Justin Lower joins the pod to talk about his inspirational rise to the PGA TOUR from losing his father and brother growing up to winning an NAIA Championship at Malone University to grinding on the Korn Ferry Tour to coming within a putt of the PGA TOUR to finally getting his PGA TOUR card and maintaining his status at the top level.
Welcome back into eyes on golf I’m Jeff eisenband and our guest today is Justin low and this is an outstanding I will call it an inspirational episode because Justin lower if you don’t know him he’s our first PGA Tour player on this podcast active PGA Tour player and he is
An inspirational figure So Many Factors could have stopped him from getting to the PGA Tour family tragedy not getting a scholarship to a division one school all the bumps along the road on the corner FY tour multiple times he was so close to getting to the PGA Tour and
Kind of felt like he had to take a step back because he missed a putt here and there didn’t play well at this point he’s going to get into all that of course we talk Cleveland sports as well and the current state of the PGA Tour
I’m excited to share this with you hope that you become a Justin low fan after listening uh other than that I do want to touch on before we get into this we taped Justin before the WM Phoenix Open we releasing this between the Genesis Invitational and the Mexico open at
Vidant I’ll be on the call for the Mexico open at Vidant on uh PGA Tour live on the Main feed but I just want to address Hideki matama winning the the Genesis Invitational incredible 62 Hideki does this sometimes you know it feels like felt like when he won the
Masters a few years ago he hadn’t been playing as well and then he comes out and just balls out blows everyone out um you know it’s it’s more sporadic than it was say five to seven years ago but he still got it in him maybe getting healthier from some of those back issues
And we gotta say uh has put together I brought it up on Twitter it’s a Hall of Fame resume at this point when you look at Hideki maybe not quite there but he is on the verge of the Hall of Fame nine PGA Tour wins he made a big deal about
That becoming uh the Asian player with the most PGA Tour wins that was something that meant something to him passing KJ Choy who had eight and then you add in the ma you think about the Masters two wgc’s Memorial now Genesis he’s done it at Big Boy golf courses
Probably has a few more wins in him I’m looking at a Zack Johnson it’s kind of a barrier a 12- win guy two major championships can Hideki surpass that certainly you would think so he’s turning just 32 I believe that shocked me Hideki Matsuyama turning just 30 two
Years of age uh this coming week February 25th he’ll be 32 so still still so much more golf in this guy I’m excited to watch it congrats to him on that Genesis Invitational win but right now we’ve got Justin low who’s playing this week in Mexico he’s the guest on
This podcast eyes on golf let him take it away Justin low third year on the PGA tour now Northeast Ohio Zone a two-time Ohio open Champion people need to know 2010 na IIA champion and five top 10 finishes on the PGA tour and coming at me with a Cleveland Guardians what is
That spring training warm-up right now uh I think so yeah it it might even be an Indians one but uh we’ll leave we’ll leave that yeah it is old school well you are like I said we’ll get into that you know Ohio born and born and bred
Still in Ohio making it work on the PGA tour in Ohio and this year making it work so far we’re coming at this this is the Saturday before the WM Phoenix Open uh three out of three in Cuts made so far this year you’re in your third year
On the PGA tour do you feel like a veteran at this point um no not really um um I mean I there’s some things that I just haven’t done yet uh that don’t make me feel like a veteran at all um uh but some of the some of the
Younger guys will call me a Wy vet but um I I think that’s just because I’m a little older but uh no I I feel old for sure but I don’t feel like a vet so you don’t feel like oh you’re showing people around AMX or Farmers you know where all
The all the the special the snacks are anything like that that’s not not not the case yet uh but we will get into that about how you you know you are in your third year at 34 years old and obviously you’ve had an amazing journey
Which you know part of the reason that I wanted to have this conversation is I’ve been watching your journey you know more as a fan and as a broadcaster than anything else and I know we’ll get into it but you definitely jumped on my radar um in
2019 just or 2018 just missing the putt obviously the corn fairy tour finals 2021 how emotional you were getting to the PGA Tour so I I do want to talk about all that today while we’re still talking about you won the PGA Tour this year third year age 34 uh what feels
Different now than two years ago when you were a rookie uh just the the comfort factor a little bit you know the golf courses you kind of know where to go you know where registrations at you know what to expect like at like this last stretch we had
You know what to expect with playing six courses in three weeks type of thing um like you know you’re going to have to get a a rental car from uh MX to Tor like type of things like that even though they did they did give us courtesy cars this year but you still
Have to you still have to exchange the American Express car for for a Tory car and then you have to I think everyone drives to that event from AMX at least um some people might fly to it but there are there might be some people Justin that there might be some people that
That have a way to uh to travel differently but but yeah I think it’s uh you know I imagine it’s some of those little things that you know I sensed it broadcasting a lot of your golf that um it felt like last year you definitely felt like someone who uh who was ready
To go um not that you weren’t your rookie season but obviously the emotion of the decade you know I think there’s a different taste probably in just getting to the Show versus okay now I’m here let’s keep it going and I do want to
Take us all the way back I want to go back to this kid in Northeast Ohio obviously uh you know Tom from what I’ve read you and Tom wisoff are the two most famous golfers from your County in Ohio Jack Nicholas making it to the PGA to
Are from the Columbus area you maybe used to see it a lot more uh in terms of your journey where did it start in Ohio uh yeah I I started playing uh when I was around eight um and like I had always like hit balls around the yard my
My my grandpa had a bigger yard growing up so I was able to hit golf balls around there and kind of chase them around and uh yeah my my dad took me to play one day and uh there was a junior tournament uh the very next day and
Uh uh he asked if I could if if he could sign me up and they said yeah absolutely so I signed up and played and uh I was so nervous I didn’t eat breakfast that that morning and I uh I started dry heaving on the golf course because I
Didn’t have really anything to come out I guess and uh I think I shot 61 per nine holes and finished second so it was uh no it was uh I don’t know if it’s the fact I got a trophy or what but um just kind of got hooked on it from there and
Yeah just kind of progressed every stage from there I think at you know at eight years old we heard Tiger Woods had probably shot 59 like 15 times or or or not necessarily 59 in his case but yeah you know we hear about so many prodigies for you uh obviously you know starting
At a different at a eight being almost late for a lot of professional golfers and then on top of that being in a place that and I’m from the Northeast uh you know so I always admire cold weather golfers for getting it done when did the dream of playing in college playing
Professionally when did that develop for you uh so I had always wanted to play in college like I was addicted to um the Golf Channel and like learning how guys came up and whatnot and um like just learning about the whole process and um like I I obviously wanted to go
To the top golf schools just Stanford Arizona state Florida all the Georgia all all these amazing schools that just um just turn out PJ tour players left and right and um I thought it would be so easy and it was just the complete opposite of that and um and I don’t know
If that’s just TV or what but they just kind of make it look easy and then uh you kind of get into that process and you’re like oh wow this is uh like I’m not even close really um and then uh like I I I was O I was an okay
Junior golfer I excelled on the local level uh played some Regional stuff played some national stuff but never um never really had big successes um and then uh High School golf I got I got a little better I won I won States my senior year uh qualified qualified
Individually a couple times um and uh like I always knew I wanted to play in college and then um ended up at Malone University and uh I I I thought I at at the time I thought um it might be kind of like a step down and maybe like
Possible transfer at some point but I just um I fell in love with uh the program the coach and the guys around me and um it was it was pretty awesome so I do want to talk you know about when you were in high school and shout out to uh
Also no laying up I should have brought up that they uh you were a young hitter back in the day so uh that was also how I think a lot of fans kind of gravitated toward you but obviously when you were 15 years old um a tough time in your
Life uh what happened and how did that shape you uh yeah so um I was at the golf course it was March 26 2005 um and uh my dad and brother were uh unfortunately killed in a car accident uh they were on their way to pick me up from the golf course
Um and yeah I mean it uh I mean you see it on you see it on the news you see it on TV shows you see it in movies and you never think it’ll happen to you and it and it and it did and it it’s something that I think
About think about every day um it’s just kind of just kind of part of my life I guess and something that happened to me um and and it it it may I may think about it for like a minute a day I may think
About it for like an hour a day I may think of it for half the day it it changes just all the time but um no it it changed my whole life just uh the way I think about things the way I act just kind of everything I’m I’m probably a
