Tommy Fleetwood | NLU Pod, Ep 1068

TC – and Soly – are joined by Tommy Fleetwood on a triumphant return to the pod to discuss his win at East Lake, the close call leading up to getting his first win, a look at the Ryder Cup later this month and a ton more.

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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the No Laying Up podcast. Sully here. We will have an interview with myself and Mr. TC here shortly with his guy Tommy Fleet. Well, he’s my guy, too. But I just have not been as fully dedicated to the bit uh as Mr. TC has. Great interview with him. We do have some connection issues with Tommy. Uh we will only have video if you’re watching this on YouTube for the first 20 minutes or so. He was out at somewhere in the countryside. Did not have a great reception. Ended up with no video on the back half of it, but the audio quality gets a little bit better throughout the uh course of the interview as well. So, appreciate your patience on that one. I want to give a shout out to our friends at Rowback. The Chris Polo subtle dog logo. Look how subtle this is. You can barely even see it on there. The most comfortable hoodies on the planet. I’m rocking the game day collection here. My mountaineers have not looked great so far, but uh hey, I’m still rocking the gear. We’ve teamed up with Robach and Aaron Hills to give you a shot at a bucket list golf experience. You and a friend will join two members of the NLU crew for an unforgettable round of championship golf at Aaron Hills. Your prize includes a round of golf with us at Aaron Hills, plus a one night stay in Aaron Hills worldclass cottages, travel credit to get you there, and a thousand dollars in rowback gear to get you looking and feeling your best on the course. Just go to rowback.com/nlu to enter. Takes 30 seconds. You might just end up teeing it up uh with a few of us at one of the top golf courses in the world while enjoying some of the best gear out there. Roback.comnlu to enter. Let’s get to our interview with Tommy Flewood. At what point did you see TC in Atlanta? Like when did you see him at all during the round of golf? He was claiming that he was trying to hide. As soon as I saw TC, I acknowledged him and I fist pumped towards him and hopefully he can uh back up my story there. You were you that was that was afterwards. Yeah, I never saw you before that. I swear I never saw you before that. Um Yeah. Yeah. You were at the back of the 18th green and I had uh it was at the presentation. Turned around and I saw you there at the back of the 18th grade. So it was it was cool. What was your honest reaction when you flew over to to England though? I mean for for uh for that one. Oh Hoy Lake. I mean I thought I was going to win too. So it was like um I was gutted actually. Uh I I mean what a story. like I loved every little bit of uh of that story and and yeah, I I I thought, you know, it was one of those one of those things where I not that I, you know, obviously I wasn’t I’m not going to say I went into it and I was like 100% certain of of everything that was going to happen, but I felt, you know, I felt good about it. I felt like I was playing well and then I’d seen Tron come over. Uh it was awesome. How good would that have been if we could have had the uh clar joke at the end of that? That would that would have been pretty epic. would have been epic, but also would have been, you know, the story would have been different. We wouldn’t have had East Lake, right? So, like I think it all it all made sense for a reason. It all it all worked out in the end. I Yeah, I mean, I am I am a bit of a um like I actually don’t know sort of what I believe in exactly, but I am I do believe that things happen for a reason and and like things work out for whatever forever which way. Um, yeah, pretty, you know, I wouldn’t I wouldn’t change anything anyway. So, what you you’ve won several times on the DP World Tour, but there’s this, you know, this narrative, the the crooked media is drumming up this narrative about your, you know, the fact that you haven’t won on the PGA tour and all that. So, it’s not like you’re trying to win for the first time, but at what point did it did it ever become a thing to you to say like, okay, all right, this has gone on long enough. Why haven’t I won on the PJ tour? When did it be did it ever become a thing in your own head of like, okay, now why hasn’t this happened for me? Um, well, I I never I never get too like high or high or low about um like what the media says. I I sort of I feel like I respect everything and you know what whatever I I do read I I I try not to read loads obviously because you you it’s easy to be emotionally involved in what people say. But like I I think it was um a lot of the points were always going to be valid. I mean I I hadn’t won on the PJ tour and yeah I’d won I’ve won quite a few times. I whether it’s the PJ tour, DP World Tour, whatever it is, I still um you know I would still say I feel like I could have won more and I’m sure everybody, you know, feels like that and I felt like I hadn’t won my fair share. But the PJ tour thing Yeah. I remember in um so in Canada in 20 uh 23 was Canada 23 or 24 23 23 like that one I stood on the last hole there. par five and it’s an iron off the tea and you know I made par on the last uh a bird you would have won it but I and and then you know Nick we had an unbelievable playoff and and then Nick holds that put and I remember being on the plane there I guess it was going to the US Open I was dwelling on it a little bit um and I remember thinking about it then but the for me I’ like you know legit legitimate chance at the time like I’ve had a few I’ve not had loads it wasn’t something that I sort of overly sort worried about just because you know sometimes it happens for you, sometimes it doesn’t and I was like it’s not like I’ve been there 20 times or 30 times and I I can’t do it. So I want to avoid then and then I think this year was definitely the hardest just because of the like the positions that I did put myself in and it didn’t happen. It wasn’t that I ever doubted like it would happen or um I made it like a story, but it definitely like it builds. Of course it does because like especially especially travelers you got a I’d put on 15 at the travelers to have a a 14 sorry to have a three shot leading monster on 15 like a really cool moment but still he’s hold like a you know 40 50 footer and then everything that could have gone wrong down the last goes wrong and then Memphis again felt like I sort of moved into control of the tournament on the bat n and then I couldn’t do it. So it it was it more it was more like just yeah that was the toughest to deal with in terms of like these times didn’t happen going to be there again at some point I’m going to have to deal with like a little bit more doubt that I’ve put in there just because those ones didn’t finish off but it’s a long-winded