The Upshot: POTY Odds, PDGA Check-In

Charlie Eisenhood and Josh Mansfield break down the Player of the Year odds and discuss best bets before welcoming in PDGA Director of Marketing Danny Voss to catch up on a variety of PDGA topics. Plus: a wild 30 Second Rule segment!

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Chapters
0:00 Tattar is Back, Slow Play
6:45 Results from the Memorial
12:45 FPO Player of the Year Odds
20:55 MPO Player of the Year Odds
28:20 Danny Voss on PDGA Live
38:20 PDGA and UDisc
41:10 End of the Covid Boom?
47:00 Natalie Ryan Settlement
53:20 IDGC Update
57:30 Biggest Challenges
1:02:10 Thoughts on Danny Voss
1:08:55 30 Second Rule

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Welcome to the upshot UL World disc golfs podcast about the latest in the disc golf world I’m the editor Charlie Eisen Hood joining me is Josh Mansfield on this Tuesday March 5th it’s Waco week and the return of Kristen Tatar she will be playing this weekend she and silver

Lot are on their way to the US or maybe are already here uh posting about her travel over on Instagram Josh you know she’s the biggest star in the sport right now let’s be honest she absolutely is and and much like when Paul MC Beth was you know still near what felt like

The top of the game and then didn’t play it it feels the same way that anytime Kristen tar is not playing it feels like there’s something missing and we get her back for wo where she kicked off her run last season with another win on her

Before she went and swept the major so excited to have her back crazy crazy comeback as Ella melted down in the final few holes and uh really should have won it but uh Kristen was Nails she hit a big putt on 18 and that was her

First win of the season so we’ll see what she can do this year certainly the expectations could not be higher hard for them not to be high when you win all of the majors and Player of the Year speaking of Player of the Year we’re

Going to take a look at some Player of the Year odds to today we’ll get to that in just a little bit but Josh I wanted to bring this up first and foremost um it perfect timing perfect timing got a push notification on my phone from The Wall Street Journal and the headline

Was he was golfing too slowly it cost him $240,000 now this week in dis golf we’ve had a little bit of controversy once again about slow play because Jacob Curtis AKA cupcake who is notorious notorious iously slow player probably like Nico kind of has the rap but

Cupcake is like right there in terms of being an absolutely glacially slow player particularly on the putting green um he was at the memorial on coverage this weekend and I mean it was just brutal I mean we’re talking about like almost a minute to throw a 10- foot putt

Um but Josh I wanted to I wanted to bring this article up and I you know I’m just going to summarize it very briefly a Polish player Adrien meron who’s playing in the uh Liv Gulf deal was uh gonna Birdie on 18 on Sunday this past weekend uh but he was assessed

A one-stroke penalty for violating the pace of play policy so it changed to a par that dropped him from fifth place down to sixth place and that means that he only won $58,000 instead of $750,000 now we’re not going to cry too much over this guy losing you know 240 grand for

Being slow play but it’s an interesting note the the the card had already been put on the clock and so then on that second on the approach shot on 18 He took two minutes to hit his approach shot and he got stroked and Liv golf has been stroking players for excessive time violations

Uh unlike the PGA Tour and certainly unlike the dis golf pro tour uh you know and Josh on the coverage we’re hearing Aaron gosage talking about how he knew it was a time violation he knew it was annoying but he didn’t it wasn’t didn’t personally bother him but he would have been

Willing to Second somebody else calling the time violation and then went on to talk about how it should be uh you know officials making the ruling I really don’t care how we get to the solution but I want to see this I want to see people get stroked when they take too

Long to play because to me it it’s it’s extremely annoying for fans it’s extremely annoying for players who get stuck behind these cards and end up causing backups and like it’s a solvable problem with Strokes you know we got we got the rule change that supposedly he like puts the

Card on the clock as well and incentivizes the card to pick it up like why why did that not happened here that this is cuz it’s the memorial it’s an a tier still that’s that’s for a this that is not just for the Pro Tour that is supposed to be for PDGA in

General do do you think that they were out there with rules Marshals no probably not probably not should have there definitely should have been I mean get that that he was taking long enough that I am hardpressed to believe that he like that card was not several holes

Behind Chase card and if that’s the case if you’re the TD or the assistant TD you need to be looking at that and going wait a minute uh you know Chase card’s on whole 17 and they’re like tapping out on whole four like there’s a problem

Here go I don’t know if it was quite that bad felt that bad Charlie felt that bad I get it and we’ve seen that at protour events I remember there was one time last year where the where the lead card was like six holes behind the Chase

Card and uh the broadcast was Terri willing to have I’m willing to have some leeway when it comes to a little bit of excessive time right like you want you got a big putt from 42 feet that’s important for the round and you take 45 seconds okay but if you

Can’t putt out from like in like basically the bullseye like let’s play like we we got to keep moving here and I I think I’m not I’m not really specifically picking on the memorial at all here or really on cupcake but like he’s going to play in Pro Tour events

And if he’s doing this in protour events his card is going to get put on the clock the players have to call it like I I don’t again I don’t really care how it works somehow there has to be an official who can put the card on the

Clock which then tells the players okay like we have to we have to call him on time violations otherwise we’re all going to take a stroke and so let’s let’s fix it let’s this is the year we could do it they did it on the Liv I I have I don’t even like

Liv gotta give credit or credits due right that’s right uh Josh the memorial indeed was this weekend and uh ganet Burr takes it down everybody was talking about Anthony berell he had the monster round we talked about it you know could he possibly crack the the MC Beth uh 1134

What is it rated round no uh he had an amazing round but uh didn’t follow it up with special rounds and ended up finishing in third place behind Aaron gosage and of course gon Burr on Scoggins comes back against Jennifer Allen and ultimately wins by eight Strokes to take down

Fpo uh Goose had a three- shot lead Josh and once again couldn’t close the deal yeah um that that that to me I think is the biggest story out of this right Anthony BR shoots the crazy round and then just plays you know okay the rest

But but gosage whole nine on Final Round gosage takes a triple bogey uh which I I didn’t know you could do with the memorial to be honest with you uh he plays safe this is the one that you long stretch of water over the left he plays

Safe with the back end on the right lays up but lays out up to like 30 feet and goes for the Putt and skips off the top of the basket into the water and then putts it should have stuck but putts left side that spits out and T to tap in

For a for a triple bogey and I mean that’s just his upshot should have been closer with water behind he needed to make sure he didn’t go over the top uh and then he had to play he took took the play from the same spot lots of mistakes that you just

Can’t have when you’re trying to protect a lead and he kind of melts and falls apart and Ganon cleans it up with two-stroke win uh you know the memorial it’s a it’s kind of a relic at this point you know you’re seeing players throwing big spike heisers there’s like people walking

