Joaquin Niemann vs Wyndham Clark – OWGR, Majors & more!

The hosts discuss recent golf tournaments, including the DP World Tour and the AT&T Pebble Beach Pro-Am.

They compare the field strength between the PGA Tour and LIV Golf, noting the parity in talent and the positive reception of LIV Golf.

The conversation also touches on the controversy surrounding Wyndham Clark’s 60 and the impact of lift, clean, and place rules. They analyze Joaquin Niemann’s impressive 59 and his performance on LIV Golf.

The hosts also discuss the influence of mental factors on golf performance. In this episode, the hosts discuss the mental fortitude of Joaquin Neiman and other players, the iconic shot of live golf, and make their picks for the next tournament.

Takeaways

The field strength between the PGA Tour and LIV Golf is becoming more balanced, with both tours featuring top talent.
Controversies surrounding lift, clean, and place rules and their impact on scoring should be discussed fairly and consistently.
Joaquin Niemann’s performance on LIV Golf showcases his talent and potential as a rising star in the sport.
The mental aspect of golf, including confidence and decision-making, plays a significant role in a player’s performance. Joaquin Neiman’s mental fortitude was on display during the tournament, as he overcame a two-stroke penalty and maintained his composure to win.
The mental fortitude of other players, such as Ludwig Eiburg, is still uncertain and will be something to watch as the season progresses.
The iconic shot of live golf, with the TV shot from above showing the huge monitor lighting up the green as they played in darkness, was a significant moment for Live Golf.
The hosts make their picks for the next tournament, with Brooks and DJ as top contenders, and the 4Aces and Legion XIII as strong teams.
Chapters

00:00 Introduction and Recap of Golf Tournaments
03:25 Discussion on the DP World Tour
10:30 Comparison of Field Strength between PGA Tour and LIV Golf
20:12 Debate on Wyndham Clark’s 60 and the Impact of Lift, Clean, and Place
41:22 Analysis of Joaquin Niemann’s 59 and his Performance on LIV Golf
45:08 The Influence of Mental Factors on Golf Performance
45:16 Joaquin Neimann’s Mental Fortitude
48:40 Mental Fortitude of Other Players
50:14 The Iconic Shot of Live Golf
52:45 Picks for the Next Tournament
56:29 Conclusion and Future Episodes

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A 59 a 60 two lots of 54 and a lot a lot of attention on men’s pro golf this week this is golf lovers United where we discuss golf the Fairway my name is Mark one of the hosts at Mr aswi on Twitter and today as always I’m joined by my

Good friends Jay progolf critic and Ben golf lover UK and we have got a heck of a lot to discuss not only are we going to give our picks for the upcoming week’s tournaments in particular the live tournament over in Las Vegas the weekend of the Super Bowl it’s going to

Be a big one but we’re going to analyze and deep dive that cracking weekend of golf wind and weather that we’ve just seen across men’s golf it’s been a really really interesting week of course if you’ve been asleep it was the season opener on live golf Maya kobba we also

Had the AT&T at Pebble Beach and an honorable shout out to the baron Championship on the DP World Tour which featured a really endearing win for someone that I think we all wanted to see back in the winner circle so we’re going to dive deep into that in just a

Few minutes before we do that a quick shout out to all of our supporters it’s really nice to see people supporting golf lovers United it’s really nice to see people joining the fan Zone and we need to give a big shout out to Tony Gentile who joins us as a fan over gc.com

Ssupport the fan zone is open to everyone one and you can get involved like I said at gc.com support you can tell your friends they can find the show on YouTube or their podcast app of choice so dig deep enjoy it leave some comments have a little bit of fun with

Us wherever you get your podcast or your entertainment so without further Ado let me shut up and I’m going to bring on the wonderful Ben the wonderful J Ben how are you my friend you had a good weekend you enjoyed the golf yeah I did enjoy the golf and happy birthday to Tony

Gentile it won’t be when he’s listening to this but I believe his birthday is today because I was chatting to him on messenger on Instagram so happy birthday to Tony um I’m going to guess Tony is a youthful 16 he’s not but he might like that he would probably I think we all

Like that we all very useful I’m sure he’s very youthful indeed but uh yeah thank you so much Tony thank you for joining us it means a heck of a lot and Jay how are you my friend you’re doing all right yeah everything’s good uh definitely dealing with a little bit of

Bad weather here in the Bay Area that um definitely impacted Pebble Beach uh we saw was a lot of PJ Pros that were making some bad weatherman content um over there in the montere peninsula when they couldn’t play uh couldn’t play on Sunday but uh yeah navigating things

Pretty well um uh everything going going well though no uh no complaints good man well it’s been a busy weekend hasn’t it we should probably get to that the AT&T we saw uh a 60 which we’ll get to in a bit um so I’m going to go 60 with an asteris just

For you Ben so we’ll get to that in just a minute and we saw ludvig abber oberg I need to get that pronunciation right he was starting to make a bit of a move so a little bit of burner contention there had it gone to Sunday would Windham

Clark have been able to protect his legacy even further by coming second who knows we’ll get to that in just a second but also the Live season opener where we saw a victory from Legion 13 which was actually it was fantastic see really really enjoyed that a lot to dig into

There and a fantastic win uh in an atmospheric playoff of course between yo Neeman and the wonderful Sergio gasier so heck of a lot to dig on this one but let’s just spend a couple of minutes before we get to that I just want to give a bit of a

Shout out to uh the DP World Tour it gets a bit of it’s like the awkward stepchild at the minute isn’t it no one’s really no one’s really talking about it but I watched it on Sunday um strium there was Dylan fatelli few people in contention on a course that Monty had

Designed in the middle of a desert what 10 15 years ago it was actually quite compelling golf I don’t know if you you watched any benj I know you you you didn’t spend much time with it but Ben did you spend much time with the DP World Tour this weekend I I