Little more tentative uh because of it um and ju I don’t know it just it just kind of shaped me uh as into who I am now and um yeah a day I’ll never never forget uh maybe maybe in a bad way but um no just
Uh yeah just kind of wild for sure uh how it actually happened and when it happened and everything and yeah so that was your dad Tim your brother Chris was 10 years old you were 15 how were they at that point in your life instrumental
To you as a golfer uh so my dad was huge um he’s the one who took me to all the tournaments um both my parents were working parents growing up so uh my dad had more freedom uh calling off work and whatnot so uh yeah he was the one who
Would take me to tournaments and travel with me and and whatnot and my mom was always kind of with my brother and uh Chris was he was just getting in the golf um I remember I so I I had a deal with the local course um that I grew up at in
Canal Folton uh Lions Den Golf Course um that uh we would work for free play and work was basically picking the range or cleaning up carts in evening um so it was I thought it was amazing at the time looking back on it may have
Been uh maybe been abuse of power in a sense but no it’s uh uh yeah Chris had started to come out a little bit and was he was just getting into the game but he was he was more of a a video gamer slash uh this is weird to say as a 10-year-old
But uh us historian uh kind of a war buff uh he would set up the the epic like battles with these little toy soldiers I’m talking hundreds of them in his room and I would go in there and uh if I would touch one of them I would get
Just absolutely scolded so uh I I I quickly learned not to uh touch anything when he was uh doing anything but uh no he was just getting into it so it it yeah it it’d be really cool to see like where he’d be uh today I mean he’d be 29
Uh like you never know what he’d be doing uh whe he could be cading for me he could be traveling he could be living somewhere and I wouldn’t hear from him for like a month and then he’d call me all the women we talk for five hours uh
Type of thing so you never you actually never know with him but uh no I I I miss them both dearly and i’ I’d basically give anything back to have a day with them so well as someone who uh had a placem with all the presidents on it and
Could memorize all the Presidents by third grade I think that Chris and I I would have wanted to hang out with Chris and talk history with him for sure yeah and you’ve mentioned that about him you know obviously he was only 10 but you’ve said that that he would be caddying out
There uh for you so on top of all of that uh the the ball marker that I believe you still Ed to this day and have used since you were 15 and you’re 34 now is what uh see yeah so I I I used to use it
I still keep one in my bag um I don’t use it anymore uh just because it was honestly kind of a distraction I get too many questions about it um but it’s just it all it is it was just a white uh one of those white plastic ball markers that
You see at country clubs mostly or golf courses and I would what I would do is I would scrape the logo off on on concrete or whatnot on the sidewalk and uh then I would just write 32605 dad and Chris on it um I started doing it in college and
Um did it up until maybe uh right around covid time I guess uh right around 2020 um and yeah it just kind of became too much of a distraction new guys I would play with they would see it and kind of ask too many questions about it and it was just
Something I didn’t really want to answer on the golf course so and it it just kind of gets kind of awkward if I I’ll just tell you after the round type of thing because then you get them thinking about oh what’s he going to tell me and
Yeah so um no but I I I definitely keep one with me as opposed with or as I I keep a couple other things in the bag as well so so a at this time back to Malone University going to Malone from 15 to 18 uh now that is prime golf recruiting
It’s you and your mom Debbie um in the house and you’re trying to figure out your life and Malone comes calling in NAIA school down the road in Canton and why do you choose them over a potential D1 uh golf program yeah so when the when the accident happened um the last thing
I wanted to do was schoolwork um if I’m being dead honest uh I I did the absolute bare minimum just to pass and be eligible um and I would have meetings with teachers and meetings with uh principal and counselors and whatnot they’re like Justin what’s wrong like
Your grades are slipping um not that they were great by any means but they they slipped um and um yeah I was just like look I I I don’t want to be here I show up just to be eligible for golf I the only thing I want to do is Golf and
Uh I I kind of knew in college that I would get kind of a fresh start um kind of academic wise and whatnot and um and the the the division one coaches the the few and far between that were actually looking at me um I think uh most of them
Were kind of frightened by the grades and the lack of um uh discipline that I showed in the classroom so I think that just kind of scared him away and uh I still have an email to this day uh from uh who a guy who was the coach at the University of
Backr in this time that he sent to my mom uh I don’t know if he thought that she wouldn’t show it to me or not but um he said that he thought I would fail fail out of college by the end of the first semester and not be eligible to
Play anymore and uh that was I mean I told him I was like look if I can if if you give me a chance like you will not have to worry about it and um I I I really wanted to go to university of akan and it fell through and it was it
Was February or March of my senior year like I was getting ready to graduate in two or three months and I still had not signed with anyone uh and uh Ken Highland at Malone University who I had met in eth grade and uh was just kind of always around he
Uh he called me one day and uh he asked me what my plan was and I was like I don’t really have one right now I’m trying to find a place to play and he’s like well the door is open if you would like to come here and I called him maybe
Two or three days later and I said yeah absolutely I’m in so uh yeah that was kind of it so did your mom show you that letter before college or years later uh she showed it to me like a week after he sent it so yeah it
Was uh I that was in the fall of my senior year during uh High School golf season and uh because I I I had taken a visit there and I thought it went really well and the the email said said otherwise so maybe I just can’t read a
Room but I’d imagine the Zips are still killing them are still kicking themselves right now because you never know you go to Malone you win an niia championship and uh I probably uh say it too much but whenever I have you on featured holes or featured groups um I
Just think it’s an incredible nugget that we’re talking about guys who were you know World Junior Champions IMG World Junior Champions when they were six or different you know us Junior am Champions look at a Nick Dunlap right now carving through the US amateur scene and uh I don’t know what the Nia
Competition level was like I don’t know what the 2010 National Championships were like who was on your heels or anything like that so what was what was that like well you were a are on the niia scene obviously there’s not there’s not recruiting and there’s not professional teams in golf looking at
You from the professional level but how did your dream develop while you were there uh yeah it it was kind of like kind of like high school off I got off to a slow start like I I qualified for the team and whatnot and was in in the
Top five and traveled to every event but I wasn’t um I wasn’t having the success I thought I would have um uh like I I I was playing okay um and like my score was counting and everything and uh excuse me I like I I didn’t get a win until uh the spring
Semester of my freshman year which was our uh home Invitational and I had started playing better at that point and I I really started working on my mental game uh I bought one of uh Dr Bob Rotella’s books and I I started just reading it I think I read it probably
Four times that semester alone just uh just going through it and just kind of instilling all these things on the golf course and it it started to help a lot and um like my freshman year I finished uh I I soon as I won I finished second
In our conference that year um uh finished eth at Nationals um and was honest I was playing really well at Nationals I was probably in uh third or fourth with nine holes to go and I think I shot 41 or 42 on the last nine and uh I I just started
Playing terribly I don’t know if it was uh nerves that I was actually playing too well or um not being in that uh process but I remember my coach he uses the example all the time just the the last nine of my freshman year compared
To the last nine of my junior year when I won uh I mean it was a night and day difference um and then like fast forward to when I won my junior year I I won by six uh I got off to a really good start um I
The third round I had the low I tied for the low round of the day and I was the low round in our wave we were in the afternoon wave our team was doing really well uh too uh but I had a low round in
The wave by four or five shots uh some weather moved in wind and rain and I shot I shot even par and just kind of p uh padded my lead I guess but uh um the the thing that still irks me though we were we played well and I had chipped in
On 18 for birdie uh to tie us for the lead and it got us into the final group as a team and I was just so punked for that because the one thing I wanted was a team national championship and we went nuts on on the last hole because we
Were the last group of the day and it was it was almost dark and uh yeah we went crazy and uh and we ended up we played okay the last day we ended up losing by six um and finished third uh but the the the cool thing about um I guess my college
Experience and my college teams uh all of all of the guys that I went to college with uh all the guys that I played with we were all from Ohio my freshman sophomore year and then uh to make it even smaller uh my junior year
Four of us in the top five were from the same county and the other guy that wasn’t in the same county was in my my conference that I played with in high school and then my senior year all five of us that started uh were from the same