answer to say like I never made it more of a story than it was. Did you learn something different from each one like from Travelers? What did you take specifically from Travelers versus what did you take from Memphis? So both of them I led the tournament from an from a certain part in the second round at some point and I led the tournament all the way up until Travelers was the 71st hole and Memphis was the 17th maybe. So 70th hole. So like both of those times like the the first thing that I took away was it away from it was how well I’ve played, how long I held the lead for and it came down to those closing few holes. I um like travelers especially, I didn’t feel like I did much wrong. I uh felt like I could have hit a couple times where I left myself like an awkward chip shot and like the the two tournaments in my mind played out so similar like it was a little bit uncanny like if you look at the shots that I had to it on so 16 I had a decent iron shot at travelers over the back and I look back and Jason Day hit a ridiculous chip shot from there that people don’t realize how good it was from like a similar spot and I tried to play it like lofted I was a bit nervous tried to go really lofted and soft and it sort of ran away 16 at Memphis. I hit it right at the green. Tried to play it really lofted, like really soft. It runs over the green. So, both of those very very similar like you know in both of them, you know, a shot a shot like half a shot out like both times and I felt like they were both just very similar. if I get myself in that position again. Um I I think more that because there was sort of a little bit of doubt that creeped in and and for how those tournaments had gone, it almost forced me to be to know that I had to be positive in in those moments and like commit to my shots. Um there was there was like no other choice because I knew if I got there again, I’d probably be thinking about these two like these two have just happened very recently. um is kind of a big talking point, but it’s going to force me to be to like have the right mindset. And I think I just I just took that away from them really. Like both tournaments played out very similar. Somebody I I never felt like I gave it away. I just felt like I’d you know had a bad finish and then the guys like Justin, JJ, Keegan, obviously they finished great as well. like they didn’t have to go on, you know, Keegan might not have birded the last um at Travelers or Justin might not have had the bat n did, you know, like things like that. So, um I just I took those things from it really and just knew that if I get there again um I’m just going to do everything I can to focus on the good and go out there and enjoy it. That’s that’s better than the only time I’ve ever been worried about you, Tommy, was I think right after Canada in 23 was right to the US Open. I think we talked that week and you literally said to me, you’re like, “Yeah, I was thinking about TC in the playoff, man. I just really wanted to do it for him.” And at that moment, I was like, “Oh no, what are we doing?” Like, “No, that’s not what you should be thinking about.” Uh, well, you know, crazy things pop into your mind at different times, but yeah, I was uh I’ve been I’ve been ready to get that win together for a long time now. What was the moment at East Lake? Like, I know you got off to a great start on Sunday. you had a massive massive par save on eight and that that for me was a moment of like all right that that putt goes in that feels different and then you know nine was playing really tough and and but that that moment on eight felt like all right this this feels much different especially after the the early birdies you had as well. Did that feel different to you or was it just hey that putt happened to go in and it was the same process? No, I was very much in the process at the time and then honestly I actually started to feel worse than any of the other tournaments through that middle part of the round because like the shots I hit on like five I a really bad T-OT and then six I played the hole pretty well but seven I know I a great bunker shot but the T-OT wasn’t like it was all right. It wasn’t that great. Eight was a terrible T- shot and then nine I hooked it off the tea and I said like I hit a shot on an 11 and I could feel like swing doesn’t feel very good like swing really doesn’t feel good at this point and like I felt worse at that point than in any time of any of the other tournaments. Um because I was like ah man I can feel like my rhythm’s gone, my tempo’s gone. Like hit some shockers and then I hit the so like you stand on 11. 11’s a really hard shot and I hit the green. Swing felt not very good and I was, you know, so I was like, I need to sort this out. And and I I said after the tournament, I was really proud of how I managed to like sort of feel like I fixed my swing a little bit there. And then I played the next few holes great. And to be fair, like 16, I hit an iron shot in there. Ball was above my feet and I a really nice iron shot. And I felt at that point I was like this the you know like visually the door is just opening wider and wider at this point. But it wasn’t until then that I really felt like this one looks like the one uh this one looks like the one I’m going to get done. Like I felt um I almost felt worse than the other two at that point in the middle of the round. Huh. Cuz that 10 makes that putt and then he puts it in the bunker on 11. you hit a a good shot and then it felt like from 12 onward was like, “All right, this is you’re he’s doing the right stuff. He’s he’s driving it in the fairway.” Uh and then 15T you had a long that was that was a pretty t like that’s such an outrageous tea box back there and yeah, you’d gone in the water the day before. Was that the moment that we were talking about laying up on Wednesday? Remember you and I putting were talking about how we scoped out laying up to the front tea box? Uh no. Um, and that was for the Creative Classic. Um, uh, um, not. Yeah. So, 15, like 15’s just not a great hole for for me. Like I I think it’s it’s probably a bit harsh like the way it’s been designed now because like and I like I look back, I think if my shot carried a yard further, I’m going to pitch on that down slope that’s just off the left side of the green and that could go in the water. And I haven’t really done anything wrong. It’s on the edge of being a bit harsh for me, but like the way that it sets up like the T the T aims left and then the green goes like on a like angles to the right. Like it it just doesn’t set up nice and like the day before. Yeah, I just put a terrible swing on it the day before and I was really disappointed that I just at least didn’t just put a good swing on it or hit a good shot and deal with it from there. if it goes in the water and I felt like I’d done like, you know, enough good things, you you’re sort of okay about it. But I I was really disappointed