it was it might be Keith curl that came in and said pressure is not on you it’s on me so like you go and just play freely all the pressure is on me so he’s not coming in like right we need to do this this which for all the players oh like you can swear yeah go for it no it’s not 2016 anymore yeah oh no this is um this is serious now we need to win like we have to win this game yeah if manager comes in like boy the pressure is on me not on you yeah You’ got your contracts that’s the thing it’s quite paralyzing sometimes that pressure isn’t it like that’s what I always think about when you see this is slightly off topic but you know West Ham got smashed by Fulham recently and supposedly it was because because we’ve been in really good form it was supposedly because there was this illness going around the camp and it just makes you think like the margins at that level one little thing affects it and I always think with players mindsets like why can one player be so inconsistent or I can be so good one week and so bad next week and there’s so many things that can affect it the big thing don’t think gets talked about anywhere near enough and I think the deli alley piece this year was really good for this is like just they’ve got their own lives footballers have got stuff going on they might have had I mean there’s a lad at Burnley who’s been who’s been off Foster I think his name is mental health stuff like it’s like you know it almost feels like as a society we we’ve got much better at that stuff now but in football it’s almost like oh yeah but football does need to play you know what I mean why is he any different than someone working in your office that has a mental health issue and or or they can’t have a mental health issue cuz they get loads of money and you know they should be that’s the one I always hate seeing yeah it’s like uh I’ve seen it recently with ruce James yeah done another post obviously unfortunately I’ve been injured quite a lot yeah and I see some of the comments like how can he be devastated I I’d be injured earning 200 Grand a week yeah it’s irrelevant these guys have spent 20 years of their life to play football to be in this moment and they they can’t do it it’s Agony yeah and people don’t realize I don’t think the mental health issues people do get when they’re injured particularly when they’re out of football for a long time like can really damaging um spe if you’re someone that’s like handled it a lot through their career you know but I think we are getting a bit better as a society slowly but surely we get coming around to that stuff MH the other thing as well that people you know they kind of look at you and they go you’re a footballer yeah which you are but like you know you’re not earning Premier League money no do you know what I mean like you know that there’s a level and I don’t know where it is exactly but in in non League you know where for example if hashtag one day would to go professional you know players would have to make a decision because going professional means we’re fulltime means we need you to be fulltime doesn’t mean we’re going to pay you more than your current job does no do you know what I mean because that’s the reality of Life Le we not even talking about League to we talking about National League teams being professional like people are playing football that level they deserve a lot of credit in my opinion because they often have turned down other careers I remember you were talking about being an architect one day like you know can do make a lot of money being an architect like and you have to park things and with our level I think a lot about it I think it’s one of the hardest levels you could play because obviously there’s high levels of football but you’re asking guys to have a professional mentality whilst sometimes working manual labor jobs you know 12 hour days on on on a on a site and then they come and play a game of football where you know it’s a proper level like that is I’m not saying Premier League players have it easy because they don’t they they have to put their bodies through and levels they have to maintain are a joke but it’s nicer when you can just go I’m a footballer and I don’t need to do anything else but be good on the weekend and like be fit and be ready and lower league players I think you have a lot more to deal with because the finances aren’t good they balance like two Jobs family if you got kids as well and the traveling as well yeah the traveling is National yeah still National yeah which is not a dig at Premier League players but I’ve seen a lot of players come out saying we play too many games and and a lot of non-league people have come out saying well you fly here you get picked up by the coach you’re not driving 3 hours to an away game coming back 3 hours or training at night getting back at 12:00 to get up at 7:00 a.m. to go on site or something brick or something no that is that is why I think it’s so hard to be League footballer I think I do hear what klopp and the guys are saying because I think that ultimately it’s more like it’s not so much it’s basically they’re getting judged on the results to such a level yeah of like that you know with the money that’s on the line and people’s careers are on the line not just footballers that do we it’s more about these extra competitions that keep coming up like do we need you know the club World Cup to be a 32 team tournament or do we need whatever it’s going to be so yeah I hear I I see both sides of it but I do think that non- League guy and and lower level professional players they uh they really do earn their money like and they could get they could be paid more that’s where England’s so weird and if we feel this hashtag right like there’s so much money so low down the pyramid it doesn’t make sense like to for the people money people can earn at the level hashtag at he’s mad not ear it at our club but they can earn it at other clubs and you’re like in any other Walk of Life you go it’s seventh division yeah like you can’t be in the divisions that you know objectively people care about for four or five years why are you spending this much money now but it’s so desperate to get there and for the journey but it doesn’t make sense they can’t generate the money they’re spending it’s not possible so that is something that will always come up I think on this podcast but you touched on it there I want to like take one word from every person as regards to you know what I think makes a good football club and you you you’re welcome to add another one but you said culture and I think that’s a really good one like it comes from the manager I do think it comes from the owners as well cuz the owners ultimately appoint the manager mhm and if you app point the manager who’s got a certain approach and maybe that approach is is you know not one that goes down very well with players I think the the owners have some responsibility for that too right so like if you are under a manager you enjoy there is someone else that’s made a decision for that person to be there but culture is that the most important thing for you it’s a culture and confidence confidence within his team for the manager to have confid manager within his team yeah it’s part of yeah it’s part of it isn’t it like his whole his whole package or her whole package as a manager yeah yeah it’s it’s a lot to think about and how many ways people can impact a