Shane and Marty welcome golf instructor and PING Brand Ambassador Derek Deminsky to ASU’s Thunderbirds Complex for an episode dedicated to the short game. They discuss misconceptions about spin, curing the chipping yips, and teaching tour-level and high-handicap players.
The guys from ping they’ve kind of shown me how much the equipment matters I just love that I can hit any shot I kind of want we’re going to be able to tell some fun stories about what goes on here to help golfers play better golf welcome
Back to the Ping Proving Grounds podcast I’m Shane bacon that is Marty Json my man in somewhat matching purple is that fair to say Derek deminsky joins us now how you doing buddy I’m great how are you doing great excited for this uh podcast we’ meaning to have you on for a
Bit I know you guys have known each other for a long long time I’ve been following you for a good amount of time on social media but as we know it’s social media I’ve never met you in human form till today it’s felt like we’ve
Played a few rounds gone out a few times but it’s been official today here we go um Marty I would like you to start the Pod by giving us a breakdown of Derrick’s golf game start to finish I know you’ve seen it up close over the
Years uh off the tea he’s got a uh a fade every single time 100% of the time reliable reliable with the metal Woods iron game is solid and trending uh shipping needs Improvement or what shipping is this little weak spot but his ball striking so good he hardly ever
Needs it on the course is it is it weird to hear that go well is it weird to go from like a good player that you know lives in Arizona and competes to becoming this like internet guy that people know of because of their short game what has that been like to see
Random people come up to you and talk to you about chipping and pitching at an airport or something yeah so it it hasn’t come to that um I guess thankfully but I’ve known Marty for a long time we’ve become good friends he’s roped me into ping which is what I
Wanted the whole time I was like oh no don’t don’t help me out with ping it anything lead me to this no please no um but I’m just a golf junkie so that’s I remember the first time we met was at the gallery North Course and it was I
Think for the PPC or something you were just out there grinding it’s super hot Marty’s out there on the back of the range I’m like oh you know I know he works with pain I want to introduce myself I’ve seen him on TV he’s like you know major championship guy and then we
Start talking like ma o Grady and he’s just I’m like this is my guy right here and I think you played well the next day yeah you know I did not but we had great times and here we are now yeah at the the bird Marty this is an unbelievable
Facility if you’re watching this on YouTube by the way you look behind us and you see why they issue teams are as good as they are I mean I have been dreaming of the moment I get to go out there and hit some Pitch shots here in a
Little bit uh this is the real deal so shout out to ASU for letting us use this and papao a place I’ve played a lot of golf Marty you’ve played a lot of golf annoyingly you take like six months off of golf and then play in the papao
Monday game and shoot like 65 It’s Kind your emmo it it is fun I I uh you know I get Mondays off with the day job so you know New Year’s Memorial Day Labor Day my three days I play the Monday Skins game here it’s it’s is it is it the best
Skins game in in Phoenix it’s still and it’s the I think it’s the longest standing it’s been going on for a long time um so yeah it is fun it’s reliable Derrick have you spent a lot of time in Phoenix playing golf yeah I come up here
Quite a bit uh some for instruction but we both play in essentially every Southwest section event so I’m up here quite a bit and when I can team with this guy I’m not saying we’ve gone undefeated but the record books would show that um so it’s a lot of fun
Playing with a tour player and I just ride them uh and make a few chips and putts can you just kind of walk us through your journey to this point because again I mean you’ve got a great social media following it’s a lot of fun
To kind of follow um what you do I I learn stuff from your social media which is something I don’t think I say a lot about a lot of social medias out there but um you know I mean you’ve you’ve kind of established yourself as this thing online and now obviously you’ve
Got a a great relationship with ping so can you just kind of walk us through your journey through golf to this point yeah for sure so I grew up in Minnesota it’s where I’m born and raised family’s there and grew up with a golfing family
My my brother my dad Dad my mom all played and we grew up in Elk River Minnesota the team was extremely competitive so we’d have like a hundred kids try out for the golf team in in Minnesota yeah so if you couldn’t shoot like upper 70s you couldn’t make Varsity
Like the JV team was shooting like like low 80s so after always being the shortest kid in basketball even though I loved it after skateboarding and then not really being that successful um went into golf and started to shoot kind of low 90s upper 80s this is about in the eighth
Grade and I got the first golf book I ever got in eighth grade the Del uh the Dave pels Short game Bible so not a quick read uh was more of a more of a Bible than maybe the Bible I guess we could say uh but I got really into it
And what I found is you know I wasn’t the biggest guy besides my besides my looks now um so I didn’t hit it that far and I knew I had to find a way to score better so reading that book getting into short game and then really seeing for me
We would play these nine-hole matches and I I would miss every green and sometimes still do but I would I could get up and down nine times to shoot like even parse it was incredible I was kind of the short game guy a little bit then
So it’s always had a special place in my heart got into the golf business golf industry and then as I started teaching again I teach all areas but short game definitely has a special place and that’s kind of why it is uh so special to me I guess
Derek what about your you know some of the funnest things is to watch it in person and I’ve experienced this uh others have seen online what is your F when did your fascination uh begin with spinning the ball one of the things that you can do that I we’re still trying to