that I hit the shot that I did. And then and it was, you know, it was an awkward number. It was such a shocking number for me. Like uh if I hit a five iron that was a bit strong, it’s going to go, you know, left and carry a bit further than where it did. If I a sixiron that’s kind of carrying just onto the green, well, if I miss it or if I push it, then that’s in the water. So, it was a really awkward number as well and that’s why we that’s why we took quite a bit of time discussing it. I just um like I just wanted to get the right one and take my time. I think the easiest thing would be to rush. Um so even though like it was a long time on the tea, I just felt like we were talking through it and trying to get the right one. And then once we got it, I was I was fine. I just committed to the shot. I actually like I hit a nice shot. I I think anywhere on land on that hole is a good golf shot. So, uh that was that was always going to be a big hole. If I got off if I got off that where when I had land, you know, like bogei is going to be fine. Like I even, you know, I I was totally ready if I if I hit it in the water as well, double wasn’t disaster. I was still in a I was still in a good position. It just wasn’t as good as where I was. And then the next two shots were probably next two shots are really big. Like Patrick pulled it into the rough and had to chip out and I hit the fairway. So yeah, that was like a that and the second shot were big sort of decisive no moments for me because in that moment what I’m what I’m we’re all flashing back to is 18 fairway at Travelers when there was looked like there was a lot of indecision on the club choice there and I’m I was just did you did you learn anything from that specific moment right did you look back that night were you like man what how did I land on that decision uh or you know was it was it the strike kind of take us back to that one because a lot of people kind of called that uh that moment help. Yeah. Again, I I spoke to Bob Teller about this afterwards. Um and he was he was really good about it because like so he he told me that he didn’t think, you know, he wouldn’t say that how I played that shot or anything or how I went about it was indecisive. He said it was completely understandable. So I’m in between I’m in between two shots like the the wind is sort of across you know moving across moving into moving across moving into I’m in between two clubs and the first question like Finn asked me is like you know how pumped up are you which is you know obviously a legitimate question like on Sunday in Atlanta I was hitting the ball like miles um and like we we just you know we judged it really well I was hitting it so far with my irons and and yeah stood in that fairway and and the one I picked originally like I’ve got this swing, you know, a hands to shoulders nine, whatever, which is slightly different flight. It goes a bit further than a normal wedge. And anyway, as I walked into it, uh, again, you know, the way the way that wind swirls and stuff like F wasn’t happy with it. It’s fine. Pull off, go to go to choose the wedge. What Bobbert said to me, he went, “You stood in there, you made your decision, you know, maybe you backed off it, but then you made another decision, which which happens all the time, and you stood up and you committed to the golf shot, and it just wasn’t the right one.” But like it was, you know, he was he made me feel really good about it because he was like, you know, if you’d have stood in there and put a bad swing and sort of felt like it was the wrong one or you were indecisive like over the shot and put a bad swing on it, that’s a different story. But, you know, got the decision wrong and then three put. Yeah, I I three putted from there. Like left it way short and didn’t hit the greatest put, didn’t hit the worst put, didn’t go in. Keegan holds it and that’s that. You know, like I said, everything that could have gone wrong went wrong. And but yeah, like you just um again like over on when you fast forward to Atlanta like get like the 16th hole in Memphis in between clubs. I had to fade it around the sorry not 16, 17 in between clubs got to fade it around a tree from the middle of the fairway. Uh I think there’s like a little bit more on it, but again like just uh funny how again such a crucial moment I ended up choosing between two clubs. I would love to stand there and know that it was a definite like you know it’s just a good six iron or something like that. But um those things just kept popping up and uh eventually I got it you know got it right. Um but both those times like I could have two pututed 18 at travelers. I could have hold it. people have hold puts on me before from like long range and you know 17 I could have got up and down and take it down the last so they just those times didn’t happen for me and but yeah you learn from similar situations. When did how often do you talk with Bob Rosella and is that you know was that something that you were seeking out specifically in relation to some of the close calls and where you were at mentally or was this kind of just a normal check-in? No, I mean that that one is uh you know after travelers obviously that’s a particular scenario that you’re going to go through and talk about. I speak to him a lot like the um I’m pretty sure he speaks to so many of the guys that he works with like all the time like I think he’s an unbelievable human being for that like he no matter what the tournament is you’ll always get just you know even just a message saying you know giving you those um and it’s you know majority of the time it’s always the same it’s always the same things we know the mental process that we want we know the attitude that we want and it’s just and it’s just reminders and then sometimes you want to speak to him a little bit longer and um you throughout all of or throughout the last few weeks when um I suppose you would say uh I’ve probably had to sort of be a little bit mentally stronger and a bit more resilient coming back uh from you know some losses or some close calls. Messaging would always stay the same with him. Uh always upbeat, always positive, doing so many of the right things, doing so many good things. you know, go out, enjoy being in the best mindset possible, enjoy being in your bubble, have a blast doing what you love, like all all of those things. So, all the messaging is and and all the the stuff we talk about is very very consistent. And then when, you know, when something crops up like Travelers or Memphis or even after a win, you know, like we’ll Wentworth’s coming up, you know, we’ll talk about that and we’ll just get back into that uh mental process of trying to, you know, perform as best we can when that comes as well. A break here to note. Again, we will not have video unfortunately for the remainder of this podcast, but an excellent second half of this podcast that you’re going to want to listen to as