#99: RICK MIDDLETON: The Raw Knuckles Podcast

Rick Middleton joins Chris and Tim to talk all things Boston Bruins, rivalry with Montreal, and winning gold in the paralympics!

Time Stamps:

0:00 Intro
1:00 Knuckles’ One Regret
5:00 Rick’s Game
12:00 Drafted To NY
20:50 Getting Traded to Boston
28:30 Rivalries
37:30 Bruins Legacy
1:07:15 Sled Hockey
1:19:30 Closing

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Hey everybody thanks for listening to Raw Knuckles podcast please like follow And subscribe I think the only reason why I tape my stick was cuz everybody else did yeah I if you would have came to training camp with no tape I would have been like this guy’s cut we got to

Get rid of this guy he doesn’t know to put tape on his stick but if you look he doesn’t tape on his stick how you talking about if you look at Bobby Bobby’s stick Bobby used one strip one one really I mean where where was The Strip at Super

Near the H near the hill so it doesn’t really serve a purpose and not using it served a better purpose than using when I stepped on the ice I never backed down and I never stayed down and I was vicious and I was malicious and I don’t

Care I’m alive he’s a freaking mad man look at him going to town that’ll be all right let’s get um let’s get rolling here and listen if we’ve talked about this certainly you and I um the incident um that uh Knuckles did uh when I hit you in the chops and well

Everybody calls it a butt end I say I hit you with my glove but regardless I I know you did what I did was totally out of line it was out of character for me I’d never done something like that and it’s the one thing that I was ashamed of the one

Regret I have during U my National Hockey League career so I I want to address that right off the Hop because so many people I still see people and that’s the one thing they always hit me with especially when I’m home and I’ve apologized to you and you’ve accepted I

Remember like 10 15 years ago we were playing in somewhere in the Mari times and we’re on the bench together and you turn to me and go nephew I got to tell you I’m sorry that was like 25 years later now it’s like 40 years later he’s

Like I thought about it I thought about it I feel bad about it come on I mean yeah I hope you don’t think about it too much because I don’t well I I don’t it’s only when people bring it up cuz other people won’t let me forget it and certainly or me or

Me every time I see you you know but um no I I was joking I said I was thinking you know why didn’t you just hit me sucker me or something and go me into fighting I said then I thought well maybe you saw my bouts against SCH and

Sitler earlier in my career and you were a little nervous did you get suspended for that N I got eight game suspension Tim y back then too I got ham yeah I got Hamm it and I got a new Bridge yeah yeah your teeth look good buddy listen join the

Club I just had these done again cuz my finally my uh my old bridge were attached to uh teeth and then those went those went on me so now I no now I got post put in I said now my mouth is worth more than my

Car Well mine’s worth more than my house right yeah all of these implants they’re all implants so I always say it I said listen everybody bleeds in this game and you know it’s funny I was watching your highlight real a couple of them actually and some really good ones and one thing

I noticed on a couple of them they had you on the bench and one time on the bench you had a big gash on your forehead and then another one you had a black eye like I’m like what the hell what happened to you there I don’t know I don’t remember you

Know you have one big black eye my game was making defenseman look silly and when you make them look silly they they kind of take you know so that was to me you know growing up I was always a goal scorer I wasn’t a tough guy obviously um so my for of

Intimidation is to get other people pissed off so they take you know shots at me and draw a penalty then you know that’s that’s to help the team maybe score a power play goal and we win the game I mean that was my form of getting into their heads was to make defenseman

Big guys look silly and in those days you could be them oneon-one you could stick the puck between their stick and their feet and you know force them to look down and today you’ll hardly see anybody beat anybody one-on-one they they skate too well today well n Point that’s a good point

For sure listen it’s funny like as a one-on-one player you’re probably for me one of the best if not the best one-on-one player I ever played against I hated guy tell a guy named Mario came along then well Mario too Mario and and and gretz was you know but they were

Different they were no there all different ways to do it yeah there was but oneon-one player like you were and I I say that because I know I I knew the sentiment on our bench and I knew the sentiment in me whenever you got the puck and you were coming through the

Neutral zone everybody’s ass tightened up everybody’s everybody on the bench and certainly the two defenseman you were going at and you would come down like a little head shake leave the puck go the puck would go by and you’re on your heels and then next thing you buy

Him and you’re alone and people are just sitting on the bench you look at someone how the [ __ ] did he do that and well you know and I say that because I’ve seen it no I was saying the same thing I was watching your highlights you had the background music was America like

Magic you know what I you know what I say about uh highlight films they’re great because they all go in no but Chris is right though it’s like you had this like you would move in the you the puck wouldn’t and it was just like this mag magic like well you

Know I learned I learned that the the most effective way to beat a guy is not to have the puck on your stick and I always joke that defenseman weren’t that smart because you know as you know n when they’re trained to look at you so they they they’re trained not to take

Their eyes off your body but I used to like to put the puck between their stick and their skate so they can actually still see it and they got to look down I mean they can’t help it look down and once they look at the puck they’re gone

And didn’t work every time I go knock them my butt many many many times but uh it’s a lot of averages a lot of a but there’s one guy that you played with that I could never beat and you probably big Larry yeah big Larry he was on the

Left side I’m coming down the right way I don’t care how many times you do this no he was just too strong he had too big a reach you know you couldn’t get around him it’s funny so would you that’s a good point though would so a guy like

Him would you notice when he’s on and just try to you know take everything to the other d man I I used to do that mine was not skill it was like just afraid to get hit by someone so I I learned I learned uh I learned after um getting

You know when I first came up I tried to beat everybody and that was hazardous to your help and then I I got taught you know well you know mix it up go wide turn come back make the P to the lake guy you know so I didn’t always try to

Beat guy so that way they didn’t know exactly what I was going to going to do every time but with Larry you know I try it at times uh I always like to cut in the middle but you got to keep your head up and once you count in the middle the

Defenseman get a little confused they don’t know who who who should take them should I take them should you take them there’s one highlight film I love it’s in Montreal and I I went to the middle and the Left Right defenseman came over and ran into the left defenseman but

They never continued to play because I didn’t score on it yeah but but yeah it’s just you know it happened once in a while and luckily they caught it on film so you’re born in Toronto you played minor hockey there uh Wexford team uh Toronto young was uh was the big

Team when I was 13 I went to the Toronto young Nationals and I got a coach by name of Frank Miller and I’m sure in your career you had a coach that really changed your game around and he was the guy 13 to 16 improved my skating