Watched highlights but one thing on the DP World TR I’d love to talk about just as a quick one is that Marcel Marcel CM the German guy I think a lot of people don’t realize quite how old he is like he has been around so so long he’s late

40s yet another I looking now he 20 I thought he finished 22nd but I’m wrong he 23rd like Marcel has just been grinding on the European tour getting some lot loads of top 20 top 10 finishes for maybe 20 odd years 25 years and it’s actually we had Scott Drummond on the

Show didn’t we who did talked about his performance in the 2004 Wentworth Marcel CM played in that event so like Marcel CM has been on tour for a long long time and just I think sometimes you do forget there are some absolute journeyman’s the wrong word because journeyman implies

That you haven’t been great and you’ve moved around a bit what would you call it he’s just been a stor wart of the tour isn’t he I I think sometimes some of these players get overlooked and I I I quite like him he’s a bit different he’s got the he’s got

The long flowing locks and he sort of languid where the way he walks up to the ball yeah I did watch it there is a young guy I can’t remember his name though the one thing that dpor did annoy me this week is there a young lad who

Who won his card and still hasn’t had a start he’s had to play four or five events on the challenge tour so he still hasn’t had a start despite winning his card and I don’t understand how that was happening and I looked into it I’m not going to get too political

But the reason he’s not been getting into it and he missed out by three spaces this time is because of the five players have been parachuted in from the PGA Tour that lost their card so you know the F there were five players that got parachuted in from a PJ tour onto

The European tour you that way you’ve got one bloke who’s qualified and isn’t getting a spot because people who’ve been kicked off on tour taking it that to me feels really wrong it’s not a dig at the PJ tour that isn’t at all I’m just saying that’s actually the PGA the

DP World Tour you’ve got a young man who’s earned his card he’s done what you wanted him to do he’s gone through Q school and earned it and not got a place oh it doesn’t doesn’t sit right with me no no I get that it’s a it’s a

Funny situation like I I grew up obviously being over here in England grew up watching the what was the European tour back then and it it I know this feels a bit cliche but it always felt stronger than when you when you had westw coming through you had palter

Coming through Rosie was coming through but then you also had people like Monty still playing the tail end the sevi obviously Bernard Langer was a massive stale W on there and it just it’s wild because it almost felt more Global back then than it does now

And it’s sort like you said it’s sort of weird to see like I never really considered the European tour to be a weaker tour back in the day it may well have been and I may just not I may just not not had the information the data or the opinion to

To to see that but it always felt that Monty and Langer could go toe-to-toe with you know whoever dval and whoever else on in in that generation and it just it is just increasingly starting to look like it’s just a shame isn’t it it’s just looking like there’s not much

Care and attention Jay I know you’ve got some thoughts on on where that that two asss but yeah I don’t know have I got that wrong is it is that just is that like rose tinted glasses from like the 90s or what no I think you have it completely right

I think that the uh the Europe European tour of old it certainly is uh it is not that anymore unfortunately um and part of it has to do with the decisions made by leadership and Keith py um and honestly this strategic alliance with the PJ tour just is not panning out the

Way that um anybody wants um I think that and I think this is something people need need to probably watch watch out for for uh two two and a half years ago the European tour had a chance to partner with the piff um and that would have allowed um access to the Liv

Players playing in European tour events now if you combine the Live players with the European tour players you start especially now I think if you combine those two against the PJ tour I mean you may be looking at a tour that’s uh a little bit better than the

PJ tour like I think that that’s something that probably should have happened from the beginning um unfortunately you know we we could talk about you know the PJ tour and how they’ve sort of threatened uh the DP World Tour and their sponsors if they didn’t sort of side with them

Like that definitely happened so you know I think that uh two two and a half years ago the live was a totally unproven thing they had hadn’t signed any players it was a totally different ecosystem then than what it is now so if you were to sort of reconfigure things

And sort of align the European tour with Liv and allow some of these great European Champions to like go back in play in some of these events like that would would be because one you’re able to get them access to world ranking points two you’re going to strengthen

Those fields so the number of points available is even more than uh than what it is now um and three you wind up building up a competitor to the PJ tour that’s like actually on the same same level like that’s where I think this whole thing needs to go um and I think

That’s that may be a world that we’re living in in the not too distant future like I think this whole deal with the merger now is very very tenuous um I think that’s probably the most likely outcome of all this there isn’t necessarily going to be a deal

Between the PJ tour and piff I think piff could go ahead and sort of take the Europe European tour because we already saw in the the paperwork the PJ tour described it as a distressed asset so it’s like you you could easily spin that

Off to the piff um and sort of have them invest in it and that seems like the most logical thing to me and I think that it would strengthen the tour it would allow a path back for some of these great Champions which is what I really want to

See yeah it’s interesting to see it the the the people coming up like the hogard Twins and so on coming up through the DP World Tour as well because the the talent’s clearly still there and and you know I think we should we’re going to

Get to the the fields in a second on the PGA tour and and live because it this week probably highlighted beyond all of the weeks where men’s professional golf is but huge shout out to Dylan forelli just before we do that because it not one on the DP World t for

Six years last year the guy was thinking about walk walking away we’ve all look we’ve all wanted to throw our 79 around a tree from time to time but this is a guy’s living it’s a a guy Ben’s done that of course he has probably when he threw the Club Championship away for

Longterm listeners you’ll get this the the emotions are rif they’re huge but this is someone’s career it’s someone’s livelihood so massive props on that one to Dylan forelli now we we got to get to the fields then we got to get to the fields jump in I want I want to put that

Name on that guy so it’s 18 old Englishman Josh Barry became the second youngest ever player to gain a DP World Tour card behind Rory mroy and he hadn’t had a chance to play yet because of the reasons we said however the good news is