well. Also want to give a shout out to our friends at the stacksystem. You can go to the stacksystem.comlu. You can use code no laying up to get 10% off of a bundle on that website. Uh I had I recently was uh boasting if you will on the most recent ad read saying that I touched 121 miles an hour with driver uh in my backyard. Had some haters in there. I got a little video that might be might already be out by now, but a little video out there proving that I’m swinging the club actually faster than 121 miles an hour right now uh in the training program. I was at 117, I think, when we started. It’s just speaks to uh how much this product actually works. I do the training program on a regular basis. It’s gified. It’s really fun. It schedules out when you should do the workouts. It tells you what weights to swing, how often to swing them. It tracks your progress. Gives you encouraging messages throughout. And that’s all to say there’s a wedge system in there. There’s a putting system in there if you want to get better at golf. If you got a limited time to do it, the stacksystem.comlu code no laying up for 10% off. I get so many DMs and so many great stories from people about how much they’ve enjoyed this product and I really truly believe in it. Stacksystem.comlu code no laying up. Here’s Tommy Fleetwood. It seems like you really just in hearing like I think a lot of times it sounds like cliche almost from other people of hey I’m just going to get back on the horse and learn from this and work harder and everything. But even after your win, you said it was like, “What are you going to do?” You’re like, “I’m just going to go home and I’m going to start practicing again.” Like, and it seems like you truly love the work. You love the process and you love it’s not just the the destination, it’s the journey. And um can you just talk talk a little bit about that because I think that’s such a refreshing refrain to hear versus, you know, hey, I’ve reached the mountaintop and you kind of look around and what else is there versus seems like you’re just constantly trying to improve. Yeah, because I mean I I I do like to read a lot of stuff and listen to a lot of stuff and I think that’s probably a theme that I have jumped on in a in a way. I I I think that it’s it’s probably right and I hear a lot of people talk about that. Um a lot of successful people and I I think I guess I’ve not reached as many mountain tops as most people or a lot of people or I wouldn’t consider myself to have. So, you know, if if I I guess the FedEx is one of them and uh you know, I still feel the same. So, that’s that’s one thing. Um but, you know, I have I have plenty of things that I feel like I want to um achieve still in the game, but also I I do love working at my game and I know that, you know, there’s times when uh you have a great tournament and feel unsatisfied and there’s times when you’ve not done as well and you feel like you’ve done like so many good things. So, I um I You know, I always kind of use that as an analogy as well and feeling and um yeah, I I just get a lot out of trying to be the like trying to improve every day, try and be the best golfer I can be at some point. Whether I’ve reached my potential or not, I don’t know. I definitely don’t feel like I have. Um, I’m I’m enjoying, you know, trying to get there and I I I just think, you know, yeah, this like I I it was a winning uh the tour championship or FedEx Cup or just winning for the first time on the PJ tour. It felt great. Like it it feels amazing and I’m so I’m so glad that I’ve done it. But I did say like, you know, for me it was never about just winning once. It was just that that one time took so long and it would became like a big story and in order to win like multiple times or plenty of times had to win once. So that that just felt like a you know it was like a um that just came like really difficult um in the end or it took a long time. But yeah, I I I really just think you know I I enjoy doing what I’m doing and I enjoy like I you know practicing and playing like I did today. like I enjoy that and at no point today was I thinking about you know I wasn’t thinking about Wentworth I wasn’t thinking about the right cup I wasn’t thinking about the tour championship I was just like playing and practicing and assessing where I was today and tried to get better from it and I I um like I I like doing that. What’s a book or two that you’ve read lately that sticks out as hey this is this was genuinely impactful. Any recommendations on that front? been listening to some good podcasts actually and I never know the name of podcasts. I like unless it’s like you know the ones that are like obvious like a no laying off or something like and I find them and then I listen and then I’m like I just completely forget what the name of it was but I’m like oh that that that was a that was a really good podcast. Um what book have I read recently? Um I have actually uh there was one that I was reading so I was reading um so I actually read into the bear trap recently. Um, do you remember Mark James captain in the RDER Cup at Brooklyn? This is nothing to do with like self-help books or like thingy, but like I read that book and that was that was really really good. And that’s that’s why my mind’s gone blank cuz that’s like the the last book that I read and it was literally uh during the FedEx playoffs and that’s kind of um taken uh taken over my mind. I’ve read these two like um it’s a few books at the moment and the the words I’m going to have to go get it later for you or I’ll send you pictures of it. But it’s um we believe these like these like no they’re these like Japanese books and I never get the words right because they’re based on a word in like simple living and stuff like that and I’ve like that um there’s a good book uh called breath um I think that was by a guy like James Nester I think it was like it’s just you know book on breathing and stuff liked that. Um, so yeah, I’m like I’m feeling a lot of rubbish now. Actually, truth is I like never read. I’ve never read anything. Um, that’s it. So, I did not know I did not know that there was a Mark James book about uh about Brooklyn. I I’ve got to get I’ve got to buy this immediately and read it. Sure enough, I just googling the description of it. You’ve got to read it. It’s it’s it’s really good. In the description, it says that the people ran through Olthabel’s line, which again, the video does not does not support, but this has been this narrative for 25 26 years now. And literally in the actual description of the book, it says, “Olith still has a putt to keep the RDER Cup alive, but several jubilant Americans have already run straight across his line, destroying his concentration in the process.” That’s my favorite. I got to read this immediately. Tommy, what’s been uh from a from a game perspective, your putting seems to be like just like the floor is a lot higher and we saw it at Memphis, we