Owain Clegg – Episode 22 – The Union Tapes Podcast

Jumping forward a decade or so from our last episode. I first met Owain
in the 90’s, he was a tiny chatty kid ripping around the boneyard in
Chester and the surrounding skateparks of the time. Fast forward many
years and this dude has never dropped off. Rode for a bunch of big
companies, won contests, flew around the world, scoring multiple
magazine covers, video parts, road trips and done all there is to do in
the game of BMX. We get in to the start of his BMX journey, trips to
Woodward as a kid, growing up around the Chester BMX scene. Changing up
riding styles, and the in-depth street riding phase and why, riding all
terrain, his involvement with BMX now, the obsession with collecting old
BMX media, recent barn edit and the open loop. And even some UKBMX hall
of fame talk in here.

Riders mentioned
Jon Taylor, Alistair Whitton, Jon Hall, Paul Harrison,
Chris Hamer, Barney, Tom Baskeyfield, Tom Holmes, Tommy Gore, Zach Shaw, Jerry Galley, Stuart Dawkins, Ian Morris, Caleb Kilby, Baz Keep, Robin Fenlon, Chris Souter, Lard, Northern Jon, Will Jackson, Joe Rich, Taj, Dave Friemuth, NateWessell, Farren Downes, Marv, Daniel Benson, Lemsip, Chico Hooke, Martin Murray, Anthony Pill, Brian Foster, Matt Hoffman, Jay Miron, Colin Winkleman,Scott Malyon, Neil Williams, Gary Simmonds, Mark Theaker, Richie Pettman,Tony Flemming, Fids, Gogo, Johnny Mingo, Hollywood, Ron Wilkerson, Dave Littleman, Cameron Birdwell, Garrett Byrnes, George Hornig, Ralph Sinisi, Edwin Delarosa, Jack Bender, Ben Lewis, James Cox

Hello hello this is the union tapes episode number 22 uh We’ve jumped forward a couple of decades from the last one and this one is with the infamous Owen CLE of Chester I’m sure many of you out there know know this name he’s been killing it on bikes for a

Good couple of decades now um and we get into all his background all the early stuff all the usual stuff but it’s definitely an interesting path that he’s had for his BMX right in life and he’s still going strong today um following on from the last edit he just put out a

Couple of weeks ago we thought it was a good time to uh to do one with Owen so um yeah get your ears around this it’s definitely a good Enjoy so just uh yeah give us a quick little bit of where you was born where you was raised and like how it was when you was a a young young child yeah uh grew up born and raised in Chester where I still live uh been in my

Whole life really um yeah just classic classic Northern upbringing really you know nothing special you know working class or whatever like just knocking about with friends on on our bikes in you know Gra style clothing just same old really like without without the accents yeah so so what was

What was your um your first bike then the first bike I ever got was from a guy in in high school and it was I didn’t know what it was till years later and it is a DP no it’s not it’s a trm freestyler oh okay okay they always got them mixed up

So so that but that was your first BMX what was your first bik oh the first bik ever got yeah it was a rally I’ve got aot it was a BMX Like a rally BMX with yellow pads and and everything and I’ve got like a like it looks like a sweatsh shot

Brown jumper on outside me I’ll send you a picture okay that your first bike was a BMX yeah I think so yeah there’s no of any other bike it’s just like a rally with it wasn’t Chrome with yellow pad sets and all that that you obviously yeah I wonder what what what

Bike that was then that would have been was that new when you bought it so what was this like late 80s or 90s no well I was born in 83 and there’s a photo of me when I’m four or five probably tops five six something like that it’s probably a

Mini one of them mini burners or something it’s tiny it’s tiny like it had like yellowy gold rally font and then there’s a pad set on the front with bright yellow with you know the bungs at the end here couldn’t slip off yeah I think I know what you mean yeah had

Stabil I think it has stabilizers on this picture but they’re probably out of shot so all right and and so that was when you was like in infant score or something yeah yeah yeah it was new I couldn’t I couldn’t tell you okay and then like so how soon after that did did

The DP come into it like how did you how did you go from that to the DP oh was a good so that was when I was five or six the fact that it was a BMX just just just coincidence just okay okay that was just like first bike like

A rally you know rather than a mountain bike or or a road bike or anything like that CU I was a kid yeah then the I got the D the trm sorry when I was first year of high school so what was it 13 something like that all right no be

Younger than that when you’re 11 11 or 12 you start high school so your brother skates right my brother’s 10 years older than me has always skated so so he was skating at this point as young as I can remember he was a skate skate a skateboard there was always there was

Always skateboarding around from as early as remember really you didn’t get into skateboarding at all I did it for about a year or 18 months before I got into BMX in and all right I was terrible I used to just try in I couldn’t OE and didn’t have the

Patience to OE so I would just go at stuff as fast as I could you know like kind of acid drop off a drop try do a few tricks on mini ramps body varials and rock fakies but that was about it really the patience to

Learn to W was not my forte yeah didn’t have the patience and the fact that my brother was really good it was going to be it was going to be hard to to get to get anywhere near him so so what was you like 10 years old or something at this

Point yeah must have been yeah about yeah about 10 or 11 just before high school where were the mini ramps then so in my back Garden my brothered so again so around that time when I was like five or six on the BMX probably was

When he was looking to build a ramp in the backyard just built it he was fif if I was five or six he’s 10 years older than me so he must have been 15 160 all right and he got a ramp guide out of rad and just built it just built it himself

Like I mean he’s he’s a joiner by trade now cool man when we were 15 just built a mini ramp that I think was eight foot wide to start with and then he put another four foot on it so it was a 12 foot wide minian in the back

It four maybe with an extension in the middle so one side was four foot right the way across and then the other side had an extension to maybe five foot andion in the middle yeah like all the skaters of that time used to skate it you know like the

Liverpool lot Brian Summers and people like that and H and those I think I think they did it was quite a strongboard scene in Chester but obviously and then BMXs and stuff like that like John would have probably John’s definitely there there’s photos of me being held up by John you know

Like on that ramp on that ramp yeah when I’m yeah I had a ninja scooter I used to ride the ramp on the ninja scooter so there’s loads of photos of me riding a ninja scoot in the background while they’re allting like get out the

Way so so that you you’ve seen like some cool stuff already because like you’ve seen like real skateboarding skateboarding that point was was pretty [ __ ] cool like for the most part you know like I remember the the jeans that are now all popular again like proper grungy like you know rage against machs

Yeah Pilots massive wide pants super wide boards okay all of that so so you were seeing it already and then so you end up with a with a trm yeah so that was that was by so when I got into High School so John had been around ever since I was

Younger but like during that interim period of obviously having the ramp and me getting to high school you know got into all kinds of skateboarding collecting comics and everything in between and then I remember seeing I think the first instance that really like got it going again was when I was

Skating I went to a uh waverton fate okay yeah yeah and John did a demo for this guy Eddie w built a uh a takeoff and a landing obviously to John’s specifications made out of steel and every year he did like a a demonstration at this waverton fate is

Like a spectacle really so the one year that I went yeah John had it was over a fence so you had a lip take takeoff and Landing over a fence whole GT air show routine all right 360 tail whip ended with the the crowd pleaser the big back flip over

Over this big gap okay so was that like 94 or something I guess 95 94 no no later than that later than that later yeah yeah definitely uh I didn’t startop properly till okay I thought that’s when he rode for GT might have been 96 or 97 then

Yeah yeah it was like it was coming to an end it was just yeah so that was like the final years of John being on GT but obviously we just went there by chance like knew that well not by chance we must have known that it was on but we

Didn’t know John to say John ring is up and say all right I’m doing this demonstration we just went to to to waver and fate to to see this demonstration really so it was the same one in exactly the same area do you remember in invert where they’re doing

Like Lake jumping yeah yeah Cow Jam exactly that was Cow Jam I think yeah so I remember when I was a kid seeing John and probably whoever it was at the time trying to jump the canal like from one off a kicker like I was a kid there

Watching that it was in exactly the same location in waverton yeah where they had the half pipe that Eddie Wally built and sold in invert and then they had a metal spine ramp that was in a field as well like this guy just made I went to the spine ramp yeah I went

Dangerous yeah because it had metal Sid so the bo skateboards didn’t fly off but that’s it yeah had metal surface and metal side so if you sketched you got bucked off the side like yeah it was death it was death yeah that was [ __ ] dangerous man later on we did a demo on

That ramp through on on a Carnival it was towed along and we did a demo on it while it moving what on the back of a truck on the back of that mini man that spine man was on a truck yeah yeah yeah just just hooked on and towed through Su

Chester Town Center while we just the spine with the side still on it yeah yeah exactly as it was that’s ended up in the Boneyard first ramps that was in the Boneyard he just towed it inside and left it there I was deadly it was bomb proof

That ramp yeah I bet it was yeah massively over engineered but like like most of the stuff he did it would just last forever oh man so so like so how did you acquire the trm though because that frame was like a really rare English freestyle frame like see I knew

Nothing of this so when I was at high school there was just a really I don’t know how the conversation must have even come about I wanted a vmx there was a really rough scall that was in my year and he said oh I’ve got bikes for sale

So he lived he lived around the corner from my high school went to his house and there was just a garage full of bikes like all bikes all Dodge all bikes yeah you know his mom was just like effing and blinding out the window and he’s like just he wheeled out this one

