Patrick Auger looks at the biggest stories of the week in the business of combat sports. Vince McMahon, longtime CEO of World Wrestling Entertainment, resigned last week in the wake of a lawsuit and some extremely disturbing allegations. With the UFC now financially joined at the hip to the sports entertainment giant, how will the unfolding scandal affect the promotion?
0:00 Intro
2:08 How will the Vince McMahon/WWE scandal and lawsuit affect the UFC?
46:16 Quick Hits: Victor Cui returns to ONE; ESPN+ cracks down on password sharing
51:33 The UFC continues to announce bouts that have not yet been signed. Strong-arming their labor force, smart marketing or something in between?
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All right it is February 4th 2024 and this is the fight business podcast I’m your host Patrick o and today we’ve got two big topics we’re going to cover and do quick hits in between those two topics but it’s going to be a shorter episode because of that um nevertheless
Important topics we need to discuss and the first thing we are going to cover is the ongoing Vince McMahon WWE lawsuit now we’re going to do a highle recap of what’s going on with that and updates from the last time we talked about this but what I really want to focus on today
Is how does Dana White and the UFC navigate this right your partner company has a massive Scandal that is causing ripples throughout not only the company but even the pro wrestling industry you are tied to them your stock is tied to them how do you navigate this
As a partner company what do you do what can you do you know seeing is how TKO is also 51% owned by Endeavor you know what ramifications are there from that angle we’re GNA dive into all of that um that’ll be topic one then like I said we’re going to do quick
Hits and we’re going to follow up quick hits with the UFC’s promotional tactics a lot of stir with the Dustin porier fight being on being off now being on again and some of the promotional tactics that the UFC has used for quite a long time where they’re announcing fights before they’re technically signed
I’m going to talk about why the UFC does this what is the business case or you know use case for this what advantage do they get and what are the ramifications when things kind of blow up or fall through if you know Fighters don’t end up actually signing on the dotted line
You don’t get a resolution like he did with Dustin porier so I’m going to talk about that as well um time stamps in the bottom as always and let’s go ahead and Dive Right In all right first thing we are going to talk about today is how does the UFC navigate this ongoing
Scandal in its partner company WWE just a high level recap of events right um Vince McMahon who is you know I I would assume that if you’re listening to this you are at least aware of who Vincent McMahon was is um to WWE and when he sold WWE to Endeavor before
He even sold WWE right there was a scandal he basically left um was not forced out but decided to leave he had controlling shares of WWE after a while decided NOP you know what I want to come back and all we knew at the time was just hey he’s paid out multiple
Ndas um to multiple women that’s all we really knew we didn’t know the details or anything of that nature um so he leaves decides after a while nope he wants to come back forces his way back in u the WWE board originally unanimously votes that he doesn’t come
Back in he uses his voting share power to change the board Force his way back in force the sale of the company uh to Endeavor um who then you know creates TKO spins off the UFC into this new entity dilutes his share power so now I believe he has
About 12% or so uh well he had a little bit more than that but then he sold some stocks so he’s at 12% or so but as part of the deal and this is something Ari Emanuel had of endeavor you know talked about is you know we need Vince McMahon
He’s to stay on want his creative mind want him to be helpful um after a while with certain things going on he was pulled from creative but he was still orchestrating deals you know just a couple months ago he was the one Vince McMahon was the one who using
His connections that he had set up with the WWE Saudi deal really you know tied together the UFC Saudi Arabia deal like he was a key part of that so he is executive chairman of the board he’s not in Creative anymore he’s doing all that uh and then a former employee
One of these ndas um basically files a lawsuit and this is what one of the ndas was supposed to stop but didn’t happen and the details come out they’re horrific again do not recommend reading them uh on a weak stomach if you have a weak stomach rather and
So all this comes out McMahon is is immediately coming under Fire um causes a whole bunch of issues and then they had WWE had their Royal Rumble pay-per-view this past weekend on the 27th and January 27th and slim jim who is one of if not their biggest sponsor right top three decides to
Pull their sponsorship says you know we’re going to pause our sponsorship with the Roy Rumble given any everything going on with Vince McMahon um it’s reported by FF select who is a wrestling outlet that I generally trust um you know that another major sponsor that they were in talks
With no longer wants to work with them so now money is being affected pretty shortly after that report comes out um I believe that’s the morning of okay I I think it’s the day before it’s either the day before yeah yeah no it has to be the day before it’s the
Friday before the Royal Rumble which is on Saturday that comes out and then during Smackdown which is one of their shows Vince McMahon resigns fully says you know I’m I still I’m going to defend myself against these faceless allegations replete with lies all this stuff but for the good of the company blah
Blah blah I’m going to resign so he resigns the next day slim jim is back on board I haven’t heard anything else about the other sponsor but you know you see the RO Rumble slim gym is is has several spots where they’re clearly promoting their brand um and it seems like at
Least on the surface all seems to be much better right um this whole time everything’s going on the stock stock TKO stock had jumped from the Netflix deal that we talked about last week it dropped a little bit but not you know hugely um and then this past
Week it it pretty much evened out at around I think $85 or so is where it ended and and kind of spiked back up and that’s after a huge Spike because of a big announcement seeing a drop from whatever it was like 90 4 95 down to 85 um from where it was