He has got his first start and he will be playing qar this weekend so great se’s got it but a question should be asked in six events in should he probably have been able to play this far having won his card I’d have thought so

But hey he’s in now and he’s gonna get gonna get a chance hopefully he will he will he will take the most of that chance he’s 18 years old hopefully he’s got a great career ahead of him it was just it was just a point just to say that didn’t

Quite seem right to me go get your card go get your card get it and then get a start felt a bit weird yeah it’s interesting because it’s the the Elation follow by the deflation must be challenging so we’ll see how he gets on in Qatar and uh yeah what something

Probably to keep an eye on in terms of a concept that you know how often does that happen does it happen year on year that’s that’s actually quite interesting mate um let’s switch gears to live in the PJ to then um I mean the irony of

Windam Clark winning a 50 hole 54 hole no cut elevated event tournament um while protecting Legacy I mean doesn’t matter which side you fall on I think it’s been a very interesting week one thing I want to talk about Liv in particular in a minute and obviously

We’re going to talk about the the pj2 at AT&T but I want to sort of preface this with maybe for the first time ever ever whether you like live hate live like the PJ tour hate the PJ tour like all golf here all got whatever it doesn’t really matter this is the first

Weekend that I’ve genuinely seen the whole of golf talking about the PJ tour and live in complete parity there’s been and obviously the weather’s played a huge part in that one but it felt like for the first time as many quote unquote column inches have been dedicated to live in a positive

Even you know worst case neutral way has has been directed towards the PGA to um again is that is that R we Rose tinting that or is that how does that feel Jay does that feel does that feel Fair yeah I think that is fair uh there there’s been um there’s definitely been

A shift uh you know ever really since the ROM signing like I feel like there there’s been this this sort of seismic shift in The Ether where you know people have been covering live a little bit differently they’ve been talking about it differently um and the thing is when

You look at the leaderboard and I uh posted this um on Sunday like you have all these like great Champions at the top number one and number two you have this Global uh sort of reach to these these players you have players from the United States South Africa Australia England um

And then uh two two players from Spain and then someone from Chile like this is like this is the whole vision of Liv actually playing out in real time um and I think that it was so the the Finish was was so exciting it was so you had

Someone you had this this great Champion like Sergio who’s won I don’t know 36 times worldwide uh he’s a master’s champion and then you have someone who’s younger on the come up walk Neiman who I have said is like me probably one of the best players uh 25 years old and under

Um in the world I think that he’s the best uh young player out there like these are the types of storylines that you need to continually build interest in uh professional golf and this is something that’s been totally glossed over and whitewashed on the PJ tour is

That when you remove all these great champions from your events and then you have guys coming up it’s like in order for those younger guys to get like legitimacy and like prove themselves they have to beat these older Champions and it just happens to be like pretty

Much all the older Champions are over it live now so I think that’s a really important thing that it um I don’t think people should necessarily gloss over I think that it’s something that’s really really important to uh sort of uh to building golf up and sort of making it

Uh more interesting is that you have to have these matchups and then you have someone like like John ROM who was breathing down their necks like this is like really really comp compelling stuff like this is something I uh I was actually uh reading right before we

Hopped on like viewership is like up 50% um on myova from last year which is this huge huge uptick and part of that is they’ve they definitely got viewers that would have typically watched Pebble but you know this is uh I I thought it was a

Great event like it was really one of those uh times it was definitely a top five um event so far um and you notice every now and then there were these times when I live sort of up levels and this was one of those times because it totally captured the imagination of the

Golf world um and I saw people that have been very negative about it for two years kind of flip and and basically saying and tweeting wow this is really cool yeah I I spotted a lot of that myself and I I think there’s a few elements to that as well just to unpick

The the upand comers versus the Legacy I think that’s an interesting one so wo versus uh yako versus um Sergio was was a big deal the I think for the first time ever for me there was I keep using this word now but there was parity between the field

Strength I I genuinely don’t think there has been I I I we can say there’s that many major champions on live that’s fine it’s cool to say but a lot of them are Legacy major Champions and yeah obviously the the young up andc comers have got to beat those guys and and and

Passing of the torch but for the first time when I personally looked at both fields and some friends of mine that have been you know on the fence when it comes to live for the first time there’s been no denying that the modernity of the field and the mixture of Legacy

Within the field felt reasonably similar and I think those the the addition of Raman hattan has I honestly think in 10 years time whatever Liv becomes that will be the single biggest pivotal moment because it was that that has transformed the brand for me and they’ve they did a few things around for

Me again they did a few things around the broadcast I thought the broadcast was far better than last year still a little sketchy in places the pylon was a little bit out of order against the commentary and like whoever’s placing the microphones sometimes the music’s loud sometimes it’s soft and I can hear

The cup rattle when the ball goes in like little details that just it’s all just through practice that is not that is not here in the cup that is an imported noise and the two things that I’ve I’ve said that Liv need to do is

They need to get rid of that import look we know I like Liv it’s not surpris rubbish but that imported noise when the ball goes in the cup needs to disappear it’s got It’s it’s got to it’s funny I like it I like it I didn’t think it was

Imported though I I thought they actually had microphones in no in the I thought it was leg I can tell you it’s imported I can tell you it’s imported because twice during the broadcast you heard the noise randomly as they’re walking down the Fairway and it is the

Exact same noise cuz I wondered if they’ got some of the channels mixed up because you heard it a few times where a few mic channels are being left on and there was like a someone’s cell phone went off and it was was a bit like Tri

Happy TV here in the UK it was you know the old Nokia ringtone jam and it was there’s a few little details like that but again it’s still fairly new I think the the quality of everything was was significantly higher um let’s talk about that field strength because um we had