County uh which made it pretty special uh we all growing we all grew up playing against each other in junior golf and high school golf which made it just that much more special so we should mention this was at TPC Deer Run so you were scouting you were scouting the John
Deere classic uh early Oklahoma city was the champion and it looks like Oklahoma Christian perhaps was the runner up so you guys just those pesky Oklahoma schools yeah they were the power for sure yeah the Bob Rotella book I want to know what what is one thing that you
Still go back to that you still remember maybe that uh you know you said I’m sure you were doing your schoolwork but you said you read the book four times uh maybe you did a book report on it or something like that what do you remember
Reading there uh one of them was like the visualization of it um like kind of visualizing uh your Target and whatnot and uh and it was kind of like when you’re over the ball and you look at your target you kind of imprint it in your mind and then you feel it uh
When you’re over the ball uh for me it was on I always felt like I don’t know if you can see the the the camera right now but uh I always felt like the picture was right here in my mind uh so that’s what I would picture I would
Picture the Target and I could see the hole and everything um kind of in my mind when I would play and that that visualization helped me uh a lot just uh with where I wanted to hit it where uh where I wanted to miss it and kind of
Stay away from and whatnot so that was that was the big thing that I picked up on for sure so you finish you graduate Malone University I believe 2011 yes and then there’s you’re gonna spend and I don’t know if you thought this at the time but you’re going to
Spend the next decade on the corn fairy tour or below the corn fairy tour if someone would have told you that in 2011 one would you have believed it two would you have expected that you would stick with golf through that 10year period uh I probably wouldn’t have believed it and
Um I probably would have stuck with it or thought that I would have stuck with it I’m I feel like I’m pretty resilient um so uh but yeah I I just it was something I really wanted and yeah when I when I graduated and turned Pro uh the first
Tournament I played was it’s called the Toledo open it’s run by the the Northern Ohio PGA and uh I thought it was the coolest thing I was like wow I’m actually playing for money and um I finished third um I I played really well other than uh doubling my last hole to
Go from first to third uh so uh but yeah it was it was really cool and then I I I played a lot of stuff that winter and learned uh that I was not that good and that I had to improve quite a bit um and then yeah played many tours uh
20 kind of 2012 2013 uh then 14 kind of got a taste of the Corn fairy tour and then back to mini tours 15 16 and then kind of corn fairy from 17 on forward so I guess quick tangent my Toledo story is that uh I so I went to Northwestern
And my senior year was 2014 to 2015 so I drove out with one friend and I told him I said uh we’re stopping at either the Pro Football Hall of Fame or the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame you pick and I’m doing the other one on the way back so
He said Rock and Roll Hall of Fame so we stopped in Pittsburgh went to a pirates game went to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame in Cleveland drove to Chicago on the way back I drove back with two different friends I said you guys don’t
Have a choice I booked Canton as our Leo as our stop tonight we’re going going to the Pro Football Hall of Fame and we want we needed to stop for dinner we were driving on Father’s Day 2015 and I looked on the map I said we’re near
Toledo so we’re pulling over we drove past the muden stadium okay and uh then we just found a place to eat and I watched the last three holes of the Chambers Bay Us open at you know some tavern while uh DJ missed the Putt and
Spe finished it off and I was like we’re we’re stopping at this time specifically to watch the end of this so that’s the only that’s the only that I spent in Toledo sounds like you you had a more lucrative uh few days in Toledo than I did yeah maybe just that one
Weekend that so those years on the corn fairy tour how do you stay patient as you are traveling around the country in you know not the private jets that we talked about uh not that you’re doing that now but not the same Arrangements back then how do you stay patient in
Everything that you’re doing uh yeah it was just kind kind of I don’t think I really had a choice um to be honest I was um like 2014 I was it was all so new to me um like I finished 73rd at Q School uh that December of 13
Before that season and and I I remember when the commitment lists came out uh for uh like on on links which is our website that we find out whether we’re in tournaments or not and uh I was in every every single one and I I was like
This is awesome and my agent texted me he’s like yeah I wouldn’t get too excited that’ll probably all change and then it like like in a week I was like 30th 40th alternate for every single one I was like wow I’m not even close um and
Like uh the thing with the season uh with the corn fairy tour the first uh oh it’s like the first four to six events are all International so it’s hard to qualify or get in them so I’m just looking at all these and I’m like God
I’m not in any of these on I’m just not even on the money list I’m just getting buried out here and I remember doing Monday qualifiers and like just not even coming close and I’m like how do guys Monday in like there’s got to be some
Formula and uh I I finally mondayed into one uh valdasta in 2014 on uh this golf course called kinderu Forest which is uh I think they still use it for hu School uh it’s like 7,800 yards long it it is brutal from all the way back and uh but
Yeah I I I’d started playing well and uh yeah I mondayed in I think I finished 33rd or 35th um and there was a reshuffle the very next day uh uh because it was the eighth event of the season and uh the next event was the
BMW proam which is a bigger field it’s 156 and got in that and I finished ninth somehow and then uh that ninth got me into Raleigh uh via top 25 got into Raleigh and I made the cut and uh a couple weeks before that I found out I
Was I got into the memorial and uh so I I remember I finished Raleigh I finished like 42nd and then I drove from Raleigh to to mirfield that night I got in like 1100 p.m. and uh I was up at 7 7 I was at the
Golf course at like 7:30 a.m. the next day CU I was so excited to go play a practice round and um and yeah it was uh just kind of a whirlwind but yeah that year turned out I only made five cuts out of 13 events on the corn fairy tour and uh got
Another PJ tour start that fall I mondayed into uh into the RSM which was back then called the Madry I think um yep and uh I missed the cut by one there and that was I I always thought like making the cut in the PJ J Tour event
Like that would be like my next thing and I like I wanted to make the cut so bad and I remember having a 20f footer on the last hole and my cad was like hey we need this I was like yeah yeah I know we do and um yeah unfortunately I missed
It and wouldn’t I wouldn’t make a cut on the PJ tour till 2017 at that point but um yeah I had my trials and tribulations with Q school and um I yeah I stayed really patient and yeah somehow yeah here we are you mentioned valdasta shout out to
Sep straa Vienna to valasta you know one of the The Road Not The Road Not Taken um but to Q school so let’s go because I think a lot of people know about 2018 but before we get to that 2017 you’re just trying to have a corn
Fury tour card yeah and there you know this becomes a theme of Justin lower The Bu The Bubble Boy what happened in 2017 yeah so I made it uh I didn’t Breeze through first stage I played really well at second stage and then made it to finals uh it was out in
Arizona it’s a new venue um Arizona in the fall or or sorry in the winter as everyone knows it’s usually pretty warm uh there’s very little wind so guys are expecting low scores uh the first day it’s like blowing 30 and it’s like 55 degrees it’s
Freezing um I I drew the harder golf course that day of the two and I shoot three over and I’m like this again like this is my third time making it the finals like I remember just sitting in the pl I was staying with another player
And a and a friend of ours that was a caddy and uh and I just remember I’m just sitting there and I was just so distraught after the round like I was like my friend has a video of me I was like eating a bag of chips I was like
This sucks like this my third time making it in the finals I shoot three over I lay an egg like 62 was leading someone shot 62 that day I don’t know how and I was like that like I’m gonna have to shoot like 20 under the next three days just to
Have a chance and uh my swing coach was cading for me and he was like hey you you still hit it good and we’ve been on the range for like four or five days now and you’re striping it you just gotta he’s like if you remain patient we will
Get through this and I was like okay I’ll I’ll I’ll bite here we go and then I so I get the at the second round I get the easier Golf Course um and the wind has died down it’s very calm it’s warm and I shoot I think I shoot even on the
First nine and I’m like oh my God I’m just getting passed up I’m like near last place and then I shoot six under the last nine like I finally catch some fire so I get back to underpar and whatnot and then um so I’m three under and then I I have
The harder course and I shoot three under the next day uh so I’m six under so I’m like okay I’m starting to play better um but I I obviously I I need a good one the last day uh because scores are really low um like the last Sun JM
Was playing he was like 24 25 under already um in the last group I mean a lot of guys just Cruise uh because really all you need is I I think it’s top 10 get or it was top 10 gets you the first 12 starts and top 45 gets you the
First uh eight starts so I’m I’m just trying to get to that top 45 number somehow and I shoot 64 the last round and I I think I finished it was like five under my last five or something like that with an eagle in there and I