Immensely to the point where I got six p scholarship offers got drafted by U generals otherwise I was a small skinny kid I had a knack of scoring but I you know I wasn’t very strong in my skates and he I actually invited him to be on

The ice the night of my retirement him and Don Cherry with the two coaches on the ice with me yeah yeah that’s awesome um how about I was going to ask you about Glenn Morley uh you played for him like that was you you had him since you

Were a kid when you start playing right all the way up until 13 years old right I don’t I don’t know if that was normal in those days but playing for Wexford it was house league when I started I mean commercial plumbing and heating were our sponsors we actually went to the Quebec

Peeee tournament uh as with Westford that was my last year with them but he was great you know when you have your that kind of Coach when you’re a young kid that makes the game fun and we had a good team and he’ always put us in

Tournaments that we’d have a shot of winning and we always seemed to to meet tournament all these tournament and so it was a lot of fun it kept me in the game kept me interested made me love the game and then by the time of Bantam

Minor Bantam it was time to move they wanted him to move back with the young kids so it was time for us to move on and that’s how I ended up with a chal young Nationals yeah so um then it comes to your Junior career and you go off to

Ashaa now was there any did you feel any heat there or were you were you Psy going ashaa knowing that number four played in oshaa before you Bob well that that had a little to do with it but um no when I actually got drafted at 16 I I

Wasn’t ready I wasn’t big enough I wasn’t strong enough in Canada as you probably know that Junior a hockey’s on TV I mean I was watching them since I was a kid the Toronto marbs Hamilton Red Wings these guys were like pros so now I

Get drafted by asua I’m 16 years old but I’m not I’m not ready yet so I played play a year of B in Toronto for the Toronto young Nationals and then I that’s why I only played two years of a I made it the next year when I was 17 in

Those days you had to be 20 to be drafted so I only played two years with oshaa but it was it was an honor to be it was only half an hour from my house in Toronto I got to keep the 60 bucks a week you know what was how’ you

Go from you went from like 70 points to like 40 points in five extra games I I don’t know one one reason was my left Winger was Billy locki and you you probably don’t know that name but he scored 52 that year we and he got

Drafted by the Red Wings who weren’t all that great in those days I could not believe he didn’t make it it was a big scrap and left Winger could fight score goals and he never made it in Detroit but that’s what happened I was just at

On a great line uh we had a good team we didn’t do much on the playoffs but uh everything seemed to go in I always said if you’re ever going to have a great year you have it on your draft year and I got lucky that was my my

Year so uh small town Canada um and and you’re in ashaa and you get drafted by the New York Rangers in the first round now I got to know leaving Canada the first time you’re going away to the to the Big Apple what’s that like when you’re a young kid

Again well you’re 20 years old going to New York that first year what was that like it must have been like just AR struck you know coming in never I never made it to New York that first year I went to training camp in 73 and if you remember the Bruins and Rangers

Played for the cup 72 the Bruins beat him in six so when I got to Camp the the the Rangers still had a Stanley Cup caliber team and uh even though the cat me Francis told me I had a good good camp they wanted me to go down to their

Minor league team and get some seasoning so they sent me to their team in Provence rhod Island so I was in living in New England when I was 19 years old I lived in Cranston rhod Island the very first year they built the Duncan Center

The Civic Center and uh had a great it was a great way to break me into the United States a different way of life than I was used to living on my own because I lived at home during Junior and uh I got my new 73 Pontiac Grand Dam

With my signing bonus and uh took off for the United States to never go back really just a visit and I loved it I loved the stage right from the Geto yeah what was a training camp like then yeah that’s what I was W the training not quite as strenuous as today

Right but uh you know I all of a sudden I’m in there I’m 19 years old I’m playing against men now I mean they got you know Z morat uh you know dale ralet dale Ral Peter stoski Eddie Joan and net I mean I I had Eddie’s hockey card you know I watching

It I know I’m on the Brad Park Rod J beer Jean Rell all my heroes you know it was like right when you’re that age and I was in awe but you know I tried to do the best I could but uh I didn’t look it

As a demotion I I took it as another step in the ladder you know because it it was always happened to me I never I had to you know go to somewhere to get ready for the big time and it was the right move to do

Because I won rookie the year that year in the American League had a good year made the first All-Star team I think and we actually went to The cder Cup finals lost the Hershey in five well you had great numbers in Providence no question you were actually

Closer to Boston than you were to New York at the time I don’t think I ever went to Boston except to play against the Braves honestly I didn’t know who I never dreamed I’d be a Boston foru one right but when you think get to New York

Yeah and how close you were to the place you ended up playing living and absolutely loving and um so you you you go to New York Leia you have two decent Seasons what was that like cuz ni ni was Phil was there at the time wasn’t he

Phil esposo or no not not the first year not he didn’t get the second year he was there yeah I’ll tell you what happened my first year I got off to a real good start I had 18 goals by Christmas I I had a shot at the Rookie of the Year and

Early January I ended up we playing Vancouver and I was doing one of my moves around um the count played for Philadelphia big big guy big defenseman Bob Daly Bob Daly and Bob’s stick came around the stick was at his waist but it was was in my mouth and I lost my first

Four I lost my first four teeth and 16 stitches inside out and they take me on the road now I I uh they put a football helmet on me I look like Fran tarkon it was like hit me here right and so we go into Chicago we go into Minnesota um St

Louis and a week later we’re in Minnesota playing on northstars and I haven’t eaten very well all week uh because I couldn’t and uh they weren’t all that concern in those days and I I think it was early in the second period I think it was hex Doll came in to run

Me in the corner and I went to slide the check my leg buckled I went over on my ankle and I broke my ankle a week later ah so that’s why I only play like hexall like the goalie Dennis his uncle or whatever and uh he

He hardly hit me in my memory it wasn’t you know he came in to hit me like anybody would but I went to slide the check I went over on my own leg broke my ankle a week later and there goes rookie of the year so I came back scored four

More goals that year but uh that was it so the next year I wanted to get off to a good start but they um early in the year they made the big trade for espo so I I got a chance to play with espo which

Was a great honor in those days but the team never Jed we never made the playoffs that year and I’ll show you you can probably see it on here so what what what got me traded was um when they when they um traded Derek I don’t remember Derek the

Sanderson was on the team my first year and it was great Derek was awesome we had a lot of fun together you know I guess me me him and your buddy Gres so just tell ask GES but U so they traded Derek early the next year and the owner uh a couple