Sitting at 77 that’s not super uncommon at all right especially because it ended the day after the announcement closer to 90ish or 89 so it’s dropped some sure but it’s not what I would call a major red flag based on you know the news of McMahon and things going on that and
Moors you know comes out about this and all as the details are being released as coverage is actually blowing up in the mainstream because you know wrestling is very much like MMA where it’s very Niche for the most part in terms of like daily coverage on who’s winning which
Matches etc etc um but you know you have the Wall Street Journal CNN uh Vice Fox every news Outlet Under the Sun that’s you know New York Times that are bigger Main news outlets covering this which is a big deal uh and the stock is kind of like sitting sort
Of normal-ish right um again you have some some loss but not not enough that you could attribute to oh this story is really rocking it right no at least at least not when the initial NDA news came out um and the pfl News came out like that really sent the stock down
Quite a bit and then on a downward trajectory this seems to be the stock kind of leveling up off after a big upswing from the Netflix announcement so it it rides that wave and again as of Friday seems to be in a staish position um but another caveat that gets thrown into
This is um you know apparently uh the way the Royal Rumble works for those of you who don’t know uh it’s like this big battle royale match and then the winner of that gets to go on to WrestleMania to challenge one of the company’s Champions and so um you had a
Wrestler Cody rhods win that you know call out one of the Champions essentially really call him out and and it was a continuation of a story line type thing uh and then on Friday uh in in somewhat of a Twist he ends up basically giving away his shot
Against the guy he’s been in in the story he’s been really after and who he seemed to want to go after post Royal Rumble to The Rock Dwayne Johnson who makes a surprise appearance Crowd Goes Wild blah blah blah and they’ve set up this Rock versus uh Roman Reigns match
Which is massive Etc um again not going to get into the deal details of that but the reason I want to bring up the switch is it’s being reported at least from some outlets and I don’t know how much of this is is truth or not but um you
Know from a couple of outlets it is being reported that part of the reason that was made was because there was an injury to another wrestle at the rumble but beyond that you know part of this is to have the rock come in be at WrestleMania and divert attention away
From the Vince mcmah stuff which is not terrible PR right that’s not necessarily a bad move just to get more people more of mainstream casual fans talking about oh this huge match in the making to distract from what’s going on I don’t know how much of that is you know
Where how much of that is truth and is the main reason I don’t know if we’ll ever get a clear answer on but I could see that being part of the strategy from WWE internally right is like make as much positive noise as possible to drown out
The negative noise we’ve gotten rid of Vince McMahon we’re trying to you know have a huge WrestleMania this is the way to do it it’s not an unused PR tactic um especially you know during the Royal Rumble they have a press they have press conferences kind of like MMA disc um and
You know Paul LEC who is their Chief coo Chief Operating Officer I believe or or CCO or something like that you know he takes questions and did an awful job a terrible terrible terrible job when asked about this by reporters asked about the Scandal uh he basically
Said we had an amazing week we’re moving forward G you know not going to focus on the negativity and keep in mind this dude is the son-in-law of the guy um who just you know got kicked out of the company uh he’s married to that guy’s daughter his his grandkid or his kids
Are that Vince McMahon’s grandkids I mean yeah um so he does a terrible job handling it a couple of other wrestlers or figureheads did all right uh handling some questions but um that’s kind of where things are now I know that there’s been a report of um Federal prosecutors you know like
Executing a search warant and really looking into Vince MC ban so it looks like he’s looking at criminal charges which would make a lot of sense um you know providing how deep this goes but that’s kind of the high level recap in terms of where we are right now um
For more in-depth stuff like timeline all that fun stuff some some if you want to get into the real wrestling nitty-gritty and I know I went for a while there but just wanted to make sure I hit the the key points um check out either um John poock or
Brandon thirston their show together both of their shows separately are are fantastic stuff they’re doing a great job covering this from the wrestling side so if you want to get into the wrestling weeds and like get into the scandals itself and the history and some of the other you know all that juicy
Gory details those guys are already killing it I’m not going to try and dive into that world too much to be honest I don’t have the time and they’re already doing a fantastic job um so go follow them for that um but as it pertains To Endeavor right and the UFC that’s what I kind of want to focus on um for endeavor right Ari Emanuel now is in a interesting position um when the NDA stuff had come out they had put in their file links with the TKO merger like this is a risk right like depending
On what happens with this this they disclose that as a risk to shareholders um when all that stuff came out as well when WWE was its own company you know apparently they had an internal investigation um with a third party and they didn’t reach out to or there’s some interesting communication as to
Whether or not they reached out to this alleged victim whose details have now come out um and so it doesn’t look great right it seems to be much more of much more of an issue right than probably previously thought and how much somebody like Ari Emanuel or Nick Khan
Who who’s over there um new is hard to say but from AR’s perspective now you immediately have to lock down again as much negative PR as you can you’ve gotta got to spin it and you’ve got to clean house and we’ve seen already do this on