saw it at East Lake. Like it it it just seems like your stroke, whether it’s the the mallet or your stroke itself or your green reading, like what’s what’s been the biggest change or transformation on that front? Yeah, I mean the putter has definitely had um a big impact. like I um after the masters um I went on to the putting green at Hilton Head on Monday and I felt like so I um I never feel like my putting gets much credit and I never feel like I’m as bad of a putter as like I I sort of and and maybe I have that little like chip on my shoulder or narrative about it at times like there’s times when obviously I put it poorly But I’ve also feel like I’ve um had some really good seasons put in and it goes unnoticed at times. Uh but this year I was like I was putting up start of the year. Um but I wasn’t putting great like I was putting fine and I just after the Masters well I didn’t feel like I puted particularly well. I went to the putting green at Hilton Heads on Monday and um Adrian and James were there from Tailor Made. So James is the tailor made putter guy and I just said you know what I want to try a few I want to try a few different putters and it it’s literally just for a different feel like a different energy on the greens because I feel like I’m doing all the right things but something’s just not clicking at the moment and I just want to change that. I just want a different energy. So anyway ended up with um so that’s what I ended up with. I ended up with the black spider and um we ended up drawing these lines on it cuz there was um a particular putter that I liked which had like some milling in the top which made lining up like it just made a really big thick line and it made lining up easy. So I went and um put that Hilton had puted really nice and then just kind of kept putting well and I think confidence has been really good like Memphis BMW like East Lake felt really really good on the greens like just felt really confident. I was I was reading them really well. And I think um like I had a great routine to put in well my pace like one of the things that always working on with with Phil and and even Butch like having conversations you know wanting that pace to be as consistent as possible and almost just being bit more aggressive really like putting a bit more aggressively and I feel like I’ve been doing that. Uh but yeah, like it it’s it’s definitely had a monumental improvement um since moving to that spider putter, but like I say, I I feel like I have like put it well in the past and sort of I always feel like I maybe it goes unnoticed at times. Um but yeah, like this this year or this summer has definitely been the best I’ve put it by by quite a way. on the ride home like you you flew back to England, you know, few hours after East Lake. I remember Yeah. sitting in the in the uh clubhouse with Finnow having a beer and he’s like, “All right, we got to go to the airport.” And it was you and Rosie and I think Shane, all you guys were on the team, you know, on the flight together. Was that a party or was that just a total release of like, “All right, I gotta just go to bed. I’m exhausted.” Yeah, I was um like by the time we’ done everything, I mean I was like I I can’t sit off to the airport without showering. Like there’s no chance. So I had like a a twominut shower like threw some clothes on and we got to the airport, checked in, went through I um so there was uh Justin so I actually randomly bumped into them just by mistake. Justin, Shane Oh no, it wasn’t Shane. It was Shane’s Kelly Darren. Shane had uh Shane had gone to Florida. Of course he had uh uh Bob was there and I sat down. I had one beer. Got on the plane and then I sat there and I was like I’m not moving anywhere. Like I there was no party. Tried to sleep. Didn’t really sleep very well. I was I was just I just excited to get home and see everyone cuz Claire and and Mo and Frankie had sort of had missed out on on being there and there was me and Oscar there and I just wanted to get home and see everyone. So, I was pretty um I was pretty tired at the end of it and yeah, it was more of a just like soak in the moment. Just relax, like take it in. It was it was really nice. Well, I I’ve made managed to make it about 30 minutes without bringing up my favorite topic, which is the upcoming RDER Cup, of course. Uh I’m I’m curious, you know, with Europe’s uh we’re recording this on Wednesday. Europe finalized their their captain’s pick this past Monday. It is almost the exact same team that we saw in Rome just changing out a nic a uh adding in Arasmus taking away a Nikolai. What uh do do players have any input on who they’d like to be captain’s picks? Are you guys involved in that process at all? Kind of uh that communication, that conversation. Does it get down to who you’d want to be paired with and matched up with? Uh and I’m I’m curious your kind of input or how the the captains communicate that with you guys? No. No. Um, captain’s picks literally are, you know, captain’s picks. That’s that’s that’s the whole point of them and that’s what they are. But, um, as players, you you don’t really Yeah, you don’t you don’t have any input in that. I think there’s probably past rider cups or, you know, the captain and the vice captains will look at definite like certain relationships with players or past rider cups and partnerships and things like that. Um but but no like from a from a players perspective like no I I had no you have no say or nor do I you know want any say in any of the the picks or anything like that. There was a a colleague of ours asked a question in your press conference uh at during the tour championship about what captains have done to set you up for success and you you started to tell a story about why you were sent out in a specific spot in the singles order and you kind of veered off and didn’t finish the answer as to why. I think you were sent out 11th. Is do I remember that right? And kind of what was the communication as as to why that was and uh I was I was curious your answer on that. No, it was it was I think what I said was so I played 11 at Wiston Straits and uh you know me and Jordan played together and it was it just wasn’t a great spot to be in for that one because um you know we struggled as a team. So then the RDER Cup was done sort of early on in that singles. So then like for us being at the back, you know, you have you have pride in your point, of course you do, and you want to play well, but it’s a bit deflating then being at the back. Uh either deflating or, you know, or won the right cup. And then um on the Saturday night I think um you know the singles draw hadn’t come out yet and I think it was I must I I I think I said it to CLA or something and I said you know I I feel like I know where Luke’s going to put me and I really want to go there like I played 11th last time. I’ve just got this feeling I’m going to go out like back end again like 11 and she’s like