Figure out quite frankly is uh is how much you can spin some certain shots especially very shots that fly very short yeah which is a hard thing to do I can outspin you with the full gapway but I can’t do it with some of the shots
You around the green when when did your fascination with spin begin yeah that’s interesting I think you know like back in the day I remember it was all you you’d see it on TV and that was kind of back in the late 90s when when they were playing
Like uh you know the bot balls like I want to do that on a full swing even so I got my Snake Eyes wedge and you know I looked for that Titleist DT spin ball it said DT spin so I mean it had to have
Spun it’s in the name right so then you know it’s like 90 yard out we find a day it’s like blowing 30 into me and I’m like man I’m just going to I want to spin this so bad so we kind of like explore that way never really did
Anything with it and then as I started to kind of teaching it into short game I just started to kind of hit some shots uh because I really used to not spin the ball so it’s not like I’ve always just been the spin guy I was kind of grew up
In that Dave pels somewhat Phil Michelson hinge and hold not that that that can’t spin it but to kind of use my hands like I currently do was kind of this process where I started hitting some shots I recorded a a video that’s on on my website
Maybe eight years ago or so and I could kind of make it stop and I was like oh this is so so cool but then after that uh really what what what made it take off was when I saw Tiger shot at the V barar there was this video that went
Viral online and it was Tiger at about 30 yards out hits this High shot it’s like okay cool like it’s going to behind stop it like checks and Spins right in back and I was like no way this is crazy so I reach out to a ton of people and a
Lot of them were like oh it’s easy you just do this and we SE are you like emailing people calling people like uh social media at this point right so social media probably started in maybe 10 years ago or just just short of that and that’s where really only one person took me
Seriously Chris Como so then at that point in 2020 is when we kind of I had this back and forth talking about this shot and then I just took it on as a challenge to really just see what there was and that’s it’d be waking up in the middle
Of the night trying stuff like all crazy golfers do and uh at some point it kind of worked out and I’m sitting on couch with you guys so Derek this is the shot tiger hit he hit and he’s in the gallery right is that the one they no so so the
First one was uh at the Val in a practice round I think when he finished second to maybe Paul Casey yeah I think and then the one I think you’re referring to he hit another one like in the Zozo I think it might have even been
Before he won but it’s in the Zozo he’s putting on this clinic and you could probably YouTube this Zozo Clinic I mean this is super nerdy I think I watched this shot yesterday just so and all these like oo and a like he’s fighting all these shots but the first shot he
Hit he Taps this ball out there 15 yards brings a ball and hits this High shot that SP spins spins right like all like hits the ball and everyone’s like whoa and it just sounds incredible so you mentioned tiger a couple times who are your kind of spin Idols if you will yeah
So Tiger Woods is number one um when I do my shots I use the Bridgestone ball Tiger’s Ball but it has to be the one that says tiger on it where he’s on the cover because it just motivates me I guess um so I would say he’s number I
Would say he’s number one do you throw the ball back to your assistant if they give you a non- tiger ball just give me the right ball what are you doing I tape up I tape up my fingers no I don’t um but I use that ball and it doesn’t make
A lot of sense but that Ball’s like you know the spinous ball and Mar’s helped me as well as Eric and all of ping right so I think that’s kind of why we’re such a great partnership as well is we have these questions that you Eric the whole
Staff are actually interested in right when I reached out to all these people they’re like oh it’s just easy he plays this and he does this and I reached out to a lot of great short game people even and they kind of dismissed it I’m like no I think there’s something here and
Kom was like let’s go let’s have a combo yeah all right so Tigers W who else do you have on your list of the maybe not even the people you look up to in terms of spin but like modern day golfers that you’re impressed by with the way they
Can kind of manipulate Spin and Loft and things like that geez uh Ju Just a ton of players right so I would say to some amount like Tiger’s Protege like Justin Thomas um you just any and any of the shots right the one that walking Neiman hit uh my
Buddy Matt Evy was on the call and he was like whoa you know I think you might have been on that live with them uh JT it’s funny because I’m a huge fan of like Steve Stricker who kind of does some of the opposite stuff he can still
Spin it yeah but he’s like a short game Idol just all these you know as I’ve taught and started to learn maybe why certain players can do things and really started to understand more than just a model but like why does Steve Stricker stuff work why does Sergio Garcia stuff
Work why does these certain shots work um that’s just kind of helped me I guess overall so it’s it’s almost more about studying process than player it’s almost more like how are they able to do X Y and Z yeah I think that’s where I’ve gotten to where I am it’s it’s learning
And i’ I’ve had some great resources but also just seeing like why does Luke Donald do this why does a Brett Rumford do this why does Steve Stricker move this way why does certain people who do certain things you know have certain body movements and then are they trying
To accomplish so it’s it’s it’s an interesting puzzle that I just I just love so much Derek one of the things I think I admire about you is is uh you know you talked about Stricker chipping with a certain technique it’s different than tiger and and JT and some of the
Other players out there how have you distilled what the tour players do their different techniques I think I’ve you I’ve seen you use the term long Arc short Arc right uh and how do you take those and teach your everyday your Club golfers you know your your mid to high