Close by it’s incredibly dangerous uh but it’s it’s fun as a non-tour tournament I think like you don’t really have to engage with it that closely you can just go watch the highlights of ab’s round it was 1113 rated by the way um a 58 a great a great

Round but once again I mean this is just comedy this these ratings at this tournament I don’t think I’ve ever really been given a clear like I feel like the PDGA needs to own it with the memorial and tell us what the deal is here why is this tournament

Particularly my my my instinct is it’s an easy course for elite pros and it’s really it’s like hard for everybody else and there’s like a because of the OB so you get these weird like disparities between the top scores like a 39 from Ab and middle of the pack scores are in the

50s well yeah yeah and and go go go to the bottom of that um the the worst scorer in Mo who did not make the cut did not play finals by the way so in three rounds the worst no player uh not trying to pick on him 30

Overpar so the disparity over four rounds and assuming if he’s and that’s that’s a 950 rated player not like a scub right so oh now granted he shot an to be9 way below it was bad but but at that pace right if he plays a fourth

Round he he’s shooting 40 overp par and the winning score is 36 under par right right now that Gap is just massive so let me let me pull a different tournament that had some no players and let’s just let’s just take a quick look

So it it’s close on the mo side for the tournament at in Mobile Alabama that the 31st annual city of mobile championships mtio of course won uh won in a playoff against Ezra Robinson but you know takes down the win um the I guess I mean the disparity well you know Charlie

I I my theory is gone uh David McKim shot a 30 overpar and mattio shot a 30 underpar so six Strokes difference well I think looking at the the total like difference there is not going to be as instructive as like looking at an individual round

Um I think it’s I mean I don’t know again like you have thousand rated guys shooting you know 50 51 52 and then you have AB shooting 39 so when you have thousand rated guys you know these people are all propagating shooting in the 50s and ab shooting 11

Shots better 12 13 shots better like that’s going to yield high ratings so I don’t know it’s it’s a strange one but uh it was in fact going to be pretty much impossible for ab to crack the MCB Beth top rated round of all time and

Indeed he would have probably had to Ace and birdie hole one which he missed he got shot a 17 under uh but still awesome round um it was funny like I saw on social media he shot that round and everyone was like this is it this is the

Year AB he’s the guy now of course it could still be true could even close out the feels like things cooled off a little bit I I honestly was impressed with Ganon Burr I mean what We’ve joked like you beat you beat AB in Arizona in

In uh in the or the like winter or spring like that’s that’s passing through an important checkpoint in your season so G looking good yeah and he shot an awesome round in finals um it was just one shot off the off the hot round uh notable Drew Gibson

In the field shoots 21 under for sixth place uh he had a 1053 rated 52 on a much trickier I think windier day in the finals um so that was that was the hot round of the day so interesting maybe you’ll see Drew getting back into

Form um all right I wanted to do something fun I asked a member of the ulti world disc golf Discord moonrocks to put together Player of the Year odds moonrock has been a a reliable odds maker in the Discord which of course is available to all of our subscribers at DIS golf. world.com

Subscribe um and so Josh I thought it’d be fun for us to go ahead and take a look at the Podi odds and maybe make some picks or give some thoughts um we’ll take a look at fo first I think it’s a little bit of an a less

Interesting story for obvious reasons uh moonrock has Tatar at 1 to 4 so bet 40 to win 10 on Kristen 80% to win the player of the year again this season uh Missy Ganon at 9 to1 Haley King at 15 to1 evina salonin at 20 to1 Holland

Hanley and Paige Pierce at 25 to1 and then you got some longer shots down the board um o and Hanna 35 to1 Valerie and Ella and Cat merch at 50 to1 so those are the players on the board what do you like here Josh you just G to put just going to

Load it up back up the truck on Kristen honestly I probably would not bet on fpo Player of the Year odds like if I if I if you handed me a crisp $100 bill I would stick it in my pocket because I think that is a better way to

Just keep that investment uh the the odds on Kristen are just so long she’s so dominant of a favorite that to me it doesn’t make a ton of sense I mean you can you can load up on Kristen but you’re it’s such a little pay out for

What could be risky and if you know an injury bar and travel concerns who knows right there there are things that could happen uh and if we’re talking purely on betting odds I that makes me a little nervous and at 80% I don’t see a huge

Return on my value but I think moonrock is right in saying here essentially that it’s not really worth betting on anybody else and it almost feels like a parlay bet it some of these odds and and that’s it’s crazy that something like this is is so low for everybody else Missy Ganon

10% feels right uh the one that blows my mind though Haley King at 6% and in third highest odds is just shocking to me well who has who’s won majors in the last two years yes Kristen Haley who else Holland who else wanted uh right throw pink major [Laughter] uh I just I

Think getting credit there for the ability to win the big ones and I’m I’m I’m trying to I’m trying to look at the uh I’m G to look up the major because I’m I’m now I’m I’m having a hard time remembering who has won most recently um page one in

2022 because she beat Kristen at Champions Cup champions cup of course thank you so I think Kristen won two because she won World and European open US Women’s was who won throw pink didn’t Missy win throw pink two years ago did did Kristen win EO in

2022 or did she not play because she got Co I she was out we played 2022 it’s crazy how much how short my memory is let’s see European open pige won it so page one two majors in 202 page one two yeah yeah Haley one one Kristen won one

Then last year of course Krist won all four uh well won the four PDGA M and Holland Hanley won throw pink Katrina Allen W throw pink the year before that um Katrina Allen not even on the board here obviously that’s that’s fair she’s pregnant but also has just not been in

Form enough to even be consideration right now uh here’s what I’d say if I were going to bet this I would probably spread my money out on Missy evina and Holland yep uh for I just I don’t really TR I don’t think Haley King is consistent enough to put it together for

Enough of the season to to win although I agree with the sort of sentiment of the odds which is that she has a very high ceing let me ask you this but like own own being like you know 35 to1 with Haley at 15 to1 like when has Haley had

A better season than own uhuh uh I I could argue because she w a major that 2022 was that but you know she just like no shows sometimes what do you think Haley’s best standings in the dgpt standings best finish probably like six she had fourth in the co year of 2020

When it was shortened and then after that fifth was her best in 2021 yeah she missed some time in 2022 so she finished seventh last year kind of colors things yeah yeah anyway I I think evina with a with a win in hand yep at 20 to1 like

She wouldn’t be 20 to1 unless she won that tournament right otherwise she probably would have been in like 40 to1 range so like you’ve already lost some odds but on the other hand you get the win in hand and she does she’s looking really good right now I I you just can’t