Birdied my last I I made like a 15 footer around my last hole I remember I hit I can remember like that hole perfectly I hit a perfect like 10 yard cut off the te uh like a shot that I had been working on for years because I used
To play a hard draw and then I finally was able to develop this cut shot off the te and um I had I think I had 125 which is like uh like a perfect full gap wedge for me at the time and I hit it just perfectly right where we were looking 10
Feet right of the pin and um it kind of spun back right a little more than I wanted to and I I I remember catching a glimpse at the leaderboard and I was t39 and then it like changed to t40 real quick and I was like okay you probably
Need to make this because that t40 is not going to last uh and I made uh to get to 14 under which was I think at the time like t32 and I ended up like t41 or t42 so it got close there a little bit but yeah finally had guaranteed starts and
Uh yeah and then it was just finally cool to go to those first couple events and uh even though they were all International and we’re all going to the Bahamas where firest happened which none of us knew at the time uh and then that documentary comes out like a couple
Months after we’re there and we’re like oh my God we’re literally where where all this went down and uh uh so yeah then yeah you can wait the event the Bahamas event was happening during firest no so funny enough I think it was firefest firefest happened in 18 and it
Happened in Exuma yeah so it would have happened um so everyone talks about 2017 the the event in Exuma with the crazy WI and I think one guy finished under par um and uh uh I think that was Kyle Thompson I think he finished two under and one by
Four or something like that and um but yeah firefest had happened maybe three months after that event and they so in auma they have this thing called the rata and all these sail sailboats come in for this week and that guy who ran firefest decided to have it that weekend
Um and he was like why can’t I get any workers for this event and they’re likew this is our biggest event of the year like we’re not going to help you out at all and then firest happened and like all the tents and stuff and if you if
You watch the documentary and then you look at uh an overview like a Google Earth overview of um that course in Exuma it literally happened right next to the golf course and it’s it’s just wild to think of all those people kind of stranded there and the wind and the rain and
Those box lunches that they were giving them with like one slab of turkey on there and um yeah it was I I couldn’t believe it and the how I found out my wife texted me um in 2019 uh she was like you should probably watch this documentary I
Think it happened close to where you’re at and we were in we were in Abaco at the time and I’m like guys I think we should watch this we had an Airbnb and we watched it and we were all shocked that this would this happened that just
Happened right there so it was crazy Kyle Thompson two under in 2017 Nicholas Thompson Andrew Yan were second at even par so yeah he was the only guy won by two yeah um and Sun JM won it 13 under the next year and Marty doe Went to went
18 under in 2019 so the scores did get get lower after that yeah we definitely had calmer conditions than they did so so that was 2017 you make the putt to for School 2018 a little bit different Stakes corn fairy tour finals you come down to the wire at the corn fairy TOUR
Championship and you know you have an eight-footer to get your PGA Tour card yeah um so I had birdied 17 uh I because I saw a leaderboard I was projected 26 um walking the 17t so I I birdie 17 and I figure that would certainly
Help I don’t know if that’ll do it but it certainly helps it’s got to put me close um and it’s another tournament where scores are low so a lot of birdies are happening uh 18 is a par five I get the t-ball in the Fairway and I’ve got like
Two it’s like 232 or something like that I had like two maybe like 221 cover front edge maybe 224 cover over a bunker and I hit it it’s a little right of where I’m looking and it hits that backs side of the bunker that I was talking about and
It just shoots all the way to the back of the green against the grand stand and I get a uh I get relief from the grand stand I get a drop and uh so I have this kind of like ticklish downhill chip pitch shot and I hit it I hit it pretty
Decent because if if it was one that if I hit too hard it was one that honestly I could have hit in the water which was right behind where the pin was um and I hit it pretty good hit it to eight feet and I had a eight-footer that broke
About half a cup uh outside the hole and um I hit a good putt to this day maybe under red just a hair and uh it caught the low lip and just kind of went maybe six or seven inches past and um I could kind of tell by the crowd crowd’s
Reaction the maybe 12 or 13 people were there then um that I could I could tell that that putt meant something and then watching the broadcast uh I was 26th going into the week and projected at 26th after that Putt and stayed there and it it came down to like I want to
Say like $358 was the difference or something like that in prize money um which I mean comes down to less than a shot and like those those previous um uh finals events like the one in Columbus uh in Ohio State I missed the cut by one um uh the
One in Cleveland a couple weeks later uh I finished 34th and I remember I I left like a 30-footer on the last hole like on the lip um and then I finished ninth in Boise the week before uh the Tour Championship so like it’s just all these like different scenarios um just one
Shot would have saved me and got me onto the tour but uh in all honesty I I probably wasn’t ready for the PJ tour at that point uh I might have played well at the beginning there just because I was playing well but um I I don’t think I was
Ready um skill-wise uh for the PJ tour at that time so maybe a blessing in this but I’m seeing you missed by $490 so you know maybe it it was maybe that makes you feel better it was a little you know a couple 100 more but but I think it’s
Interesting too that you say you weren’t ready because obviously you couldn’t know this at the time uh but you wouldn’t get your card in 2019 you would keep your corn fairy tour card wouldn’t get your PJ tour card and then of course covid happens you have the twoyear essentially corn fairy tour
Stretch no one gets the promotion in 2020 so now you have to wait from that moment you have to wait three years and then 2021 it feels like we’re right back in the same situation and again you’re coming down the wire trying to get your
Card yeah um yeah so I finished 30th in the the kind of Mega season there um I had it as high as 19th at one point I think um and uh but I was always kind of like from 20th to 30th uh excuse me but I
Yeah I miss the cut in Omaha which was the last regular season event it’s where they do the card ceremony and everything and I was pretty I wasn’t too happy then and uh but my wife has always been super positive throughout all this she’s like hey you still have a chance like corn
Fairy finals you’ve played well in all of them you know all the courses and uh yeah I went to Boise and played uh played okay finished I think I finished like 40th or something um then Columbus or maybe maybe 30th I don’t know it played kind of harder that that
That week it was a little more firm than previous years and then uh Columbus I finished like 50th so I I think I was 40th on the finals points list going into the week um so I knew I needed a good week but uh I knew just like I knew
That scores would be low on that golf course just because it’s soft it’s it’s it’s the weirdest thing that Golf Course plays firm and the scores will be around like 800 par winning and stuff like that but if it plays soft we can just tear it up for some
Reason um and yeah I get off to a decent start and uh first two rounds and have a good third round put myself I think I was in the top 10 at that point but uh one thing I did that week that I’ve I’ve really never done uh was I I so I
Deleted the PJ tour app from my phone um and then I didn’t look at a leaderboard at all and uh and in my interviews that week um I I I was at I asked them I was like I will do the interview on one condition that you don’t tell me what
Place I’m in or what I’m projected the Finish um and yeah all those interviews I I give hats off to him I think Kevin price gave me an interview he didn’t say anything uh Kira Dixon gave me two interviews that week she didn’t say anything and then obviously the the
Memorable one with Kira after I uh somehow shot three under my last nine holes to get that last spot and get up and down on a last hole uh that interview with Kira at the end there that was it was just kind of just all those years where I finally got one
Where I finally got the card and I finally did it it was um yeah it was just kind of like a a huge weight off my shoulders really I don’t really know how else to explain it but yeah two things there one Kevin prize you uh you mentioned him I think
He never actually sent you you asked for the 2018 put that you missed for him to send it to you and he never sent it to you if I’m not mistaken he did send it to me oh he did yeah he did no he sent
It to me and I thought I would use it as motivation and um turns out that is not a good thing to look at over over so um no uh that was part of another of my journey like I had to really uh improve mentally and uh focus more on the
Positive aspects of everything and um uh the mental coach I was talking to was like she was like you need to get rid of that video put it away hide it do something and you need to focus on more positive videos um and yeah I uh started
Watching One so Kevin was actually back to the Q School in 2017 he actually recorded my final hole um so I have that putt that I made to finally get guaranteed starts um so that was the one I started watching and I started telling myself like hey you would not be in any
Position that you are in now without that putt right there so that was um that that kind of helped Propel me and uh but yeah Kevin and I we talked about that video we talked about uh uh the video of me missing uh in 2018 we I mean
Kevin and I uh we’ve become good friends and uh in him being a Bills fan of me being a brown fan we can we can certainly uh share our demise at times and and uh lately our successes uh on in the NFL but uh I was going to say Kevin long time