And I can’t even remember what I paid for it but it was it was that trm frame with all other parts they weren’t the rest of the bit the rest of the bike was not trm it was just anything so someone had obviously built it up and

Then he’ ended up with it but it wasn’t until years later that I realized how obscure that frame was yeah they only sold us frame and forks I don’t think they made any other product yeah I found out years later when yeah i s i I sold that frame to

Jed in nework okay yeah got it now and he’s made forks for it and everything I’ll I’ll send you the pictures he’s he’s done it as it as it was but it was Chrome so from what I understand that was even rarer like they used to be color but it was a chrome

Trm I think I only ever saw one yeah I think it was Chrome one I saw well I got out of a scall Lads Garage in Chester so that was it that was so what Wheels did you had on that like plastic wheels or something or it had a front mag and a

Rear spoked back wheel which I have no idea what they were they were nothing special yeah and then you was off though that that sent you on the journey right what what did you discover from there like the magazines it would have been a little while we were just like your classic you

Know going to the local um what you call it down just jumping off pallet you know down Asda or whatever and just making pallet jumps used to be a golf Depo that had loads of pallets outside there’s a photo of me just jumping off a load of pallets on

This trm when I was that was when I when I first got it and that was it basically just po did you have a crew of people to ride with back then or so there was a few of us in high school yeah there wasn’t many

There was probably like four or five of us uh like called Jordan and W and Paddy that slowly just got into it I think they must have I don’t know if they went to that same demo with me or not I can’t remember it was coming up Wen it at that

At that point in time like BMX was like climbing and it was just just just coming up if if you’re talking about 96 997 yeah it was just on the way back back to itself yeah yeah it was yeah because obviously there was more and more magazines at wh Smith and stuff

Like that that you could pick up around that time and what can you remember your first mag I was thinking about it the other day I think it was either BMX grind or or one of the early rides like ride 26 27 something like that who was

Who had the cover can you remember that guy doing a Superman like green Superman I don’t know if it was at Slade’s Farm or something like that he definitely had slayes Farm okay yeah yeah right yeah I know the one yeah the white white Edge

Yeah in the on the grass yeah being here somewhere yeah but uh yeah BMX grind like I’m surprised I Stu with it after that wasn’t the greatest introduction was it that was yeah that waser it had Brian Foster on the front that was probably the only saving gra I I think

Brian Foster shared the cover with grop bags and someone else actually right okay it it was like three people on the cover right I just remember Brian when I looked at it a while back it had Brian Foster on I thought yeah that’s it yeah ding Grace

And can you remember like videos were were quite popular at that point in time they were just making sort of a that was the New Media that that bit well the thing I remember about videos was obviously we got some at that time the

Main one that I had and was always in my house was a copy a burn Copy of Head first oh okay I’ve had that was in my house from like you know since my brother probably had H Street video and then head first on after that and we

Wore that video out to death that was even before we got into riding like it was just you would just put on out everything you know like that’s mind-blowing as well is it like even now you look at that and you’re like [ __ ] unreal man yeah all of it all of it on

That video like as much as obviously Hoffman you know steals a line like like does loads of stuff on there like the street stuff you know yeah Brad all of them trying to think of the year that way it was like 91 or 92 as well so was [ __ ] early yeah it was

Just on a it wasn’t the original it was just a copied VHS nice so you knew there was you knew there was good [ __ ] to be [ __ ] done if you’ve seen that video you know straight away yeah I remember that being like as soon as I mean that

Would that I remember seeing that video when I was younger and then when we got into BMXing we just watched that on repeat really and then the early videos we probably got I remember Thunder was massive th had a really good vibe uh soil we had soil and then I think the

First props I ever saw was props 13 there was a was a lad in high school that robbed it from the local bike shop and bored it all right yeah that was the first one not cond down can you remember who that who was in that it had those um

Like you know those competitions that always used to W was like Padre Island or whatever it wasn’t a BS comp it was when it was slowly turning into ESPN yeah yeah I know yeah yeah yeah it was one of them and I remember like I remember distinctly like Miron doing

Like a massive transfer like an Al baring transfer or something like that like and winom and doing transfers like that was what stood out I can’t remember who the in were on that one issue I’m going have to have a look for that yeah I think find out what

One it is I haven’t I haven’t got it anymore sold that to someone what about like what was the first UK video that you saw last resort oh really yeah yeah last resort that was a good that was around yeah that was that was the the crew of

People around the time the first first comp I went to had Ian and fids and all them were there so I think we obviously twigged you know put put two and two together two together yeah yeah yeah the first R Works comp we went to they were

There oh okay yeah I know to W that I wasn’t there but I remember the the coverage in the mags and that it was pretty cool was it it was when ramp Works was at the old smaller place right yeah it was good in there and Ian had

The Welsh flag seat Fitz had the the Jack I bought that seat because fits had that on even really Welsh name I I was born in England oh excellent that was a good comp that was remember that was like one of the first times we got the train and

We all got the train and went went oh you went Lonesome yeah like with the crew just not with your parents up with like three or four people at the train station still right now like Ango who was like SP local NE Williams uh G you remember G yeah I remember yeah I

Remember Neil as well yeah yeah yeah all them they were at the training station just met with them and never been there before and they took us so amazing that was a great day like obviously all the locals and then you had things like I remember on that day there was like Mark

Sea do you remember him yeah yeah I remember him yeah yeah local hooker and then yeah that’s it I tell you who else rode that day someone called Richie what was his name yeah Richie was like massive inspiration to us when we around that time because he was he wasn’t a

Pro but we saw him and he could do everything that real good yeah I remember the pictures really good Richie pman his name is okay all them all them kids were good weren’t they like all the Richie was like the stand out and he had like classic STA and four piece bars

Standard four piece bars and one footed X UPS bar spins transfers you can do it all yeah as well they FN dog Tony okay yeah yeah I know yeah random like in r in in r in a street contest but yeah it was good there that first part was

Really good yeah well that didn’t last long though right they moved into the a big one quite soon after couple of years yeah I don’t know was it I never went to that so I assumed it wasn’t that or did I I might have actually I might have

Went once yeah bright red floor like it was one of those floors where they painted it to look good but if it was even remotely like wet or condensation it was a death trap I think I went on a 70s tour once to that place yeah yeah

Yeah you would have done yeah but yeah that was a really there there was yeah Ian fids uh all Bo was yeah Bo go there was a really good lad as well coming up called Gizzy who was from roundway he was Richie and G Ro that yeah that was good good SK part

That my dad sorry my dad took me there once to that skate park and uh was meant to go to work my dad lived my dad worked in Liverpool at the time so he’ give us a gave us a lift there and uh went to leave and his car wouldn’t start

So couldn’t couldn’t work out what it was called the RAC out turns out under the seat was an immobilizer switch and had stuffed My Ride magazine turned off two half hours late for work this guy literally switch on your way oh excellent and that was like I suppose if

You that’s your first contest in you first like that’s that’s a new world has opened right that was yeah you’ve seen into like a whole new thing here yeah yeah because we’d gone to local skate parks but you hadn’t seen all those people who in the magazines

Like I just said I grind Ian was in that fids was in that all of a sudden like going off at the local the skate park that you far from your house that you’ve never been to it was just like reachable go yeah let’s go you know like let’s

Where else can we go and bump into these people and and do all this stuff and what what about Chester the Old Chester skate park was that a point point in time where you was going there or was that before so around the time ever since I

Like I said when I was younger I remember going to Chester skate park the first one the concrete one was that was it was already demolished like I went there on a ninja scooter with my brothers you know oh okay okay why I remember going past the football stadium

You used have to go in between the football stadium and like a carlot and it was at the very end and it was demolished then the things I remember one it was Rubble and two that was a half pipe with no deck they were like the two memories that I

Had yeah I went there and it was half demolished probably the same as what you saw it like stuff was pushed into the bowls and there was like just loads of rubble but two bits I think were rideable and that was it but I’ve got two brothers so one the one brother that

Skates is 10 years older than me my other brother is 18 years older than me so he remembers being it was like a membership you know you could pay 20 kid he remembers it being built and finished and you were paid to be a member and it

It was done so I mean that was you know obviously it had been left with you know demolished for a long time before even my eldest even my older brother got but yeah he remembers it was called inner city truckers it was called Okay and like yeah that’s a crazy story because

Like that must have lasted two years if if that you know if that build all that stuff and it’s gone in two years like it was big yeah from what I remember I mean when I look back on photos now it was big like it would be it would be iconic

Now if it was still there you know along the same lines of like stevenage or yeah yeah that’s it that’s what yeah like that I don’t know obviously obviously there was Rubble in there you know I don’t know if it was like good transitions or whatnot but yeah I found

There is what there was actually another skate park in Chester as well as that one but I’ve never seen photos of it finished I’ve got a photo of them building it and you can see the shapes where there’s a bulldozer like all bows and mul but I never saw it finished and

That was like the other side of Chester I wonder if they finished it I’ve never seen pictures of it I did once go to the Chester archive office and see if they had photos you know you can like search and go through like newspapers but nothing came up [ __ ] yeah

You know what year it was which the other one yeah no no if building that and then skateboarding had just folded you know like must have been the plug maybe there’s a few Facebook groups where I’ve like there’s quite a lot on that inner city trucker one but nothing on the other one

This picture just popped up and I know exactly where it is because it’s like Chester’s main Leisure Center is in the background it’s like a 60s building you can see it in the background so I’ve been there and took you know like a photo of like what it