The MMA side before right um I know I’ve seen some wrestling journalists or or places talk about like well are they G to get rid of you know Paul LC who is a key centerpiece in terms of creative designs of the stories of pro wrestling and all this other stuff and you know
All this you know when Ari bought the UFC and Endeavor bought the UFC right they cleaned house like no other and there was not some major scandal going on um they just wanted to cut bloat right remember all the Legends deals that were going on um Chuck Liddell who
Maybe maybe ra Rashad Evans no Matt Hughes Matt Hughes Chuck Liddell couple others um where they were getting these you know crazy deals crazy amounts of money for doing nothing essentially right um they were not coming into an office they not doing anything the only person who survived
That initial round of cuts was Forest Griffin because he actually like showed up to the office and tried to do a job he tried to like actually do something and then he ended up you know being an integral part of the pi and you know actually working with athletes and so
They were like yeah we’ll keep you on because you’re actually doing something but you had so many Legends deals so many things going on where people just getting paid because you know they Dana and the fertitas had essentially agreed to pay these guys and like these Company Men and then that
All went away just overnight just poof Ari has always been about the numbers and about Focus his recent comments right about CA who is a rival of WME IMG um going private and getting paid a ton of money and their stock being valued at something right his recent comments were you know
I want my stock bu at that we’re at least worth forget what he said maybe he didn’t say 10 times or eight times whatever CA got but he said you know at least four or five times what we’re you know our valuation is this is crazy blah
Blah blah um you know he’s trying to pump up his stock price he’s trying to get his respect from that regard but that that’s just always how he’s worked he’s always been about cut cut the glut cut trim the fat and make this as profitable as poss possible pump up our
Shares and the fact Endeavor stock has not done super well since appearing on Wall Street I think is a thorn in his side I think that’s something he takes I don’t know if it’s personally but I I could see it right like I mean he definitely it irks him to a certain
Degree um and this right with TKO this was something that was going to help Endeavor stock by offloading a fair of their debt um you know being bringing together two Powerhouse names in WWE and UFC use those back offers synergies which we’ve seen through layoffs specifically on the WWE side um and now
We’re finally seeing the co-promotion of events right so you got I think 298 UFC 298 and um a big you know House show or uh raw or something that weekend and now we’re seeing we’re finally seeing the kind of co-promotion of like yeah check out this weekend you can get two huge
Things of wrestling and MMA and they’re trying to increase the cross pooll polonization of customers right like basically I’m sure they’ve done research on this I know the research I’ve heard is like 5 to 10% but I’ve I’m sure they’ve done some casual research on this that suggests that there might be
Opportunity to get more crossover between MMA and WWE fans right um especially if you have you know someone like Brock Lesner who is also named in this case uh by the way and has all but been removed from WWE uh but you know that somebody like him is an opportunity
Where okay he can fight but he also wrestles and so you can kind of do some cross promotion we saw Cain Velasquez before his whole ordeal you know go over to WWE for a bit and do an angle with Brock Lesnar and do a whole thing um there’s certainly some opportunity there
Where they’d like those two sides to work a little bit better I think and to to hopefully get more customers to go to both especially if they’re in the same weekend right it’s an experience that’s what they’re trying to build um how far that’ll go that’s yet to tell
But that’s definitely something they want to push this is the start the co-promotion uh that they’re doing but Ari now is in a position where looking at what’s happening in WWE he pretty much has to clean house and he will anybody that is even remotely involved in this and the lawsuit named
McMahon but then there’s several other members of WWE who are anony anonymously mentioned right like corporate member number one uh think of athletic trainer a referee maybe a particular um wrestler there’s there’s a whole bunch named in just this lawsuit and there are many other lawsuits and the question
Becomes too you know is this the worst of them or is this the standard you know if we open up these other ndas if if this NDA which is going to court and part of it could become unenforceable right like if or if a judge rules it unenforceable that could
Open up basically all the other ndas where women could come forward and actually reveal details um the lawyer for this particular woman says that they’ve had several people come forward and want to talk about this and it’s a you know rotten culture uh that you know they’re overwhelmed by
This there’s been a lot of Rumblings from reporters talking to people apparently and saying like this thing is real bad all over the place and again we’re we’re going to find out how bad to an extent um but Ari has to swiftly Ari and and
Endeavor and the board of of TKO has to swiftly get rid of anyone who might be even potentially involved in this because if more details come out if it turns out that key people who are still in the company right now um because again McMahon was was kind
Of kind of there kind of not right Ronda Rousey mentioned you know he thre an agent of uh Bruce pitchard he was still kind of you know there quote unquote through a surrogate but but he McMahon himself wasn’t physically in the building wasn’t physically doing things and really was focusing more on
Things like the Saudi deal in UFC rather than um you know actually running the show if it turns out that there are people who are running the show are still there and lots of people that’s going to cause huge huge problems um because in this you know woman’s this Janelle
Grant is her name uh in her lawsuit she names the WWE and if it turns out that this is a systemic problem right that yes McMahon is the perpetrator or the key perpetrator I believe John Lattis is also named who is a key figure there for