oh why I was like well you know if we start off great like radical will be over and I I kind of you know I I’ll want to celebrate at that point or you know I’m not I won’t be really that interested in my point but then actually could come down to us at that like back there and if if it does like oh no it’s kind of a lot of like there’s a lot of pressure at that point like it’s not going how we want it to go and um like we we were laughing about it in the uh team room, me, Shane, and Bob about being at the back and stuff. But anyway, um like I said that to CL, I’d not said anything to anybody else really about it. Um again, like that and then the draw comes out 11th and um so anyway, like I I I really didn’t mention it. I didn’t really say anything about it. Uh but Cla must have told Luke cuz um at the end of it all or walking off the 70 actually I didn’t see anybody for ages. So like 16 was where we you know we guaranteed the point but then 17 I went and finished the match on 17 but everybody had gone pretty much like there I did an interview on the 17th hole where there’s crowd around now I turned around and there was like we were just stuck on the 17th green and everybody had gone like there was nobody there so I didn’t see anybody for ages and when I did see Luke he said uh I wish I could remember the exact words but he was like you know are you happy that I put you out number 11 or not too upset that you’re out 11th now or you know something like that like it was it was it was a really good moment and he and he probably said you know the confidence he had in me to to put me back there and stuff and how it and how it all worked out. So um so that was that that was a you know just a good example of like uh like I say like you you have ultimate trust in your captain and um it did work out in the end. Tommy, do you do you prep for a Ryder Cup any differently than a than a individual stroke play golf tournament? Well, the Ryder Cup is like um the week of it is just so different to anything that we experience like week in week even leading into the week like like prior to the week starting. Yeah, I I I don’t I don’t think so. I think you practice on your game um as you normally would. Like maybe think about the course cuz you know we’ll we’ll know the course at that point in the week leading up to it and think about that or what you might want to work on certain holes or you know certain kind certain type of puts. But no I um no I I don’t really feel like I I do anything that differently. I sort of kind of I try and believe that you go in there and you try and everything about that week is trying to play your game which is almost the hardest thing to do right like in the circumstance but play your game and um for me like mentally part of that is preparing the way that I would always prepare because when you get to the RD cup like there’s no none of that time is your own time like you you you’re not on any you don’t have anything like that you’ll have a couple of sections like little pockets of time where you can practice but the rest of it is obviously so much going on in terms of practice rounds with the team, um, team meetings, media, dinners, like like things like that. So, so you you sort of have to be ready to, you know, wherever your game is at going into their cut. That’s like what you know, you want it to be in a pretty good spot and not be worrying about it. So, yeah, I just I just think I practice how I would normally practice and go and try and play my game. You you’ve been a part of two triumphant teams at home in Europe. you’ve been a part of one road team uh that was not triumphant at Whistling Straits. What do you take from the Whistling Straits? Is that the experience you draw on? Like are the are the home and away RDER Cups two totally different experiences in terms of what it takes to win? And what did you what do you take away from being on the losing side of one of these into the next one to you know to say like all right well this this time around we need to do this differently. Yeah, I I still take away like W Straits uh you know for the result that we had and I I think you know a lot of us in that team didn’t feel like we did ourselves justice in the way that we played or we didn’t do Europe justice in the in and we we just couldn’t play like we wanted to but had the most unbelievable time and what I what I did feel in that RDER Cup was we were getting beat from the get-go so we didn’t really get out of the blocks obviously in a way rider a cup so support is not in your favor. Um how much we came together as a team, how much we drew on like whatever the good stuff was we could find in that week and the positives and half points, points, um little moments like times that we spent with the team like we drew on all of those things which were an unbelievable experience and I’ve always said you know I don’t have I don’t have a favorite Ryder Cup out of the three. Um I I’ve loved them all so much for different reasons in each one. Uh and Whistling Straits was one of them. And yeah, it’s uh is it is a completely different um you know test like the home crowd as it should I think plays a big part in in the RDER Cup. Um and and I I think it should do that. That’s that’s part of what the the dream is and the experience is that you get to go into these scenarios that we don’t get to do like week in week out. Like Ryder Cup’s so special to us because you know those home rider cups, you get to experience it with that home crowd. They lift you on their shoulders. You ride their momentum when it’s going well and they can pick you up when it’s going bad. And um for an away rider cup, you’re obviously uh playing it playing against those exact same things. But um dreamt about playing rider cups all our lives and uh and away one is is just exactly the same as that. Like you still dreamt about it. You still dreamt about that atmosphere. Um you know does it get any bigger than New York as well? That’s going to be amazing. And um yeah, I’m I’m really really excited to go there and play this one. Is it is it truly that much more in intimidating? I guess, you know, you’re talking about the the home crowd, you know, you’re riding their shoulders, you know, into hitting good. I’m always curious like how does this translate into good golf shots or bad golf shots, right? Like is it that much more intimidating to play in front of a crowd that that’s rooting against you? Is it the you know, the insults that are hurled at you? Is it the you know, I’m just curious. Yeah, I don’t I don’t think it’s it’s it’s an intimidating thing because um like it’s just it’s it’s just not like um as in I I mean like it’s not the intimidation factor that that you worry that you worry about. I think it’s more of the obviously the momentum that the crowd can create. Like you hit a you hit a great shot in a home rider cup, it obviously gets a an unbelievable reception and you feel like you’ve hit a