From the same angle of what it looks like and the leg still there but I never saw a picture this other one finished again it was massive W man sucks I think like you said that the skateboard ding during that time they probably didn’t it fell

Off a cliff like literally just was like done over night yeah it’s weird so maybe they were late maybe they were late get coming on to it so it was later of the builds because obviously you know must built in the boom and survived it whereas this probably wasn’t even

Finished if it was on the tail end of of the demise so when you went to that Liverpool contest yeah did you go on the trm or did you have another bike it’s a good question I assume you’d have had something else I don’t know well from the

Trm I got well into it and the bike was wrecked so I saved up on my mom got me a GT Performer it wasn’t a Pro Performer I remember getting the the catalog and it was like performer is it Pro Performer and then Pro freestyle team that was like

The hierarchy I think it was a pro performer All Chrome everything had those GT Pac-Man thoughts where you had to put yeah yeah I know yeah the pigs yeah but for me that was everything because all that done with the trm was probably like you do had some grips you

Know had a tire or whatnot oh where was you getting parts for at this time you had a local shop so yeah the well the GT didn’t come from a local shop the GT came from me subtly circling uh an adverting rid and just okay this is where you could get this from

And then uh but yeah there was a local bike sh called Dave Miller cycles that was always been mountain bike lead but had a few things in you know they had a few issues with props and they had they were a GT dealer and a harrow dealer

Just the mainstream ones but they never got any like core Parts in but other than that there was a Sho in all saging near crew and I remember getting the train there remember getting the train there to go and buy UFO gyro fish 50 m round trip for for

That would drive one mile to go and get a UFO gyro now but yeah 50 miles stage sideway Cycles it was called they used to advertis in ride I remember the adverts in ride yeah yeah totally shop but they had they had more stuff they had more Brands oh okay and I was

Stupidly drawn to UFO that’s what kind of what was mean one of the things that was happening at that point in time anyway so I understand you know I I didn’t get the handle bar so I do have some of self respect left yeah good um so so then

What where did you go from there like you riding ramp Works occasionally and then like you you on a GT and then you’re sort of finding the shops and you’re finding the scene and you’ve got like a local Crew That’s riding with you I assume and then like so so what H

What’s the next stage like of because you seem to learn I mean I I met you probably when you was 15 or something but you was already pretty good when I met you but you probably met me at Boneyard the Boneyard yeah yeah you seem

To get like you was already good you was really like she was still a young kid to us you know yeah the Boneyard would have been the next step okay so around within six months of that rant Works comp I think or within a year the first

Incarnation of the Boneyard was built so it wasn’t always in the building it was in now literally like across the yard was another building and okay that was the first space that the Boneyard was in the ramps were built by parents and so there was and it was a roller

Hockey roller hockey was massive then so all right so there was a family that lived just next to the skate park and they’ obviously needed somewhere to practice roller hockey so they marked out a course for roller hockey with roller blades being on the up and on the

Back that there was another parent uh Carol her name was Carol Del zus that started the skate park she uh her son was into roller B and so they built some ramps but they were literally you know like a fly off ramp that you could push to one corner and then they

Built they built like an eight foot quarter pipe that was God awful you know like humongous coping at the top that was like met it had no the deck was just laid on so if you popped out you slid on the deck like it wasn’t screwed

Down so they just didn’t know what they were doing they best best intentions but yeah I didn’t know what I were doing and there was no lights the lights were security lights so every 30 seconds you have to go and like wave your hands in front of it you know your house yeah

Yeah I remember John doing a demo there and it was freezing cold in this warehouse and this this guy that used to work for the estate thought it was a good idea to start a load of fires in like fire bins you know to get heat in

The room all right yeah yeah turned it into smoke just smoke bellowing I remember John doing a flare in this like smoke filed yeah just this sketchy quarter but obviously John could do like all the GTA show tricks so he had FL flips on lock on the world’s worst quarter

Pack was you hanging was you hanging with JN at this point in time was he still too young still too young he was he was on the tail end of the GTA show so obviously we would bump into him and obviously my brother skated so he was he

Knew about the skate park and tatan all and we were of an age where we could go there ourselves so although my brother skated with his group of 10-year-old friends now they you know we went as as our own group so we went there all the

Time really so he was just like the local star really and he would just come and go as he was back from the GTA show because his mom and dad lived in clotton which was like four or five miles away and how far was Boneyard from where you

Was in Chester eight miles so did you used to ride that all the time time yeah like literally all the time we would just ride there and then either try and get a lift back by anyone that had a car that was going back or even the lad that

Worked there Chris you’ll probably remember him he used to have like one of those lights on you know like rock climbers light and we just follow him he would pedal home and he would be the only one with the light and we just ride back because it was all like country

Lanes and stuff up until a certain point right sketchy yes no lights you know just like we did that a lot but we did get a lift you know not not and we rode there all day we got a lift we would ride there I tell you what else we’ used

To do as well which was obscure back then there was the post bus so that used to drop it would leave Chester you could get on it with your bike and then it would drop Postman off so it would drop a postman off in waverton it would drop

A postman off in the next so you could just get in with all these postmen and how you wangled that what how did that come about though was that just locals knew about it or what was the story I never I didn’t think about it till

Recently but yeah it was a post bus so basically it would leave Chester and as opposed to now where there’s every postman’s got a van and you know goes door with a van they just had this post bus that would literally go the same rout you needed to go to to the Boneyard

But it would drop Postman off and then when you got all you’d get out but that was way get BMX in it they would take your BMX like no problem it was weird [ __ ] great man yeah just from City Center and then it would just and

Then it would go first thing in the morning obviously for the postman to do their round so you could do that and then You’ get a lift back or you ride back yeah thaten a lot I don’t know how that even came about like that’s [ __ ]

Weird as [ __ ] yeah you couldn’t do that now could you no there’s no way that would be happening now they’d be like [ __ ] BS get the [ __ ] out of here yeah that and just loads of kids piling in with like 10 no no chance no no way man

Yeah no weird so and it was like this around the time that you went to the US um trying to think when I went to America went to America fairly quickly so obviously when I got the bug we riding it was but like when you went to H

Um McGill’s ramp and like that was when I was younger so like I said when I yeah I was on a ninja scooter like there a okay said it was early yeah the ninja scooter may be in America all right so my mom my mom’s single mom so she used

To save up and took my brother and me to America so once a year for some reason we chose America my brother’s into skating so we went to McGill’s and we went to skate shops and all that in California like early uh I must have been about eight or

Nine if that yeah well that was yeah it was because my brother was fully into it so it wasn’t like we went there just trying to find a skateboard shop he knew where they all were he knew he wanted to go to Mike mcel skate park he knew he

Wanted to go to I don’t know Venice Beach or wherever he knew where skateboard shops and and skate pretty pretty [ __ ] cool that is it oh it’s awesome there’s photos of me at Mike McGill skate park like when I’m well young in the background and watching all these skaters which obviously I didn’t

Know who they were at the time now legendary characters in skateboarding so can you remember who was skating there when you were there Mike Mill was there but other than that you’d have to ask me brother would now I have no idea it wouldn’t mean anything to me at the time

I was just probably messing about in the dirt like yeah yeah yeah yeah and so it was a different year that you went back to the US to the east coast when I fully got the bug of riding so like you said in 96 when I started

Getting into it yeah within that small window of a year or two years I was like massively into it you know just every day going to the Boneyard or going out with that c right right as I said earlier so yeah when when we my brother

Was probably old enough by that stage to not need to go with us so I was just probably saw well woodwood was probably on although it would always been there I think that was a time when it was really up yeah yeah yeah so I remember requesting a brocher from America and it

Turning up when you get the brochure to go and everybody’s in it you know uh Dave mirror jiron uh Hoffman’s on it uh Jo Joe Joe T all of them lucky yeah like the top top Stars yeah all those people that you think of synonymous with it of that era

Were in this brochure and then you obviously seeing them in the magazines whenever you could get them from America and in the UK it was just a no-brainer but obviously yeah it involved saving but my mom had already done that so we used to do did a paper round for a year

Whatever saving up you know I like to think that that Year’s paper round probably pay for it probably didn’t probably yeah that’s that’s a top top tier man that is mate take and she took you on your own to to Woodward yeah we went the first time we went we went to

New York and then we were there for a week I think before we went to Woodward so she never drove my mom never drove so she didn’t have a high car we just went to New York and then went to New Jersey and to a twoip contest

On the bus yeah yeah went to that and saw like that was again that was like in the same way as the ramp Works comp that was like an American eye opener yeah so like you had young van Homan Garrett Garrett Burns uh the standouts on that day was there

Was a guy you remember Dave little man that used to ride for two Hip he was I remember the name yeah George hornig as well was he there no I remember that name yeah Cameron Birdwell super like him and that Dave little man rode for two hip and they were just going

Nuts but yeah there was all kinds of people there R CI met now like okay I say met them I’m in the corner like yeah yeah you saw them yeah yeah yeah just keeping himself like Ron Wilkerson and all that like I didn’t again I knew what

Two hit was from the magazines but I didn’t know how iconic like Ron Wilkerson was yeah yeah and that was at that Tom’s River skate park that is in lot of like the little devil movies yeah that’s it it had the the feature in US ride of that contest didn’t it there’s a

Photo of Van Omen doing a one I swear that’s me in the background on the floor so yeah but yeah got that and then got the got the bus back that’s G me m Peggy back to the bus station because we were running late so and what was well