Many years um but if it turns out okay this is a systemic failure it isn’t just two people at the top AB using their power the that lawsuit becomes very expensive very quickly and couple that with nd’s not being enforcable and you’ve got multiple of
These it I mean it could it could go very bad very quickly for WWE so Ari has to immediately figure this out with tko’s board and get rid of anyone e anyone who even remotely might have been involved in this um and that’s going to bring a lot of hard changes
Right I don’t know how personally just from an optic standpoint I don’t know how Paul ofex stays on because I mean this is it would be hard given his relationship and given some of the stories out there you know that he would be unaware of he
Might not know again all of the details but he’d be unaware of some of this stuff kind of seems like a no-brainer um and that could again affect WWE’s story line right that that’s firing your head rider for a TV show H or or you know your head
Showrunner for a TV show that’s that’s not great um so it it’s it’s a lot and endeavor’s GNA have to navigate that and and TKO could easily you know right now their stocks doing okay they could easily end up in trouble so from the UFC side of things
Um just to you know Circle this all back and I know I’ve kind of gone on some tangents here but it’s important to set this up right um from the UFC side of things what does Dana and the UFC do right now their only tie is to Brock Lesnar that’s their main main
Tie in to this whole situation is he had Brock Lesnar come back for UFC 200 uh he’s a former UFC World Heavyweight Champion um I have said many times I thought Brock Lesnar was going to come back for UFC 300 in the main event which still hasn’t been
Announced so I thought they were trying to work on that if that was even being talked about and yes I know Dana said he wasn’t but I mean Dana said he wasn’t for 200 too so you can’t always trust that um either way I now think that’s definitely
Not happening um I do not think Dana and Co would want to touch this at all um so now would not be the time to bring back Brock but you know that’s your biggest tie and Rousey is also a tiean right but the UFC’s kind of distanced themselves
From Rousey since the Hall of Fame and since you know she kind of gave up and and Rousey made much more of a clean split right there’s there’s been rumors about her coming back but you know we’ll see um honestly if you one easy you know PR
Tactic is if Rousey coming back was on the table for 300 that’s not a bad call right um because that’s you know getting that that definitely is like we’re you know getting an empowering woman to come in Step into the cage it gives her shine I mean that could be a whole thing
But um but that’s kind of you know I I don’t think that’s going anywhere and I don’t believe it would give so much of a PR shine that it’s really like oh this is great right um so making sure you don’t bring back Brock Lesnar’s step one
That’s easy you just he’s not GNA be at 300 he’s not going to be you know part of if you got any UFC documentary stuff on him or some happening in the background that all stops immediately he you keep him off the ra radar for right
Now um see how it plays out because his involvement is kind of wonky right it’s it’s the details of that are definitely seems like he was kind of involved but how involved it’s hard to say and and you know all that stuff so um you you just basically you you don’t bring it
Back that’s easy enough to do at this point too especially given his age um it’s pretty simple uh but beyond that right if you’re the UFC you’re in a very unique and interesting position the really what you you have to put now Above All Else given what’s
Going on with WWE and that re and TKO are dealing with that is you have to make sure that you do not have any very awful negative press Scandal type things come out anytime soon right WWE syncing could hypothetically sync the whole ship although given the UFC’s profit
Profitability I don’t think it would um but it’s definitely you know if WWE really went off the deep end here right and just let’s say it turns out like this thing stuff is going on on everywhere all the time it’s still technically going on today something
Crazy like that and WWE now gets hit with endless lawsuits that are going to cost a ton of money and really just drain the company and it’s a whole huge thing and viewership drops off C customers leave all that stuff apocalyptic scenario right UFC’s profitability because they are so
Profitable um i’ have to go look at the actual numbers but I think there would be a chance they could survive especially because TKO would probably clean house in ways by cutting certain things or you know shutting down parts of operations and all that so they’d be
I think they would have a a pulse what state they’d be be in I’m not sure but you know UFC is is not burning money in unprofitable you know in in a way where it’s like okay if WWE goes to UFC can’t do anything and TKO is dead um
I think they definitely have a pulse minimum honestly uh now that I’m thinking through things yeah they’d be they’d be alive but so with the the antitrust lawsuit starting right in a in a couple months now that’s bad enough if there’s any other Scandal thing or whatever you’re even remote something that you
Think could remotely creep up and cause a whirlwind of negative press you’re locking that down right now if you’re Dana whiteo you’re also escalating that if again we’re I’m not talking about a scandal necessarily the size of this magnitude with uh Vince McMahon and everything else going on but
If you got some crazy Scandal or something you know bubbling under the surface that could potentially come out could cause issues you are raising that up right now to tko’s board and to Ari and you’re saying Hey look I know you’re dealing with all this crap but like here
Is a risk that we have to keep an eye on you’re basically you’re you’re taking a risk register and creating creating a risk register of everything you know at the UFC level that could cause issue especially with PR now you know Sean Strickland stuff isn’t great right
Um and obviously they didn’t have him available after his fight which was interesting interesting um after he dropped the belt but yeah you you you definitely need to be careful about that I know Tana last time we talked Dana leaned into it he that’s his consumer
Base that’s his fan base you know he said he’s not going to censor anybody sure that still doesn’t mean you don’t do things like remove him from media access after a fight where he might get asked more questions or it might cause more issues right um you do what you can