Weeks later puts an article in the paper saying the reason they traded Derek was he was getting two of the younger players into training problems Rick Middleton and Ron gresner they put our names in the freaking paper so I didn’t I took offense to it I didn’t say

Anything right away and a couple weeks later a reporter came in asked me about it and I said I can’t believe the only thing I said I can’t believe a well educated man like Bill Jennings who was the owner could believe in such gossip because it wasn’t true next day I walk

Into practice one of the my teammates hands me the New York Post and I I I open it up to the um I open it up to the sports section and there’s the headline what’s it I can’t it’s a little blurry Middleton shot at the boss shot

Oh my God that was the headline in the post the next day and that was um that was February 18th 1976 and I got traded three months later wow notash not grash me not gr yeah so it well let’s face it that potty scene was pretty big big back in the day

A lot of guys went out had fun that was back in the days drinking beers and you know on the road it was it was part of the whole thing yeah yeah you guys weren’t playing video games or anything like that I they weren’t around no so

What happened was on Sunday nights as you know the the the Rangers played at Madison Square and the Jets and the Giants would play in the afternoon so there was a bar on First Avenue called the tit tattle that Derek was friends with the guy who ran it of course so

We’d go there the Jets the Giants and the Rangers would all be in there till 4 in the morning we just had to make it back to Long Beach Long Island for practice Monday morning and uh so that was Studio 54 wasn’t even there yet they didn’t get there till 76 thank

God well you know I played in New York at the end well near the end of my career and I’m telling you there were a couple nights there going to Flemings you know I get home at 5:00 in the morning and I’m 30 years old now and I’m going I

I that never sleeps yeah it doesn’t so you can imagine when when you’re 20 21 years old 1974 or 75 you know it was it was it was a lot of fun that could be a that would have been a curse for me if I got

Drafted by the Rangers for me too but luckily I got traded to a a better team because we didn’t make the playoffs that year and I get traded to a a perennial you know Contender for the cup yeah yeah for sure and what we’ll talk about so

That trade we know um basically why you got traded but for the life of me and I have all the respect in the world and I absolutely love John Ferguson yeah but what the hell was he thinking and respect for Ken Hodge too but Ken Hodge 10 years older than you and they

Making I connected the dots I could asked that too like I don’t know but I think what happened was Fergie came in he was a third coach that year and he was the GM because fired in your Francis all right now do you remember you remember the series of the century

Canada against Russia right 1972 you remember who the head coach was Harry sindon oh yeah okay oh oh the one over in the the Russian series four games in Canada for in Russia I mean being you were talking about the other one being American you probably didn’t watch it as

Much as us yeah I I listened to the last game because Harry S was coaching right do you remember who his assistant was um was it TJ johnus John Ferguson Fergie so there’s the relationship who who is the top player on the team Phil Esposito because Bobby

Couldn’t play because of his knees so there’s the triangle right there so Jump Ahead three years ESO gets traded to New York Fergie’s the coach in GM yeah article in the paper the owner probably get rid of this kid you know and uh Fergie’s got all this pressure on

Him and eso’s hounding him from what I heard later get to get get a Winger one of his old Wingers then I find out when I get to Boston that Don Cherry is soured on Kenny maybe not even dress him so that’s how it happened they Bruins

Want wanted to get rid of canny they traded up for 10 years difference uh ESO was hounding Fergie you know ESO hounding Fergie get one my we and I think that’s get that’s what happened you know so it wasn’t I don’t know if this is a typo but it wasn’t like were

You minus 38 sorry I just had to bring this you know what a very good possibility nothing to do with it very very good possibility cuz you know if ESO wasn’t back checking I wasn’t back checking no I told you the team wasn’t bad we just never jelled that year that was a

JD’s first year John Davidson I mean it was yeah we just couldn’t get out of our own way no well you go to Boston certainly the best thing that ever happened in your career and have just you get off to a a a great start there and and and grapes

Being the coach how was that coming in first with grapes how was he with you you know grapes loves listen he loves loves tough guys we know that he’s a tough coach hot ass how was he with with the how was he with the better play as

Well I’ll tell you a funny story how we met and Don and I always had this uh relationship you know that we bust each other at times and I didn’t really know him but I knew of him because he coached Rochester the year I played in Providence and Johnny wi Johnny was his

Tough guy so we had a couple of balls so you know so we knew each other and so I get the Boston first uh first day on the ice and I’m out there you know I I I had met cash the night before at the hotel I

Get to meet Peter McNab he just got traded ended up my roommate for eight years God bless him we lost him last year yeah um yeah and all the other guys right but I knew ratty and Parky from New York so you know it was wasn’t that

New to me but I hadn’t met on so we go skating on the ice I’m skating around this my memory of it anyways with cash and Maxi and Bobby smz I think so don comes over Ricky boy Ricky boy Ricky boy Ricky boy hey you’re looking a little uh

So you heard the story you’re looking a little bigger he says you’ve been working out I I just looked at him no Don I had a good summer the only time I ever saw Don speechless Bobby SM was laughing so hard he fell on the ice and we haven’t even

To practice yet that was my very first interaction with him and since then you know it’s been the same he busted me when he was when he came um when he retired my jersey he got up and told the audience that they he had to introduce

Me to the goalie at the end of the first year because I never came back you know so we always had that relationship and that’s how it got off to a start but he you know I got a hattrick my first game was a bruin I got 20 on the whole year

Because da never played me he dressed me but he never put me on a regular line because he said he wanted to teach me the the whole game both ends of the ice I don’t know if that was true I thought I was doing okay but when you come from

New York at minus 38 maybe yeah I was going to say there’s only one way to go after this a point well you you certainly were that 200 foot player and played both ends of the the ring no question he helped teach he helped teach me so by the time I got

To the 80s uh you know uh Jerry chers played me first minute last minute power play penalty killer I never killed the penalty till the 80s Don Jerry would never have me kill with he had he had Shephard and marott and all those guys you so yeah so

Uh and I got to ask you because and listen I had Taz on here um you know I have a relationship with some of of the the guys that I played against and some I played with when I was a bruan and Ray right and I can hon

And I say this because I was a huge Bruins fan Rick growing up I would imagine you would be yeah and and and I looked up to those guys I love bore I look at um that stretch where the Canadians went for straight and I said this to Terry at

The time not so much but I was when we would beat you in the playoffs and we get in line and shake hands you know people think you know okay there’s not much said I always felt bad for certain guys some guys I didn’t give a