Handicap players I think where that has really helped me is just understanding when someone has a certain pattern what their struggles would tend to be I.E when when people are told to be wide and shallow in general they’re going to be under plan the whole club the whole
System is moving so far off and I’ll be like well are you are you hitting a fat and thin a bunch like oh how you know so just kind of know what their Tendencies might might be and then we can help improve them just just with a shot or a
Skill right so if they’re super wide low and inside we can somewhat quantify it and it’s not quite the simple but it can be it’s like hey I need you to use some amount of wrists and hit me like a risty slice that can tend to neutralize them
Contact improves they can see a quick Improvement more than hey let’s shorten that Arc let’s let’s increase this you can make it real simple that way okay cool what are some misconceptions about spin because I I was chatting with you earlier we out here kind of like messing
Around with some wedges and stuff and like I think everyday people get taught that lower on the face spins more you’ve got to hit it high to spin the golf ball like what are you figuring out running into solving the problems of a bounce spin that maybe you thought one way that
Now you think the total opposite yeah so that would uh all all those questions go to Eric Hendrickson and everyone at P because even me I’m learning new stuff all the time right and and I’m sure uh you know I’ve got bad information out there right it’s like oh okay well this
Is kind of colum and knowledge we think that maybe this produces this it’s like okay I’ve kind of seen that and then also there’ll be things that I can take to Eric and Marty where it’s like hey I can hit on this part of the club this
Tends to do this and they can explain why it’s like at at this point again they’re so smart it’s like here’s what I’m seeing you tell me why like I I don’t really know but I can do this I don’t know really how but you guys tell
Me Smarties I yeah I think Shane what uh why Derek and Chris the rest of our ambassadors do and our players they you know we had Joe Mayo on right a while back is that push they’re pushing us and a lot and when we don’t know the answers
It means they’re observing something in real life we need to try to figure out and then try to feed that back back into just that understanding of golf physics and Derek brought up a good point that hey maybe I have bad information out there you know uh in in the scientific
World world it’s kind of you you could say that you know facts have a halflife because you can level up your knowledge absolutely I mean and and maybe golf is the biggest sport about that right yes because you think about the stuff you and I’ve talked about on this podcast
That was true 10 years ago that is the complete opposite these days distance versus accuracy and hit low on the face and things of that nature so this has been great to have Derek on on board to push us come in and and and uh help do
Some of those fun fun projects try to crack the code on those those spin shots yeah and also the fact that you guys have the spinni wedge makes me look pretty good we call that science friction science friction lots of compliance if you know what I’m saying
How did the relationship start with ping like how did that conversation begin I was you know Marty’s always helped me out um like doing some driver fittings like he would always take care of me super nice every time I had a experience of it pinging it was like incredible
They got you know I was like I’m hitting driver bad they oh try this I’m like wow I didn’t I didn’t know I could hit it a little better and further so Marty was just helping me send it and then at that point working with Chris uh qualifying
For that a Shriners event kind of this perfect storm and then being up the road and I know what Ping stands for and everything so it’s it I was kind of like oh no don’t don’t help me out or you know like sure I guess I’ll go hang out
At Bing so it really was this hope hope that it would work out and yeah it’s it’s it’s great Derek was a a good case study Shane we’ve talked about that on drivers there’s a relationship between distance and accuracy Derek drives it very straight straight but he’s self
Admitted not the longest player out there um so what we did with him is we put him in our Ulta CB xflex shaft super count counterbalance right up to the 46 in limit so that’s a case where we actually went longer because because he drives it so straight and put a premium
On getting more well remember the first time though we it was 48 it was over when it was when it was to 40 I’m like Marty give it to give it as long as I can I don’t I don’t care it doesn’t matter and then what I do I put it right
In the back you’re like you don’t have to play this it was like at we up I’m like Marty is going straight in it’s just like it’s like there’s no there’s no barrier it’s super easy yeah it’s like of course I is going straight in great um Derek the you know your your
Interest on social media has led you to I’m assuming some doors you probably didn’t know you’d be knocking on or walking through tour players have come to you for advice collegate players LPGA players who was the first Tour player to reach out and you worked with and how
Has that been personally for you to have people you see on TV and professional golfers want to pick your brain about golf yeah so I I I’ve worked with some like two s people in the past uh Ronnie Black’s a good friend Don pulley but then like getting to know and become
Friends with Max hom you know mutual friend um seeing him when Co really started is when we kind of started working and then just watching him grow and you know obviously with his coach Mark Blackburn he’s got him so dialed in and just kind of being a sounding board
For a while and working with him there and then uh not to have a little success like for him and we’ve both seen it he’s just the hardest worker I’ve ever seen he will do information right away he’s just an incredible talent and then when you put that all together and now he’s
Won like six more times again like with no no real help for me such such a talent but it was really cool to see and hang out with him a bunch at TPC Scottdale and and and then you know who doesn’t like Max Homer right if you