To mitigate those risks and that’s not especially given how it all played out that’s not a risk on the same level as McMahon’s issues right but any extra negative attention right now is going to be they’re going to be extra sensitive to it and that’s what you kind
Of have to realize moving forward if you’re Dana um and I keep saying Dana but it’s really just the UFC business as a whole right um if you have any us like the new not usada anymore but the new drug testing program if you have any
Failures or any issues with that you you need to immediately Shore them up and you need to raise risks that’s you are on heightened alert essentially um because the spotlight is on WWE and as an extension on TKO and you are half of TKO so making sure your house is in
Order is is step one and escalating any type of of risk and managing that far far more stringently than you had before is is step one um step two right once you’ve kind of got that you know settled uh and sorted then you’ve got to do the winning
And and the the lifting for TKO so you need to be putting on huge events ideally um you need to create a lot of positive Buzz about what you’re doing going into new markets new sponsorship deals things of that nature and you need to put on exciting fights sellout Arenas
Things of that nature you you’ve got to go out there and win uh your you know your partner is down you you’ve gotta pick up the slack because this is going to cost a lot of money it’s going to cost a lot of negative publicity we’ve seen with WWE how it could cost
Sponsorships you’re going to have to pick up that slack that’s not something the UFC is UNAM Amar with though right when they were in endeavor’s portfolio and Endeavor bought them out fully I mean they were the Crown Jewel we talked about that on the show they were the one
Fueling Endeavors Acquisitions of you know on location and the uh Sports IMG Arena right they were the The Jewel Crown Jewel of Endeavors ecosystem because a lot of that ecosystem was just burning money or barely Prof profitable or was incurring a ton of debt in order to
Acquire new parts of the ecosystem they believed in um and it was up to the UFC to just keep making money paying down Endeavors debt with its profits paying out dividends um to certain shareholders right there was the the New York Post article that was about uh the dividends
To a lot of celebrities things of that nature who had invested in the company um but that’s I mean that was really the UFC’s role then was like all right we’re going to go out there and keep winning and killing it uh while you guys figure your stuff out so they’re
Back in that position again instead of being toe-in Toe with you know a partner who is also very profitable and they can kind of not relax because they’re always trying to grow and succeed but they don’t have the same pressure or same role as before um
Now they’re back to where they were when Endeavor owned them outright that’s really they’re they’re back in that mode uh so also wouldn’t be surprised you know seeing more U UFC Vegas 85 fight nights and then big events which they already came out with three uh you know huge pay-per-views
Coming up with 289 299 300 which are all very good uh 297 was not so much but the the the next three are they’re going to have a big you know first half of the year for sure um and then you’ve got rumors about Conor McGregor coming back
For international fight week which makes a lot of sense would again help with the Press help with you know boosting positive if you know coverage of the UFC and take away from negative TKO coverage so they’re going to do that but that’s you’re back in that okay
I’ve got a win roll well my partners and and everything is down I’ve got to win fine that that’s easy enough too for them that’s that’s not very different at all from they were just you know a year and a half ago right that that’s their
This is where they’ve been for a while so they took a break from it now they’re back um so that’s the next thing they have to do and then lastly you know the the biggest thing you do here is from from a specifically talking headpoint which would this would be
Mostly Dana I would imagine maybe Lawrence Epstein maybe um maybe Hunter but not really Hunter really does interviews and things of that nature so mostly data is if the WWE stuff comes up you you have a company line that you tow and you stick to it and you make sure
That to what extent you can you make sure fighter stick to to it too right um if it bleeds into you know UFC stuff so far it hasn’t I’m not saying it will I think there is technically a possibility with the Brock stuff and just again the fact that if
You know TKO shares tank that affects UFC and so that becomes an issue and I’m sure it could come up but um you know you tow the company line here and you you have a unified front on this stuff because again UFC has had plenty of scandals right plenty of scandals
Um most recent one being the video of Dana White slapping his wife and they you know you had ESPN talking about it you had video of him doing that um I think he got some Grace given that his wife had also hid him right so that gave
Him a little bit more of a grace period to get out of that situation and he was able to answer questions in a way that allowed him to pretty much stay where he was uh I think if his wife does not hit him or you get you know just the video
Of him slapping his wife or or really going after his wife I think that’s that’s curtains for him but um but UFC knows how to navigate scandals they they’ve been through plenty of them um and they’ve just kind of go got to go into that mode and make sure that they
Maintain what they’re doing other than that there’s not much else UFC can do right they I mean they’re kind of stuck um it’s not like it’s not like now which this is important moving forward where now you’re going to have some of these same back office roles fulfilled by the same
Fun like business unit that’s part of the synergies is is that with some of the layoffs um you know sponsorship uh I think is the biggest one but there’s marketing some other places where like now you’ve got one team working on certain graphics for both WWE and UFC
And and it becomes kind of a merger of the corporate office back office structure now that’s important too that if that culture is coming in from WWE that if you’re you UFC you you get rid of it ASAP and TKO knows that I’m sure but you make sure that does not permeate into