What was just you and your mom or it was someone else just me and my mom wow amazing that’s proper it went Brooklyn Banks and all that like there photos of me at Brooklyn Banks and remember trying to find BMX shops in New York and there

Wasn’t many there was there was one in Harland that we rang and they said you probably best not coming up here get a taxi but don’t don’t rock up on the train and then there was one downtown that again similar to the the shop we had in Chester like he did some

BMX stuff so I remember buying a lot you KN on holiday so you know like yeah boat out yeah yeah and then uh and then yeah went to made our way to woodwood so the first time we had friends in New York of my brother my brother had friends so I

Think they drove us we first of all went to Harrisburg which isn’t far from where Woodward is in Pennsylvania stayed with their parents and then and then my mom dropped me off and then went back to New York for a week and came back and got me and how

Was how was the Woodward experience then it was good right yeah Mega just like just being in those cabins and getting to ride like all those massive massive skate parks like lot eight and the outdoor one that was at the it was the first Incarnation before skate light was

There when they had it like the blue ramps outside that and that indoor mini ramp that mirron and and and Castillo and everyone used to ride you remember the one it was like yeah yeah I remember yeah yeah all of them just rode them and that was Mega like my counselors were

Over the years I went there I had Ryan Corgan Shad Johnson and Ralph Ralph CI oh amazing so when you you how often did you seen woodwood on video before you went like a few times right trying to think where I would have seen it been props it was really props

Like featured on props every year so it must have been props must maybe like 20 you know earlier than like the iconic like props 27 one where t Ruben in it and it was before yeah of course yeah oh tell you what it would have been on like absolute like video

That love to this day it would American Muscle it was right yeah yeah okay I used to watch that religiously because that CA because it was a Schwin video those shops that I mentioned earlier that did GT and Har they did twin all right that’s how we

Got we probably had more chance of getting American Muscle because they would sell a Schwin mountain bike or whatever then we would get a props or or soil or something like that yeah yeah of course American Muscle that’s definitely where we saw Woodward so so when you

Went to Woodward did you see some of them obstacles and think like [ __ ] this is way bigger than what it looks on video I think everything feels like way bigger than it does on video when I I went in 2000 or 99 and I remember going

And looking at them riding on video like amazing [ __ ] people riding and I remember getting there thinking like oh yeah I’ll be a to do this and this and this and you get there you’re like whoa that’s [ __ ] right over there and that’s like over there and this is [ __ ]

And I remember just being like oh this is [ __ ] just a different world to what I thought it was yeah I just wondering if as a kid like getting there just feel like what the [ __ ] am I in here yeah I remember every time I ever

Looked at a vert ramp being like these are monstrous like you know when you’re trying to learn to drop in on a four foot quarter you would see a vert ramp and it would be one of them where you’d like go and look over the edge like

You’re scared to look over the edge yeah terrified to look over the edge let alone drop in on it there was definitely that and uh yeah just loads of stuff that was in American Muscle like there was a hip into do you remember that bow they always used to ride with like yeah

I was yeah I rode that yeah yeah must have been seven or eight foot and I think Miron 270s in into this like skinny Landing yeah yeah I know the one yeah yeah that section of miron’s is just [ __ ] top that’s unreal man that’s one of the best sections ever me if not

So did you get so did you get a bike a frame out there or did you get like you had a standard right at one point this is early on I remember that when I saw you at Boneyard let me just give you the

Info I thought this was on a video but I don’t know if it I thought I filmed it but maybe I didn’t on your is it on mine yeah yeah I thought it was but then I couldn’t and then I thought I don’t remember it being on there so you bar SP

To feeble grind yeah yeah it’s on your video what is that Nows in a coffin first first one yeah yeah yeah okay cool man I’m on that like so that was your first video clip I don’t think it was the first video clip but I remember distinctively

Being stoked on it like it could have been I’d say it was from what you’re saying but I remember you going and you being like quite a friendly young kid and like you was into it and you had all the pads and you had all the

Stuff white sta yeah and then like we was just like Milling about just riding as we usually would and then suddenly went B over that driveway bar spin Landing feeble and it was like holy [ __ ] that’s like the latest of latest moves just got done by the youngest kid in the

Skate park and I I just distinctly remember being did I ask you to do that again or did I just catch that by chance I don’t know I probably would have done it again I remember PS like like you were saying earlier like but everyone had pads then

Really so yeah but it was just [ __ ] year olds have humongous like prot Tech KN knee pads and elbow pads that were bigger than my head just like when I look back at it now I was like how did I even move well it was working

When it it was [ __ ] that was that was the uh hot trick of the day and it was done by the small kid so learned them the wrong way what to spin the bars the wrong way yeah so like I did it into the spin like okay years

Later to like learn it the other way like John should have told me earlier on I should have been called out earlier well yeah that stda frame was a bit later so I had the GT when I went to woodwood and then after that I got Sabbath I bought a Sabbath frame and

That was when yeah that must have been around the same time so the GT was around the ramp Works comp time because I had a Sabbath with that United Union Jack seat on it okay off the GT on the Sabbath and then after that the STA came about

Uh I I got hooked up with a local shop where it was uh if you could buy it for cost I bought it for cost I bought the St to C two scoop or custom Riders I think that was who was bringing it in

And they got me the the white sta nice I got that because of the Wakefield lot everyone at Wakefield they all rode stas yeah so so you’ve been to Wakefield a few times at this point yeah yeah so the first time we went to Wakefield there was a coach

Trip from the Boneyard oh so to go to another skate park there wasn’t many we got a coach trip from the Boneyard and we all went to to wake field for the day that was the first time ever went there and that was like because wak field was

A big skate park it had it was yeah it had a thir ramp it had a driveway had a grind box had a vert wall it had everything so yeah so we used to go there as often as we could but that we didn’t get the train there that involved

Getting a lift so we were just back to my dad or whoever to you met like the older guys that rode there at the time right so yeah they were like the first time I met all of those people who I’m still friends friends with now really who that Wolfman

Craig Wolfman Craig Kev Martin yeah don’t see Martin as much I see Craig my son did work experience with Craig with Kev last year went to Craig’s 50th Wolfman John best friend I mean you already knew John but like bestwick went there a little bit as well I think right yeah remember seeing

Bestwick on the vert ramp like I was saying to you earlier about looking over the quot like looking over the deck of a qut like him he was there riding he was pretty much him and John were like the only ones riding the vert and I was just

Blow that was when the vert ramp was in its own room before they opened it and then they had the first time I went there it didn’t have that what do they call it white man’s Rhythm it didn’t have that Rhythm Section in it just had

A spine all right that was the first spine I ever jumped jumped it jumped it to Flat cleared way that’s the way everyone does it man had a was was the spine in the right hand corner or where was that it was next to the jump box so

There was the flat jump box and then it went in oh it’s a free standing spine yeah okay where the second Rhythm probably went yeah yeah I hit it as fast as I could there was no one to show you how to do a spy I just pedal as fast as

I could and landed on the floor had a dino had a dino full face and I landed on my on my neck on Me on the bars was like winded halfway down the m62 driving back C it just just all of it well that place amazing so so do did

You get on after your first trip to Woodward like had you progressed a lot in that first trip or was it the one after that you progressed Thea the one after and the one okay went three times so all right after that I was thinking about this the other day I think that

Was when no the first time I went there was no one there the second time I went John Hall was there who I knew from Manchester just by chance we just obviously booked the same week oh he was at Woodward as well yeah yeah there’s aot John all Ryan

Corrian um afro Pat like all of us all of us there and then the year after that Alli had got into riding so obviously that was further down the line but yeah yeah that that second year and the third year yeah there was there was a trajectory of getting better I remember

Shad shad te taught me fast plants that’s how I learned fast plant okay so good good good teacher yeah yeah so what Ally you met Ally at Woodward or you met Ally in in the UK yeah Ali was Alli used to come to the Boneyard on roll bades before oh

That’s right yeah I remember his story yeah yeah used you all gave him Ma yeah so deserved yeah deserv it the bullying worked he soon well yeah he did everything he had a mountain bike did a motor bike you know was just one of them like you know

Every night was something could do it yeah yeah so then I bet he learned quick on a BMX then right yeah because he had a background in motor cross and mountain bikes and he was quite where as I was like scrawny and malnourish looking he

Was of a dad really tall so like he could throw the bike around really really really easily but yeah he had you know like bright neon Moss helmet and stuff like that but like in no time at all he got really good like he started

Off on a r burer destroyed that and then he as he got better with bikes he just got quick he got good really quick yeah I remember he came out ofwhere yeah yeah obviously where I probably had two two and a half years of BMXing he probably did a year in a bit

And was just like yeah and what you went to Woodward the third time with him with him yeah and a friend from school as well that had got into so yeah there was three of us there and again yeah he loved it we all but like he was he was

Like I think he’s a year is he a year or two years older than me so he was like a year two years older than me so he was getting to the stage where was going to finish school like he he he he loved it there you just like he was just getting

Really good and that was around the time he went and did that um stunt sh yeah that’s right I saw one I didn’t know him one that’s in the video yeah and what was that like um like being at woodwood as a camper like how strict was

It it was pretty strict but I was I wasn’t wasn’t not a toe the line anyway it was just like live and breath BMXing yeah yeah it was I would say it would it was pretty strict you know at night times and all that with curfews whatnot but I was literally just