Bet Kristen if you if you really are sure Kristen’s going to win which I think is fair enough you just have to not bet but I do think there’s some value in putting a little money on players who have really shown up and looked good lately Miss’s been really

Consistent and getting better obviously we’ve seen really good stuff from Holland and she’s been improving improving improving and if evelina’s putter is even League average we know that she can be super dangerous so uh that’s what I would do I could see value in Paige Pierce if you are really can

Convince yourself she’s going to get get back from the injury not not with the same odds like if Paige was down with and henna at 35 to one then I might consider it but at at at the same odds for Holland I’m I’m I’d put money on Holland

My concern go ahead I was going to say Ella Hansen is my favorite long shot I think so too yeah um the one thing I was going to say you know you point out with Missy evina and Holland and I think what’s reflective there that like I look at is like

I expect all three of them to have a good season but the problem is that if all three of them have a good season I just think it’s going to be very difficult for any of them to beat Kristen like I they are going to take up

Too much too much oxygen from each other that if Kristen plays even a semblance of herself she’s going to cruise like you you need somebody who you I think the Challenger by committee is not going to work unless they all three are consistently outperforming Chris

Together if if only one of them Rises up at a time and beats out Kristen like that that still cements Kristen that’s the biggest problem here you’d have to see Kristen taking a step back and one of these players really stepping up I do think voter fatigue could be an issue Kristen could

If it’s marginal could lose even though she shouldn’t kind of like the Year Missy Ganon beat paig pierce the heck um it’s possible right so I I think putting your money on Kristen here just it just feels like just too risky she could get she could

Get hurt she could you know have a missing stretch of time that she misses for whatever reason travel issues who knows to too much to to only be getting uh one to four um okay Mo appropriately crazy here we go you got four players tied for the uh I guess

Worst odds and that’s Isaac Robinson Ricky Waki Calvin heimberg and Ganon Burr all paying out 5 to one AB is at 9 to1 then you got Kyle Klein and Simon at 10 to1 Eagle at 15 to1 McBeth at 20 to1 anela and Cole ralin at 35 to1 mattio

And Chris Dickerson at 50 to1 and then Aaron gosage Ezra Robinson Adam hamus uh Bradley Williams and Cory Ellis at 100 to1 so no clear favorite kind of what you might call co- favorites with Isaac Ricky Calvin and Ganon at 5 to one Josh what what do you like

Here man the the five to ones are all very like tantalizing you can see the path for all of them and I I really it’s it that that to me is just so so exciting I actually really like for where I think I get some value I like

Kyle Klein at 10 to1 um I I think putting him below Anthony berella I mean Anthony Bella does have the win in hand but Kyle kle has consistently won on tour and finished above Anthony berella you know at least for the past three seasons so to off the major win he’s got

The major win like K Kyle to me I think deserves a little bit more respect here and because of that I I put money on on Kyle Klein for sure of the co- favorites I know you’re high on Ricky I probably I probably go with Ganon I

Mean he just has continued to get better and better as his career has gone on and while I was worried about the new bag the win at Memorial kind of absolves that for me it’s I’m good now I I don’t have concerns I think Ganon bur could be

Player of the year uh the the other player who I I see man that’s that’s really it’s tough to see lots of value further down the leaderboard I guess Cole rolan’s my long shot at the 35 to1 oh I’ll give you my long shot gosage 100 to1 the guy he just you

Telling me 100 to one the guy he had a five stroke three stroke lead and lost by two this weekend okay head-to-head Cole ralin Aaron gosage at any tournament who is the who do you think uh depends does it make it to a playoff because if it makes it to a playoff C

All in every time do you remember do do you remember what happened at ledstone yes I remember I I understand but at 100 to one it’s worth a Sprinkle that’s fine I you don’t have it until you have it I I would take C Allan I mean he’s got

He’s got a win I get it I get it at 35 to one it’s it’s it’s a little too short for me I think I need to see more in the 50 to 70 range um what do I like here do you think the co-leaders are appropriately odd honestly

I just feel like the the the the the best way to play this is to spread out your bets on Isaac Ricky Calvin and gon probably I’m gonna be honest I think it’s like you’re not going to make that much you know if you want to pick your horse go ahead I don’t

I don’t really think it’s there’s there’s an obvious way to to play that we don’t know right you know things break there’s Randomness that could it but do you really think that somebody outside of those four is going to win Player of the Year this year do do you do you have confidence

And any of these other players to to to outperform those four it right right those those were the guys last year right Calvin with the consistency Isaac with the major wins Ganon with the most wins on tour and Ricky has looked very

Sharp I I I just I have to I can see the case for ab but it’s just hard for me to see him playing good enough the whole season right and like Simon probably missing a little too much time Eagle we don’t know when he’s goingon to be back MC Beth

Injured can’t bet him right now right and then everybody else is kind of like H they’ve never done it like I guess good for you if you can call your shot I would I would sprinkle on gosage and I would probably spread bets out my heavy

Bets on the top four guys and I would take my likely small payout and that’s why you made money and I walk away $100 poor come on Cole but fun exercise and I think this is approximately right it feels like the there’s no one guy who you can really say is the clear

Favorite Moon Ro does a great job with this yeah I think these odds would look a little different if it was preseason versus after one tournament but kind of makes it more interesting to see that you know Bella being the next guy up

Maybe but I I do like by the way I like your Kyle Klein call out definitely looks like a nice number at 10 to one all right we’re going to take a break when we come back the PDGA Danny Voss director of marketing will join us

To talk about all the things that are going on at the PDGA we’re going to do a little check in uh PDGA live and the new stat stuff and uh you know we got the new executive director rule changes all this good stuff stay with us it’s the

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Can reach out to their customer support folks and you’ll talk to a real person so no AI or any uh nonsense like that and they’ll help you find a product that fits your Needs joining us now on the upshot is the PDGA director of marketing Danny Voss Danny I’m I’m pretty sure we’ve had you on the program but please jog my memory this is not your first appearance no I uh but I do think the last time it was a it’s

Been a while uh it’s I know I was on uh I think I was in Evansville for am worlds a couple years ago and I’m standing around in the clubhouse at the golf course there and I think it was just Josh and I too at that time so so

Um I think we were going over dgpt and PDGA national tour stuff so which feels like 10 years ago at this point but here we are national tour man it’s it already is like it’s like ah remember when now it’s vintage and it’s cool again so yeah bring back the PDGA NT merch

Gonna get myself a throwback not to um so uh lots to discuss uh always many things going on over at the PDGA I want to start with the thing that kind of has been the most visible part of pdj changes recently and that is the new pdj live platform uh new SL existing