Don’t like Max hom you’re the problem let’s be clear like it ain’t Max so doing that and then now it’s yeah just uh I consult for a lot of players a lot come to Tucson you meet some really cool people and uh it’s a wild ride and it’s
Doing what I love I love teaching Olive golf but some special about helping short game to me that just you know when you do that thing that makes you feel alive or it’s like I don’t even know what I’m getting paid I don’t care what I’m getting paid like this is what I
Want to do it’s like teaching short game to really anyone but like the high level player is is special I’m I’m actually interested in both of your thoughts on this but I’ll start with you Derek you know you we talk so much about teaching golf um is it a different approach to
Teaching a great player versus teaching an average player because they’re bringing so many different skill sets to the table but in theory you’re probably trying to get them to similar spots right I mean in terms of contact or where they hit the ball or the way they’re they’re moving it through
Through impact I mean I’m assuming the end goal might be the same but the way you get there might be different the the tough thing is a tour player you can give them terrible info and they can probably make it work okay they’re so skilled so so talented that I could tell
Them to use opposite end of the club they’re be like okay yeah I get you know depending on what their level is but when you get a player comes in for a lesson they miss your hand you know trying to shake it it’s like okay we’re
G to try to get this club on this ball let’s be clear it ain’t gonna probably go that well so so knowing that so then you really have to dial in things that they can do what’s reasonable make it very clear so that they can have success
So so that’s really kind of a sneaky fun challenge it’s like you know if I can get this person a short game at will not you know with with no disrespect to them because it’s a challenging game but it’s like man that’s that’s an accomplishment compared to these super high level
Players that really can do anything which is why they’re where they’re at the way I’d answer that one change from a from a fitting standpoint would be that the high handicap golfer we don’t see them we they don’t need to have as much uh variation in their short game
They can have one staple shot they rely on let’s say 90 90 95% of the time and quite often they are not comfortable opening the face right so I I want to flip that your way here in a second Derek but then then the more skilled golfer they need they’re going to have
More variety they’re going to move the handle around they’re going to lean It Back Lean It Forward raise the handle lower their hands for different shots so we will put them through a more advanced fitting protocol that stresses all those areas and make sure it works for the
Shots they need to hit on the course Derek for you what do you see with the high handicap player um do they do they fear opening the face can you get them to open the face is that something you teach them I’m kind of curious to get
Your thoughts on that it’s it’s very Case by case basis I get a lot something that I somewhat have a special te and I guess is I’m a lot of people’s Last Resort when they have the Yip so I’ve had people flying from all over they’re
Like it’s you or nothing and you’ll see some of these people and it’s like that’s either a major compliment or a huge dig I’m not F it’s like hey you’re my last resort this is it and you’ll see him hit some shots and I’m like are you
Really playing are you doing this in front of your buddies like this is wow so when that’s the case it’s just getting any way that they can predict contact uh getting comfortable with with any any style before we start moving up the chain to like okay we we got to make
Pretty good contact then we got to control it and it’s building this this kind of Learning Foundation of okay well then we can start to open the the face same thing in bunkers right they people have one speed when they come to me they’re struggling it’s called Panic
Speed get me out of here they can give it full gas and this Ball’s going anywhere it’s so uh it’s very player to player in that regard I I feel like teaching golf I mean you know if you were going to compare it to like a road
Trip there are you know High handicap players players you’re talking about last resort type of players that the road trip like to get them to a Next Level might be another city it might be driving from Tucson to Phoenix or Tucson pass so you’re talking to a tour player
It might literally just be trying to get him to the next exit you know where it’s like it’s not there’s not that much you need to improve on but if I can get you a mile better on this road trip then it can be you know it can be an enormous
Leap for you because it’s just so incremental in terms of getting better when you’re that that high of a level of golfer I think that’s what’s helped me out even in my coaching so I get a lot of players that see me for spin right
They want to hit that spin shot so we don’t necessarily have to change form change technique change how they do anything it’s like hey we can add these shots we can add these skills to your toolbx and then head down the road Derek uh what shot or let’s say
You’re on the golf course um what you you you walk up to your ball What scenario and conditions get you very excited like you’re going to be able to melt this golf ball you’re going to be able to show off with a shot on the
Course so I really like so if I had to set the the stage right so it’s a perfect Glide ball sitting up right TPC Scottdale is a perfect example when it’s it’s like man how can I I’m just gonna spin this thing and then if I can go I
Kind of like you know you can spin it you see guys spin it from like 50 60 that’s fine but the one that opens eyes is when you’re close and you can spin it and people are like I haven’t seen that so if I get it right about my sweet
Spots probably if it calls for it right because in tournaments I’m going to try to be smart but if if it calls for it you know something where it’s a tight pin maybe over something uh great lie maybe in that 10 to 20 yard range where I can
Just cut one up there so so you’re telling me you get excited about the shots that we don’t want to hit that’s what you’re telling exactly the ones I’m like I don’t want anything to do with this I’m GNA pitch this 20 feet by and maybe I’ll make the putt yeah it’s it