[ __ ] about but certain guys I felt bad for and you were one of them Taz was the other one and Ray bour was one but when I look at your career you get to Boston there all those years how difficult that must have been having to face that team every year in the

Playoffs it was a great rivalry this unbelievable rivalry and and you came so goddamn close and I was still a Bruins fan I was drafted in 78 right by the Habs and you guys were playing the playoffs they were going for their fourth Standley Cup in a row the Habs

And we all know what happened but how how much do you hate the M how much do you hate the mon Canadians it’s funny because I was just saying this um the other night they asked me to go into the Brew one of the a nights asked me to go into the Bruins

Dress room before the game and read the lineup I guess they do it every once in a while and they’re playing Montreal right so I now I gotta say a few words so I said you know you know I lost two Stanley Cups to

These guys in the late 70s and I grew up in Toronto and I basically have hated them since I was six freaking years old so go out and kick their ass so yeah I mean when you grow up in Toronto you automatically hate Montreal you know the whole French English thing

And everything so honestly yeah I’ve hated Montreal since I was six years old but coming from New York and not making the playoffs that year and all of a sudden you’re in the Stanley Cup Playoffs the next year I went from one end of the expect from the other I

Didn’t care who we were going to play we had to get through Philadelphia before that beat him fourth straight I mean we were we were saing and then we hit the wall I mean 77 that team had nine guys go to the Hall of Fame you know yeah

78 they had lost I think Lam mer and corn way but you know they were still powerful and we got we won two at home you know which was awesome and we thought we had a shot and we just couldn’t climb the mountain and and at

79 we knew we could beat them and it wasn’t the finals it was the semi-finals and by 79 their team had changed they beat the Rangers yeah yeah that we thought we we can beat them this time we can we took them to seven and we had

Them in the second period we owned them we’re up 3-1 going into the third period never in that position before and we knew we’re getting the penalty problems are you kidding me the fans are going to call a couple you know and uh they tied

It and I scored with four minutes to go and there was I’ll I’ll give you a funny quick story we had a third goalie in the audience you know how you always dress a third guy in a suit yeah named Jim seaweed Petty I think he still holds the

Record in the eastern league for most penalty minutes by a goalie but so seaweed comes to me in between the second and third period and he he leans down he goes I’ve been watching dry and he likes to put his paddle down you know like all the goalies do today says you

Get a chance shoot for The Far Side it’ll go in under the knob I said all right jimk thing so yeah keep right so if you look at my goal I was coming around the back of the net on my backand and it must have flashed through my head

But it didn’t get out far enough and when I fired it it hit the inside he had his paddle down hit the inside of dren’s blocker and went in and we went up 43 so if we had a won it I would have given him all the credit in the world he would

Have been a hero and or seaweed yeah we lost and nobody ever heard that story and he just passed it he just passed away a couple years ago too unfortunately but no it was a challenge and you know it made you be a better player because you always had to be on

Top of your game especially in the Montreal Forum it was Yankee Stadium you know you so even though you didn’t like them too much you got up for the game and that was the biggest challenge of your career and I I rebeled it I love playing in there I really did didn’t win

A lot SE in the 70s but I loved it you know I it’s like I said that yeah even though I was drafted I’m still a Bruins fan because I’m drafted I was drafting the 17th round like everybody they thought he doesn’t have a chance he’s

Just going to go to training camp he’s gone see you later but I was still a Bruins fan and I couldn’t believe it and and in in defense of the crowd calling penalties in Montreal that penalty you know they Too Many Men no I know no I’m not arguing

About that that penalty was self-inflicted that that penalty was self-inflicted and John Deo yeah gave you guys every chance to get off the ice and finally he had to call it right and you know what’s surprising is when guys jump on the ice you automatically count sometime you know

Yeah you know who’s on we didn’t nobody had a clue and I didn’t even I forgot that I was one of the guys on the ice I didn’t look at that tape of that game for 15 years I couldn’t but all of a sudden who jumped on who was it that

Jumped on it wasn’t who jumped on I thought we’re going to call him out right now we’re like the truth comes out who was it well no it’s who did da call up so who wasn’t supposed to be out there nobody remembers except da he says

He’s going to his grave with it so but it might have been me might have been me it might have been Stan I was playing Wing that night with ratty and cash on the right side and might have been me I think it might have been either Stan or

I that screw it up but I don’t want to try to think about it well regardless uh it happened and then we know how it ended and God what a hot break play the sitting out it would have played the Rangers it would have been awesome you

Would have beat the Rangers you would have beat the Rangers been tough they had a good team but it would have been a good series I think we could have taken them yeah listen you took montre all that yeah but uh I remember sitting on I we

Had my dad put the TV out in the back we had a little teeny backyard and we put the TV out there and we were watching it we’re all and then sure enough lefur ties it at the end and then lamb if you look at that um Bonny marott stick maybe

Six inches from tipping that shot and about a great shot you know how hard it is to to slap a one timer off of a drop pass that you you don’t even stop I mean the accuracy of that only one guy in the whole league could do that even Mike

Bossy bossy was a slot guy he could score from there you know how many times they must have practiced that play yeah the two of them worked perfect and Tim if if you’ve never seen it it’s just incredible the game seven when when the uh havs beat the Bruins for that I

Felt so bad get to the finals Julie jber stood on his head that I felt so bad for yeah wow and then what he go to overtime yeah went to have W it I saw the overtime not too long ago and Donnie marott had it right in front and Dryden

Was down on his knees and he hit it right here you know oh so you know it can go either way Tim it was unbelievable if you LEF Flur SC would like minute something left like it was crazy and they tied it and then it went

To OT but we got so we we get that out of the way uh certainly but what a rivalry um when you and it’s it’s a shame because such a good rival we don’t see anymore the league is certainly so many more teams now there’s 32 the

Original 32 and then you know we used to play Four exhibition games against each other right two down in Boston and two up in Montreal or somewhere and then we played Tim eight times against four in Boston and four in by the time you got to the playoffs you just there was so

Much [ __ ] that happened during the season it was like well it it was and that wasn’t even as bad as the original six those guys played each other like 12 times right right you know or more I don’t know but uh yeah more than 12 you know and uh you know rivalries are

Born in the playoffs and they’re always in the playoffs there you know yeah always in playoffs against Montreal so that’s where the Rivalry came from you look at Detroit Colorado I mean they probably couldn’t care less about each other till they played in the playoffs and they hated each other you know for