There to ride that’s all I lived and breathed so it didn’t really you had your head down anyway so it didn’t matter yeah like literally from morning toon night would just be like riding all day on on one you know who was there riding um from the US guys that year

Like can you remember watching people from the US right there yeah there was there was all of them I’ve got hat here yeah got hat with all the signatures on so cool man yeah I’ve kept it like uh Joe Rich Dave fouth Dave mirrer Westell Kenan Harin Mike arene Hollywood

You remember him he killed it was he a TR guy no like Tech like he still rides now like Midwest but he could do everything then he was like remember it yeah no he wasn’t a name you knew but like when you saw him he warranted his name on the hat yeah you

Know people so so that was an eye opener again like seeing those guys in what’s this 97 or 98 yeah 97 says on it so yeah oh cool man yeah so yeah that was they were killing it like oh yeah absolutely killing it and I was into Hook Line and Sinker like I

Bought oversized jeans from Kenan Harkin and those Dave mirror Adidas trainers that were like four sizes too big for me must have seen me coming just I was just buying anything off them basic t-shirt it was like like humongous just Bo anyway yeah all of it but yeah seeing all them was just

Unreal like so they basically rode as as the pros and then we would go back to the cabin with people that were staying there in the summer like Corgan and and those people that are obviously staying and working so yeah I mean all those people that were there then just iconic

People you know yeah yeah right through you know that are just like in it life as you know sh yeah from from that era yeah like all of them just like the best really and really thankful that they were the people that showed you the way

To do it yeah do you know what I mean it could have been someone awful and you went off on the tangent of doing stuff terribly but it it wasn’t going to wash with theml so so how early do you think that you knew that you BMX was going to

Be long term for you because it seems quite early that you knew like this is what I want to do will you got imagine from from seeing John do that demonstration where he literally like at that time so say that ramp Works comp you saw some mad stuff or transfers or whatnot

Yeah i’ SE a demo where John had done bar spin 360 tail whip backflip like in a in a 20 minute show so you were like whoa like they they’re for the big tricks there’s no reason why you know it took I’d seen the big tricks firsthand

Pretty early on so it was like something to Aspire to not that they were the tricks but like he was so dialed then that you were be great to get to get to so it’s from it’s from there like you just like i’ got to do this and then

When we saw him ride like with those or we went to it would have been yeah so when we saw him ride outside of those four tricks he could do everything you know he could could do 540 nose picks he could do everything like that and that lip tricks was definitely something I

Was drawn to quite early on like always love lip tricks yeah like strong at that point that was a they was really strong weren’t they lip tricks they was they was good and they were like they were still a focal point whereas like in more recent times

They’ve kind of dwindled a bit and now they seem to be coming back a little bit but yeah got Joe Rich did the food on the cafe that was like the next step up like rather than on the it was like onto a subbox so it was like the next wave of

Like oh someone’s done it on a b rail yeah but yeah definitely I mean that was something I was drawn to because I wasn’t necessarily the strongest you know to man handle the bike in the air what not but like lip tricks you could just slowly work up to like

Just remember trying to learn them all you know double peg this quarter packe right up to a 10 foot and then F just try and learn them more quite yeah that that that that went into my nature of trying to do everything if I could do it on something I’d try and do

It on everything yeah you know learn a trick and make sure I could do it from this right the way up to anything yeah yeah that’s that’s kind of like we used to learn fly outs with that same mentality I’m going to learn this in a

Fly out and we’re going to be doing it over doubles it was a similar thing you know like you want to learn it to to take it somewhere else yeah and what about school like when you was school for them like years that you’re like you’re still young but you’re fully into

BMX how much of a pain in the ass with school once you left like was that just like I’m F I’m [ __ ] going now I was just was never not that it wasn’t for me I always did it I was always all right at school like all right describe it but

Like I couldn’t wait to get out and just go to the skate park it would literally be like finish go home go to Boneyard like repe and no one knew that I did BMX justt myself to myself like just have have the ride mag behind me French

Textbook so me teacher couldn’t see me like as soon as it was out I’m off that’s what I thought you’d be like what what about the other kids that what was BMX look like to the other kids who didn’t ride BMX at that point in time like you’re the BMX guy there’s probably

One or two of you in that school right didn’t get it yeah and like Ally was a couple years older than me so I’ve got no bones Ally would probably be embarrassed to see me in school you know I would be oh Ally you know like he would be like I’m trying to

Cough off with some 15 year old girl or whatever you just I remember his M think his mat used to give me [ __ ] like who is he like why are you talking to him you talk to me later when I give you little es skate definitely that he was a couple

Years older than me I was just a [ __ ] dog like oh there was definitely that in school and then there was a few people that like road but they were like they weren’t some were serious but they weren’t as serious as me like that was just it just tunnel vision for me like

That was that was all I wanted to do really was just ride and ride anywhere it wasn’t like I wanted to ride one type of thing it was just like just ride any anywhere yeah yeah obsessed yeah you can tell like that’s the the the mind of

Someone Like You like you you’ve gone so deep into it at so many levels so and then like so you start going to like UK contest at his point like further field than local ones yeah well this would be that would kind of be on the transition where John

Would have finished GT and he would be on the STA or whatever so he lived in Chester similar to bwick and a lot of the others they didn’t live near Wakefield they were drive to it and obviously going right there but John was back in Chester he wasn’t traveling

Anymore so he would come to the Boneyard all the time it was much easier to come to us than it was to drive however far till to W field so yeah we just rode with him all the time and then obviously off the back of that and in not having

The um the connection to GT anymore like we’d go anywhere you know we used to go to Bristol comps you know like I remember you know that was not long after he got off GT like remember when he knocked himself out yeah I was that one yeah yeah that was

Like the period where we just started going anywhere you know if you look back on John riding comps there there was probably a big gap between him riding that Bristol comp and king of concrete like four or five years before that’s right over GT no one saw him yeah so

Yeah during that time then every weekend we would just start going to places don’t get me wrong he wouldn’t take us all the time because he had he was still riding with a Wakefield crew but like yeah we had more chance to go to Wakefield or we would go to or all these

Places because we just tag along with John and then obviously that was coming into the time when those kind of those comps were coming up you know yeah I mean when was the first urban games like those kind of contests you know Urban games and 99 or 2000 maybe yeah was bit

Later so yeah Skate and ride comps like we we went everywhere really so he sorted you right out really he was the mentor W he who was who else was in that crew of what that started going around with you John and like who was The Other Guys me John Ally and then

There was people like we’d meet Wolfman and Kev uh Craig uh we’d meet up with Lee M we’d meet up with Manchester guys yeah some of them like maybe maybe clarky and Tommy and them because they were around they’re the same age as me so maybe through not so much like the

Older generation of Manchester Lot H Mark howth maybe like we would bump into them they wouldn’t really they weren’t really in our group grou like those those people really like John Ali me and then we would meet up with um others like Kevin Craig or whatever where they’d still come from Wakefield

And did you know about like the older like the old older legendary guys that had kind of not stopped riding but didn’t ride as much like Chris HR and and the guys from marzu and like Harry and the guys from Manchester did was there like did you know about them guys

At this point or yeah and then people like not so much Harry because obviously I didn’t know much about like sheep and all that kind of era but like used to ride quite a bit with splodge that obviously does yeah because he had the shops in Stockport and so we rode with

Him he was right on my street because he did all lip tricks yeah road with him and then we would see hyr about obviously you know like Street or at the the bone skate park in Stockport so that was that that had a really good scene as

Well that’s right I forgot about bones actually yeah yeah yeah that had a really good scene there all those guys used to ride there a lot didn’t they yeah yeah yeah like yeah Lee would go um what was his name um Tom holes Mike woodier yeah yeah there was loads of

People John all there was loads of people that rode Stockport and then obviously Roe there didn’t they have a little bit as well you had clarky Tommy Gaz Barney you know they were all coming coming same Agee as me coming up yeah that were really good times like

I say really good times we had so many parks up our way yeah I remember that that period where you could just ping pong around that area and there was [ __ ] indoor parks everywhere weren there that was that was right when we were you know right on it so we would

Just go all of those we locals at all of them really yeah Boneyard was our core one but like we would literally go you know ride boneyard in the week and then go to all those other skat parks at the week weekend there was tons of them yeah

Bolton uh Derby storm was coming up there was loads that like you would class as as Northwest pip was it pipeline the other one pipeline yeah that was really good as well yeah that was really used to go there a lot yeah that’s where we yeah yeah yeah

We saw a lot of those Riders there then and then what was like some of them bigger contests that you entered when did you like when did you first get sponsored because this is like around a period that you started getting free stuff you mentioned volume and I forgot

About that was that your first sponsor that was my first yeah first sponsor that so there was when ramp Works was in its second location where it is now i’ I’d got a flow frame for me of the First Federal that Nation oh that’s right the

Red one yeah yeah the F doing like a fast planting dig and that same time that same comp I don’t know how it came about but Jason NS came over and he was riding that contest like I didn’t I don’t know if he was on a tour but he

Literally just came to RW comp which was out of the blue I remember yeah and then thank through him they’d obviously put a good word into 70s and said oh that’s that lad right to ride for volume and demolition because I were quite all right of that contest so yeah that’s how

That came about due to Jason NS oh amazing yeah yeah it was amazing yeah I bet yeah what what frame did you ride the Helen or something yeah that was it yeah yeah I think that was his one and then it was decked out because obviously it was volume and