Cornr tour media Guru but now got the got the call for the PGA Tour this year so now he’s following you guys around yeah no it’s been fun to see him him and my wife get along really well and it’s it’s been fun to see him so and then you
Mentioned the the interview with Kira in 2021 obviously emotional for good reason you finally that 10year Journey going back to graduating Malone culminates um with you getting your PGA Tour card the number 25 in the corn fairy tour finals the last player to get your card via
Corn fairy tour regular season and corn fairy tour finals that year and of course you being you the humility you take the time in the interview to shout out Taylor Montgomery who you bumped out who had come so close I believe he was also close in the regular season as well
I want to say it was 2626 and on top of that he played in the US Open that year at Tory ponds before they changed the rule before they changed the rule so he chose to do that so didn’t earn points and you in that moment have to wherewithal to shout him
Out what was going through your head then um I don’t know honestly I I just figured like I mean to have that kind of double whammy pulled on him like that like i’ had been in that position um so I I just knew like how he
Felt and whatnot and um yeah I just just wanted to let him know that I was thinking about him and I I I knew how he felt and I knew how good of a player he was and obviously he shown uh with the success he’s had the last two years um
And even three years with that uh in the 2022 corn fairy season that he had uh but then last year he played so well and then this year he’s gotten off to a good start as well so um uh no Taylor’s a great guy and I just wanted to let him
Know that I was thinking about him in that that situation so and of course he came back and got his card via the corn fairy tour The Following season and got off to one of the hottest PGA Tour rookie starts we’ve probably ever seen him and Eric Cole flying around last or
I should say Eric Cole got off to a slow start last year I think they they kind of Switched they they swapped powers in about February if you could if you could merge their Seasons together it would have been would been spectacular a very a very historic season without a win but
Uh yeah so I’ll tell you we’ve spoken I mean I didn’t expect us to go about 45 minutes talk about your prep PGA Tour career but I think it’s so compelling and I’m glad that we have have done it not to gloss over it obviously you have
Your PGA Tour rookie year in 2022 in 2021 to 2022 I have the pleasure of calling your whole and one the AT&T Byron Nelson and you of course right back where you you you always end up right at the end at Windom you’re trying to get into the top 125 you just miss
You get emotional again turns out you know now the put wouldn’t have mattered um yeah so it’s okay uh and then you you end up you you go back to Corn fairy tour finals you take care of business anyway you get your card anyway via 125
Because I don’t know if you heard but certain people left the PJ to were around then uh all of this emotion going on I mentioned off the top I felt like that second year on your PJ tour last year just felt like you had a sense of
Belonging more when you got that card again how did it feel different oh it was just uh I mean not obviously with like Windam and everything like and just like the grind that your rookie year is like you’re not getting into every event you’re you still have to do
Monday qualifiers from time to time and then you try to get some momentum built and I I had some built and I was playing decent golf at the time and uh yeah just with it was like the one thing I will say I I’d never pictured my first three
Years on tours being so volatile I guess with like um like the guys leaving the the the lawsuits and the the who’s staying who’s going the what’s happening the the just everything this is the PGA Tour yeah I mean it’s been a crazy three
Years I mean and I was I was on the pack my rookie year too so I had a front row seat to to everything that was going on and um yeah it was just kind of wild and uh but yeah as soon as I got my card back
And I I I had a full season um uh and I knew like I knew the golf courses I knew what events I was going to play and I could kind of make my schedule a little more and then I started playing events that I hadn’t
Played before which was cool a lot of the bigger events and um but no it just felt again with the comfort factor and everything and um yeah it was just uh kind just a weight lifted off your shoulders and you know you know what to
Expect more I after like it’s a golf is a much easier much easier game if you know what to expect so of course pre Signature Events too before the not cut sort of events being 125 versus like I said when you were essentially 50th in that corn fairy tour uh upgrade you’re
Going basically when you add in major Medicals and past champions I mean you’re going from 115 from 190 to about 115 in the pecking order so that’s uh 125 190 to 125 that was a big deal uh I do want to I know you haven’t talked about it that much and I feel
Like it’s not necessarily what you love to talk about but you did bring it up just the uh the difference of you know you coming in this long journey to make the PGA Tour grinding on the corn fairy tour to finally be making PGA Tour checks and living this life and seeing
The landscape of the way that the superstars are acting and the way that everything’s going down what what have your reactions been the last couple CP years and you know from your Viewpoint right in the thick of it what have you seen I mean I I learned a lot my rookie
Year just how the tour runs is a business and um in the end with kind of all professional sports it is a business there is a bottom line that um the tour as a as a Running Company has to meet and uh there’s just so much that goes
Into it that people don’t see and uh like you read on you read on social media all these armchair quarterbacks that think they have all the answers and think that they know everything I I I wish they could sit on sit in on a pack meeting and uh know what know what goes
On and know what we talk about or sit in a player meeting with Jay and know what ha what’s happening and stuff like that because it’s it’s crazy uh with all this and um has it been good for the game maybe it’s given uh uh Med it’s given the media more
Stuff to write about more uh stuff talk about which is always good I mean I I don’t think there’s any such thing as bad press I do think that is a true statement um but a lot of this comes a lot of with this comes a lot of
Controversy I mean um live is run by a I I don’t know if it’s a questionable uh regime like where all the money comes from I I don’t I haven’t uh I haven’t Dien too far into it to learn enough um I I feel like I know a
Little bit about it um I think everyone has a price I I I certainly know I have a price if I was ever offered I would probably uh consider it and then with all the rumors about those guys maybe being able to come back if if an agreement is
Actually uh at one point comes together um you you kind of never know uh what will happen to the guys that have either just been suspended or resigned their membership um it is it is wild that we don’t have um a set of rankings that includes some
Of the best players in the world um I do think some of those guys that have uh left uh I do think some of their careers are maybe tarnished um I’m sure their competitiveness has gone down maybe a little bit um simply from a comfort factor um but obviously you see with
Guys like Brooks EPA and Taylor G um they’re still playing tremendous golf Brooks won a major last year but um one of the things will be interesting this year uh with Liv being in its third year uh some guys aren’t eligible for the majors anymore so they have to they have
To play maybe a little more golf you see like wae Neiman um playing a little more DP World Tour to try and get eligible for the majors and whatnot and uh yeah it’s going to be really interesting uh this next I thought we would find out a
Lot uh come December 31st um it was no shock to me that they pushed the agreement even further um and then this whole thing with strategic Sports Group that was just announced um we still have a lot to learn from that um yeah I honestly I’m just trying to show up
Every week and play golf and if if we become one big tour it’d be great um I just want to keep playing on the PJ tour as long as I can um until I am ready to call it quits maybe um or or until they can’t tell or until they tell me I
Can’t play anymore so um but uh yeah who knows I just wanna yeah I just want to keep playing as long as I can so where where were were Jimmy Haslam Dan Gilbert and the Dolan family right jumping in for didn’t jump in with SSG uh yeah well
I mean um if I’m being honest maybe the Dolan are a little too cheap for that price um we’re talking about the the Guardians Dolan fan we can talk their cousins with the Nicks and Rangers other time I do want you being on the inside and seeing this you talk about at
Some point we are going to see probably more deals we’ll see how SSG deals with things uh you mentioned being on the pack your first year you’ve now seen the tour you’re in your third year um I know that when it comes to fans especially you think about Memorial and some you
Know some of the hyper local the hyper local aspect of you being an Ohio guy and for a lot of Ohio fans their guy uh what is what does a peak Prime golf world look like to you uh what can be fixed adjusted improved and how do we
Get the fans excited for week in week out golf Ah that’s such a there’s so many answers but like so many there’s so many answers but so very little correct obtainable answers I think um obviously I think a I think maybe a honestly what I what I think will
Happen um I don’t know if it’s obtainable I don’t know if it’s uh fiscally responsible or I don’t know if it could happen I think a world tour will happen at some point um it’ll be the top 50 with um with 10 extra guys um who who will be
Relegated not and promoted just kind of week in week out maybe a series type of Base uh kind of what you’re seeing now with the swing five uh but I think it’ll be like a 10 a 10 number there um I think the PJ tour will eventually become