Obviously pdga.com has been around for a while at this point but it’s now rolled out for Elite Series and Majors uh this is the new platform for statistics as well replacing udisk uh for the disol Pro tour now um I I guess my first question is what was the motivation for

The PDGA to want to build out their own stats platform and have this taken away from udisk uh we had Steve Hill on the show from udisk he mentioned that uh and an Jeff spring also mentioned this that the PDGA wanted to have their own platform for scorekeeping for the majors

Um and then then ended up being kind of a sticking point and then the tour and udisk uh separated and now it’s all on the PDGA platform so why do that when udis was working perfectly well sure so firstly you know like you mentioned PDGA live as a platform has

Existed for for some time now um and the pdj live app has been the official scorekeeping like scorekeeping app uh even while udisk was doing the stats uh at pdj Majors and Elite series events and things like that so and that was you know for probably the past two seasons

Where there was like a a udisk volunteer that would take take stats and then also scores those were always unofficial and really geared more towards the dgn broadcast and being leveraged there but that that scorecard was never like the official record so the players or you know their designated caddy or wh ever

Still had to do the official scorecard on pdj live or paper or whatever and that’s kind of the case now so functionally the official record has really hasn’t changed at all in the past few years so it really boils down to you know how does this interact with really

The pro tour and the live broadcast and things like that and so um I think that there’s been a little bit of miscommunication with like why some of these things have happened um it’s definitely not as adversarial as you know maybe it’s been painted to to

Appear um and you know of course I listened to to Steve coming on uh your show a few weeks ago uh and you know there there are there’s some Nuance there that you know we can’t really get into because the one of the Clauses in

The PDGA and DG PT’s contract is that we you know we can’t disclose certain details about specifically with like the live scoring and and the uh different mechanisms uh associated with it uh but yeah so it’s it’s really more of here’s a product that can fulfill a need for

The Pro Tour as the pj’s closest partner and we have capacity to provide a service to them that makes uh the broadcast and the tour function a little bit more efficiently and so we fulfilled that need was this the plan when the pdj acquired stat Mando or was it after the

Acquisition of stat Mando that then the decision was made and and do they work on this project so not really the the project of getting PDGA live built out as this bigger platform has has implications that go a lot further than the pro tour and the Elite series and

Um mfo majors and stuff like that you know eventually we do want to roll out this capability to to All Events all 10,000 events worldwide um and maybe even get something available for uh for members to use outside of sanctioned events and stuff like that we don’t

Really have a timeline on that right now but that is kind of the bigger goal is to really provide a member benefit so with that being said those types of things were already in the works with our technology team for months uh before the the aqua hire of uh

Stat Mando um stat Mando coming on board definitely helped accelerate it because they have you know just by the virtue of getting additional people integrated into the PDGA uh you know ecosystem and and working with our existing team you know just helps more hands make less work kind of a thing so um

Yeah that’s kind of that’s kind of long and short of it it’s it’s certainly the the addition of stat Mando wasn’t nothing obviously it definitely had a positive impact on on this project um but the the core technology team that here at the pdj that’s that’s been here

Has been really you know busting it to get this product up and running and honestly it it’s it runs really really well for for the amount of manpower power that they had available and um and honestly it after um chess.com excuse me as a Florida guy I keep it almost the throat

On the mountain comes out every time but uh but yeah you know I think that I think that it shows that there was a lot of really really good things that came out of the development obviously there’s always room to improve no matter what um but we have a team that comes through

Feedback that you know looks on social media that has uh input of our own um to to make the product better and better and better and um I think we’re starting from a really really good place there was an hours long outage on pdj live.com uh that affected not only being

Able to see scores from the dgpt event but also knocked it out for people using it for their tournaments um around the country and the world is that root cause been figured out and will that be fixed moving forward oh yeah absolutely we we published a incident report later that

Day uh the our director of Technology uh dug in there and figured out what was going on um as a not quite technically proficient uh individual myself I don’t want to uh misspeak on what it was but basically it it was an issue of you know did we have the the the the

Infrastructure and the and the bandwidth in place to like handle a new traffic and stuff like that so everything has been rectified like the the the wires have been put in the right place and everything is flipped on the right way so that we shouldn’t have that problem

Again um and uh we yeah we should have everything figured out but uh yeah it was a little bit of a uh a little bit of um you know uh okay let’s get this done let’s fix this for everybody um because this is exactly you know what the people

Are counting on the PDGA to do and and honestly I mean compared to the outage AT&T had like the day before or whatever you know I feel like we move pretty quickly for you know our revenue is a little bit lower than AT&T’s big surprise okay last thing on this uh when

Will we have full stats for the season slash you know aggregated at a tournament right now you can only see it round by round yeah so that’s one of the pieces of feedback that we definitely receive that and like favoriting players and and some other features like that that

People are used to um those are all those are all things that our technology team is looking to build out so that we can make the um you know this transition to a new platform as familiar as possible for the audience so uh I don’t have a timeline on those types of things

Uh we do have a senior meeting here in a few hours and I can bring it up then but um for right now I mean it is something that’s on the horizon for us and we’re definitely looking to add because we want we want the product to be powerful

And engaging for everybody so um it’s it’s on the way while while we’re still on the scoring app just changing uh gears a tiny bit Steve Hill had mentioned on when he came on the show that udisk had offered to include udisk premium subscription I don’t know what tier and

What form but some form of udisk Premium subscription as a membership perk to PDGA members and that the PDGA declined I wanted to hear the PDGA side to that story a little bit and hear some of the logic and reasoning behind what happened and and what the choices of the PGA were

Yeah that’s a really good question and a very very interesting situation well very interesting is maybe a little bit of a blowing it out of proportion but um I heard that and I was a little taken aback honestly and so I did a little investigating here internally and and

Figured out what what this situation was so um basically what we what we believe Steve was referencing was an offer from udisk to um include 10% off udis premium for PDGA members in TW ahead of the 2023 membership year so this would have been like you know back in uh you know

October of 2022 um and so that was when udisk pricing was I believe that was $15 a year for the udisk Pro or or udisk premium whatever it’s called so that’s the a $150 discount um you know we were like H it be nice if we could get that

Closer to like take a third off 33% off that kind of thing and that would be a little bit more in line with what the previous member benefit related to udisk was and as as far as like a monetary value to the members and things like that uh and just an alignment couldn’t

Be struck there uh and so you know pdj moved on to try to find other member benefits um and right now we’re actually in another push for figuring out what other member benefits would be so um to sort of fill the Gap that people may have and and part of that is the

Technology platform that we’re building out that’s you know native to the PDGA but you know other other things too uh that members already receive or making those me member benefits a little bit more robust or meaningful or relevant or what have you so so anyways it’s the the