His one was the Destroyer no that was it was the it was that Helen I’m sure it was the first one yeah yeah it was too long for me that other okay break it that frame I’ve never broke a frame ever oh really unreal head tube on the trm but I’ve

Never broke a frame ever [ __ ] that’s good going man should have done and how how long did you last on on that what what happened with with volume demolition yeah it Chang or did it maybe change dros it changed Dro and obviously but before the volume thing

Like I said earlier like Ian had given me a frame so we’d been down to Hastings John was connected 70 so we went down to h a lot and we met up with them by that time where we knew them more you know so I went to the old 70s Warehouse where

They had the spine and all that stuff and there’s big SNM vert wall and stuff like that so we knew all them so as much as a connection had come from Jason n’s my loyalty was more towards 70s I can’t remember I don’t know who it

Went to was it to scoop or something but there was no connection to Hot Wheels maybe there was no connection to where it went to so it was that I would just stay with 70s yeah I think it went to Hot Wheels and what did what did you go on after

That then fit hman Hof okay okay to them so yeah that that was good I mean from what I was saying earlier but head first like Hoffman was just like the best did you get much coverage on Hoffman I can’t even remember you riding for Hoffman you

Got got quite a few ads that was when uh Big Ed was shooting uh adverts and stuff like that but yeah just just you got to remember there was me baz and John so obviously JN and baz were like yeah here already you know B is obviously based in

Hastings and John relatively well known so like yeah there would be I’d get adverts but there’d be few inire between fitting in between but yeah it was great we went to I went to the European X Games because of Hoffman because Hoffman ran all those contests all right you know like the vs

Comp so they did a Europe I went there won Hoffman due to them and then they they got me to go to China as well I did a uh I went to China with Clint Miller and who else was there a load of the Aussie Riders Zach muso and uh

I forgot the other guy’s name he’s gonna kill me but yeah they gave us a there was a theme park in China that had a skate park and they went there and did instead of demos it wasn’t demos every day you did a contest even though there was only

Five so literally went all the way to China like and you would Place third one day fourth the next day it was the same five people obvious going to a Towers the person the day before hadn’t seen you yesterday yeah yeah of course yeah yeah that was that was yeah really weird

Really weird where was the European X Games then Barcelona all right he was right on the beach that was good that think remember Chris that worked at the Bone Yard used to have dreadlocks at the time vagally yeah yeah well we went we went to Barcelona and then we got the

Train back so we UK yeah like stopped off in Marseilles stopped off in Paris you our defense and then that was when contest were every other weekend so I distinctly remember we went to the European X game took a week to get back to London and

The urban games was on the next weekend all right oh amazing yeah that was great went to Mar and to Paris and what about did you go to any of the bike shows because that was like there had been a couple of bike shows at this point in

Time as well between this hasn’t there yeah the bike shows yeah we went which was the one that road Falls one came out of that was the first one I went to yeah yeah that was 98 yeah that one yeah went to that and that was like that was that was

Like getting I remember buying the only thing I came away with from that day was Road Falls one yeah yeah is right yeah right behind you yeah that was that was a good that was gamechanging because although you know I’d seen some of those Riders at

Woodwood you didn’t know them yeah so to see that for the first time as a trip it was and especially the street stuff you just mine was just blown yeah that was that was a good time on it when every one was kind of like yeah when when things were becoming

Like like ridiculously yeah like like f mind-blowingly hard but like not impossible because you know when things become impossible and now it’s just like oh yeah Bo anyone can do anything it’s kind of like desensitized it a bit you know but back then it’s like what a gap

Gap to rail I remember seeing that and being like how how’s he [ __ ] manage that like just just yeah yeah mindblowing M show was really there was quite a broad scope of people there like yeah yeah it was mixed up fly and you know having those kind of

People where a number of the distribution companies had brought come together and sent people you know as opposed to just being all 70s or all someone else it you know yeah yeah yeah because they well I think it was it was mostly yeah mostly 70s but then you had

A few Riders from standard and stuff like standard yeah Jim Jim Rin massive like fan of him so like iin yeah yeah yeah he was always incredible yeah we got on the back r that video clip yeah absolutely the best anything you ever put out was just like the best oh

And what was the um the urban games that you come back for was that the first one or the second one first one first one first one all yeah had all those War rid and where Scott and Fizz did yeah yeah that was they were cracking weekends

They were yeah they were they were they were good now looking a car on that Pub on the on on the on the green yeah everyone was in the hotel I SLE in the car [ __ ] there was was that there was no one from America over for that one it

Was it was the next one I think that people come over for yeah next one was that wasn’t it yeah yeah a few people must have come over for that first one was Clint the first one I can’t remember but I don’t I remember it just being predominantly

English guys yeah B I remember B doing a Superman to Flat I’ve got footage of him somewhere like does a humongous Superman over the box and clears it there was loads of people rode in that comp like like you said it was more UK based was it yeah I think was what

Was he from Bristol area wer he B Bristol B yeah there was a few from Bristol yeah think remember like I’ve got video footage of him doing a humongous Superman and like just jump box is gone long G and then like so so we’re kind of like

Cruising along into like the be really for me this is like the best ERA of BMX like as as BMX I look back at it now this is like from the late 90s to the early 2000s is’s like that’s that’s the patch that I think is like the [ __ ] you

Know sounds like someone’s getting killed upstairs but yeah um and then like like things are happening like Orchid shoes and like new bike brands but like good good stuff’s going on and you said you was you was TM for orid at one point that was a bit

Yeah it was a bit later that was did so Shadow came before orid yeah when would Shadow started so basically the shadow thing came about because Ali had already gone to America and was like well established okay you remember the adverts they literally like yeah the Riders and they they they gave

I think one or two Riders you could choose each each of the core pro team could choose one or two Riders to be on the flow so that’s how I got the nod with Shadow yeah was you was you on fit when you or you weren’t on fit yet yeah I went from

Hoffman to fit okay yeah I went from Hoffman to fit and then got Shadow Parts because when I was on Hoffman there was no part thing it was just whatever I wanted from 70s really okay but I say so how did you how did you end up from Hoffman to

Fit uh there’s no falling out or what not I think it was just I don’t know when fit started but like they already had baz and John so it wasn’t like yeah you fitted like yeah do you know what I mean that was if you saw how many Brands

There were to have three people on just one of the ones just who we’re gonna put on fit when that came about really and obviously I I’d know known Robo before so yeah it was it seemed like a better better mix you and fit than you and

Hoffman to be fair like you think I didn’t think it at the time but obviously it did it did go on to be that yeah yeah like a younger company and a a newer thing yeah yeah looking back I would say so yeah I mean I was look I

Was looking at the team they’ put together just be like yeah intimidating to be associated with him even on a flow thing from the UK do you know what I mean was you on fit when when they first started then yeah when it first first started okay so that

First video like that that sort of era yeah I think I was the first fit Rider yeah all right amazing with me it must have been like me Scott Edgeworth was on early that’s right yeah yeah yeah who El I think that might be it there might

Be someone else it was it was it was Scott and me okay I can’t think who else it was what what frame did you ride of theirs to start was it the S1 or something is that yeah S1 gr yeah yeah that was good that one yeah that was

Pretty clean looking that was like you know I’d gone from some of the Hoffman bikes and of that time the S1 was clean was it you know it was like graphics and everything was pretty it was all pretty pretty yeah it was like back to Basics

When the Hoffman maybe a bit like bit Guss and a bit like tweaked all that time but then when the yeah yeah yeah it was Clos to me going back to like an SDA or like you know a T1 or whatever it things roll forward don’t they and then they change and they

Just seem to be at at the at the sort of front of that sort of change a bit really like around that time they went to Barcelona like we went to we went to Barcelona about two two or three weeks after they’d all been there for that

Trip oh all right just with my group of friends from that time that was that was quite funny them just was just getting paraded around telling us what they’ done just took us around and just showed us everything you go what you do pre video so yeah the video wasn’t out yet you

Just getting the Insight yeah yeah we didn’t even know they’d gone there but we got there and the locals just basically paraded us around showing us what they’ done and what we weren’t G to do surprise surprise yeah what was your first like your first ad on fck you

Remember I can’t you know No wonder what1 I don’t think it was like unlike the Hoffman thing where they was in they started off low key and then moved up the rank with the Americans they were building it you know like it would just be like Nate Hansen or Edwin or that

Would just be the main focus there wasn’t really a push for UK it didn’t need it because it was building it was building wanted push what they were doing in America all so so what was like the first significant fit thing that happened for you probably just hooking up with them

Whenever they came over really you know like obviously at those times like Robo and Orland were over quite a bit um I went on a shadow trip once and I went to um what you call it root Jam so there was quite eight K and all them were there

That trip that ended obviously it was based around Orlando so obviously Ro Jam was there and then we went off on a on a road trip after that good then root jams how was that what one was it second or third one I think it was the one before it wasn’t like the

Massive sub rail one it was Prett was it or was it might have been a bit earlier Vic Murphy was on one he no it wasn’t that one it wasn’t that one I think it was I think it was maybe the third one the first one was like Jo John Jennings and

That and then there was one with oh yeah yeah okay Rick Murphy it wasn’t that one it was like a third one I I remember not not really being too in too intimidated to ride I don’t remember riding I remember going on the trip afterwards but I don’t to cause

Much and the shadow thing was like that started to take off after this time yeah yeah like we filmed on that trip quite a lot for the section for the first video and then obviously got some footage from in the UK but the main but most of the