A feeder tour um as as weird as that sounds um but I I what I do think will happen is uh if Liv and the PJ tour merge um then uh I think you’ll see the the top PJ tour events U something similar to the designated events now along with the
Majors and maybe the top Live Events um as as well as the top Events maybe around the world um like you have the uh the BMW open on the DP World Tour some of their Rolex series events um and then like some tournaments uh in Australia like the Australian Open Australian PGA
Stuff like that I think you’ll see a schedule formed out of those uh maybe something similar to what Rory was talk talking about and um it would be I I think it’ll be very small Fields 60 to 70 guys no cuts a ton of money a ton of
World ranking put points a ton of FedEx cut points or whatever type of Cup points we’ll have at some point um and I think it’ll be very hard for those guys to get kicked out um unless they get lazy and non-competitive and they’re finishing last in every event to where
Uh like I said that 10 number will come into effect and there will be some relegation and some promotion at some point um and then you’ll have your uh regular P PJ tour events like your your Napa your John Deere your um your Phoenix Open your just your
Regular run of the- Mill events I think those will still exist uh with similar similar purse sizes um and then I think you’ll see maybe like a DP World corn fairy tour kind of merger and maybe have one tour over there one tour over there over here and
Kind of kind of feeds into the PJ tour and then it feeds into the world tour I think that’s what will happen but um yeah a lot has to happen before that all happen so um uh that sorry if that was kind of a rant there no that’s look
I I think I think that’s probably a more thoughtful answer than we’ve heard you know then I think a lot of people are you know I think people’s answer changes week in week out too you know how feel about I think it’s fascinating hearing you say that because we talked as we
Were getting ready I asked you you know your upcoming schedule and we talked about just the the um the Mexico open idant that’s coming up and how getting from LA to PTO Viera to Palm Beach is its own sort of Journey that guys have to make so you know you hear tennis
Right tennis from a world tour aspect or Formula 1 that’s part of the fabric that’s what people are used to I don’t think that golf is used to it as much I think there are guys that love to be able to hop around our flights three-hour drives place to place in the
US and I do wonder about the groans that would come from hey there’s going to be like you said there’s going to be a European swing there’s going to be a Middle East swing there’s going to be an Asia swing uh I think it’s going to be
Interesting you know it’s kind of uh careful what you wish for sort of situation that so many of these players want to they say that they want to I think make the most money and go around the world and do all this but then are they actually going to be excited to do
It and you’re self- included I know you’ve got a young a young child you know if you were at that level and all of a sudden you’re traveling around the world you know how would you feel about that I it would be it would be tough but
Honestly if I me and my family my my wife and my daughter uh we we travel as a family I mean we my daughter is 13 months old and she’s been on close to 50 flights already um which is pretty wild to think of but um but yeah obviously if
You’re playing that that fictional World Tour um you’re probably flying private most of these places um which is a convenience and it and with that convenience comes uh the convenience of traveling with your family and the luxury of traveling with your family so I’m it would be
Something that I’m sure a lot of guys would do um but it’s it’s honestly golf is just not it’s not a normal sport like at all um uh if I could shout out Kyle Porter yes Kyle uh even though Kyle and I don’t really get along on Twitter um
Uh I I will admit that he he has it right golf is not a normal sport it would be it would would be different if we were if we were match play every week and it was like tennis to where we had matchups all the time but you just you
Just can’t do it um I think it would if you did do something like that it would have to be a lot of nine-hole matches and it would have to be a lot of uh doubling up like hey you won this match you have to wait until this match ends
Then you guys will start on 10 like um and then maybe the like the semi-final matches would be 18 holes and and and then the finals matches would be 18 holes but uh yeah it would be it would be wild if uh if golf was like that but
Golf is not a normal sport so um that’s that’s where I think it may not be attainable but who knows I mean as you say that I I’ve been thinking the whole fabric of the sport and the history is changing that right if if we had a world
Tour well how do you judge tiger and Sam Sneed winning 82 PGA Tour events with guys winning I mean I think about it right now the way that some of these players top players have their signature event schedules just the pure percentages of it they’re
Not going to win as many events as you know tiger and Phil and guys did for the LA and VJ for the last few decades when they could you know tiger could say hey I’m gonna go play um you know the Buick event that was in Michigan every year
Kind of around you know he could go pick that off every year and it was a good field maybe guys came because it was Tiger but you know would Tiger have had 71 wins if he was playing against loaded Fields every week it’s it’s hard to it’s
Going to be hard to judge uh moving forward I do want to again I’ve taken you’ve been so great this last hour and I I do have some more questions I want to ask and one is uh you’ve been very vocal that your goal is to play in a
Major and you you know you you have not played in a major yet uh I I will tell you I looked it up before this interview the PGA Tour PJ tour.com has PGA Championship standings for the last you know the PGA Championship points are from PGA Championship to PGA
Championship do you know where you are on that list right now do you want me to tell you uh I think I’m probably like 108 maybe one maybe somewhere between 108 and 120 um and I know it usually takes between like 60 to 80 to get in so
I you were at 120 last time I checked through Farmers so I think it’s like you said I think it’s 70 technically gets in or 70 not already you know whatever the not I believe it’s just 70 um so I think 70 gets in and then it usually goes down
To like 78 with alternates and what the select few so I’m pointing out the PJ Championship obviously open qualifying for the US Open if you wanted to go for the open go for it if you win a PGA Tour event in the next few weeks uh that
Would solve a lot of the issues of playing Major sure yeah but um you know how what is your next goal between playing a m major winning a PGA Tour event making the FedEx Cup playoffs which to this point you still haven’t played in what are some of the goals uh
Yeah they keep changing the rules on me every year so no I uh yeah I obviously I I want to win um I think I have I think my good is good enough to win um it’s just like the fields are so deep guys
Are so good like you so much has to go your way to win and like I’ve been like I’ve had a 54 hole lead and that OB viously didn’t go my way I was I I was playing with Max hom who was arguably playing the best golf of
His life at the time and then Danny Willet who is a master champion um who was maybe finding some mental demons at that point but um yeah it I mean I was right there in the thick of it um with like seven holes to go I think I was one
Off the lead um so you got a great that was a great front row seat to a great finish at the oh my God it was like so I actually did a I did a podcast with the with a Browns Rider yesterday and I I
Tried to tell him it was like it was like Max was the Browns Danny was the Steelers I’m the Bengals just kind of sitting there watching um the Browns are down by 14 with two holes to go or like 10 minutes to go they score there’s all of a sudden
Two minutes to go they get the onside kick but they don’t score on that possession and then the Steelers are driving and then they throw a pick six from like the two yard line or something like that like that’s that’s literally how it went in football terms like it
Was wild that finish specifically in AFC North terms yes for sure um um I could not believe like couldn’t I was sitting there watching it and I could not believe it happened it was it was wild but um but that like I said it’s not a
Normal sport at all um it’s Golf and I guess that’s kind of why we play so I I Wasing back go on sorry uh no but back to my goals uh to win obviously um I just want to be more consistent I want
To make a lot of cuts I want to have a lot of good finishes I I want to make the I like I want to do everything that everyone wants to do out here I want to make the pedex Cup playoffs I want to compete not just one week I want to
Compete a lot of weeks and be there and get that adrenaline flowing and get that nervous feeling of like wow like your life could change this week and would it change who knows um if something were something great were to happen but um I like my wife and I have life goals that
We’re trying to accomplish as well so I I’m I’m worried about that I’m trying to be a dad as well and that’s been um it may have had a detriment to my my game the last year uh maybe early early last year but it has been the
Biggest blessing to me uh my daughter is the love of my life and I I wouldn’t have it any other way for sure so I think and that’s you’ve always struck me you know you’ve been so open and emotional about things in a way that how
Many PGA Tour players do we see that we don’t get to see the emotion right whether it’s on the course you know everyone’s stays as steady as possible or off the course guys you know kind of answer questions can answer questions robotically you’ve never been like that
At the top of this podcast you talked about you know after your your dad and brother’s passing that still affecting you to this day uh it sounds like from a from a sense of anxiety um you know how how do you navigate all that Chris Kirk has talked about his challenges kind of