And we both know you guys can both play but it it I think it does help somewhat practicing those kind of unique shots because it’s like I can go have fun with this and I think something that’s helped me in events is I don’t care how I look
Or how I play like I can live with any result if I had a terrible shot no one’s better at living with a bad result than me so I think that gives me a huge Advantage because I don’t care how it turns out so that helps me free it up
Put myself in that practice mode kind of lick my lips and be like watch this and then I mean it’s just fun it’s just however it goes it’s great when did social media become a part of all this because I mean as I’ve mentioned I mean the social media side is great grown
What’s your relationship like right now with Instagram do you love it is it is it frustrating at times yeah so the great thing for me is it’s all fun it it’s I I don’t NE like an additional thing exactly so the the greatest thing that it’s helped me do is meet great
People great coaches great players I don’t need to make money off of it if a video does well or bad it doesn’t really matter to me I again I think I started kind of eight or nine years ago and I was talking last night to George gas’s
Good friend and we were both like a couple like a thousand followers or 2,000 followers and I’m I’m seeing him and you know to watch him grow and so we were kind of early adopters I guess in the in the Instagram era which I probably should have done YouTube
Honestly if IID talked to my younger self and be playing golf for fun for a lot of money um and then it kind of Instagram changed Tik Tok came out some of these other platforms so like the algorithm or whatever you want to call it has maybe adjusted somewhat but it doesn’t matter
Like I’m still just putting out things I like often times times I’ll get asked to speak about goofy not goofy things but like you know how do you build how did you build your brand or how did you it’s like okay I got on Fiverr and I got my
Logo you know for 15 bucks you know I sent it to 15 people put in okay yeah exactly so it’s like let get 15 options you know we we’ll we’ll do it from there and then um again just really being able to to to do it for fun I think has really
Allowed me to to have no pressure right so I’d be doing the same thing if I had zero followers same thing if I had whatever followers but it’s just because I love this game so much and it’s just I love teaching it I love playing it uh I
Think about it too much and it’s just like an addiction Shan we did the Halloween edition scary shots yep and it was uh the like 40 to 70 yard bunker shot this guy is probably the best I’ve ever seen at it what’s your what’s the I would actually agree I’m pretty good I’m
Real good I’m not going to lie I’m going to be honest Prov in the puding though all can you walk us through your process super easy it’s the easiest process oh now you’re going Phil Michelson on us look how easy this is so I’m not that so
Here’s but here’s what I so when I have two two players come down or at least college kids and I’d ask you both of this so your highest lofted wedge out of out of normal sand when you make a full swing how far does it fly out of a
Normal bunker shot how far give me a number eight yards full swing oh like I’m I’m hitting a full shot like it’s a full bunker blast oh 30 yards exactly I have no idea that’s the problem 20 20ish okay so in a tournament mine flies 30 yards exactly full bunker
Shot yeah uh normal shot so I know that I have all my players calibrate that okay so that’s a knowledge thing so when I get to a greenside bunker and I pull out my laser and everyone’s like what’s this goofball doing it’s like I’m again I don’t care how I look right we’ve
We’ve been clear about that I don’t care at all I’ll laser the pin and it’s like oh 3 it’s like 31 pin oh this is full does your laser measure that short well so see most people don’t even know that yes it does so and then if I got 40
Yards it’s my next wedge it’s my 55 at 50 yards it’s my 50 degree at 60 yards it’s pitching wedge I had a shot this past summer it’s like 75 to the pin I just looked at I got my little Matrix and I said oh this is it was kind of
Sitting down so I didn’t want to hit like a shot I was like that’s just full nineiron blast it was 70 75 yards I hit it to 15 ft because I just I have a system that I just feel like again I’ve never seen it hurt anyone to know those
Numbers because then it can give you confidence in events when you need it and it it it I’m not trying to get closer to the ball podcast I’m not trying to do anything different it’s like I love a 45 yard bunker shot because it’s just a it’s a full it’s a
Full 55 we played together at Phoenix Country Club the driveable number six yeah you guys were up there I was he’s back in the bunker back there kind of kind of number five yeah it kind of WIP yeah kind of didn’t hit one didn’t make
It over at any back I see him it was like Rainman he got out this thing and doing all this stuff and then all of a sudden I walk up by the green he hits up to like five feet I was like okay yeah
And then he HED about a 35 y bunker shot perfect for birie D we were coming back Marty birdies yeah we came back we came back beat the amers take take down take down the I’ve never again I mean you think about how much you focus on the
Game and to think about never knowing how far I hit a full bunker shot is I’ve never I’m 39 never thought about it once so I’ve got I’ve kind of developed these protocols things I like every Tour player to have I get a I have a lot of
High level kind of D1 players that I I help out to um I have these certain metrics that I like you to know just because again like when I had that 75 yard bunker shot in Minnesota the ball was sitting down I had a solution to the
The question the course asked I didn’t have to practice it ever I just like okay this is the plan and then let’s let’s do it what is the checklist you ask the players that come your way to have answered yeah so when it comes down to it it’s like having certain shots and
Skills right we can simplify and there’s there’s much more to this but it’s like having a good ball first skill in short game having a good ground first short uh SK skill in short game out of the bunkers knowing certain numbers from 30 to 100 knowing certain numbers again