Long and short of that really boils down to we wanted a little bit more for the member we couldn’t strike an agreement there between the two organizations and so it just kind of like fell off and then you know we’re here in 2024 now um the membership numbers are in for

2023 uh another all-time high for the PDGA 136,137 on YouTube um we’re seeing the end of the pandemic boom and the both in absolute terms and in percentage terms uh a big reduction from the kinds of growth we’ve been seeing over the last three years unsurprising you know we I I

Think we probably most of us would have anticipated this uh absolute growth numbers 5855 for 4 and a half% growth um that absolute growth number is actually smaller than it was in 2019 uh are you concerned at all about the trajectory here of membership growth obviously this looks a lot like kind of

A reversion to the sort of growth we were seeing before the pandemic uh but is this steep of a decline given you know and certainly in percentage terms given how much the sport has grown over the last three four years are you concerned by that well it’s certainly Something That We’re addressing

Uh you know concern you know sure we have some concern about it it’s something that we look at and evaluate and that’s part of the reason why we’re looking to bolster the member benefits so that we can make a PDGA membership you know more enticing and more relevant for more people right

Um so again that’s why we think this technology platform will be part of that um we have a survey coming out regarding um the disulfur magazine as a member benefit to see you know how people feel about that if there’s an adjustment to be made there uh and there will be more

Things coming around as well also we’re running a promotion on renewals so anybody listening that hasn’t renewed you have a chance to win a basket we have 10 baskets to give out just got to put a little plug in there um but but yeah I mean are we are we concerned I

Mean sure we’re we’re taking a look at it we’re evaluating it it’s serious um but it’s not something that we feel like we need to panic about or anything like that we’re just going to try to meet our members and our future members where they need us to meet them right and uh

And that’s kind of our mission right now is to provide the best possible membership we can how how are memberships tracking so far in 2024 relative to this time last year sure yeah it’s pretty much in line with that year end report um we’re definitely

Not at you know hitting a 20% Spike but we’re definitely not hitting a 20% dip you know we’re looking pretty steady with last year um but we do want to kind of push that up a little bit you know historically the goal had been a 15%

Growth um you know which we we didn’t hit last year um but you know 15% compared to uh like you mentioned 19 uh 2019 was what 4% is these past two years right so uh you know the absolute growth is pretty close there so um figuring out

What that mean is that we need to get to that’s sustainable uh is like our big goal right now and so uh again just making sure that whatever we’re offering as far as member benefits and and access to tournaments and things like that is sufficient for um current and future

Members is our is our priority yeah well well Danny one of the things that has to you know be affecting pdj strategy in addition to membership reports is having a new executive director we got Doug bukus now over at the PDGA how has that changed or affected things what are some

Of the biggest changes that you’ve noticed since the the change in leadership over there yeah well firstly I I want to take a moment to like thank Joe for being our executive director before Doug you know Joe was the person that brought me on

Board so I owe him a lot for sure um you know he was a great leader for us while he was here um but I’m very very excited for what Doug is bringing to the table right now um you know Doug has had done a lot with Dynamic Discs and uh he’s

Bringing a lot of I think that culture to the PDGA um you know we’re trying to do a little bit more forward-facing marketing things like talking to our friends at ultiworld more frequently um and and hopefully other uh outward facing you know discussions and bringing a little bit more transparency to the

PDGA um you know those are those are values that Doug has made you know very clear that he wants us to you know uh push forward so we’re we’re doing things like that um and then also just kind of looking at what our priorities are as far as you know being the global

Governing body uh before we were talking so much about our core competencies being uh memberships and access to competition and obviously those are those are tremendous uh uh you know goals for us and and core competencies for us um but you know maybe how do we

Frame those in a in a way that’s as impactful as possible for you know the the 99% of members um and and you know future members too so um yeah opening dialogue with more Partners opening dialogue with with our audience and and things like that I think are going to be

Big themes going forward um and there’s there’s plenty of more to come that’s for sure right before the holidays the PDGA announced settlement with Natalie Ryan um and both in that post and in the board minutes talked about how uh higher than expected legal expenses were part

Of the reason that the PDGA uh lost money this past year for the first time in a long time maybe ever um you know the settlement is in place 2 years Natalie Ryan and others who meet the you know lower bar for uh you know participation as a trans woman can play

An fpo now uh so what was the impetus for settling on this and you know looking back at the original decision from the board of directors to effectively ban Natalie and others would you do you think the PDGA should have handled this differently wow what a loaded

Question uh yeah so I I I really don’t think that’s a loaded question if I’m being honest well I think that’s a straightforward question I do think I mean if you don’t think you should handled it differently I think that the you know following the board’s Direction

Here on this topic it is you know they they made a decision for how uh the policy should be handled um and it that was executed for you know almost entire season um with like you mentioned the the litigation kind of driving the conversation to Ultimate change right um

I think that because of the the the atmosphere in in in that environment around this topic has been incredibly contentious um somewhat nebulous you know in certain instances there were there was no litigation filed um for at protour events or PDGA majors in 2023 um and and others there were

Obviously that’s a strategic move by by those parties um ultimately the the best you know fiduciary response that the PDGA could take on behalf of the members is to back up that decision on the policy and say hey look right now this is not the best way that we could be

Spending our our money to to provide access to dis Golf and to Pro provide access to better memberships right like so that’s I think that is the biggest driver right now I think that ultimately you know my personal opinion is that patience is what’s going to you

Know patience and empathy are going to be the best things to drive both sides of of this topic uh so that everybody can come to the conclusion that makes the most sense and that fits you know what will be ultimately a historic decision down the road um but you know I

Don’t think that dis golf is really positioned to be the tip of the spear on this topic one way or the other uh we really need to follow the the lead of of another sporting organization or the Supreme Court or what have you uh and so

Right now right now I think that where we are with this decision is in the best interest ultimately of members because it again it it gives us the ability to focus more on memberships and competition and less on you know litigation that doesn’t impact 99% of members and just one quick followup and

I think that’s all well said um as we know from last year you know PDGA members are you know the majority in surveys stated that they they didn’t want to see trans women playing in Foo so obviously this is going to be an unpopular settlement with members uh how

Have you seen that manifest at all you know have you been getting I don’t know angry emails or people cancelling or things like that or has this mostly been a non-issue this year Well Charlie we get angry emails all the time whether it’s related to this topic or uh anything else almost

Um you know as far as any analytics on like how does the settlement impact uh membership or participation in in events or anything like that you know again we’re not really seeing like a huge dip in either at the moment so um I think that for a bulk of the members you know

The the the settlement while they may feel passionate about it might not directly you know a affect their participation and so we’re we’re just trying to do the best that we can for the majority of members again focusing on that 99% and and I think that means you know