Many years so oh yeah that that’s born in the play and it is unfortunate that uh over the last decade or so you know it it’s not there so it gets replaced by Toronto Boston or you know well even we got excited about the whole you know

Tampa Florida series that was at I don’t know what year that was two years ago year ago was terrible yeah tamper and Florida was like what is this no it’s not it’s not the same U but as you said with so many teams the odds that you’re

Playing the same team in the playoff year after year after year um you know isn’t isn’t going to happen too often so uh nth geez there’s so much I I I want to get to it you know I I saw um you were named to the all Centennial

Team I I just love I love the fact that your jersey went up in the Raptors say oh thank you you know I I it’s incredible that the career you had and what you did for that organization the way you played the way you carried yourself you were a bruin you weren’t

One of those guys either like you could see in Philadelphia quite a bit who had a lot of tough guys they play with and they took advantage of it you never did it gave me a little more room it gave me a little more room sure it did but I had

I had a job to do and I did my job I didn’t try to do everybody else no but yeah you did and it was so great to see your jersey go up that was awful nice as you can imagine and uh when cam called

Me in the summer he caught me off guard i’ had seen nobody wore 16 for a few years and Marco Sturm was basically the last guy that that had worn it so I thought maybe maybe one day but I wasn’t thinking about it he often called me on

Because I was the president of the alumni and cam would call me sometimes on so that’s what I thought it was about we missed each other and I called back what were you doing when he called I was just at home as I remember and um I got

A message from him on my phone neepy uh give me a call I was really short you know so I called him back and I missed him anyway we hooked up and small talk summer talk how’s the golf and blah blah blah and then he just blurted it out hey

Uh well we’ve decided we’re going to retire you’re number 16 I went what I didn’t think I heard him right and I got emotional I did I got a little emot my wife came home and she thought somebody died the look on my face I said no

No and so I had four months it wasn’t until November when they did it um and so I had a long time you know it’s not very often you’re out of the game 30 years and then they retire your jersey so hello I had lost I had lost a

Lot of friends that were very big supporters of me during my career both players and personal friends that I found out all their kids were at the game that night to watch my retirement so I I I wanted to include them in my

Speech so I had a lot of work to do to to make the speech the right way over 30 years you got a lot of people that think yeah a lot of people yeah and it’s funny you said that they hadn’t um used the jersey for a bit because it it

Happened to me and by no means do I think my number should be retired but they they gave it to a guy Turner Stevenson he was a first rounder for the HS and he wore it for I think maybe a year and a half to two years and he

Finally changed his number and he said he felt too much pressure cuz he was a big kid and a tough kid he felt too much pressure everybody wanted the fight expected him a fight and he got rid of number 30 he changed his number so they

Tucked it away again it was gone for the longest time and then I’m I’m thinking why don’t they use my number and I’m not thinking Oh They’ll retire it someday but they finally took it out for Primo uh the kid from North Eastern who I

Don’t want to be rude but I’m like it’s a terrible number well like 30 well do you know why Tim no I don’t think maybe I do if you said it you probably told me well back in that day the Canadians had so many jerseys retired oh that when they call guys up

They give them the because a goalie didn’t use 30 then they had Dryden was 29 and Bunny lorck was number one okay so 30 became a call up number Rick mahaga called up he woron number 30 he got sent back and the story is I get

Called up they give me number 30 I’m like oh but I’m not going to complain you don’t got a goalie like yeah take it from see try to take it back from me see what it I got a goalie’s number Ian I don’t want a [ __ ] goalie number so I

Don’t say gum warley War the gum yeah so my dad comes up the first time he comes to maral he goes in the Pro Shop he said can you get me uh Nyland jersey number 30 please and the guy said yeah do you think you uh he will be here long enough

For you to wear it and my father says I don’t give a [ __ ] how long he’s here yeah I swear to God the guy said because it happened before Maha came up someone bought Maha Jersey right and then he got sent back down so Henry said I don’t

Give a [ __ ] if he’s here for a game or he’s here for the rest of his career no you gotta get give me the Jersey so Henry gets the Jersey re and probably wearing and everything and I’m here for about two weeks and I said Hey

I was talking one night in the phone I said Dad I’m thinking of change my number I I don’t want number 30 you know it’s a goalie number ex God damn it he said wear that Jersey wear that make something out of that number 30 and I’m thinking you’re cheap bastard you just

Don’t want to buy another jersey and anyway I I did wear it and I was fortunate enough to have it everywhere I I went but well you know I always felt I never heard that knck that’s that’s incredible story I always thought that the job you guys did you

Know Terry Stan you know um it never gets recognized enough and and especially by the Hall of Fame you know I really think there should be a category for the guys that you know gave up so much and and as you know a lot of them uh shortened their lives because of

It y um and I appreciate you saying that there’s not enough recognition uh at all you know I don’t know why maybe because the NHL was always trying to get fighting out of the game and didn’t know how to do it but but back is all was

Always such a big part of the game leaning up to I don’t know what year huge you know original six you know and it was always an intimidation Factor you know if you had a tough team you get a little more room out there and a lot of

A lot of teams didn’t want to come into Boston Garden and Montreal Forum so you use that to your advantage and but not so much anymore but back in those days you know for sure Philadelphia Boston counted you know they counted I remember we always played Philly every year in

Providence an exhibition game you know so you can imagine you know in their lineup you don’t know anybody’s name and one year funny they they brought their own Indian did he looked just like Stan he was about 5’8 stalky and they fought Stan beat him and you never saw again

But honestly God that was that was Philly right it’s crazy it’s CRA hey Tim Tim like there was a thing it was legit it was called the Philly flu oh oh yeah a lot of guys scared to go yeah it was crazy going in that building and Boston

You know I listen you can’t show it I I was always nervous going in those buildings but I you know I hit it well yeah and but you got you got to be ready you know yeah ready um there were guys that when I started with New York we

Didn’t have a very tough team we had Ronnie Harris I don’t know if you remember Ron but he was you know pretty big guy he was he was about our only tough guy you know so right near the end of my first year uh Schultz uh albow me

In the head turned around and came out so I just dropped my gloves and I I thought I had them but you tied up and I and I didn’t so I it was funny so I’m doing a charity thing somewhere you know after your career and I’m with Davey in a bar

Somewhere and I thought having a beer I I I wanted to see what he would say so I said you know David I said you were my first fight in the NHL and he looks at me he goes I fought you how I F really how did I fight you I