Footage from this road trip that we did because it was like skate parks and Street and all that that was really good it was like yeah to go to America and actually doing a road trip as opposed to just going to woodwood that was probably one of the

First times I really did that you know we went to all all the skate parks that they went to in the road Falls when they went to Florida didn’t get to cona that’s one I would have loved to have gone to still all right and who was on that

Trip uh all the teams so it was ali uh John Jennings Ryan Sher Byron Anderson Ronnie B came along and then we met up with like Mike Andrews and uh oh what’s his name now I forgotten used to fire the guns uh Jason Levy remember that guy

Inue recollection yeah yeah he he was wild he jumped like had a fake gun that he would like sh he was on a rooftop and jumped from one roof to the other and the police came careering over wanted all our IDs and he like tried to convince them that he wasn’t actually on

The roof that where they were looking at him from he was on the floor like I was like really trying to [ __ ] him and he was just that’s pretty [ __ ] good that it was really good and Mike and really good as well they had like it was a proper

BMX house that was like we were watching a video and he had two sofas one on top of the other you know like a cinema oh yeah yeah put it above they had that in one of the in the super doome in PA they had one of them

Yeah like double deck of sofa yeah Jason and Mike Mike Andrews they were that was that was highlight of the trip for me them too [ __ ] hell brilliant yeah it was really good it was good like yeah just shot photos and and did video go Joe Simon Joe Simon made that video oh

Joe Simon yeah yeah that’s yeah it was good it wasn’t like it wasn’t of that time when he had you know like epic steady cams and all that it was just more real yeah yeah and what what about um the backyard jams did you when was that a bit

Later like the first backyard Jam you went to was what tford that must have been one of the first ones yeah okay did you go to any K koc’s uh one or two was one where does like a 360 W ride on the fine went to that one can’t remember that was riding

And there was like a sequence of people doing loads of jumpbox tricks and stuff like that yeah we just w p helmet Scott wasn’t that early oh it wasn’t that early no okay The Landing was still as as long slack yeah maybe seen some that on video people’s feet are blowing

Off when they land like yeah unbelievable yeah no that was that was good it was uh going back to what I said I think that was the same year that was it that lad Gizzy I was talking about in Liverpool he tried to drop off the roof into the

Bank like in the street car South SE South okay yeah think was it butcher maybe butcher had a sequence trying yeah I think I he tried I can’t remember who crashed and who pulled it I don’t know year after year someone tried to ride off the all right okay yeah I

Wasn’t at that that one but the being in the king of concrete was as good as a contest like you know we stayed in student Halls like Lee mow and Ally and yeah the Scottish lot were there and stuff like that so it was like that was that was good

Fun yeah back what was the first back up was it tford the second gen the second gen was I think tford yeah yeah that was the first one you went to yeah yeah went that one and killed himself oh that’s the one where you tried to jump the Gap

Yeah yeah so is that is that the crash where you like guillotined on like your body on the I remember yeah I didn’t remember until you just mentioned it I did yeah was Hospital job or was you all right after that what happened there I was mangled

Like that was a classic case of being young and Keen like you know like now I tell kids like just take a second I remember going for it and someone getting in the way and rather than being like I’m going to take five minutes and get the back just went straight back

Round you know thinking you know I’m not important like let’s just get this done just went and as soon as I took off I was like there’s no chance and just just scissored it sideways like I I can remember it that was that was a lost memory until you just brought that out

That’s pretty [ __ ] it was Grim it was Grim there was I think reuben reuben did it maybe someone did it right Ruben did it yeah just instead of onto the bank like onto the yeah yeah even harder where was I just like oh yeah I was in a

Bad way just got wheel just wheeled myself into the hospital in Chester got left back and just like what was the story I didn’t break anything I literally they had like extreme groin strain I think it was like literally there was no skin on the inside of both

My legs like gone where I just like couldn’t walk for two weeks like properly walk like John Wayne for two weeks and that was that was annoying because that was when the 70s trip came to Boneyard after it so likeon and Joe rich like when hullman and all them came

And I would I literally was just barely walking barely back walking rubbish mate is that on video what the crash yeah I think I’ve seen it I’m sure on one of the Scottish videos uh Johnny mingo’s got it on one of his videos yeah I’m sure I’ve seen that on a

Video Yeah anyone anyone with uh any respect would have stopped pressing record but I think Johnny Ming was like yeah he’s he’s he’s dead on filming he’s dead yeah it’s definitely on a Scottish videos I’ll find it and like around this point in time is the time when you took your brakes

Off yeah it was I think it was just a common thing at the time wasn’t it yeah yeah it was yeah it was really blowing up like but I remember the and stuff like that a lot of them were breakless like I remember being on the S1 and the

Breaks were off okay yeah and and how what was that you trying to change up your style and just like freshen it up a bit or what was the story there I just to riding more and more Street really and then like riding all kinds really you know

Just doing the same stuff at the skate parks but then yeah riding Street a bit more and whenever we went somewhere it wasn’t just primarily on the skate park and that was around the time that my crew back in Chester all road so like we

Would go to the backyard J and we’d go street riding you know all around and then and then the contest I remember going to comry and riding Street and we were like six or seven miles away from the contest you know just rid and then

Come back it was it was all that all that time of just like riding more and more Street really did did you at this point did you look at like other sort of the the BMX from before like like the the sort of T1 maybe the T1 era that kind of stuff did

You look at that as like that’s the old stuff and this is the new stuff or you just like just doing something else anyway no not really I wouldn’t say it was the old stuff like the T1 stuff was obviously stuff that was like great and

Everyone aspired to be it but I wasn’t yeah yeah I mean T1 is like an era rather than like because everyone rode like that you know I I I I would like to say that I’d like to try and ride like that but I wasn’t I wasn’t that stylish

Or skilled to ride to ride like that it didn’t it didn’t feel like to me like as much as I could like appreciate I just meant that as like an era like no one could ride like them guys but they everyone wanted to ride like them guys and then like the

Breakless thing come out and that was like the next thing that everyone wanted to ride like so I just wondered if that was like so for us like we we would have seen trail riding and been like I we ain’t really riding that ramp anymore we’re going to ride Trails like you know

Because it was like to us it was like the new thing and we was happening and it was like I just wondered if that was the same Vibe I think it was probably just the influence of being on the fit team and seeing what the American fit

Team were doing you know like Edwin and and there was quite a few of them wer there that was probably break yeah yeah yeah I would like die hard into the New York street teene but like loads of people took their brakes off off the

Back of that and rode in way no hot thing yeah yeah it just changed tried to give you more control really it seemed like that was quite refreshing at the time because you were just getting very stuck in the thing of doing you know the same lip trick yeah of course yeah yeah

Yeah more Street ring as had got more more skillful to actually ride street properly do you know what I mean where before you would go out and do every local handrail but now you could maybe toothy anger it or ice pick it or so you you say that helped you helped your

Rideing it was quite a refreshing change yeah I think it gave you more control though definitely yeah definitely what I mean yeah yeah even even to ride breaket in a skate park you know you would like have to under pump or you know you know all that stuff slow it and

Control it down where as you had the break before that that would do that yeah definitely helped on street riding it it what I was doing definitely changing like manual to Bar spin or something without catching the break and and that more handil stuff really yeah okay and this is

Like I guess this was just before you took your brakes off but you got the cover of ride yeah you still had a break on right yeah I’ve got a knock on cable on I’ve got all the all all time I’ve got Chris King head set I’ve got every

Ripoff yeah yeah so must have been influenced by ruin and the like what what was the story of the the cover of ride was that Northern John who shot that that it was l oh was it yeah yeah L shot that yeah okay I think we’d met

With him a few times like just because he’d been up to Chester because he was quite strong friends with Robin so that’s right yeah he would come up and see Robin and stuff like that and we’d ride together in that and then I remember coming up and he was saying

That you could get the cover if you’ve got something good to do he distinc said you could get I was like right get down this and rail so that hand is Big yeah yeah it’s big it’s one of them though like going back to what I saying earli about skilled

Like it’s big but it’s steep so when you get on you go into the bottom it’s not one of them where you’ve got to like I didn’t have the control like to get okay literally like you’re on and you going to the bottom because I think

I you you’ve got that on film that one yeah that’s on like that was around the time we were filming with my friends to kind of make our own video okay and that’s online yeah yeah that one yeah so I saw because I saw it from the cover I

Didn’t know it was so big but when you see it on the footage you can tell like it’s a big one yeah there’s one on one side and there’s an even bigger one on the other side that that uh Josh has done it’s so the lad like the other

One’s even bigger again oh okay how was that like cover of ride good yeah yeah definitely and then it kind of like that’s what I’m saying for like the Hoffman thing like it was like great I’ve got a cover do you know what I mean like it it was good and obviously 70s

It’s given me all kinds of bikes it was kind of like felt good to actually get give something back get good coverage yeah die you you’d been in the mags like a bunch of times though at this point right yeah some of the squat bags had St

Shot stuff and stuff like that like whole Pipeline and then we’ had we’ had the interview me and Ali had that interview that split interview yeah and then a few other photos and stuff like adverts and stuff like that and comps and stuff but yeah that was like a

Distinctive like cover yeah I him saying like if you can do something good get the cover so it was like right let’s go there oh cool man yeah that’s good nice where where were we from can’t be a cover no yeah cover’s pretty like prominent and it it’s like a bit of a