Obviously let’s let’s think about it this way okay it felt like there was a lot of parity between the pj2 this week in terms of field regardless of the results and live all right that’s the first thing to note but then if you look at some of the stories that came out of

It all right we had Windam Clark who won with a 60 54 holes um but he he then had let’s just say the the next two orberg and pavon pavon won last week and oberg’s breathing down his neck he frankly I think he would have pipped him

Because he was on a bit of a tear and then you had yako you had Sergio but the big stories were people like Sarat Vincent you know they all had pretty strong debuts a lot of the argument has been that the players just aren’t there and I just feel like that is probably

Changed how important for Jay I think this would be an interesting one for you those story lines around like people like Caleb Sarat okay if he forp puted and instead of G to pieces like I would he absolutely blitzed it all right how important is that when you have similar stories like

Dunlap and and oberg on the PGA to her you know the argument of strength of upcoming Talent again that doesn’t necessarily seem to be there anymore it’s yeah again there’s a bit of par yeah it’s true I I think the diversity of talent is something at live

That they’ve really done a good job of upleveling from last season to this season um I think the depth of field uh you know we always talk about raising the floor of Live And I think um it was addition by subtraction in some ways too like some of the guys

Like uh sewan Kim unfortunately I hate picking on him but it is what it is uh and then people like you know Chase kka uh th those are like two of the punching bags of live last year um and this this year like you don’t really like if you

Look at the field like you don’t really have that anymore like you have guys that are younger but they’re uh proven sort of talented Commodities like Sarat like um I think that’s something people it’s going to go totally gloss over but when you uh totally screw up and and

Have a four putt uh when you’re having a pretty good round typically it’s going to go south after that he rebounded immediately and made five straight birdies like that’s something that like people need to like like really file away like oh wow this is like really really impressive um and then when you

Start looking through the field like there’s not like there’s not a lot of weaknesses anymore like I think that the uh the relegation this season is going to be really interesting to sort of see who who’s at the very very bottom uh because that’s going to tell

You a lot about sort of where Liv is going and like we mentioned last week a lot of these sort of captains and sort of higher level players like their contracts are going to be up this year and next year so uh you you start falling down in the relegation all of a

Sudden you might not have a spot on on live in very very short order so I definitely think that the depth is there I think that if people people are always going to nitpick like certain players and trust me I could go to the PJ Tour leaderboard and talk about like all

These these people that no one’s heard heard of I know it because I’m a I’m a golf sicko Mo most people are not not going to know those names the live model you get to know these players because there’s less players and you get to know

Them week to week so that by the end of the season you may not have known who Caleb Sarat was prior to two weeks ago moving forward you’re going to know who he is because you’re going to have a whole season he’s going to play in every single event against these great

Champions from the past or the uh sort of current he’s on a team with John ROM he’s on a team with Terrell Hatton and I think that that’s something that’s really interesting and it’s something that people really need to keep an eye on as time goes on a lot of these guys

You don’t know now the end of the Seas season if you’re following live very very closely you’re going to know exactly who who they are uh you know by the end of the season I think Caleb Sarat is you look at it he was he was seventh I I just

Lost it Sarat where is he he was he was eighth in Greens in regg and that is just and seventh in Fairways hit for a boy who they kept saying was repacking his dorm to seventh in Fairways hit and eighth in greens and regulation is phenomenal and

Especially you consider he had a four he had a four put to just go birdie birdie birdie birdie birdie and have that discipline and that control because you missed a couple of those Fairways and a couple of those greens and you go from seventh and

Eighth down to sort of 15th and 20th and and you’re middle of the pack but like the strength of field for me is fantastic and I and I and I look I look at the if I get the big big one of my big screen on the phone and I look at

The I just look down that list and again this comparing it to PJ tour fantastic the PJ tour a fantastic card as well you look at Clark aberer Sheffer Thomas Day Burns Rose Klay Keegan Bradley morawa in their top 14 in that all big names Neiman Garcia Ron Burmeister Johnson kka

Hatton us cam Smith Paul Casey Taylor G like it’s just those that you could put that one one 14 against the other 14 it’d be a fantastic fantastic event where you’d probably have to do a coin flip and that’s that’s Testament to the characters and the players they brought

On and I think that what for me is so encouraging is that there are so many people saying positive things this time about live that they weren’t before and it does feel like a lot of the the maybe the fence sitters have gone you know what it isn’t as bad as people made

Out and I said the one the one thing that did make me laugh was it’s gone from being oh it’s a it’s a tour of has beans which it never was it’s a tour of has beans to going they’re now moan they’re now moaning about the music and

The team names it’s and I and I get team names are always funny but like who who went who Who would thought in Miami Dolphins when it first came out was a great a great team name like the LA Lakers find me a lake in La they weren’t

Based there originally I mean like they Red Socks white socks it’s it’s all moved around and names don’t necessarily work straight away I think that is something that will come with time and um recognition and just repetition of it being in existence but look the PJ tour had a great a great

Level of player the Liv had a fantastic level of player on display and I think it’s I know people say I want them all to play together but part of me doesn’t I like them playing a part and I like the fact the majors are going be where

Hopefully they all come together and if any point ever gets done a PGA Tour versus a live tour competition a rider cup style event I don’t mind a little bit of people being on one side and the other let’s get them together and let’s let let’s let them compete against each

Other four or five times a year they don’t have to compete together week in week out that’s such it’s a huge thing just to to jump in J the it’s wild isn’t it with the majors because that the comment from from from yako at the end where you know a lot of

People have said almost said it as if it was flippant you know the the first thing he said on the interview was you know congratulations he said yeah but I’m not of the majors and it was it sounded flippant and it looked flipping when you see it in black and white on

Twitter or whatever when you see the guy like he’s upset I know he’s in the open because he won the Australian but he’s upset by it and is it wasn’t FY was it it wasn’t it was it was upset and anger yeah it was it was his first reaction