Even as a PGA Tour player printing money how when he misses a cut he went through a time that he felt like how am I going to provide for my family this week I came home with nothing how do you deal with the anxieties of your family and
Being a PGA to her player uh you know it’s just um I I’ve been in a lot of um therapy the last ever since 2019 really is when I um kind of got introduced to it and I learned a lot I’ve learned a lot about myself and how how I how I
Think a lot how I how my brain works and how the human brain works and whatnot and the psychology of it all and what anxiety is and where it stems from and uh like just simple things as what like food can do to your brain and like stuff
Like that so I’ve I’ve uh I’ve experimented a little with some stuff here and there some meditation some audio stuff and uh I think it’s something guys don’t really talk about because on tour it’s uh I mean some guys look at that as a weakness I mean but it
It it’s it’s a big part of our society now um obviously like the mental health awareness and whatnot and it’s something I’m very aware of and it’s uh something I I go through a lot and um I’m always trying to improve will I improve it and master it probably not I don’t think
It’s um I don’t think it’s something you can master I think it’s something you have to uh work on and improve all the time and take time for yourself and whatnot and um at the end of the day I’m trying to be the best father I can be the best
Husband I can be and the best golfer I can be and if I can if I can do those three things I can I can say I’ve I’ve I’ve done well for myself so I think that’s beautiful on top of that what have you what’s different about your
Mental approach today as opposed to say a decade ago oh god well I’m a lot older um so just I I I just know how I mean we’re we’re so um I think we’re we’re we’ve been introduced through so much in the last decade just technology wise just as how
The world works and whatnot and um you just kind of have to take it as it is and don’t get I I I definitely don’t get caught up in things as much as I used to um obviously when you’re in college you think you have the world figured out at
Times and you think it like obviously like that’s why they say it’s the best four years of your life because you’re you’re kind of living in La La Land to a point if you like if you’re hanging out with your friends every day and like golf like playing golf in college like
You’re basically playing in member guests like you play like in five or six of them then you get to play uh your postseason events and then like you’re partying you’re hanging out with your friends you’re practicing you you you have to go to class but um at some point
You’re just trying to graduate so uh yeah it’s just uh at least that’s that was my mentality um uh but yeah so yeah I’m just a little older maybe a little wiser uh and I say that maybe just a little wiser but uh uh yeah it’s it’s I don’t know Life’s
A funny thing so I’m still try trying to figure it out I think everyone is at some point but yeah I mean it’s it’s incredible like you know you’re 34 um I think it’s hard for fans to put it all into perspective that you’re the same
Age as Rory mroy and Ricky fer yeah right so you think about careers those guys because I I’ve said it a million times that Eric Cole who’s a year older than you just won PGA Tour Rookie of the Year and is older than those two guys uh
Rory and Ricky who you know we seen some you can find some of the pictures of them playing against each other at the Walker cup and um you know they were really in our lives going back to 2008 2009 you think you were just starting College around then um and so it’s just
A it’s a different path that you know you’ve taken and then you say I asked you at the Top If you feel like a veteran on tour it um it’s just a it’s a whole different approach to everything so obviously you’ve you’ve gained different mental experiences than they have uh I want to
Ask two different Hoin ones or I I call them hole in ones Daniel Chopra chews me out says it’s holes in one either way uh yeah so the AT&T Byron Nelson one which I called which I I think is that your only your only hole in one on the PGA
Tour PGA Tour yeah but you also had a hole in one at the Cleveland open on the corn fairy tour at home yeah which is the better in one in your mind oh God probably the one at AT&T uh just because the crowd and everything
I just wish my reaction to both of them was better um so uh the AT&T one I was literally just in shock that it went in because I had had such a crap weekend like I had played so good you were in like the third to last group or something like
You were in one of the last groups I want to say uh the on Saturday I was on Sunday I was in the first group off the front with uh Xander and Pat Perez and Xander was like 10 under par for the round it was one of the best rounds
Probably the best round I’d seen on PJ tour um and um Pat was like maybe three or four under and like I was like like I was so afraid to talk to these guys and like they turned out to be so cool and like Pat and I were just talking about
Like pxg before that and Bob Parsons a little bit before that and so like I don’t know if I like had a comfort factor on that shot a little bit and then I I was able to see Xander shot and then like I I looked at my caddy JP at
The time and I was like it’s just a perfect little kind of chip punch nine iron and I hit it just exactly how I wanted to and it just went in I was so shocked it went in in it went in because I had played so bad the the last
Like 33 holes um I just wish I would have like celebrated more and like gave just gave it something I don’t know uh but Pat gave me a weird hug I don’t I still look back on it like I I don’t know what he was thinking but um and but
Uh no that was probably the coolest one of the coolest moments of my life just in front of I don’t know how many people were there I heard it was uh close to five or six thousand people on that hole alone but it was yeah it was it was
Really cool they packed that in they’re they’re trying to be a little adjacent WM Phoenix Open number 16 they’re trying no one no one can outdo Phoenix Phoenix is in its own but uh yeah they’re they’re definitely trying there and then like uh with the Canadian open and the
Rink the rink is pretty cool uh but uh yeah and then you on the call uh the bucket that was that was pretty good so I I enjoyed that one I said and I was on the call with Jane crafter and I said I said uh I said bucket and you I think
Shared something on Instagram about that and I I started saying I called um so then last year I called Hayden Buckley’s hole in one at sass which was I mean that was that must have been like 8:30 a.m. in the morning he was he was like
The second group I think to get to 17 so we really weren’t you’re not you can prepare as much as you want but you’re not expecting it and it goes in and there’s not you know later on Aaron Ry and Alex smly had hole in ones that week
With big crowds like Saturday and Sunday afternoon Hayden Buckley is Thursday morning there’s a crowd at 17 but not yet and I said to I said everyone I was like should I have said bucket like should that be my Hoin one call after and a bunch of people were like no don’t
Don’t do that but so you got that so I was glad that glad that you got that uh Phoenix it’s coming up this week I honestly don’t know if this is if I’m gonna put this out this this before Phoenix or after but I do want to ask
What’s it like walking to the tea at phoen it’s nerve-wracking I mean as soon as you play whole 10 you’re right there because 10 Green is right behind 16 green and it’s you’re right there you like if you’re in the if you’re on the back nine you’re in it 10 11 12 you’re
Kind of in it 13 14 you get away from it but 14 there’s an entrance so you you get to people watch pretty good because everyone’s walking back and walking out um and usually all of them are just hammered beyond belief um and then uh
Then 15 you get back into it you start hearing the murmur of it then you walk through the tunnel and it’s it I is pure pandemonium I mean there’s 177,000 people on one hole and they’re on top of you it’s not like any other part three
Like Saw Grass they’re kind of away from you there at points there might be as many people there but um I mean they are on top of you and you hear things that you don’t want to hear on a golf course that’s for sure so do they have a nickname for you yet
No I don’t think so uh I hope I hope none of the Thunderbirds are listening to this uh so maybe maybe hold out on hold out on releasing it till afterward but um I’m sure I’m sure something will be brought up whether it’s about Cleveland sports or something but yeah
You hear you hear some crazy things out there and uh I I am G to wear a Nick chub Jersey at some point this year so let’s go yeah should be pretty fun yeah why Nick chub I just I feel so bad he didn’t get the play God and the Browns
They had s such a good year and he’s probably my favorite player in the NFL uh next to mon Garrett uh but um yeah he’s just I think he’s the coolest NFL player he’s so good and he stays out of everything he doesn’t say anything stupid he just goes about his business
And it’s just I think he’s other than the fact he went to Georgia I kind of can’t stand Georgia but um other than that yeah you don’t think the sleeves will be a problem like we see a lot of basketball jerseys no donin Mitchell coming out no no I Mitchell would be
Cool garland would be cool um I I honestly thought about the LeBron High School St Vincent St Mary Jersey uh but soon as Nick chub got hurt I was kind of like yeah I’ll probably do a Nick chub Jersey but no the sleeve shouldn’t be an issue I’ve made some Swings with it
Already so we’ll get the St Vincent St Mary’s will come out one of these years the old Irish green maybe maybe when he retires you mentioned Xander that round that 10 under round uh on the PGA tour that round maybe it’s that round has there has there been anyone that you’ve
Played with that has just blown you away out there uh yeah probably Xander’s one of them just uh the way he goes about it um and I I I notic like every every tournament that him and I are in together we I see he prepares the same