Your company tactics and builds right and I don’t think there’s you know I don’t believe they’ve had any like actual office mergers where they’re sending people from uh Vegas up to Connecticut or anything like that I I don’t think that’s happening I think mostly things are remoter so that’ll you
Know help with some of it but you you you stonewall if you’re the UFC you say nope this is our culture this is our brand this is what we built and you do not let anything uh if if it is truly a systemic culture issue in WWE you don’t let
Anything penetrate what you’ve built in UFC’s culture you you make sure that that is locked down in a way to prevent that from bleeding into the MMA side that’s that’s really all you can do are those things um it other than that again it’s it’s kind of like watching you know a fire
Across the street you you can call you know you can call your fire department you can watch it and try to help her you can but ultimately like it’s not your building that’s on fire it’s that building and they have to figure it out right um and yeah will this affect things
From from a governance standpoint sure I’m I’m sure that that certain things will be put into place to prevent this from ever happening in WWE again that will also be adopted by the UFC um you’ve got the rock joining the TKO board which means you know he can
Technically vote and speak to things that involve the UFC as well uh so that automatically changes some of the government with McMahon out that’s just also going to happen um there are going to be changes that will ultimately trickle down to the UFC side that they’ll have to deal with
But right now there’s not much they can do other than go out and just do well that’s that’s their biggest goal and then tighten things up raise risks everything we just talked about that’s kind of how you navigate this if you’re the UFC um you keep Communication open especially with Ari
And and Co you do what you you offer assistance but you you’re kind of in your own world and and it’s important for you to succeed in that world while this is going on that’s from a business perspective right um similar type of thing in a in a way
To I guess the the the bow on this uh this topic is you know think about like with with a family right um if you’ve got a family with two brothers and one brother is messing up all the time and I know some of you come from families like
That um you know I’m lucky I’m lucky I if anybody was to mess up it was me in in mine um but you know when that did happen right like when I would mess up or or there’ be issues you know my older brother would you know be
The good kid would be the one not getting into trouble and you know would know like I’m you know basically my parents would essentially be like look we got to deal with your brother um and and you know we have a whole bunch of stuff we got to deal with your brother
Or whatever what have you you know we need you to to you know get good grades and not go out and party and not do these things right that’s the expect that’s all you can do that’s if if you’re the good kid that’s all you can do is just keep being
The good kid make sure you don’t get in trouble that’s step number one because if you if you get in trouble and the boat like then it’s a huge issue right um then your then your whole house is on fire and it’s a big problem but if it’s just you know
If it’s just one section of the family you could tackle it and figure out how to go through it it it makes a huge difference that’s that’s the analogy I would give I know I’m not the best at analogies um but that’s kind of what I
Would say is you know if you’ve got the problem child the good kid has to remain being the good kid and yeah you switch on and off sometimes right but like you got got two kids you hope and and you expect one to be good while you’re dealing with the other’s
Problems as much as you can that’s the best way to support the family that’s what TKO and R is going to be looking for the UFC to do and that’s what Dana and and Co will do that’s what the UFC will do moving forward um I have
No doubt that’s going to be their goal anyway so with that in mind let me know your thoughts on all this I know this was a long one um but it was important to talk about because again ramifications of this will affect the UFC U for perally at least for right now
But you know governance is is going to be policies I’m sure will be put in place that will have to be put in the UFC because they’re put in wwe and it will come from a top- down governance structure a TKO governance itself is is changed and my guess will continue to
Change I don’t see you know day-to-day operations or anything being affected in the UFC side uh I think again it’s more likely now if they were looking at any UFC Cuts uh to kind of balance out out some of the WWE Cuts they’re probably not looking at those as much right now
And seeing WWE is more of the problem so there’s that but yeah it’s going to be an interesting ride and we’ll see what the stock does and we’ll see what UFC does to try and counter and and succeed on their side because that’s all all they can really
Do all right quick hits and these will be very quick um two things I want to point out uh one is that Victor qu is Back At One championship um that’s a big deal he was kind of beloved at one had left I believe to do
A CFL or AFL um football league thing has come back um to help kind of write the ship and chartri was asked about you know financials ones financials mentioned he’s gotten about $500 million in investment and you know that they’re succeeding they’re going to be profitable soon saw a lot of people
Saying like oh I mean UFC has a lock on the market so much that you know 500 million dollars shry has and he still can’t you know compete and you know that’s it’s not an entirely true statement right there are lots of caveats with that but it does speak to
The UFC’s Market power and you know it is something that may come up at the antitrust lawsuit uh you know it it’s not great that they get $500 million and they can’t get a functioning um MMA promotion to really compete at the level as the UFC that’s from a you know
Anti-Trust standpoint something to think about but uh Victor being back again is Big especially with the other Executives that left um him coming back is is a good signal at least in terms of the company bringing back a beloved figure that I’m guessing they believe will help