And I get it and it just feels like if the cards are played right like you just alluded to Ben the like the majors are the clear winners out of all this if the cards are just played right and because all the ratings go up all every everything just

Raise as if the mes are the only places that these guys are playing together and it just seems wild Jay that we can’t we just we can’t seem to get to that you know yeah unfortunately and this is some something that I’m I’m going to keep complaining about until it’s until it’s

Fixed um I just I don’t know I don’t have any confidence that the majors are are going to fix this like I don’t have any I know David fary basically guaranteed that Waka was gonna get an invite to the Masters I don’t see it that that way at all I think that the

Sort of golf establishment wants to punish these guys um and I think that 2024 might be their sort of last opportunity to do that um I think that they want to punish some of the players that are not in the Masters so they’re not going to extend any special invites

I hope that I’m proven wrong I really do like it it will restore some of my faith um in Augusta National if they they do because if they don’t invite walk nean who’s literally only the only reason why he’s not in the Masters is because of politics um like it goes against

Literally everything that they stand for they created the Latin America amateur Championship specifically for guys like walking Neeman to get recognition and get in the Masters he won it um in 2018 like it wasn’t like that long ago and he was playing in the Masters he he played

In it last year and he played well he finished 16th and it wasn’t that long ago that if you finish 16th in the Masters you were automatically invited back next year so there’s a lot of reasons why they could say oh yeah let’s just I’ll bring him in

I think that the whole golf establishment is very Petty I think that they’re very upset about how things have gone with Liv um I don’t think they like being back into a corner like this um and I think they’re going to resist I don’t think he’s going to get invited I

Think it’s going to be a travesty I think that it’s going to go against everything they stand for and I think that um Augusta nashal is gonna get exposed if they don’t invite walking nean because he’s this great Global superstar in golf like I think that he’s a super like he’s that good

Like I know uh Talent when I see it walk Neiman is like one of the most talented players that like I’ve ever seen so um and for him to not get in the majors like I still think he’s obviously in in the open he’s so good like I I’m pretty sure

He’s going to want to qualify for the US Open too um and I think his ranking should it should be maintained so that the PJ Championship he should still be in the top 100 I think uh it might be a little bit dicey but uh so I I think he’ll he’ll be in

Three of them but the Masters is a closed invite unfortunately uh the only way he’s going to get it because he’s not going to have enough world ranking points to get in the top 50 um for a variety of reasons and uh it’s really frustrating to me

Because the majors are supposed to be where the best players are all coming together and if you you start getting to the point where you don’t have all the best players you’re going to start to people are going to start questioning like oh man like you’re missing like all these guys

Like you’re missing one now maybe next year you’re missing five maybe then the year after that you’re missing 10 15 like all of a sudden you start getting to the point where it’s like wait a minute like is this really a major um and that seems crazy right right now I

Get it the Masters is like one of the top you know golf tournaments it’s it’s probably the top golf tournament in the world everybody watches it it’s it’s the the highest rate r one I get it looking into the future though part of the reason why it is what it is is

Because it’s always had the best field and if it starts getting to the point where uh like in two years Bryson dambo is not automatically qualified for the Masters so and there’s a lot of other guys uh at live that that are like that too Bryson’s probably gonna have to win

This year uh to make sure he gets gets in forever but uh that’s the thing that’s really frustrating to me I don’t know how this is going to play out um I’m hopeful fingers crossed that we get some sort of resolution to get these guys access to the major so that we

Don’t have to haggle over this um except I think for 2024 they’re going to do everything that they they can to keep wo out we shall see on that one not too long to wait before April rolls around and we should get a little bit of news

Before then now in just a bit we are going to talk a little bit about Windom 60 and uh yakos 59 we’re going to dive deep on those two plus I think there was a bit of a pivotal broadcast moment for live that got some people interested but

Before we do that remember you can get over to gc.com support and join our fan Zone anytime you’re going to get some Early Access to meetups you’re going to get some Early Access to content as we roll more and more out but also you get to get

Involved and say that you are a part indeed of golf lovers United now Ben you got some thoughts Windham Clark has shot a historic 60 over at PEB Beach but you asterisk mate what what’s going on what’s the asterisk um again what I found and this is

What a couple of people like that I get on with quite civil with in the golf media that are not they’re very anti- live have said things like why can’t you just say Well done now my point is I did say say Well done it was an incredible

Round to shoot 60 is unbelievable but those same people were the very first people that when Bryson got his 58 when it was lift clean and place that 58 doesn’t count it was lift clean and place it was lift clean and place Bryson’s 58 doesn’t

Count and when you dare to say the same is a valid point Bryson’s 58 was world class like unbelievable what an amazing round it was lift clean in place the 58 still stands cuz he shot 58 Windam 60 still stands cuz he shot 60 the point

I’m making is if you’re going to apply the lift clean and place attack to one person and attacks the wrong word critique you should be able to apply it the other way now winden’s 60 was undoubtedly one of the best rounds that’s ever been shot best score for

Sure and one of the best rounds that’s ever been shot at Pebble Beach you can’t take that away from him it was world class and I watched back think snar back 12 shots because of adverts but the the adverts are a problem but hey I’m not I’m not

Moaning about that windom’s round was fantastic I about 12 shots for it and the guy was flushing it absolutely superb but we’ve all played golf when it’s lift clean in place and even if you don’t improve your lie through the lift clean in place mentally you feel like

You’ve got a better place you feel like your ball’s in a slightly better position and golf is up here we know that my point isn’t that it’s not a great round and it’s not that it isn’t the best shot to score ever at at Pebble

Beach which it is my point is should we be saying to ourselves fairly is a 60 with lift clean in place as true a 60 as a 60 playing it as it lies that’s all I’m saying and I would never have said that if the comments hadn’t been made about Bryson’s