Said well I I don’t know but I bet you I didn’t start it I remember that going into Philly there that Don celeski right oh yeah he was a yappy bastard yeah but he was a yappy bastard in Philly and I remember then he got traded to Colorado I think

And then he wanted to be friends with everybody they didn’t have a freak they didn’t have a freaking tough guy on the team that you know no schz got traded I think in 78 or 79 to LA and and guys were lining up to get him you know

Because he didn’t have any support Christ you know I I remember going into Boston right Tim they they had O’Reilly Cashman wiyn Jonathan and Al cord like come on like you’re going in that building it’s like hello and then sucks this is gonna suck then what I the

Incident I had with Rick then next thing I know they called Jay Miller up they had C they had yeah well it’s funny he gives he gives us both credit for that listen it’s funny the next day the next day here’s what happened when they called Jay up after um the incident between

Myself and Rick um and Jay got called up and I knew what he’s oh my God I said now they’re gonna bring another guy and another guy I listen I paid for that daily I I they address you know what I can never understand is how you and Jay

Became such good Fighters playing college hockey where you can’t fight right I never that did the city did Boston like hate you at like was it tough going home oh no they hated me yeah they hated me oh yeah the whole place with chanton Island sucks Tim at

The Garden but I remember Jay gets called up and lame was coaching at the time and um I end up getting put on the I and L man never would stop me in a like a building like Boston or Philly he he he would wouldn’t stop me he had that

Respect for me right he just I’m not going to do that to you and I’d be at home I’d be on in the form i’ go go out in the ice and if the other team put their tough guy out would take they got the last change so they can put put out

Whoever they want to go yeah so we’re in Boston I get on the ice and Jay comes out and I’m now oh here we go [ __ ] I’m I’m still paying for the Nifty incident and and Jay lines up and I say to him I said listen I know what the [ __ ] here

For and we’re going as soon as that puck drops well Boom the puck went and I dropped my gloves I went right after him I grabbed him then he dropped I didn’t punch him right away and then I grabbed him and get just to get settled in and get my

Balance and then all of a sudden Curran’s coming the defenseman he came right at me and I I threw it if you watch I threw a punch right over Jay’s shoulder and got him right in the kisser and then I started fighting Jay and the next

Day the next day I got a call from my father-in-law and he says to me God that Miller guy what a good guy he says uh he say he said in the newspaper he said you know what I’m because of Rick and and Chris I got called up he said that’s why

I got called up now I have a job in the NHL he actually said it in the newspaper he is he gave usit he ends up playing with grety La oh unbelievable story that is unbelievable yeah and we became friends Jay and I for sure oh yeah he’s a he’s a

Super guy I love Jay oh we had him on here he was I’m glad I sacrificed my chicklet so he had a job oh so nth um Mom and Dad was there something growing up there did your dad kind of want you to follow in his foot footsteps

He was a did he own a printing company or something no no my dad from Tim Ontario he grew up in a mining town and yeah he uh from the story that I I know I’ve been to Timmons oh yeah lovely Place uh they claim they claim the fame

Of Shania Twain right yeah that’s where she from no but the story goes his dad died at 13 he had to he had to quit school start working worked the freight boats when he was 18 on the Great Lakes and he didn’t want to do that the rest

Of his life so he ended up uh learning how to be a printer and then started as one man he didn’t own a company he own a oneman printing shop never played hockey now but fro The Story Goes he froze a rink in the back he bought a house in

Scaro in 54 um and I was like one and he froze a rink in the backyard when I was about four the older kids would take me out skating and [ __ ] but I didn’t get into hockey I got into hockey through baseball I think if the the story was

Right because my baseball coach softball coach was a hockey coach and talked my dad into bringing me out so it’s ironic that I sucked at baseball but if I never played baseball I would probably never would have played hockey and uh you know those days in the 60s in Toronto the

Least won four cups so you know what are you going to do but play hockey and then there’s only three channels on TV so I was playing street hockey Road hockey right in front of my house we had a brand new suburb of Canada a lot of kids on the

Street we’re out there every freaking day I learn more about the game on the street than I did on the ice and uh it just kind of morphed over onto the ice I think because I never used tape on my stick and that had to be because you

Never put tape on your stick playing street hockey because the snow sticks to it all the time so I think I yeah I was going to ask you that no I think that’s know I don’t know for it wasn’t crazy I think I wanted to see if I felt the puck

Better on the ice like on the on the street and I did so I didn’t have the big slapper or anything and I I just just went from there I never used it again you know maybe I was lazy too I don’t know it’s unbelievable yeah like I

Probably would have I think the only reason why I taped my stick was cuz everybody else did yeah yeah if you would have came to training camp with no tape I would have been like this guy’s cut we got to get rid of this guy doesn’t know to put tapee on his stick

But if you look he does have tape on his stick how you talking about if you look at Bobby Bobby’s stick Bobby used one strip one one really I mean where where was The Strip at near the hill near the H near the hill so it doesn’t really

Serve a purpose and not using it served a better purpose than using it let’s put it that way I can die a happy man now that my Jersey’s up in the Raptor I was going to ask rather have I’m from Toronto I mean

I I would like to be in the Hall of Fame that would be nice but you know being one of only 12 in the Boston Garden in your home where you played most of your career I mean to me that’s the biggest uh thrill and honor that any athlete can

Get I think so I’m I’m I’m good with yeah that’s so cool I’m good with that all right I’m I’m gonna ask you this um and we always hear it what’s a Brom what what does it take to be a Boston Brewing Nifty well total total

Commitment you know um what was what was great about the Bruins and still is and I don’t know maybe Montreal lost it a little bit is the continuation of that theme of their players like they went from you know the early the big bad Bruins of the early 70s to the the

Bruins of launch paale gang in the in the 80s and then Ray comes in and he’s obviously the new guy and you know te Terry was the the inspirational leader on the team you know he didn’t expect everybody to play like him but you better put an effort in every night and

If you don’t I mean you’re not going to be on the team much longer and when he was a coach there was a couple guys that weren’t doing the effort the right way and they were gone and they ended up history I had a say then right yeah and

Then you know milberry might have continued that you play you played under Milbury right I love playing for Milbury yeah yeah Mike Mike was born of that same era you know and so that keep kept continuing right up until Marshon berson Chara they lost it a little bit in the

90s you know cam ended up getting hurt and after he was gone Ray tried to continue it and they just they didn’t do anything for him and he ended up leaving but uh after and I hate to say it after they did the salary cap it worked for the league everybody’s