Way every time he’s super down to earth um the the data that he shares with his caddy Austin back and forth over shots is pretty cool and just like their whole process of everything is it’s admirable and it’s it’s it’s pretty cool but Xander’s up there um trying to think of
Who else I played with uh you Max that final round yeah seeing Max uh get it done obviously uh I I I learn a lot from watching people get it done uh I played with Colin last year when he he got into the playoff at Rocket mortgage
Um uh and then I’ve played with Hideki twice so um Hideki is kind of funny he he just kind of goes into your bag and starts looking at your clubs he’s a huge Club nerd and it’s kind of hilarious because you kind of just sit there and
You just wonder what he’s thinking um but uh no it’s it’s it’s been great to get to know some of these guys and play with them and I just learn as much as I can so he’s thinking mauno and suen play pay me so much to use Japanese equipment
And Japanese wear Japanese apparel but if I was ever going to do something else let me see what else is out there yeah so but again I know your your daughter you were nice enough to she was down for a nap and she’s probably going to get up
Soon so I do want to get you out of here but uh you mentioned the the memorial getting the sponsors exemption when you were on the corn fery tour long really a few years before you get your PGA Tour card I believe you said that was 2016 or
2017 um that you first got the exemption do you have a relationship with Jack when you got it did he you know how did he treat you as an Ohio guy uh so that year met him was the first time I met him um so I won the Jack Nicholas award
In college um to make a long story short I didn’t get to go because I got invited to a tournament in Spain that summer um to represent Team USA so that was I so I I had to miss the the ceremony that uh that year so I didn’t get to meet him
But I met him in 14 uh talked to him for maybe five minutes in the locker room he’s like it’s cool that you’re from Ohio and playing in this I really admire that and everything and I thought that was cool and um yeah I’ve met him a
Couple other times I I I really don’t think he remembers who I am um it’s just I I I get it I I’m not I’m not a face on the PJ tour at all so I I get it but also at the same time I was having lunch
With um I think it was me Dylan ferelli Jordan SP and I forget someone else sat down with us at the table and spe was just getting his food to go to take back to his RV and Jack came and sat with us for five minutes and talked with us and
He’s like yeah I’ve got my fraternity Brothers in here from Ohio State and we look over in player dining and there’s I think it was Monday or Tuesday afternoon and there’s like all these like they’re all between the ages of probably 78 and 82 and they’re all just throwing back
Beers like it’s nothing and sitting there and dining it was It was kind of incredible to watch and uh just kind of sure they weren’t milkshakes some of them had milkshakes I think I think I had four or five that week um they’re just addicting uh but
Uh uh yeah it was It was kind of cool to see that but yeah I I don’t think Jack knows who I am Barb I Met Bar Barbara that week and she was she’s a sweetheart she’s incredible but um Jack I mean Jack is similar to Tiger I don’t I mean I I
Can’t imagine tiger doesn’t know who you are no no I’ve never even met tiger I I got within 20 feet of them in Mexico this fall and I started shaking basically so um uh and then I and then I bladed a chip shot in front of him so uh
Yeah uh that’s that’s another story to come but um yeah I just uh yeah I I I get it um but I I wish I had a relationship with them but it’s it’s just I don’t know I I’m just not a face I guess but maybe maybe if I catch
Fire here maybe they’ll one day read about me in a tweet or something well I’m not letting you off without that story you bladed a trip a chip in front of tiger what happened yeah so we were at the the worldwide Technologies championship in Cabo and playing a
Practice round it’s me and Ryan Palmer and we’re on the par five it’s I think it’s 14 was the par five 13 or 14 one of the holes and it’s got like this back stop back stop on the back of the green and we’re figuring out how we can use it
And whatnot then there’s a huge like fallof area and then a collection area and I’m down there looking and these two carts pull up and I’m like what like just two random golf carts and who pulls who gets out of one of them is none other than Tiger Woods who designed the
Golf course and he’s he’s there for the week and he comes up and he stands on the back edge of the green and I I walk up and I’m like oh my God like it’s actually him like like holy him and Ryan him and Ryan have to have a relationship
I they said a couple things to each other and um I I remember like I was like holy [ __ ] it’s actually Tiger Woods like like I he’s my like he’s one of the reasons why I play like he’s he made it look so cool back in the day like early
2000 all of 2000s basically um and uh I was like well now I have a decision make I can go up and introduce myself or I can go hit some more chip shots and practice and I was like I’ll go practice he’ll appreciate that he’s got the mamb
Mentality type of thing so yeah I’ll go I’ll go I’ll go practice hit some more chip shots and the very first one I hit I go down in this collection area I was like well you may you probably shouldn’t have chosen this area because it’s pretty much death down here like you’re
Not getting this up and down and um I open up my 60 Dee and I try to hit the swap shot and I send it about 40 yards over my Caddy’s head and he goes what was that about and I was like look to your right and he looks and he goes oh
Okay completely understand it as he chases my ball another 40 yards down the Fairway so he didn’t uh you guys didn’t make eye contact after that uh he might have looked at me like kind of like what the hell are you doing how’d you get at this
Event um but uh he drove off shortly after that so I might have missed my opportunity of saying hi to him or something like that but uh who knows maybe maybe I’ll get another opportunity soon but a a lighter question to send us out who wins a championship next the Guardians Browns
Or Cavaliers oh my gosh such a hard question the Cavs have one so I’m I’m happy with that even though they are starting to look more and more like a championship team starting to play like one um the Guardians have had two really good chances in my lifetime 95 and then
9 well three 95 97 and um and uh 2016 2016 was heartbreaking um and and I swear if the Browns ever win one uh Lake Erie or Cleveland may just fall off into Lake Erie um so I I just for the party aspect of it I want
To say the Browns um I think all the pieces are in place um maybe just us maybe a star wide receiver who’s maybe a little more in his prime is all we need but who who knows at this point it just it really sucks like the Cavs had like with LeBron
Coming back like well even his first in with Cleveland like they make it to the finals who do they have to play they have to play papovich and the Spurs who are some of the best team of all time then when he comes back again like they
Finally beat the Warriors who do they add they add Kevin Durant who’s arguably a top 10 player of all time and it’s like are you kidding me guys like we can’t catch a break and then like the Browns who’s in the AFC you have the bills you have the Ravens with Lamar who’s
In the Browns um division then you have burrow down in Cincinnati with Jamar Chase then you have Patrick Mahomes who’s probably the best quarterback ever to play the game and it’s maybe up until Brady but his career is still young uh but I mean we just can’t
Catch a break um yeah Flo yeah hey if he would have done it all God he would have played let’s see if he would have played he would have played like four regular season games uh one playoff game you think you would have won division divisional game AFC Championship game Super Bowl he
Would have won a total of eight games for the Browns and he would have had a statue had he won a Super Bowl and he would have played most of his most of his career all of it with the hated Ravens with um I only want to get into
That story with them leaving and becoming the Ravens so yeah um you’re getting me fired up here Jee I don’t know I was gonna say I was trying to send you out right now I feel like we could do a whole other podcast just on Cleveland sports but I may have to take
My daughter on a walk after this yeah no I I want to that you have been awesome Justin obviously I wanted you know to tell this story wanted to get to know you better and as I was starting I I said to myself you know it’s funny I
Don’t a lot of people like what ha you know what was your life like from 2011 to 2021 and I think that obviously once you’re in the PJ tour Spotlight people get to know you a lot better but perhaps you know I I I loved being able to tell
That story today of your journey to get here and I hope that people enjoy this and I know that you have so many fans out there in Ohio and and you’re building so many Beyond um and I look forward to watching you the rest the season and getting that first win and
Playing in that first major absolutely thank you Jee I appreciate everything this was fun we’ll have to do it again thanks Justin thanks so much for listening thank you to Justin thank you for taking that time we did that on a Saturday morning actually a Saturday
Morning of U the AT&T Pebble Beach Pro Am uh made it work thank you so much for being so open Justin uh obviously there’s a lot of heavy stuff that was in there there’s also uh some of the you know under the covers sort of PGA to her
Corn Freight to her access and all the things that you know you might look at some like someone like Justin lower and you know his name you you saw him on your DraftKings fantasy uh you know DFS list you saw him on the betting board
You saw him pop up at some of those events he brought up the fort the fortet uh where he was writing the mix the rocket mortgage but to get to know him as a person like I said at the beginning I hope that maybe uh you’ve become a fan
After listening to that thanks so much for listening to eyes on golf remember to follow subscribe do whatever you got to do I am Jeff eisenband I’ll see you on the air for the Mexico open at Vidant on PGA Tour live and I’ll see you next
Week for another episode of eyes on golf