58 it was a bit defensive of me for sure but I feel like many of us have been riding into battle for some of these people at times because of the unfair criticism and I think it’s a perfect example of criticizing it on one side and not leveling the same criticism or being

Cross that criticism is being given away that’s all it is Mark and yeah fantastic round best score ever there he flushed it round there what he shot a 60 without lift clean in place quite possibly who knows I tend to think lift clean in place is probably worth one and a half

To two strokes anecdotal made up in my own mind but I know that for me if I get a chance to live clean the place I always joke my favorite time of year is March the 28th to March the 30th when the green when a

Fairways is started to dry out a bit but I still get a bit of lift clean in place under winter rules so I’m getting the Best of Both Worlds or when it goes into when it goes into October and of course as a strict October to end of March

Lovely stuff I’ve still got some Fir and Fairways and I can pick clean and place and I met I said as a joke that’s all I’m thinking it’s not it wasn’t a great round it was one of the greatest rounds we’ve ever seen it was superb he

Deserves all the praise but a 60 with lift being in place isn’t the same to me as a 60 with a yeah I think that’s that’s totally fair and I think that the thing about some of these criticisms too like all the criticisms of Bryson sort

Of that came out after he shot 58 it was like it was so disingenuous on a lot of levels um and that’s that’s part of the reason why uh you know some of us sort of leaned into the fact that you know wind clar 60 was lift lift cleaner place

But actually I dove into the numbers a um a little bit on Twitter some of The Strokes gain numbers um about WAMS 60 and people were trying to say I think he even said some something about oh um I’d rather shoot 60 a pebble than 59 someplace else he’s obviously take

Taking a shot at walking neon there’s no question question about it uh and when wind just just needs to zip it about Liv because there’s a lot of information out out there about why he’s not uh he wasn’t playing at myao but this this this week we’ve already shared some of

That information so uh he needs to just like stop so uh but W walk nean 59 was basically almost three shots better uh Strokes game than uh wind Clark 60 uh just because the scoring average uh at my Coba was was was actually a little bit higher than it was at Pebble

That particular day the distribution uh was a little bit wider for for walk for walking Neiman uh which makes his 59 again almost three shots more impressive than wiam Clark 60 so because the pebble scoring average of pebble was like ridiculously low it was in the 60s so uh that’s something people

Need to sort of uh if you are going to die dive into the numbers a little bit more and I was waiting for data golf to say something about it but they they never really did uh but they were the the first ones to sort of dive into and

Sort of try to discredit pricing 58 uh it’s stuff like that that just like really grinds my gears in it like this it’s I’m hopeful that we’re sort of moving into this period of time where where people are going to start treating these things more fairly I still think that there’s so

Much bad information out there or just like withholding information or like double standards and all these things that we just have to continue to keep calling them out it just is what it is until this this is fixed may maybe it’ll never be fixed maybe it’s always going

To be some some level of un um unfairness in terms of how these these things are uh uh covered but um it’s our job um it’s something that I take seriously and it’s something that like I want to make sure that I am sort of centering the conversation whenever it’s

Going too far in One Direction I’m going to bring it back to sort of Center uh that’s sort of uh one of the things that I’ve been doing from the beginning and it’s part of the reason why people think that I’m I’m such a Liv shill is because

The the conversation about Liv has been so negative over the last two years like I’ve been trying to centering the center of the conversation the whole time so I it probably does see seem like I have a live bias and and maybe I maybe I do but

It’s it’s like you do have to treat these things more fairly and that’s what I’m all about that’s what this podcast is all about um and we’re going to continue to keep calling out this um unfairness and hypocrisy um until it stops let’s talk about yakos

59 which I watched the entire round on that his putter was on well he was on fire throughout from T to green and and and and on every single putting surface but that could have easily easily been a 57 Miss 4f footer 4 foot 4 inch on 17

Didn’t play 18 fantastically short of the green a little bit of a little bit of a Duffer um but he duffed it for a 59 I mean holy crap that’s pretty solid stuff uh Ben that could have easily been a 57 though man am I the only person

Whose lower back hurts watching him in his impact position hurts all the time mate that’s that’s over 40 for you surely I can’t be the only person that watch him as watches him impact and goes that’s absolutely insane how how he get like it’s just like oh unbelievable but look

Fantastic round he he’s a great striker of the ball and I think one of the things that waku would say himself he didn’t have the greatest first half of the season last year on Liv like that things weren’t quite jelling for him obviously he was new in some ways with

The team and getting his mates together in the way that it did and all that sort stuff and what other external pressures might might be on a man and he we all know we all have different levels of form but he’s sort of taken that back

Half of the season on live and got better and better and better got into the DP World Tour um in the live off season played a few events there we know he won the Aussie open and we know he won he came fourth in the other event

Which minu Lee won and he just kept going and going and going a fifth place in Dubai and he he he’s he’s really trending and and the thing I get when I when I watch him is he doesn’t seem to have any self-doubt at all now I’m not saying the other 53

Players have got loads of self-d Doubt but you can sometimes see from what I I like it to Rory M when Rory M’s got that Swagger going you know he’s going to shoot a 65 you mean when Rory gets going that strut goes and Rory’s I joke he

Bounces down the Fairway like he’s got Springs in his shoes but neeman’s almost got a slightly different it’s like a it’s a it’s like a quicker to the ball like that and it’s and I love it and you can just see and he gets there he has long conversations with his caddy and

The relationship they’ve got is fantastic and I thought his 58 sorry his 59 was absolutely superb it was a pleasure to watch and a joy to watch but I am going to say something about Golf and Neeman from day two and day three not about the two shot penalty um that