better shot than maybe you have. Hit some unbelievable shots in an away one and it’ll be a lot quieter. And I I I think things like that, you know, I I I I think I think that obviously plays a role in it. So momentum is like a very it’s not a real thing, but it is a very real thing. Um, of course it is. And I I I think that’s the best way to describe it. Um but but you know that that’s that’s why you come together as as a team and you use each other for that and and you enjoy that and like I say enjoy that atmosphere. I think the crowd is always um the crow the crowd loved that they can get involved I think and that they can create those moments and um and I I think as a player like you love that as well because it’s it’s so unique in our sport and it’s so unique to the RDER Cup and um but yeah they they they just play a big role in momentum I think and how it feels. Tommy, looking ahead at next year, 2026 majors. You got Augusta obviously, but then you’ve got Shinnik where you’ve played well. Uh you’ve got Aronom for the PGA and then a home game for you at Burkedale. Do you put extra pressure on a place like Burkale and and how do you approach that one or is it similar to how you approach the rest of them? No, I like I I would say I’ve been lucky um like I’m so lucky with where I with where I grew up and you look at you know I I would consider an open at Hoy Lake um a home venue. I uh you know and then there’s Burkedale which is literally my hometown. Um you know if there was an open at Litham that would be a home venue as well. like you got these three places that are so close to where I where I grew up and I I I’m so lucky and so blessed that I get to, you know, the event that I feel like I um love the most or put on a pedestal. Uh I get to play, you know, the odd one at home. And I think that’s very very special. there’s I I think it’s you know you have to deal with your own expectations and and the hope that you have because um is is there again you talk about dreams from being a kid like my god standing on the 18th green at Verdale like with a cl jug it’s like off the charts like uh how that makes me feel but um so there’s like controlling that side of and managing that, but also it’s it’s a huge gift that you get to play in front of a home crowd and you get to do that um and play that tournament. Most the majority of people, you know, go their whole lives without being able to play an event that they would call like a a home event um and let alone like have the chance to do it a few times and it being literally in that in you know my hometown and it be the open. So um yeah, it’s it’s a very special time for me. feel like I’m very lucky and I think as as I as I continue to sort of get experience in that situation like Bertdale in 2017, I’ve played Hoy Lake twice now. I think knowing how important it is to enjoy and embrace it and use it as a positive and use it as um an advantage uh because it is is is so crucial because everybody’s there and they just want you know they want the best for you. They want the world for you and and it’s very very lucky. It seems like a great course fit for you too. I was gonna say and that dream TC is gonna be by that green too with that cleric drug jug. I promise you that uh TC could be a you know south we caught sand grounder it would be that’s what people from Southport called. So you’ll be adopted sand grounder for that for that week. Um uh yeah I haven’t played it since the changes actually. So I’m actually uh if if when I do get the chance I’m looking forward to seeing like the new layout of Bale. How do you from a home perspective like you your coach lives in Vegas, got a place in Dubai, you like you you play a lot of golf in the States. How do you manage just traveling all over the world and in your blocks of time in different regions of the world? Uh yeah, I just do it. Um you know, I I’m always like I’m always very aware that you know, I never complain about the amount of travel I do. Um I’m always aware that I always have a choice. I could not travel. I could not play if that’s really what I wanted or what we wanted. Um so yeah, we just we just manage it as best we can. Uh kids are you know kids are obviously in school in Dubai and uh that’s where you know we’ve decided to base ourselves for the time being. I, you know, get over to Vegas as much as I can, which is, um, you know, a handful of times, a little bit more than that, uh, throughout the year and try and find those pockets. Um, playing on the PJ tour a lot. So then, you know, you get these like the early part of the season, I think the schedule’s I remember looking at schedule and I haven’t like delved into it much yet, but it’s a bit different next year. So, uh, that’s obviously the first thing I look at. I’m like, you know, how am I going to get home or how am I going to structure it to get home? And then there’s always like a big bulk in the middle of the year where um I’m in America for a few weeks and and playing tournaments and I’ll I’ll get one week off but I’m not going to travel home for a week and I have friends that I’ll that I’ll stay with and hang out. But it’s always been fine. Like um we’ve ne, you know, not had an issue with it yet. My family are very supportive. Uh and yeah, we’ve just always made it work. And like I say, I’m always aware. Uh, I’m never going to be one of those that complain about travel or or schedule because, you know, if you didn’t want to, you don’t have to. Like, nobody’s, you know, forcing you. So, you’re looking for three three to four week blocks and then if you don’t have at least 10 days, you’re not going home. Yeah, exactly. If if possible, like three weeks uh or four weeks is perfect and then, you know, you’d get two weeks at home and then travel back out again. And there has been, you know, the last few years there’s always like a a seven or eight week block that I’m out there and um if I manage to get family out there for one of those weeks, it’s a it’s a bonus really. It’s it’s good if we can do that. Awesome. Uh speaking of just just managing your schedule, when are we doing our lefty match? And tell me about what do you Well, no, I I I have to improve a little bit and um before that like uh do you know what do you know what’s really interesting about it is like what I’m trying to describe it is to people is like so my right-handed golf is like my job and I I don’t get time to like practice left-handed. It’s not like I can throw everything at it. So anytime pretty much anytime I do something left-handed, I’m just going to film it and video it. Like I haven’t hit balls for a while. Like I’ve just played the the playoffs and everything. Uh I haven’t hit shots left-handed for for for a little bit now. So I’ll you know I had a lesson. I did whatever like hit some balls. But I’m just going to be back to square one when I do hit shots again. But like everybody will see it. So are you getting lessons from Butch left-handed or