Even if you don’t use them so I like my players to be more planned than the guy or or girl that they’re going to play and then it’s just like a a cheat sheet when you’re when you’re on the golf course do you do any of that with
Putting as well any any any any of that framework go to putting so I haven’t yet but I feel like there is a need because if I teach someone and and this is what I found in teaching it’s my job to meet them where they’re at if they don’t want
To practice I’ve got to figure out a solution for them I don’t need them to practice per se if they don’t want to that’s on me so at that point if someone comes to me they say I plan my annual work event how do I hit a 50 foot putt I
Should have a solution to that so what we can do is we can start to use their feet spread them out and say hey if we have a certain metronome number and we do a certain stroke I think this is where you’re G to get close or we can
Have them kind of measure three three three stance widths because I’ve got to give them a solution again like I don’t need them to practice if they don’t want to but I better give him a good solution explaining hey if you’re not if you’re not going to practice you know
These maybe goals you have are not attainable but if you don’t want to practice I better be able to give you somewhat of an answer whether I want to or not you did that with my kids in putting I remember I just they just took their normal stance with my kids are
Their Putters going all over so just to the foot to the foot boom exactly they’re rolling the rock yeah they’re rolling the pure I mean what what a what a way to think about it where it’s really teaching per player you know I mean we’ve talked a lot about that
With different instructors where it feels like the old school way was here’s my system I’ll match you to my system yeah and now it’s a lot about I’m going to try to figure out the best case scenario for you and I mean I’ve thought about it in terms of swing and body type
And Mark Blackburn talks a lot about this I mean you know talk about matching who you are you know to what you’re capable of doing what your body’s capable doing but even even the commitment to time and and ability to practice and what your goals are at the
End of the day I I mean it’s so interesting to think about it from that perspective yeah again I think that’s where I’ve become a better instructor is because you know I’d be like well you got to find not not that I would ever say it but like well can’t you find time
To practice and again you guys have you know kids family and all that and then also what you’ve realized after teaching for so long is people who practice don’t necessarily get any better right they get vitamin D from the Sun they get sweaty they get frustrated and and the
The time spent doesn’t equate to better score so at that point I don’t want you to waste your time I’d rather you go play so if I have a I teach a lot of working people and I’m like I want to give you easy solutions and I need you
To go play and have fun I don’t want you to go beat balls at the range again where you’re maybe doing something that we’re not working on you just you’re maybe regressing or doing something poorly I want to give you good Solutions you go play you just have better answers
Derek what do you like more playing or teaching so what helps my teaching is I love playing the game way more and I love to teach so you like them both when I love them both wi win but playing so making my game in in season my game’s a priority
So someone’s like can you squeeze me and I’m like no I can’t uh I gotta practice or I gotta play so by doing that though it shows your students you know the commitment when needed also when you go and do Playing Lessons and hit shots you
Know when they I’ve never seen it be bad for a coach to be able to hit great shots not that you don’t they have to right you don’t have to be a great player to coach well but I’ve never seen a student not you know when you’re
Hitting some great shots and you know you’re kind of lighting up the the green and it’s looking pretty good for you I’ve never seen a student be like M bummer you know this guy doesn’t know what you’re talking about it just can can add value added it’s it’s only going
To be helpful can we talk about the new wedges because um I mean these the s159 are so A beautiful I think that’s what’s kind of blown me away the most but it it feels like and I don’t think you’re going out on a limb to say this they’re
The best wedges ping has ever made and for somebody that’s obsessed with spinning the golf ball and in and around the greens I’m sure when you saw those for the first time it was probably like a bit of like a Christmas birthday kind of combo yeah again ping is so great in every
Area wedges haven’t done as well as maybe you know ping would want I’m sure right it’s it’s you know well known to some extent there but now with the app with the Simplicity of the wed lineup with the look with the options with the bounce options and then having the again I’m in
The friction business so it’s like the spinni club I see you back there friction man it’s the spinni club in a high friction environment and then it’s just so much better in a low friction environment so for what I do it’s great but again playing all the Ping
Stuff right ping Woods how well do they do I mean you’re you guys are in non-staff guys playing ping night day right I think it’s I think it’s a a humbling thing would say very well would be exactly right so it’s going very well and then I feel like now like again ping
Has had but like their their wedge lineup and product is so good and again I before I played in in the Shriners I had you know another brand and it was like okay you probably don’t want to switch that before you go in you gave me
The wedges out of the bunkers they were incredible and then off the ground I’m like these are going straight in and it was just like from day one they did everything I wanted and more and then being in the friction business they make me look better than I probably am what
Is your what is your typical kind of um gapping how do you do your gapping on your your own wedges there so I’ve always liked UH 60 56 52 48 but now modernly it’s 60 55 50 and then 45 okay yeah yeah so always been a four wedge