Making money the Bruins all of a sudden spent to the top they went out and got Chara the Shelli and they and they ended up winning the cup and now they’ve continued that whole new era right into you know today’s game today’s team so it’s really just the continuation of

What a breu is about and they always like to talk about that and but it’s true and sometimes it doesn’t work but they’ve been able to do it and uh I I hope the new leaders I hope they are able to get new guys in like a maoy or

Whatever that will continue that uh you know that carry that mantle of what it is mantle and they look back and they see us you know we’re just doing the irin nights and they they comment that they love to see how involved all the older guys are that they’re still here

And they’re coming in here and uh see that that’s just an awesome thing to hear because I’m going to tell you and Jeff Gorton and Hughes have kind of brought it back a little bit some of the players are around more when bersan was here he didn’t

Want the older guys around because he felt that it put too much pressure on the kitties you know and I get it it’s their time I don’t want to be there anybody yeah yeah so like honestly no one guys just weren’t around and and that’s too bad you weren’t you didn’t

Feel welcome that’s too bad which which really uh there was a lot of there wasn’t a lot of trust there for some reason but you know like that now KN it’s still like that no no Jeff Gorton and and Ken Hughes have have certainly uh made the the retired guys

70s guys around like this Larry or uh well Larry’s down in Florida but ion ion lamb is always around yeah right a short some is short plate home well you got to work yeah I’m still up here freezing my balls off you can do that from Florida why we’re doing this show

We want to get down to Florida yeah um but ni yeah I was made embassador here with the Habs with carono and and and Breeze and D Fu so which was quite an honor for me first English guy ever and first American so it’s pretty cool uh

You know I love the organization um they gave me my my opportunity which was incredible and uh yeah the winningest organization in the game in the history so you’re part of history I mean that’s something to be really yeah and it’s nice it’s nice to um finally see them at

Least trying to rebuild this thing the way it should be and hopefully they’ll get there at some point that rivalry can be reignited at some point yeah listen um I want to ask you obviously when in retirement you know you in charge of alumni for years and um you have this

Affinity for Boston you love Boston and I don’t blame it my hometown I freaking love it too and I miss it sport town right great Sports everybody’s been spoiled this Century because they won too many times oh my God it’s crazy it’s crazy they expect it every year yeah the

Success that those teams have had and it’s great for the fan base for sure um but you did some coaching I I I don’t know if a lot of people are aware of it you coached the US sledg hockey team uh right you coach them to a gold medal in

The Olympics yeah and um par Olympics you you’re gonna be doing a um um documentary on them I’ll do no it’s it’s a full uh movie movie yeah um I’ll be as quick as I can about this but no that’s okay time what happened

Was in 2001 I was in my house and a phone rang and it was a buddy of mine and he’s on the he was on Paul Edwards he was on the US disabled ski team and he tell he on the phone he just says hey I just found out the US national sled

Hockey team’s looking for a coach their coach quit the world championships and they don’t have a coach and they’re going to Salt Lake City in the par Olympics next year would you be interested and then he says you do know a sled hockey is right and I froze for a

Minute because I had not a clue but I thought if I said no he said oh well never mind so I said yeah I know what hockey is so anyways long story short I I got I got the job I figured I heard hockey and Par Olympics and that’s to me

You know how tough could it be right so as it turned out they never won a game in their history nagana was their first Paro Olympics the World Championships they didn’t win a game and now they’re a team in shambles and so we had our selection Camp there’s more to the story

But you got to watch the movie so um the selection Camp was August 01 in Buffalo and I had to pick 15 guys two goalies 13 skaters and there was I saw some good talent out there uh and um we’re supposed to play a tournament in Montreal against Canada Japan and

Ourselves on September 13th and 911 happened so they shut the airspace down as you know we never went to Canada we never played another team until we got into Salt Lake City all we had was one Camp each month from Thursday to Sunday in Boston Minnesota Chicago Dallas and

Then six months later we go into Salt Lake City as the sixth seed because they’re only invited because they were the host team because they never won a game so we know I was just didn’t want to be embarrassed and these guys have never been taught as system so my

Assistant coach Tommy Molton good friend of mine big hockey guy and decided we’re going we’re going to spend all our time teaching them a simple system so we taught them the Don Cherry dump and run because it was very no because I’m figuring slant hockey most of the goals

Like women’s hockey come from 10 feet Around the Net right you don’t have the big slap shots and if you don’t get the puck down low you’re not going to score any goals so you got to go in and bang them so that’s what we did dump it in go

In and bang him get the Park moving around and we ended up winning all five of our our games beating number one seed Canada 5-1 in front of 6,000 people at the youth center and went on to play in the gold medal game against Norway who won the gold medal in

Nano went we were up 3-1 in the second period they tied at 33 we tired over 8,000 people at the East Center largest crowd to ever see a sled hockey game I’m I’m told and went into over over time 10- minute overtime still tied went into

A fiveman shootout I’d never been in a shootout in my life and I had to make the list out before the game and we lost the flip in the shootout so we had to go first and went down to the last shooter I mean if you wrote this it would sound

Phony but that’s what happened and we won the gold medal in a shootout that’s Nots and they’ never won a game in their history and since then they won a bronze in in Italy in Italy in 2006 they won four goals in a row they’re the winningest sled hockey

Team in the world Canada can’t even touch them I know i’ I’ve seen them I’ve seen the games Canada us and they’re violent they’re nasty games right what a lot of realize is they’re you they’re only two feet off the ice right and so when you hit the boards that’s where the

Stanions are the boards are designed to give up here not down there and it’s like hitting a brick wall and some of them they break their ankles some of them are paralyzed a lot of them most of them are double lamps today and uh a lot of veterans too coming back from the

Wars we didn’t really have we had one a goalie but um no and our average age was 34 we had the grandfathers of sled hockey on our team what a story yeah there’s a lot of [ __ ] talking out there they get pretty competitive oh yeah yeah and and two penalties they have they

They they have these picks on the end of their sticks like razor blades like can you jab people with them any TRS I can do oh yeah and the other one is t-boning you’re not supposed to run your sled into a guy but what they would do is they kick the end

Of the sled up and they’d hit you in the in their stomach to knock your window and they hit you in the side to in the kidneys yeah so it gets a little dirty out there too yeah yeah I’m sure it does so so nift um coaching