Them uh move into this new era of profitability and expand into the US uh the other quick hit I wanted to go through would be that ESPN plus along with Hulu and Disney in general are following the Netflix model and are going to start cracking down on password sharing
So just like where Netflix used to be able to share your password and one you know account may have several people tied to it that’s now gone uh on Netflix’s side and it’s sunsetting I believe in March for ESPN plus that’s big because again um UFC media rights deals are coming up right
This is the exclusive negotiating period and then they start to get to talk with other entities so how much that affects subscribership uh I think could easily impact the UFC’s rights deal um depending right if it’s if it’s a statistically insignificant amount sure they don’t care um if anything that just
Helps ESPN because it’s great we got these guys uh that means we’re going to force them to sign up for their own perfect if it’s a ton which I don’t know that it will be but again it’s a possibility right if all of a sudden you have a bunch of subscription
Cancellations or you have those same subscriptions but then you know viewership starts dropping for UFC events because again we get viewership through ratings but there’s ESPN plus number we are not privy to right where they can tally it on the back end if you’re streaming it’s you can see how
Many are concurrently streaming something that they keep those numbers pretty under lock and key that’s part of the reason and the way the UFC makes their decisions about who to push or not right it’s it’s a big deal so um if those numbers start falling significantly right or pay-per-view numbers
Are affected a ton which shouldn’t happen you’d think um but you never know uh then then that could you know play a part in this I don’t think it will personally um I think it’s going to be kind of like Netflix where like sure you lose subscribers or or people get mad
About it or you know less viewership but overall pretty much stays the same because people want to see their Sports and you know whatever but ESPN plus is in a weird spot because Netflix right has always had that content and if you’re going to watch Netflix that’s the
Content you want ESPN plus has been a part of the bundle a lot of the time s and has been more pushed as yeah it’s got UFC it’s got a couple of games here and there but it’s not the quintessential ESPN network so until they transfer that over that’ll be a
Thing too but just something to keep an eye on um those are the quick hits let me know if I missed anything else uh oh yeah RZ Pharma as last one RZ Pharma is now um signed a deal of sponsorship for the UFC for erectile dysfunction and
Some other male needs uh low to mid seven figures so not like a crazy deal but uh interesting nonetheless they’ve always been in the space there’s been people laughing about it and talking about it with uh you know Trojan and condom Depot and that stuff but um yeah
I mean it’s quite the name RZ Pharma but it’s it’s sponsorship deal nonetheless and it’s another another feather in the cap of that sponsorship team which they are again consolidating and trying to get one team together from my understanding for both WWE and UFC which is Big
Because sponsorship is a huge part of making money for both of those companies so another further in the cap there let me know if I missed anything but those are the quick hits for the week all right last thing I’m going to touch on for today
Is got another classic case of um you know Dustin porier versus uh benois St Deni announced for 299 and seems like everything’s great until Dustin says Nope fights off but I’m still training comes a whole issue where they’re saying nope it’s not signed you had a whole thing on Twitter
Happening um and then Dustin comes back and says nope sorry I jumped the gun we’re good I just couldn’t get a hold of my manager Etc and people were getting upset Dana was going after a couple Dana and Co were going after uh G Cruz I believe um which I still don’t
Understand what that was all about but essentially you know saying nope this fight is done it’s a whole thing um I believe because he had reported that that and another fight had never actually been signed and it was announced um so with the poier situation I don’t know if it was signed
Or not and it just didn’t get communicated what have you but we know from other situations right in the past in the UFC lawsuit documents that this has happened before and we’ve seen this happen before we’re Fighters have come out and said like we didn’t I didn’t
Sign this deal they just announced this fight we’ve seen it especially more frequently right um and it’s important to track because this is something that I think will continue to happen and it gives the UFC a slight advantage in marketing and for promotion and here’s why if you are able to announce an
Exciting fight right ahead of time for a particular card you’re going to get people buying buying those tickets and it’s always card subject to change right it it always always card subject to change so one you try and pressure those fighters to make that match up because that’s the matchup you
Want right and now if it’s out there and they say no it looks like they backed out or they’re scared to fight so it’s a psychological and and appearance tactic to be like hey you guys are going to sign this and fight if not like you’re
Going to look dumb or it’s going to be your fault you’re going to get the blame which often happens right it’s if even look at the poier situation poier is like nope our fights off we couldn’t come to a contractual agreement makes it sound like and a lot of people were
Saying well it sounds like he you know he didn’t want to fight and well and I couldn’t get it done that’s the whole reason they do that is to spin it that way it’s not man we’re the UFC we couldn’t get this fight done we really
Wanted it blah blah blah it’s no and in the meantime right you’re G to have Die Hard Dustin porier fans or people who are like okay I want to see who’s on this card before I buy tickets to go to$ 299 oh that that fight’s added that’s
Big so now what I’m looking at the whole card great as a hardcore fan now it kind of like hits that tipping level of yeah I’m gonna go ahead and buy buy my flights all this so even if it gets cancelled oh well that sucks that fights off that’s whatever well I already
Bought the tickets I already bought the flights I already bought the hotels like yeah I’m still going it just sucks it’s gone it’s that simple I I do not understand why people are scratching their heads like why would the UFC do this it’s this is how you sell cards and they