club but before we let you go you’ve got any advice for us you know we’re trying to get to level that you’re playing at what do and I know you’re sort of Fairly familiar with you keep you keep up to date with our results and stuff what do you think we need to do to make that step up to be fair I think the way you’ve gone about it is the right step because I’ve seen a lot of clubs that obviously Chuck money they swap managers every season like sford for example they haven’t kept a manager don’t think for past two years or something like that because they’re so keen on getting to that next level aren’t they we are too and I think we’ve just done it but you’ve done it steady it’s like youve not put the pressure on right like AFC f for example they had League 2 2023 24 on their sleeve for a while I don’t know if you’ve seen that really they had a badge on their sleeve obviously with an aim but they put a lot of pressure on getting to a certain level that’s mad where I think you’ve gone about it in a steady way from what I’ve seen anyway yeah cly financially we have but I do Wonder I’d love to get your take on it because as a player like we preach sustainability nonstop and we like we got it’s very fan focused and we want to be around as a player do you not like and this isn’t like you know this is genuine question yeah that environment is going to be more hospitable and probably more stable but is it also like people that went to Billy Ricky for example under Glenn templin when he was just throwing money at people do you not little little bit of them not love that like we’re here we’re getting paid way too much money like by a certain Club under the wrong manager or the wrong owner whatever is that a bad thing for players if if they get paid it can be yeah why I think well the hunger might go a little bit for some players their personality might go right money that’s it yeah and the love of it goes a little bit that’s probably why it gets players on the way out doesn’t it like later years of their life yeah cuz I just wonder what the player cuz might I have an idea of what our non- league boys are like obviously I know our players pretty well I think when you get into like professional football and you get to like particularly high level where their players got so much money now as they’re all like multi multimillionaires right like and you know you get this I think Ronaldo famously said in the press conference once they asked him about some big political issue and he was like guys we just talk about girls cars and money he’s like oh handbags like that’s all we talk about I don’t know how to tell you anything different and I’m sure that was an overstatement there are obviously a few more of the intellectual footballers but like I think partly that is like true to an extent higher levels and they got that much money it’s very so low impact to them isn’t it it’s a different culture isn’t paid hundreds of thousands of pounds into their Bank every week even after tax like are the Brighton players going to each other oh our owners are doing such a good job you know I love their money ball approach and it’s brilliant and they keep finding another 18-year-old Colombian like or they just go like I can get so much more money if I go to City probably be of both isn’t it but I think ultimately they’re probably thinking this 18y old Columbia is going to take my spot yeah well it’s probably with them it’s again it’s Brighton is a great Club to come to when you’re younger but it is probably viewed as a stepping stone isn’t it for that reason they know if they’re really good they’ll get that caredo or karella move or whatever timely you go to Chelsea at some point you go to Chelsea that is the move that’s the career trajectory I’m really happy we got to catch up Scott and I’m hope this is only part one of a followup we do down the line yeah when you’re playing in the some of these high levels maybe obviously you got a job to do at yil first you know I think um YoVille hopefully will go up this year hopefully I’m not jinxing that but top of the league right now certainly belong at a higher level than they are right now massive club and I think like the journey you’ve been on so far and what’s happened at YoVille it’d be lovely to see you get a run of games in that team show everyone at YoVille and all those fans what you can do because I think you’ll be a fan favorite in no time I me he would wouldn’t he absolutely just hope he gets that chance to be honest that’s been there’s bit of a misconception around that maybe going to another day there been been a bit of a shame however Scott is just busting to get back on that I can’t wait mate to get you fully fit running at people scoring goals Left Right Center back in the FPL team the other thing people don’t knowa is people don’t know we nearly got used to TST last year nearly yes obviously the oval deal was in the midst at the time I think um I think you just gone to YoVille over a long period we were talking about it because obviously we had to confirm our squads but um you just gone to YoVille and it was like a little bit of that period where start the owner was it started to become apparent that maybe this ownership thing hadn’t quite gone through yeah and we were talking to the what we believe were the owners and we’re saying would this be a possibility they said absolutely yes gave it to us in writing and then it sort of transcended that they actually weren’t the owner no so if they they’ve been the owner you might have been there we probably would have won a million dollars proba won a million doll yeah next time well the invite is always there obviously when you’re contracted player you got to respect the club so we we know see if we can make it work and it goes about saying we’ve actually I’ve actually said it to you offline before but your career is going to go far but if anything ever happens you know this # United spot waiting for you when you’re ready come in the league so yeah yeah we could catch up possible if you over wer where they were we get the play you never know but no I don’t need a guarantee from you I’ve got one from Ben Foster I’ve had one but before you retire many many years from now you are going to come back at some point yeah in my mind i’ i’ I’d love to that’s contracted now that even if it’s your last game as a football minimum we’ll get it done but uh fantastic stuff Scott listen wish you the best thanks for coming down thanks get back on that pitch stop bagging them in right that brings us to the end of another episode of how to run a football club a little bit of a different one but a really important one been great catching up with Scott Pollock you can keep up to date with his career follow him we’ll put the links in the description uh obviously on Instagram what’s your hand on Instagram Scott uncore Pollock 12 easy yeah Scott under what’s the 12 about uh just lucky number 12 has that always been that yeah never got 77 in the hashtag days I do follow him I do know that um but yeah make sure you’re following uh and get behind him and also if you want to watch future episodes of this podcast drop a like let us know you’re enjoying it let us know in the comments who you’d like to see and if you’re listening of course uh follow us on whatever platform you’re on leave a rating if you’re feeling really generous it does help you and we’ll see you on the next one bye for now