Not tying up funds into litigation and pushing that back into like our core competencies like our membership and and access to competition so like ultimately I would like to see the PDGA and its members end up on the right side of history when it comes to this topic and I don’t think

That anyone has the foresight to Def to say that this is definitively the no the only possible answer like we need to be patient and empathetic to everybody and listen and be a listen a little bit more shout a little bit less and that’s kind

Of the the vibe that I’m trying to put out there for everybody um and and ultimately like let’s look back on this and this topic and you know 40 or 50 years and say hey maybe it took a long time or maybe it it you know they the PDGA acted

Deliberately But ultimately came to um a conclusion that is uh is the right one the board minutes talked also about the uh idgc course updates um these obviously published and come from December but we know that we’ve seen updates uh how’s how’s the property coming along um how the courses going

And and the restoration there yeah we published a request for proposals uh for uh a new course design uh right now if you’re in the area you can go to the idgc uh check out the fully renovated interior of the building you know we pulled the museum kind of

Out of that weird sort of hallway type of a room and pulled it into the big area um there are some some interesting things like that the Hall of Fame has been redone as well um and then all steady Ed is is open to play um and that’s a fantastic course uh probably

The most fun course that was on the property um as for Jackson and Warner uh they definitely need work uh there’s definitely work to be done out there uh and that’s part of that RFP process so um how it looks for Champions Cup will kind of depend on you know maybe when an

RFP is awarded or if we decide to kind of take the 2025 layout inhouse um as kind of an interim um that’s probably a little bit more likely depending on on the the bids that come in and what gets awarded uh but nothing set in stone yet uh

Ultimately the the good news is that the uh the the law lgers that came in in other parts of the property just clear-cut everything just Oaks and hickories and Pines and everything and um Mike DS the deputy executive director um he was he met with the parks department and with the uh Logging

Company and said hey look we really need you to stick to just cutting down the Pines because those are the only ones affected by the pine beetle that infested the area and they did and they left all the Woods up so it is not this clearcut like Barren Wasteland of a

Property uh that we were kind of afraid was going to happen they the Logging company was deliberate and thoughtful with what they did and um and we’re really excited for for some opportunity and uh you know I got I had the privilege of getting to see a special

Part of the uh of the property that the local staff knows about and they said how cool would a green right here and it goes down to the lake and it’s just beautiful and uh so our Michael DS and and the staff at the idgc you know

Wrote to the uh to the organizers that you know run the park and said hey could we maybe use these 30 acres to put in a new course and so that was approved and so we have a lot more blank slate to work with too so uh I again I think it’s

Another opportunity to to move slowly so that we can do something really really good once and uh look back on it and say oh yeah we we got it right here we did it right ex it’s exciting so you think even if you don’t have a fully rebuilt course

With a you know whoever you hire through the RFP process in time for next year’s Champions Cup you will still hold it there on some sort of temporary layout that’s the plan right now that’s I mean that’s subject to change of course um you know our priority is to run a elite

You know highlevel event and if that you know if that means it the Champions Cup going away from the idgc again in 2025 to facilitate that then that’s the answer but right now the goal is to at least you know maybe have a temporary course that suit the needs of that event

Um uh in time for the 2025 Champions Cup but we’ll we’ll just have to wait and see right now what would you say are the biggest challenges facing the PDGA for the next let’s say two or three years yeah that’s a good one uh I definitely think that a a bigger focus

On the 99% uh is it has maybe been a little challenging uh over the past last couple of years you know really kind of getting back to the the people that make the PDGA like the members the um the players that go out to the C tiers and the

Leagues and really drive the foundation of the organization um providing those better member benefits and things like that that I’ve already mentioned so um I think that that will help Rectify maybe some of that those absolute growth numbers and the percentage numbers that we were talking about before and you

Know while it’s a while it’s a challenge obviously it’s also a tremendous opportunity for us to to make everything about the PDGA better um and by the way we’re still trying to do all this without raising membership fees right now you know that’s something that we’re really really working hard to not change

Because um everything else is going up in price but you know the pdj membership hasn’t gone up I’ve never paid I’ve always paid the $50 for a North American amateur membership my entire time I’ve been a member 15 years I mean what else hasn’t changed in price in 15 years you

Know what I mean so we’re trying to we’re trying really hard to do that for our members as kind of like that Baseline member benefit so um so yeah I guess the The Challenge and the opportunity there is is growing our membership and uh and uh yeah providing

The best possible service that we can all right final thing here Danny thank you for your time um this one actually comes from our subscriber Discord and uh if you don’t mind we’d love to have you stick around and answer some more questions from the Discord in our subscriber bonus segment uh inside

The circle you okay to do that let’s do it awesome so uh this one is about the five minute rule uh at a tiers with scheduled tea times and staggered starts you have to be at your teapad 5 minutes before the start time Kevin Jones found

Out the hard way uh that that rule was in place and got stroked for not being there 5 minutes ahead of time um what was the impetus for including this Rule and I don’t necessarily know if you’re going to specifically know the answer to this one so sorry if I’m putting you on

The spot but uh you know why the change and is this something worth getting uh upset about if you’re a a player uh you know like like Kevin sure if you’re asking was there a specific instance that you know sparked this change um even if there was obviously I wouldn’t

Say oh my gosh but there there wasn’t the the thing is is that the the time that time the five minutes before the tea time uh and and showing up ahead of time to meet with the starter is critical for players to know any possible changes to the course

That may have occurred overnight I mean there it is not rare for you know a hole to be altered because of you know a fallen tree or or what know who knows what kind of weird scenario could could take place um but also just kind of getting everybody dialed in on the live

Scoring and familiar with the volunteers that are there so that they’re not kind of taken aback by like hey why is this guy following us and is right up in us and talking to us and asking us questions it’s like well they’re here to help take stats so you know be nice to

Them that kind of thing and just getting all this stuff sort of arranged that everybody can be told at the same thing at the same time um and you know it’s it’s five minutes it’s 10 minutes before the tea time it’s you know I think that’s a a reasonable ask um for for

Competitors that are you know taking the uh taking the event seriously awesome well Danny thank you for being here uh we’ll continue the conversation inside the circle and uh uh appreciate you coming on the show always great to have you no doubt thanks for having me Danny BOS from the PDGA with

Us here on the upshot we’ll be right Back welcome back to the upshot great to talk with Danny boss from the PDGA I thought it was interesting I I am most I don’t know how to say how concerned I am I mean I’m already on the books Josh is s suggesting that we’re going to see continued growth this year

But I’m a little concerned about the conversation about membership growth um not specifically because I think like the PDGA is in trouble or something but just kind of what it means for the sport in general like is the PDG membership actually down a little bit right now year-over-year I don’t necessarily know