Guy and just theyve P told me so Marty what’s your gapping right now 61 then a 56 at 55 50 at 50 A2 and then my and then my uh blueprint s uh pitching W okay so yeah you so you you’ve never have you gone four wedges before I mean
Obviously you’re using the wedge out of the set if you ever gone like the four wedges and why the why the switch back I guess is what I yeah so yeah the set wedge the the uh blueprint s pitching wedge and I went to four wedges when
When I went went from Arizona to Colorado because then my gapping just exploded and I was like you get up there in Colorado in uh you were driving it far and then you have a lot of 120 yard shots at a huge gap so I got the gaps
Kind of dialed in and I’ve kept that ever since I’ve really I’ve really enjoyed that it’s a a skill to be able to develop to be able to hit those tweener wedges that’s actually something I need to work on a little bit this year we heard from Preston who right here literally out
Talk I mean when’s our tea time yeah when we did our podcast with Preston and he did his like strengths and weakness analysis off of his previous year it was his number one thing he wanted to work on was his wedge gapping he’s he’s got
Not a bad spot to work on right there Ian this is a it’s a bit silly if if you if you can’t see behind us we’ll probably show it if you’re watching the YouTube uh clip of this but at the bird you can basically dial everything within
Five yards of every shot I think up to 125 or 130 so if you’re not a great wedge player while you’re at ASU it’s your fault that’s like Derrik saying I can try to make you better but you probably have to put a little time in
Derek what mistakes do you see um some of your students come in with in terms of their wedges or maybe their lob wedge first question and second question related to that is do you like to teach your players to use two wedges or do you
Want them to be like we heard tiger and anuka hey 60 degree learn how to use it from everywhere yep so for myself growing up I I’ve always used again every time I have a shot you’ve seen it unfortunately it’s like why is this guy bringing this whole bag up to the shot
Well I always bring my four wedges and I like my last wedge to be my w I don’t like playing like a 48 there because I want it to not spin so I want it to be somewhat of a set wedge in a sense that
It won’t check up when I want to hit it lower and and have it not spin based on that uh the question of what do you want a student to do short term if they don’t have time to to practice and they like one club I’m
Just going to have them wear that club out right we can work on some landing spot stuff we can do some stuff like that but then I say hey maybe longterm here’s where you know I feel like over time we can start to put the odds in our
Favor as we start to do less work if I’m going to carry the ball less have it you know be more predictable with spin I feel like I’m doing less than a lot of people again you see the Social Media stuff when I play I try to remove spin
To be a little bit more predictable when I need to so I feel like on stock short game shots I’m doing less than most people so I want that maybe for a long-term college player professional but it it’s whatever is working right so if someone comes to me and they say well
Gez I don’t really want to change this and I say well your stats say you’re last so you know we can kind of keep that in mind but I wouldn’t keep anything you’re doing right or maybe they’re doing something where the stats say hey the stats back this up so we’re
Going to look at that before we you know make too many uh decisions Marty that is it’s interesting you ask that question I feel like that’s something I struggle with a bit in my game is I’ll walk up to a shot and I will almost allow myself
Too many options yeah you know it’s like a like an easy Chip Shot and it’s like mightbe it’s 56 and it’s kind of low with like a little bit of spin or maybe I get to the 50 and do the same thing and I’ve been trying to lean a little
Bit more into just taking the one Club up to the green like if you’re riding a card or or you’re using your push card and you get it over to the side it’s like just take one so then you only have one option because I play Four wedges in
I mean it is easy to kind of get lost in the process as opposed to just going up there and going I know I can make this this shot work with this club as long as I completely believe in it I’m guilty of that I’m guilty of that getting over
That Chip Shot I’m about to hit it I got my four clubs there ah swap it out it doesn’t feel right swap it out it goes back to it’s always typically the first choices it’s almost the right one to go with yeah trust your instinct there a
Little bit yeah and I think for that right so when I bring up four my process would be I’m kind of trying to find that flattish spot two to three steps on the green or where ever is reasonable if there’s no slopes or anything we can
Negate that but I’ll kind of find a spot and then just doing it for so long it’s like okay then what what club fits that window and then it’s like okay there’s my club choice so I’m kind of it’s like I could land it here or there but I’m
Kind of I’ve kind of trained myself to kind of see the same kind of spot I want to land it and roll it out and then it’s pretty easy to to decide from there but I can understand like well I could do this I could do this I could do this so
At that point that’s where the benefits of you know one club to just be like hey this is what you got to do when you have uh college players or or young professionals come to you for advice around the greens what do you feel like is a shot that they consistently either
Struggle with or they’re trying to get answers for because when you play golf with really good players you know a lot of the standard shots they’re good at what’s one that maybe they all kind of ask you questions about yeah short game is weird because some players will reach
Out because they’re like hey I’m feeling kind of yippy okay right so at that point it’s like okay how how do we solve that a lot how do you solve that uh so it’s very it’s it’s very player based because I’ve got some videos of some some yippers that you just you couldn’t
Believe so it’s very player based but it’s essentially changing the way that they do things because usually and in my case I’ve never found it to be just mental it’s this it’s a poor technical way to do it that over time if I had to do it