Happened not if you just look and Greg Norman was in the booth for a little bit Greg Norman said something and we’ve all been there he said today because what did nean get on round two he got sorry got got got was one over and Greg Norman

Said sometimes when you play golf for some reason and some reason you can’t explain you’re always between a club and Greg Norman did a fantastic he said yesterday when he shot 12 under he said they got to the club they got to the ball what distance is it

175 okay that’s my a iron I’m picking a random Club but it was always his number and he said you go to round two and every time they got to the B every time you heard him speak oh do a seven do an eight he was NE and golf is so funny

That you can shoot a 12 under the day day one and day two you shoot a one over and he didn’t play Bad Golf day two but sometimes you you’re just in between clubs and I I’ve shot a couple of low single figures which I know to Jay is

Nothing he shot on dep par a few times but the couple of times I shot low single figures everything my I had a four over every time I got to a ball it was 125 or 137 like which are the distances that I hit my gap wedge and hit my pitching wedge I

Mean it was it was literally every sing and I thought about that and I thought I wonder if there’s enough made a golf about sometimes just that balls in the right place for you do we talk about no I don’t think uh we we talk about that nearly enough like that’s

Something that is like a really that’s the reason why great rounds turn into great rounds is because U everything kind of goes your way um it and look walk like like I said walkie Neeman is one of the top five to 10 most talented players in the world he he literally has

No weaknesses in his game like I have been uh watching him for a long time a lot of guys I tend to sort of find something that’s like a little bit of a weakness and I want to uh sort of talk about that the the one weakness that I

Thought uh maybe he had was like the me the mental toughness like I wasn’t exactly sure sort of where he was there but like to get that two-stroke penalty right before the the third round that turned his uh 70 into a 72 um and then to bounce back and still

Wind up winning the event that’s something that’s going to go totally glossed over but it’s like a lesser player would have like taken that and like was going south a little bit in the final round like a lesser player would have probably shot 75 and lost um he

Wound up keeping it under part he kept it together uh granted it wasn’t as good as his first round like very few rounds are but you know I think he was able to sort of keep his level he drove it great his iron game is always solid short game

Good putting was great uh he was able to save um some really good pars um you know he’s just he’s a player that has no weakness so like I think part of the reason why he made such a big deal about the majors in the uh Post Run is because

He knows that he can win not one but he can win multiple Majors there’s no question about it in my mind and it just takes him getting in and he’s playing so well now uh that they they better keep him out of the Masters because he could

Easily go there and win so uh because he’s got the game to certainly do it so and he’s been trending at Augustin National the last three years he’s been progressively getting better in figuring out that course and he’s still so young he’s only 25 so it’s like he has his

Whole career ahead of him um I think that he’s um as long as he finds a way to get in these Majors he’s GNA win one I think in the next two to three years I don’t think there’s any any question to me about that um and he’s just he showed

His mental fortitude and it’s something that there’s other younger players that I’m not quite sure if they have it one of those players is leig I’m not sure if he has that mental fortitude just yet he hasn’t proven it in Majors yet he hasn’t even played in a major yet um and the

One time he was in a big event he was in the lead in the third round he totally blew up in the final round so um at the BMW PJ last year so it’s just something that people need to keep an eye on as things continue to unfold this season

It’s something that I want people to just like uh plant that seed so that when it does things start going a certain way you’re more equipped to say oh you know uh this is some something we had talked about earlier in the year um and it’s something that I think uh is

Going to play itself out a c certain way I’m excited to see how the season plays out I think it’s going to be really interesting so we’ll have to see I disagree massively on lud viberg I think that everyone has a bit of a blowup I don’t think that necessarily

Means you’re mentally fragile or mentally weak I would say say one of the things I think that really helps abber when I think that mentally it’s a good he’s he could be very strong I what we are yet to see is that if you’re a natural flusher of the ball and you’re

Not a forcer of the ball that really helps mentally if you haven’t got to try and force gaps and force this and force that and just a natural flusher I think that really helps so I think I think you’re being a bit harsh in abber there

But we don’t always have to agree do we not at all you disagreement is part playing nicely I’m going to get this on Twitter you got like you guys like nothing more on Twitter than going look back at this tweet from 12 years ago when I said Twitter is amazing and now

Look at it it’s amazing I was right you guys are to be clear I did pick walk Neeman to win this event so I don’t I didn’t want to Pat myself on the back here but I thinked the win Michael and he did win so let’s just let’s let’s not

Gloss over that you can have that one I’ll give you that my friend I do want to get to the picks in a minute we are going to wrap up in a second because I think you’re absolutely right you did pick that mate and you deserve that one

The um the the picks for for last time I want to get to I want to skim over them and just just revisit them but also let’s get our picks for this weekend as well but one thing just to finish up on I think we live in mayakoba which I

Think has probably beg to change the tune a little bit we talk about brand quite a lot of Liv and he had a lot of work to do on brand I think Liv accidentally got something that it desperately needed this weekend I think every thing whether it’s a media Outlet

Whe whether it’s a golf tour whether it’s a startup whether it’s a band whether it is a movie needs an iconic shot and I think Liv golf finally got its iconic shot this week because the TV shot from above showing the huge monitor lighting up the green as they played in darkness coupled

With Sergio saying come on let’s go and just get it done that they desperately needed that iconic shot and I think they they managed to get it so yeah huge huge props on that one I thought it looked fantastic now let’s get some picks um Ben very quick recap I

Wasn’t around I had tons soltis who did you guys in achil have for Maya kobba let’s those the only way to make this work right is that we’ll do our picks over the season whoever gets the lowest score win because obviously if you pick Bryson which Jay did and he finished

25th for his third place that’s 25 so what what we’ll do is we’ll just you have three picks and whoever whoever’s got the lowest score of the season and Mark standing in for you last week was achil and he’s done you some favors you’re off to a flyer so both achil and