That we got a super concise answer about that uh but clearly you know if they’re doing renewal giveaways and things like that they’re thinking about this it’s interesting because Danny talks about the fact that the PDGA price has you know never gone up and and it’s never changed but I still receive a

Magazine that looks like it was published 20 years ago as well that I never read I I throw it in the garbage the second it gets to my house uh it’s it’s not why I’m a PDGA member I’m not a pdj because I want a card that has the

Dis golf ethics on it um I don’t want a card a membership card with my membership number on it that I then block out when I hold it up to social media like that that’s not why I’m a member of the PDGA and those things

Don’t add value and so I think the PDGA is long overdue to do a hard look as to like what it is that people find the most valuable what it is that they’re paying money for and why why do you join the PDGA and and the answer is that if

If you know if outside of competitive disc golf and wanting to just play tournaments regularly like you have to find that answer if you’re going to be for the 99% as Danny talked about and it’s I think it I think it sounds like to me that it’s something that they’re

Starting to look at it should have been looked at 10 years ago yeah there may maybe a little late on the pivot here but I thought that was kind of the clear message that Danny had was like we’re focusing again on the 99% of PDGA members and he

Basically straight up said that was hard to do over the last two years and you think about all the things that they’ve been doing right they transitioned the NT over to the dis golf pro tour uh they expanded their media team a bunch uh they had the whole Natalie Ryan

Situation uh there’s been a lot going on on that front and and to be honest like I have a hard time even like thinking about stuff that was not related to professional disc golf obviously that’s what we care about on this program so you know it all feels very germine to us

But you know tournament like the the craziness of not being able to sign up for tournaments is in the past right tournaments now not certainly some are still filling quickly but you’re not having to race click to get into events anymore right and so like you know demand has kind of

Softened and now the PDGA is probably looking at last year’s year-end membership number and going whoa like we added fewer we had fewer we added fewer and more active members this past year than we did five years ago like that should be like definitely a warning

Signal now the thing is if you go back to trend of adding sixish thousand people a year that’s what it used to be the question is with a higher base of membership should you expect to have the ongoing 10 to 20% range growth I genuinely don’t know that might be hard

To achieve but if you’re going to want to achieve it you’re going to have to figure out how to make becoming a member more valuable that’s just that simple I mean I think the clear most obvious benefits are you know tournament participation duh rating right yep and

Three is dgn Discount yep right so if you are a professional disc golf fan which means you’re pretty hardcore probably it’s a great value but if you’re a casual why bother and that’s that’s going to be the challenge for them is to either figure

Out how to get more people to to want to play in tournaments or to figure out ways to make the membership valuable enough that people will get it even if they’re not serious you know a tier players yep and that’s that’s the that’s the trick and and you know we T talked a

Little bit before and you used to get a disc with the membership and I think you have to pay extra for that disc now and so even before like you know if you were going to play the the here’s the value proposition is the way it used to be at

50 bucks you play two tournaments and you get and maybe I guess back in the past three tournaments that’s 30 bucks 10 per tournament plus you get a disc at it’ll say 20 bucks right and you get the cool stamp and and whatever it is right

You play three events it’s worth it to you now without the disc I can go play five events before a PDGA membership it becomes neutral in terms of the value that I get out of that and the number of people I would be willing to suspect

That there are a high percentage of PDGA members who play less than five tournaments a year because they play the local the close ones they play one per month during the summer I think three to four is probably like a pretty High number for pdj members and and at the

Price point right now it is not worth getting a membership worth noting you still get the disc for free if you’re a new member first time oh new member okay okay now I don’t know if if that’s if you used to always get a disc I genuinely don’t know I don’t I don’t

Know but you still get the disc you can buy it if you want um if you’re not a brand new member but but for my renewal point right like if I’m not going to play five events it’s not worth it for me to go up like renew my membership

Unless I care about a rating yeah which some people do some people do and that’s a value but but you know you wonder about udisk having its own rating system like does that nudge people be like well I still get a number yeah I I don’t know I don’t know you gota that’s

Something I will be tracking this as board minutes come out to see where membership numbers are because I think that that’s this is going to be an important year it’s going to be an important year um all right time to get into another segment of 302 rule where

We have 30 seconds to talk about each topic and if we go over time it definitely does not matter there’s no Strokes over here being handed out Josh take it away well first up thanks to a concerted effort over on Reddit Terry Miller has broken the 100,000 subscriber number on YouTube

There was a post over the memorial weekend uh where people had realized that Terry Miller was quite close you know in the the 97 Range and Reddit pulled through man when Reddit puts their mind something they really can pull something off uh and uh Terry

Miller now hits the th 100K Mark so big congratulations to Terry Miller and you know this guy’s just been grinded for so long uh you know helping out fill in the the coverage gaps right people want to watch Memorial I mean I feel like I I’m

Gonna pull it up right now um I’m putting Terry Miller YouTube but do I need to put the dis golf guy it’s gol guy it comes up anyway oh yeah it does look so let’s see uh 104,000 views on the front nine of round one at the memorial uh of The Bella

Card so you know he’s he’s putting up some numbers over there and like it’s super helpful to have somebody willing to go put in the time to fill in the gaps of coverage where at these kind of like bigger a tiers and Terry’s been doing that the last few years and um you

Know editing commentating doing it coordinating doing it all he really is the disc golf guy I wish you got a big Financial bonus for getting 100K Subs but unfortunately you don’t uh next up European open has announced that in preparations for the 2025 worlds they are going to be adding

A second course the tare course which will be played at the 2025 worlds to the European open this year so the fourr round event will feature two uh at the Beast though I think is it going to be a modified Beast I uh didn’t see that in the press

Release TBD I think because they talked about it last year there going to be changes to the facilities coming so you know we’re not 100% sure what the Beast is going to look like but two rounds at the Beast and two rounds at uh tare Disc

Golf Center on the course that is named the monster so oh the the Beast and the monster love it uh teree for the first two rounds the Beast for the second two rounds uh should be really I mean Tom is a fabulous course and you know this is

Gonna be world’s preview right so yep get ready to overreact and say who the you know 2025 world champion is going to be based on what happens at European open this year um I’m so excited for worlds and Europe that’s going to be awesome but like they’re going to figure

Out the little tricky spots problem areas fix everything up world is going to be spectacular think about how many people are going to come out to worlds in Europe it could be amazing could we get to 10,000 th000 people at the course for the final round that doesn’t seem

Impossible it doesn’t like people will actually travel I think from around Europe to go to watch worlds so I’m so excited I I’m I’m just incredibly pumped up about Disc Golf in Europe in general and I think this will be a positive change uh for four round event I think