That way too I’d be in Basket Case as well it’s you’re not having success how you picture success like you’re seeing bad shots I would be pretty negative too right I mean we haven’t seen any success so The Yips are a little bit um player
To player I I I get players a lot of players for spin right so that’s kind of a forte of mine but then I’ll get a lot of players who they’re like you know things are okay but my stats don’t back it up so I’ve developed some ways that I
Like to see people practice with hitting some certain Landing spots I’ve got some metrics for if you have a certain shot what what the The Landing Zone should be and that’s where you know Scott faucet’s come down to to do some work on that so it’s really you know even in in short
Game it can be like well you know I’m I’m hitting the shot but it just kind of feels this way right so it’s it’s not quite full swing coach in that regards but it can just be these almost weird requests at times where it’s like well
Why does this do this and and so it’s it’s very can be General and it can be very specific yeah Derek let’s talk a little bit about that marriage of teaching and fitting um we talked to Boyd summer Hayes on the Pod he was like if there’s ever any issue with
Performance I’m looking at the equipment first right because he said Tony and Preston they’re kind of they’re kind of proud they’re not complainers uh but quite often hey maybe it’s if you’re hitting your seven iron right maybe the lle off or something right what is that indication if you get a player down
There everything’s looking good mechanically but they might not be in the right grind what what what do you see in the results how do you diagnose that how do you marry up the the fitting the grind fitting with instruction so often times again if someone’s struggling or just kind of you
Know have some members at the club because I teach a lot of high level players then at our club we have members from five handicaps to new golfers right so when they come in and I might just see a club and I’m like man that club’s
Way older than me they just stick it in the ground because it’s like a knife I don’t even know if bounce was invented yet so I’m like man congrats like this is kind of what you should be doing I’ll let them try my club I’ll let them try
Some other things like oh man I didn’t know that once you explain the technology you know how to use maybe the bottom of the club if that’s something they struggle with and then from there giving them some different options asking what type of terrain sand shots they like to play so
That we can kind of further dive into and I think that’s where U you know some of the new stuff with the with the Ping fitting app is going to be special yeah yeah I mean the app is Sensational it just simp to to simplify all this stuff
Down to questions golfers can actually answer is such a unique thing Marty I mean I I I tout this all the time I mean the Innovation around pinging has just been so cool because it it’s so easy to not easy but it’s it’s it’s easy in theory to present new technology and say
This stuff’s the next best thing but to explain to a golfer why they need it or if they’re using it the right way I always go back to the adjustable drivers when they first came out it was an amazing technology but average golfers had no idea how to figure out even what
To do with the driver until it was simplified to a way where you could actually go okay if I click click it open here then this adds one degree or takes one degree off wedges I mean we’ve talked about it here we’ve talked to some other of the short game Geniuses
Around ping and I feel like the grinds and and all of the options around wedges make sense but it’s very hard for an everyday golfer to understand which one they even need for the golf course they play or the area they live in yeah I mean I think Shane in in wedges people
Get paralyzed by what all the different grinds of all the different manufacturers so the the big friction point or pain point we try to solve with that app is is not only the grind get you in the right grind or down to two you can then go demo try out and Chip uh
But also we see a big problem with the gapping and that’s why I asked Eric about gapping is how do you Gap your set because people we see it all the time they don’t have the right spacing in their wedges and it’s costing them a ton
Of shots so the app kind of solves both those things Dereck have you ever thought about going like 70 wedge or 75 degree wedge just see what you can do with it uh I would guess uh my dad you know he tends to get some of the infomercial clubs he might have that
Option right I’ve seen that you know the 80 degree wedge again at at the to hit you in the nose at the club you know I’ve seen every late night TV Golf Club you know when they come up and they’re struggling it’s like well you know they
Got this glub and this club okay would there be any compliance on an 80° wtch that’s my question for you you know what if anyone was going to make that ball comply it’s going to be me it’d be you But Eric Hendrickson would probably say otherwise well Derek uh fascinating to
Hear your story I mean one of my favorite followers on Instagram it’s a it’s a treat to actually meet you in in 3D human form it’s always nice when you get to do that with people but uh keep grinding because like I said it’s cool to have you as an ambassador it’s cool
To have you in and around the Ping team and it’s just fun to see what you’re able to do you know with the wedges because not a lot of humans on planet Earth can do what you do yeah and it’s it’s really a win-win I think it’s a
Bigger win for me than ping because I get utilize their resources it’s like going to a library and I’m you know I’m excited to go there it’s like oh G to bug Eric so Marty the librarian I think it’s a symbiotic relationship I’m kind of like hey Eric
What are you doing tomorrow he’s got all these things I’m like could you want to hear me talk about what I’m seeing can you draw some cool drawings for me yeah Marty’s card catalog is just his laptop of design features on the clubs uh yeah
It’s uh like I said it’s it’s awesome to have you a part of it and we thanks for your time absolutely thanks guys this is the Ping Proving Ground [Applause] podcast
2 Comments
Going to the range tomorrow! First time in months
D Man! Congrats sir!