you No, I I had uh I I actually So he actually called me. So I’ve done that video. So the the lesson uh the video the YouTube video that’s just come out. I had a lesson with Michael Sweeney. He’s like head of performance at TFA in Dubai and he was he was really good. But I get this phone call off Butch and he’s like you’re playing golf left-handed now. Uh and I was like well I was like just hear me out. He’s like what are you doing? Uh I don’t get it. And I was like well just hear me out. It’s just it’s just a bit of fun. It’s just something I like wanted to do and everything. And then, yeah, I sort of talked him talked him through it a little bit and then uh he’s going to give me he will give me a lesson. I’m going to okay have to get my left-handed set to uh Vegas and he he’ll he’ll give me a lesson. So, I truly believe it’s it’s like I think it helped my right-handed game a bunch. It balanced my body out. It helped my course management. first session. The first session that I did and again I filmed it, put it on there, like after half an hour or 20 minutes, my right ankle was on fire like loading loading like hitting through the shot into my into my right side. I was like, “Oh my god, like this this is like and I just I’ll just power through it and stuff.” But yeah, it’s it’s different. It’s different, man. And the thing is like I’ve got no idea like what to do. Like whatever I do right-handed, I can fix it. Like I’m not saying I’m going to hit a perfect shot straight after it, but I can do something different. I’ve got no idea left-handed. I’ve got like just no idea. And it’s um it’s kind of infuriating shots yet. Yeah, I was all right out of the bunker cuz bunker was the thing that for me that was would just go there. You just be there for like a week. I always say whenever I’m trying to give lessons like in a bunker, I’m like, “Well, bunker bunker plays like the easy bit because you don’t hit the ball.” Like that’s the one that’s easy. And then I got in there left-handed. I was like, “Oh, no, no, no. This this isn’t this doesn’t feel good.” But I was because you feel that resistance and it’s totally because I’ve I’ve always been a good bunker player right-handed. I’m like, “Oh, like bunker play is easy. It’s simple.” And then I finally identified with higher handicaps of like, “Oh, wait, no, it’s not simple.” Yeah. It feels awful. Yeah. Tommy, have you uh had a chance to meet with the new PJ Tour CEO, Brian Rolap? Uh I know he’s been trying to meet with with as many guys as possible. One, have you? And if you haven’t, what’s uh what what are your biggest priorities? What’s on your list of things uh to talk to him about of how he could uh improve the PGA Tour? Um no, I I uh I’ve met him twice, but we’ve never like, you know, never sat down and spoke or never spoke over the phone. He was he was there at the tour championships and and everything. And I think seems like a you know a really really impressive guy and I feel like without um you know without understanding details and and without knowing any of that stuff he he’s he seems like he’s kind of hit the ground running and he’s saying the you know the right things and all of that and he and he sounds really good. I um do you know I of of of course I have an interest in what happens on the PJ tour, but I have no interest in making those decisions or saying like or like um you know coming up with those ideas. I just um it’s it’s it’s just never something that I felt like I’ve never had the mindset for it or the or like the mental capacity to like you know being somebody from um you know from England from DP World Tour, you know, then I moved to Dubai. I you know I I love the fact that I can play on the PJ tour and I I’ I’ve always enjoyed there’s never been the time where I’ve not enjoyed like being at a PJ tour event and getting the chance to play like you know against all these best players and I I I just I you know I obviously there’s been changes and it’s been it’s been really good for us. the changes have been good for the guys that um again like very lucky I’ve played you know all you know almost all the elevated events I’ve you know had that perfect schedule I’ve had that I’ve been able to play the majors and and and all of that stuff so it’s it’s easy for me to say like you know it’s it’s all great but you know I thought it was great before as well so like whatever the changes have been like you know again I know I’m lucky and and and I’ve always been able to play where I want to play but Um, I don’t know. Whatever the changes are, I I will show up and I’ll work and I’ll play and um, you know, I I’ll still enjoy like trying to enhance my career, but um, we’ll see. I feel like the tour’s in a really great spot and um, like yeah, we’ll see. Tommy, have you been to the new Everton stadium yet? Not since it’s finished. No, I um I went when it was getting constructed and then uh I watched well I was watching uh them play Brighton at home uh the morning of the Sunday at Tour Champs and stuff and um and then they played a League Cup game there but no I haven’t been um since it’s been done and and like since it’s been full and everything but everybody’s like raving about this place. They say it’s unbelievable. Looks awesome. Yeah. Last one I got for you Tommy. Who’s the most interesting person you heard from after your win at the Tour Championship? That’s a tough one. Uh, you can name a couple if you need to. Well, no, like a lot of guys that I mean like sporting people that uh that you know people would be interested in like you know um you know Rafa Nadal, Michael Phelps, like obviously ton of like tour players that um you know which is really cool. Well, I think the coolest thing is when when your peers like text you and message you and say um you know and say congratulations and and and things like that. Um so many you know so many friends and and and stuff. I I think you know what struck me was like just the amount of people that seemed to just become invested in in the story and uh and me like winning that golf tournament. I um that that took me back and that was like the that was you know the coolest thing for me was uh people from like I say people from as close to me as possible like but then throughout the world as well and that that was like by far and away the coolest thing for me was just the amount of people that seem to just become invested in that story and were so happy tweeting about you. Yeah. Yeah. I mean it’s reflection of how you because I didn’t see any of that but like LeBron Tiger K. Yeah. It was pretty good. Cool. Well, hey, we appreciate you spending some time with us. Wishing you personally uh from me the best of luck uh at the upcoming RDER Cup, even if I’m not necessarily rooting for your team to to be the victorious team. That’s okay. That’s okay. I’ll let you off. So, we appreciate your time. Good catch up and congrats on everything. We’re really happy for you, guys. Thank you so much.