Jay picked nean to win ail had cam Smith and DJ finished eighth and F fifth respectively um then Jay despite picking the winner is in last place because he picked P Reed who came 17th and Bryson who came 25th and while I didn’t get a winner I had Burmeister at Fourth Abe at

20th and John Ram at third my Fireball pick came sixth um Achilles range goats came 11th and The Crushers came in second with the teams what I’m going to do is I’m going to double that up because it’s the difference of having a single versus a team so that’s how we’ll

Do it we’ll track it over the year no one will be interested apart from me and maybe like 10 other people who listen to this but I will keep a record of it so what I need off you gentlemen I need your F your three singles players you

Can say who you think’s going to finish first but the three singles players is what’s going to is what’s going account for your score and your team who you think your team will be so let’s fly through them if you want me to go first I’m happy to go through them first but

We’ve got a rule Mark to keep Jay on time you are only allowed to give a 30 second explanation behind the player that is the rule because you know what Jay’s like he could give you an hour on why Paul Casey who we won the pram with

Is gonna finish second so if you want my picks I’ll go first I’m going to take that as a challenge I’m going to go first and I’m going to keep this all under 30 seconds um and also I kind of think that we should only pick Winners instead of the top

Three but that’s Pi top two top two then just do two do two all right top two I’m going Brooks to win I think Vegas is his spot he loves Vegas this course suits him I think he’s gonna play well and number two I’m gonna go DJ um I think

That he is playing pretty well right now um and then for my team I gotta go with the Four Aces I think the Four Aces played really poorly in myoba they will be the first to um admit that they’re going to bounce back they’re going to

Bounce back in a huge way they’re going to win uh live Golf Las Vegas Mark I’m gonna go with Rambo because I think he’s got a point to prove from last week I think he desperately wanted that first week win I think he wanted to like they kept saying on the broadcast

Of the new sheriff in town so I think Rambo’s got a big big point to prove um and he played well so he’s coming off that team win as well I also I think Bryson’s probably trending as well he seemed to feel pretty good last week um and for the

Team I mean this is it just feels cliche now we’re only two weeks in but it feels cliche to say legion 13 but I just they looked that strong this week because of that fourth that fourth player counting it just looked really strong um so there my picks my

Friend okay I’ll allow it this week but from now on after this week you cannot you can only pick one captain that’s got to be fair otherwise picking the same seven or eight players the whole time that fair cuz if we were going to pick one captain and one other my other would

Have been a different player that I’m going to pick there is no way for me I’m not going to pick Brooks Las Vegas golf and country club is an old school Golf Club very tight but still got length so it’s going to reward being tight and accurate and into

Greens I can’t Brooks has to be my pick for that Brooks absolutely has to be my pick for it now I’m torn between Sergio Garcia going for another great round flushed his irons all day was a little bit wward at times off the tea so I’m I’m going to go

For I’m G to go for John RAM and I don’t want to go for John Ram because I wanted to go for T Hatton but because I thought we’re g to do one captain and one non- Captain but you two have got got me for

That so you gone Legion 13 I was I was talking between Legion 13 and between um Ripper I think the Ripper were trending really really really well at the end I have some concerns maybe about Sarat and Vincent for they’re just their first time not in this players with a big

Crowd they can have a massive crowd really tight to people I don’t know how they’re going to respond to that so I think that the Ripper GC going to be better in that environment but I can’t Overlook The Stingers I’ve got to go Stingers I’m

Going for The Stingers is my team I go for The Stingers they love a bit of te to Green right that’s that dealt with we’ve done the teams I work out the scoring from next week on gentlemen it is one captain and one non-ap that’s fair I think I can smell a

Spread sheet coming that sounds very much like something Ben might get on with anyone watching the YouTube version of this you’ll see how delighted it looks Hey listen thank you for joining us for Episode 22 of golf lovers United what a fascinating time it has been over

The last week and will continue to be into next week of course with well live golf last Vegas which has built its own party hle to compete with the PJ tour over in Phoenix at the waste management so we will see what comes we will be

Back next week with more of the same if you enjoyed this let us know over on Twitter at Glu Golf Club you can listen at gc.com you can watch us over on YouTube or you can tell your friends that can tune in in their podcast app of

Choice and if you want to get involved in the fan Zone just like our good friend Tony Gentile once again happy Birthday Tony you can do so at gugc support Ben we’ll see you next week sir thank you very much and I am probably four to five hours away from

Having completed the um putting together our first event in the UK so I’ll have all the information on that and I’m trying to make the date work for when Jay is going to be in the UK and ailly from drunk by the turns they can join us

On our golf day get yourself a spreadsheet that’ll sort it out and it will be a great day and if you do turn up at the event you can bring your own spreadsheet to the lookout for for that one now it will be exciting and you will

Get to know about that first if you are a fan Zone member gc.com ssupport and Jay always good to see you mate love you four aces hat commiserations on not winning the team event this week yeah it was a tough week for us um however like I said we’re going to

Bounce back um I can’t believe we’re already 22 Episodes into the golf lovers United by the way this really impressive um last I I checked there uh We’ve now done more than I did with the other guy uh who will remain nameless um I think that things have been going really

Really well for us we’ve got a great team uh so yeah I’m looking forward to another 22 Episodes I love it and as a day guy I’ll tell you this my friend we are trending very very well in terms of downloads in particular over on YouTube we are doing

Really really well in terms of what does an average podcast get it’s it’s we are in a very strong position and most podcasts only make it to episode 7 so we’ve tripled that record and we’ll be back for more next week so until then thank you The everpresent Listener thank

You to all that get involved over on Twitter at glug Golf Club so until next time enjoy your golf whether you’re playing whether you’re watching enjoy yourself look after yourself and we’ll see you next week