Can get away with it because again it’s it’s not a situation where they are they they’re knowingly throwing these cards on and saying like nope this isn’t going to actually happen so we’re they’re not committing fraud or lying about it they’re saying no we believe that this is the fight that’s going to
Happen we’re announcing fight because this is the fight we want this is the fight where it’s happening contracts are out they just have to sign and I do wonder what would happen if somebody challenged that right of like oh this is purposefully when you look at the you
Know some of the texts and things that were going on when um Jon Jones situation which you know they announced Gus guson versus Jones before Jones had actually had the contract and and signed everything um you know I wonder if somebody sues if that fight fell through
And then Su the UFC for you know false advertising I don’t know how that would go but um but as of right now they can continue to do this and it gives them the ability to move tickets and move promotion faster um while they’re waiting for the
Fighters to sign and be making the fights they want right like if you’re a fighter i’ I’ve seen this a lot recently and it’s important to note that if you are fighting for the UF you can turn down an opponent there seems to be this notion out there for
Multiple people uh you know Stephen aith mentioned it uh Eddie he mentioned it in a discussion uh with I think Yale or or with a college discussion that John Nash put out there that was great it’s good to look at for boxing negotiations versus MMA negotiations check it out but
Um but all these people are saying no like well you know the UFC gets to decide who fights who they say oh you know this guy you’re GNA fight that guy sign the contract but as a fighter you can still turn them down now if you turn
Them down you can get your contract extended it can become a whole thing but you you know especially I think it’s after so many offers like two or three offers depending on who you are depending on your contract but it’s not a like you have to fight this person if you say
No then you know too bad you’re in trouble Etc like that’s not how it works that’s often how it feels and that even if you don’t say yes it can have ramifications but you can turn down opponents that is the thing you can do but by announcing these fights again
Ahead of time if you turn down the opponent The Narrative is going to be spun as well you know we we made it we thought we were good and then this this person didn’t want to fight this person and that doesn’t look good for you right it causes issue for you and
What again what is stopping the UFC from continuing to do this what is what is the you always have to look at this from a cost benefit analysis every move that they make right on the proverbial chessboard what is the risk if I do this what’s the risk if
They continue to announce these fights and then they’re not signed and then they fall through fans get grumpy media says it’s a problem big what that over in a day how many people bought tickets and actually moved money right I think the only way it blows up is if you announce some crazy
Main event for say UFC 300 and then it falls through last second and turns out well it was never actually signed then you’ve got problems but those aren’t the fights you know where that tends to happen all the time and I’m not saying you know again Jones gusterson PO is a
Bigger name sure but like it’s it’s a scenario where they’re going to keep doing this because there’s basically no downside there’s only upside it only moves tickets moves promotion tries to force Fighters into matchups you want it this is why would they ever abandon this tactic why I can’t if somebody I would
Love in the chat uh or message me on Twitter whatever like tell me why the UFC wouldn’t continue to do this they’ve been doing it for so long now what is the downside there is none there’s none at all it it’s it’s just free promotion and free moving
Tickets it makes the card look better you’re good to go hopefully they sign it and oftentimes they do sign it right we’ve heard Fighters say like well that hadn’t been official yet but then we worked it out there you go and then you get to announce it earlier which means
You move more tickets up front that’s the name of the game right we going back to WWE using that example right like if you can announce that the rock or John Cena or whoever you know Stone Cold Steve Austin is going to be doing something the sooner you announce it the
Better because it moves more tickets right I it it there is no downside to the UFC right now other than Fighters getting frustrated sure which that can have a systemic effect if if enough Fighters get mad um but for the most part they just get mad and don’t do anything and
Media and some fans getting angry but that again media is still covering it and fans with with the market share of the UF C has fans are still watching and they’re going to blame the fighter most likely they’re going to see so and so is off because they wouldn’t sign the
Contract that’s how Dana is gonna spin it that’s how uh the other Fighters Camp is gonna spin it right that’s just how it is there’s there’s no downside so let me know in the chat again if you think there’s a true downside to this but but
It’s it’s smart on the UFC’s end it’s a great promotional tactic for them they’re using their competitive advantages to pull this off and there’s no reason they’re gonna stop so yeah sorry it’s gonna it’s gonna keep happening it’s just gonna keep happening um yeah I literally can’t think of a
Reason why they would stop let me let me know let me know what you guys think because it’s seems like an easy question to answer to me all right that wraps up up another episode of the five business podcast appreciate you as always for watching on YouTube or listening through one of your
Uh preferred listening podcast it’s late here uh so apologize also apologize if the audio is a little wonky hopefully it’s all good um but yeah I’m getting stuffed up my voice is kind of kind of going from the sick stuff so I’m I’m gonna bounce but as always like
Subscribe Bell notifications if you’re on YouTube listening on any of the other uh Apple Spotify what have you podcast platforms appreciate you guys as always and until next time get money
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