You and I both agree it’s really nice to have two courses yep yeah I I accept it for a major because I think the added weight of that event is is fine to have it on a single course but four rounds two courses stream so I’m gonna steal a a 30 second rule

Spot from you Josh please do this came across a an advertisement that I saw for Charles Schwab which is weird because I already have a Charles Schwab Bank account um but it’s a it was like a little dis golf ad and I was like what

The heck so I clicked and I thought it was pretty interesting so take a look it’s a short video uh about second careers got into the computer business really at the start of it I was in the office every day for 32 years and I was always looking out the window wishing I

Could be the guy working outside I just knew I wanted to retire and do something different the only plan was to move up closer to my kids and build our our dream house I was building that house I would play disc golf disc golf is basically like Ball Golf

Except with frisbees I hadn’t played before I had walked around with my kids as they played because it was just it’s just fun then we decided maybe we could buy a property and have our own course you know we weren’t really sure it was going to be a viable business and

So we built it for ourselves and we did the work ourselves it was pretty much a family thing which was the other thing that I I really wanted want out of this I wanted more time with my sons you know people liked it started uh we decided to start charging and they

Actually paid and then it just kind of kind of fell into place I did invest heavily as much as I could especially early in my career I think that’s where it’s the most important because you get the value of money over time I put as much into I

Could early which was hard because we had kids you have to do it if you want to retire early I would say to other folks that are thinking about starting a second career just be open to it cuz I had no plan I was just going to take it easy

Travel you know hang out with my grandkids but this just kind of popped up it kind of happened you know luckily we went with it I can’t imagine anything else that would have brought us together as much as this place Has so there you go the flying armadillo disc golf course which I’ve heard is very cool uh I know Casey white did a YouTube uh video about this course uh it’s a 4.7 uh sorry it’s a 4.8 over on udisk um I think there’s there’s there’s multiple courses so they have a mini

Course that’s a 4.8 and the the the regular larger course is a 4.7 on udisk um and yeah I mean this video was made in 2019 so pre-pandemic uh but this definitely makes me want to go to Texas and play it’s got the like it’s got the Vibes of you know Keep

Austin Weird it’s in San Marcos Texas which is I don’t know my Texas between Austin and San Antonio I am not surprised it has Austin Energy uh but it looks like a lot of fun I’m sure we’ll hear from some listeners about flying armadillo yeah I mean th I think those

Pitch and Putt courses are are exciting additions to put on private properties that people can go and and enjoy so uh yeah love it love the it’s cool advertisement I I do not get Charles Schwab advertisements I guess because I’ve have not seen that uh next Paul MC

Beth posts to Instagram that he was hanging out with lri marinan uh the jazz Utah Jazz player is Paul just like trying to find a professional athlete in each of the sports just have his is his buddy yeah um Honestly though I saw it like I’m like uh Finn basketball star like I

Think I think I’ve seen something about Lori playing disc golf before so uh so he’s got I I don’t really know if he’s like homies with Magnus Carlson but he has met Magnus Carlson he’s got Dylan CE he’s got Lowry marinin so we got baseball chess and basketball yep

There’s got to be some we know there’s hockey guys I don’t think I don’t know if MC Beth is in touch with those guys but there’s a there’s a hockey goalie Who’s got like dis golf basket stickers and stuff on his helmet um so what are we

Missing uh football NFL uh Casey the Smith is the the goalie I was trying to remember it’s the Pittsburgh Penguins player yeah and L marinan has a Facebook video up of playing doubles in Finland I okay this is true I was I was at a bachelor party

And my friend there from Pittsburgh said that uh I don’t know if it was him or one of his friends but uh the watt brothers were out playing in Pittsburgh that’s right yeah I saw that video and they saw them at the course uhhuh all right so mcth there it is I JJ

And TJ MC Beth MC Beth’s gonna come rolling up to worlds one of these times es this year at his course it his McLaren just loaded with like casy SMI Casey the Smith clown status none of those guys could even fit in that car only

Mcbath I I don’t know how tall is Magnus Carlson Magnus Carlson might be able to get in there he’s probably kind of tall I bet he’s like six foot let me let me find out no he’s only 5’10 he’s to MC Beth well AR we all I’m taller MC be I’m not

A tall man sorry back to you yeah know you’re good uh last up Ricky may have the last laugh Ricky’s Bitcoin bonus tracker has updated and Bitcoin reaching an all-time high means that Ricky Waki is is looking real nice right now on his Bitcoin bonus 250k he paid

Yep and got in his bonus paid in Bitcoin in January 2022 the bonus according to the Ricky’s Bitcoin bonus tracker Twitter account is now worth $426,500 and Josh I put it in to an S&P 500 tracker okay if you put 250k in the S&P in January 2022 you would have 282,000 even

Close good for Ricky and people trolled Ricky people trolled Ricky troll riy we trolled Ricky I will tell you Josh as Bitcoin literally just hit its all-time ever high I sold I’m out and I would recommend to Ricky get out get out get out right now you did it you you won put

It into the put it into your index fund of choice and don’t watch this thing retrace yeah or wait wait for it to D drop again and then stick it back you know stick the 250 back in but there you go yeah well but see the thing is maybe it’ll never

Go back down Josh May Maybe not maybe not I would not bet on that but the markets are crazy right now uh but wow how about that Ricky’s Bitcoin bonus the what what what if he ends up making more from that than his contract we’d have to

See a lot more increase in yeah price but you’d be kicking yourself for getting out Ricky Ricky troll us all he did uh all right anything else 30 second Ru nope that was it what a 30 second rule Charles Schwab NBA stars Bitcoin like

Man we hit it all we hit it all today uh all right thank you so much for tuning in we’ll be back with you Thursday well wa I’ll be back with you Thursday you’ll be back Josh I don’t know do you want to do you want to talk about it oh sure I’ll

Talk about it uh we are scheduled for an induction tomorrow Wednesday the 6 we’ll go into Wednesday the 6th uh probably baby will probably come on Thursday the 7th so that that’s the plan right now um you I’m hopefully you’re not going to see me on Thursday there’s just probably

No way you see me on Thursday good luck thank you we’re so excited for you uh it’s uh it’s it’s a whole it’s a whole new world so Josh will be out at least for a next couple episodes but I’ll be back with you on Thursday to get you

Ready for a wakeo and uh we’ll see what what Josh’s status is in the next few weeks but um sounds like he’s likely to not miss as much time as I was expecting but we’ll see we’ll see but Josh everyone’s pulling for you and thank you can’t wait to see pictures and

Everything else big thanks everybody all right that is going to do it for this edition of the upshot we will I will be back with you on Thursday to get you ready for a wakeo talk to you Then