That sledg hockey team like systems you said dump and chaseing all that um how many guys I guess played the game on the ice before the accidents would have very good question and the thing is that I didn’t when I met these guys I didn’t go around asking them what their injuries

Like some honest with God out of 15 guys two of them were train accidents if you can believe that and one was U polio one was spinabifida you know so I wasn’t going I didn’t know I didn’t need to know their whole story so you know um

But since then I’ve got to know exactly you know what happened to Lot most of them because we’re doing the the movie and so you got to know and my Captain Joe Howard who’s from Boston uh they just retired his jersey in the wouth rink couple months ago yeah

Yeah that’s where he grew up playing hockey your to your question but he lost his legs jumping trains at the age of 15 him and his buddies on the way home from high school and they greased the rails I’m told and he’d slide in yeah and uh

And lost his legs you know um and then he didn’t find sled hockey till he was 29 Terry O’Reilly actually visited him at Shriner’s Hospital when he was in the hospital after that Terry remembers it very well and they had a Rel ship over the years and just ironically I became

His coach and I made him Captain so he was the captain of the gold medal team uh what a story the team just the team just got inducted into the US na uh Olympic and Par Olympic Hall of Fame last year in Colorado Springs the first Paro Olympic team to ever be inducted

Did you go off for that yeah oh yeah absolutely that’s so cool yeah that’s so so it must be so fulfilling to be able to get a group of guys listen I coached a little bit in the East Coast Hockey League I had two years I absolutely

Loved it I have guys today talking about those two years they call me say hey coach this and that I’m in touch with a lot of the guys that played for me back then yeah and I gotta tell you when they finally get what you want them to do as

A group yeah it feels good right so obviously you did and and record time I mean you know we did we did it you know while we’re playing we never playing anybody so the first game was against Japan with about 12 people in the audience at 9:00 a.m. right and we’re

Z00 going in the third period And I said to I said I said we don’t beat these guys might just go home I mean we can’t even get a br right and we scored three in the definitely wasn’t a herb Brook speech well I didn’t come up with many

Of those my my assistant had the best one before the gold medal game he says if you guys lose it’ll suck I was yeah this your movie is not going to be like these inspirational moments I think they’re going to have to make up a couple of good lines for us that’s

Amazing so what I’m sure they will we uh seven years ago we started trying to write a script and it just never got anywhere through Co so we got rid of our our producers we got two new producers about a year ago wrun a new script we

Like it and we’re going with it we’re in pre-production right now so which whatever awesome what’s what what’s the name of the film going to be tough sledding tough sledding yeah um I’m going to certainly keep my keep my eye out for it for sure and I’d love to

Maybe have you back on when it comes out we can talk about i’ love awes we could talk about your roller hockey career is this for right too you know what you know the internet try to get something taken off of it no I never went to I was never a roller

Hockey player in Toronto no but what I did do that wasn’t on there three games no goals I mean I don’t I know that’s why they fired me but no what I did do that’s not on there at the end of my career Harry bought me out of my option

Year with 12 points from a thousand thanks Harry right so so I decided I him and I had a verbal deal I said I’ll tell you what I’ll go to Europe and I’ll play stay in shape I’ll come back down the stretch because they end early so I

Ended up going to Switzerland for two months I played at the end of my career 35 years old in the B League they ever seven goals against the game coach couldn’t speak English I’m like what am I doing here I came home and retired but yeah you they don’t even have the right

Information on there and I called them to change it and they never called me back DB right it’s on DB yeah DB that’s look like well you a roller hockey career so I feel good now Nifty saying I should have never went over there when I I got the invitation

To go to Bano I’m glad I didn’t go now if Nifty couldn’t make it there well Bano was in the a league in Italy would have been beautiful right I’m tell playing in Bullock in the B league and they they average seven goals against the game and and our goalie played

Senior hockey in Toronto wait where in SW the bull that it’s north of Zurich Clon is where Zurich Airport is and Bullock is the next farm town north of that I was gonna say because I played in I played in or um Lugano oh you did okay

In the a league the a league with but then I played one B one year in the B league in the Inon I don’t know is it’s it’s kind of like similar it’s like by it’s yeah who knows it’s my last game was in Geneva I scored two goals in the

Third period for a 66 tie and we’re out of the playoffs it was January 5th I flew home January [Laughter] 6th God it’s beautiful over there though right it’s got to be gorgeous well here’s a quick story Bobby Miller was coaching in a little town called sier

Down in the elps so I’d have Sundays off so I’d hop on the train it’s a three-hour train ride down to Sierra we drink all day Sunday in a Lou hours and he poured me on the train at 7:30 the next morning because I had to be back on

The ice by noon so they give me my paycheck right so I’m going through the elps hung over like a bear but it was beautiful going through the elps by train oh yeah it is it is beautiful it’s it’s it’s nothing like it all right hey Nifty

Um I got one last one for you and it’s um I want to know if you could write the first line of your eulogy what would it be oh I don’t I don’t know H the it would have to be a funny line I’m I’m putting you on the spot

Because I would want it to be funny I would and I would have a buddy of mine do the eulogy and maybe Gres because we go back so far and and he would know this I would say that you know everybody knew Rick as Nifty but his real nickname was

Silky there we go all right we got it and I’ll tell you I’ll tell you who silky was we’re in a we’re in a strip joint in in Long Island one day the whole team was there oh this is beautiful this is beautiful so this is

My first year you know Gres is a rookie and um the strip stripper comes down over and talks to us this my memory of an in and I had long blonde hair down to my shoulders in those days and so did she and her stage name was silky right

So who starts naming me silki but Peter some COI starts calling me silki but the trouble was it wasn’t a she it was a he so I was I was I was nicknamed after a transvesti stripper okay so there you go oh sounds like sounds like

GR laid law that on his podcast he was roaring he was roaring snn so you can ask R about that one I will and I’m gonna certainly I’ll talk to him in the the next week or so for sure I stand I I stay in touch with my roomie my former

Roomie he was awesome schner yeah God funny guy good I got traded and he married Carol all so you know what silky went up the road listen uh Nifty thanks so much for joining us again I I mean and meant every word I said I’m so happy your numbers up there you should

Be in the Hall of Fame and again you know um I I’m I was an [ __ ] for doing what I did to you well it was a lot of years ago and and probably not too many years from now I won’t even remember it that makes two of us yeah exactly anyway

Hey thanks so much N hey everyone thanks for listening to the raw Knuckles podcast don’t forget to like follow And subscribe