Distinction you know um and then like so Orchid shoes what was the story there uh you said you was TM from him that was a bit later on yeah so at one stage I started to do a bit of work for 70s on the website and was okay I got to choose

Like a few people to put on the team that was a bit later on that was like when Jason felen and uh okay so you’re going to 2005 or something a bit later bit later I can’t remember I thought I think the thing with 70s was

Like you know obviously if you had a bike if you had the bike sponsor and then you had the part sponsor whatnot so I’ve got fit Shadow oh we got shoes now you know it was just like you know it was like who was already on in in in in

The group yeah yeah in the family yeah yeah yeah so it was just an extension of that really and what was what was orid shoes did you ride for them just for 70s or was that a us thing no just for 70 just for 70s yeah just for 7s okay I

Think I think Robin was one of the only ones that was a UK based Rider but like had a stronger connection like he was in that video that they they did that’s right yeah he was on that road trip when he a lot of the sponsors were just 270

So it was just like a UK based hookup real yeah all right um so yeah so then you had like your breaks come off and um can you remember the street fire days yeah remember Street fire but yeah what when like yeah a lot of people had

Something to say about you taking breaks off on Street fire right so yeah I thought I thought you told me Maybe I’m Wrong here no I don’t remember I maybe okay maybe I got it wrong I just thought that that was because that was like the opinionated like what’s he doing coming

Over to our yeah yeah yeah yeah mayic infringement that sort of you know you know guilty guil 100% I want in with a cool kid and then like so so from there like let me just check this out um so then we’ve kind of like around the

Time of is this around the time of roundabout or like we are you doing Red Bull demos first Red Bull demos and all that first yeah okay yeah all right so so yeah how how did that all happened the Red Bull demos and the like all that

Stuff again to like through JN and baz really because obviously baz rode for Red Bull for a long time like rode with baz for I think I think the first times we met him with Urban games and then like he used to come and stay with us in

The summer a couple of times you know like not for long but he would just come up and we’d go Derby storm or whatnot yeah Sim similar age and obviously riding Hoffman and stuff like that yeah and yeah he was on Red Bull and then John John obviously knew those those

People so we just just came came as a package really I think you know like just when those were done like I couldn’t a very high in a vert ramp I was just your token like tech tech you know yeah yeah yeah yeah just really you know where the others

Could all high that was when like ver demos yeah only just vert demos yeah uh yeah a couple of spine demos and stuff but most mostly ver like we did lead and reading we did um te in the park in Scotland uh what else did we do a guy

Watched a full demo at te in the park naked just off his box who are the other guys just just you three or was there other people yeah uh Scott did a few Jerry did quite a lot of them yeah Jerry did a lot of those V

Zack uh who else then it’d be random people that would just pop in yeah it was mostly that Jeff used to do a lot I remember crazy yeah I didn’t know that he did a lot I’ve seen footage of him riding on one of them but yeah I didn’t know he

Did a lot of them I think he did a few I remember I remember him doing it been there a few he definitely did there was one in Manchester that they did and it was like him Zach Scott and then they all went home and me and my friends bled

Their hotel we just went in and said that we were them like plush hotel across the way it was great it was welled rocked up Mr Jerry gy or what did they pay like them vert demos they were good like yeah the money was really good and that was at a time

When I didn’t have any outgoing so I I saved it I saved most of it yeah like that was yeah that and then that was like the same year was king of Street and stuff so I ended up with like saving loads of money in one year so oh because

What did you did you win at king of Street one yeah that’s like one of the only comps I ever won at so we did it there was a demo I’m sure there was a ver ramp demo there as well cuz I remember going there getting paid for

The demo and then competing in the comp and winning that so I ended up like C up yeah definitely was there was definitely a vert thing there because I watched it like last week or whatever yeah I’m sure it was demo okay placed in a vert comp

It was a vert demo so we remember was getting it was a Red Bull vert ramp I’m sure it was it was a Red Bull event was it was it I can’t remember yeah so them demos were like you did them for one summer yeah and then you the king of

Street was like in the middle of them I guess yeah in Birmingham yeah you won that contest yeah can you remember what that paid for the winner on that contest yeah I got two grand in a day wow with that the ver demo I always but all I had all they had to

Show for it a year later no was a mini disc player that broke one day out one day out warranty I remember treating Wolfman and everyone to uh Little Chef on the way home just like celebrate treat yeah that’s probably the only comp note that I ever won really can you

Remember what you did in that comp like the big the big moves SK as fakey you remember I remember the fakey yeah yeah I’ve seen it on video Yeah shocker and then just fast plant any ramp that was there there’s a I remember r a photo of me doing a fast plant

One-handed and the like one-handed fast plant I was getting off it was a bail I was J okay yeah but who did you be you remember yeah like Clint Miller Scott Jerry uh pill pill took oh that’s why he knocked himself out yeah yeah bad yeah everyone of that time was there

Really it was a big one every every rider was there but it was no crowd it looked like there was no one there at all no I don’t know if it was not publicized or what but it was it was massive yeah it looked like in a huge

Arena where no one there yeah it’s weird don’t know where they used to do gladiators and all that one it that oh was it yeah yeah yeah was it but NEC was it no it wasn’t NEC it’s the one in the city center I can’t think what it’s called now

Okay not the NC it’s one right slap bang in the middle of Burmingham all right yeah you’re right now now you come to think of it yeah there wasn’t many people at all you can see it on the footage yeah there’s no one there did

Yeah money R yeah [ __ ] him to right job done um and then like you end up moving to London for like a winter like that was off the back of that saving and like ever since I left College I went I worked at my mom’s business is what I

Run now so from 18 to now I’ve worked in the business so it was like I’d saved all this money I was like just gonna just gonna go and have a like a gap year I don’t know old yeah gonna go live a little yeah 22 yeah I don’t even remember why

Why London I think we’ve just done a load of trips there and obviously what you were saying earlier about street riding it was just it was just it was untapped as you used to call it yeah 100% you didn’t go anywhere it’s untapped that was one of

Our quotes we still use that one you didn’t leave W still I lived in hack me we we still use that one we use that untapped yeah it’s [ __ ] classic man love it and and yeah well the riding was different was it like the riding that you was doing was completely different

To what everyone else had done because he hadn’t reached that level yet so but yeah it I don’t know why it came about like I wasn’t necessarily close with Marvel Benson but I must have been down I’ve been down a few times just with trips with clarky or or with my group of

Friends yeah and twigged that they were moving there as well because that was who I it was the only people I knew that were gonna that live there that rode was Marvin and Benson really and then you ja yeah that’s it yeah Jack yeah that’s

What I live with I live with Jack cool man that was a good time yeah but it’s like you came like in a real bad sort of time of year didn’t you yeah just just as it was getting like dark you know yeah just stupid optimism

Like and then you went just as it was like getting better again like you seem to be not that long yeah found out was G to be a dad that’s why yeah I remember I remember you saying you telling me yeah I remember great like literally like cheap

As chips I had to like move my move my mattress when I open the door to like into my room but I was never there like and just every day would just go out in a different direction the problem I’ve got is when I look back on it no one

Else was unemployed so I would go out first thing in the morning because I’ve been used to you know going to work at 9 in the morning go out first thing and go like miles find a load of stuff by the time I got back and Marv finished work

It was like fancy checking out 18 to this you know it didn’t really come off but there was great times you just found just went all over the place and obv I remember used to go on filming missions as well didn’t you it was like maybe that was at the weekends and stuff

But yeah I remember that like footage crop up someone would have it I can’t even remember who but yeah because you went out with lmip a few times didn’t you yeah used to with lmip quite a bit remember yeah quite close with L like he to ride he didn’t live far I lived

That’s right yeah rode there and then used to ride there I’d go to PlayStation there wasn’t many that’s the thing with London that probably probably still the same now there’s not many places to ride under cover like you go same yeah meanwhile you know PlayStation as it was

Or B 66 whatever it was that one Seven Sisters was it that was like underneath a community center it was the one in it wasn’t Seven Sisters it was the one in Baker Street it was near Baker Street there quite a bit or or are you talking

About the squat that was in Seven Sisters no there was a there was a community underneath it in the in the Arches was was ramps we WOD there quite a bit because no one ever went there oh no that’s in um South London I think no it’s

Not not you’re either talking about the place in Baker Street which I can’t remember the name of the place which was in West London yeah that’s probably more closer to there or there’s some arches in South London which you can’t even get in there yeah I don’t know where that it was

Definitely North London okay it would be Baker Street place then yeah Community Center and then down below there was like an few couple of quarters that was it yeah but it was good there yeah I can’t remember what it’s called but it’s it’s got a certain name for that club yeah

But we I went all over used to go and ride out and meet Taliban Tom and go TS me and and then go out as far was like Crystal Palace that all quarter and stuff like anywhere uh yeah what was that roundabout where they did the London’s calling dfu uh South London

Can’t it’s called oh elephant and castle Yeah there yeah yeah all around there anywhere really yeah yeah there’s a lot of stuff out that way there was there was there was so much stuff that I found that I couldn’t even I couldn’t even remember how to get back to a week later

You know I just not made any wasn’t like you didn’t have an iPhone where you could like pin Lo yeah know I just had a little a toz London map that I just scribbled on and then I bought a London map that was the size of my

Wall like full size like eight foot by eight foot off Ordinance survey and we just come home and put where where stuff was but we never got back to most of it it was like it was great but you weren’t going to ride do something gnarly on

Your own 10 mil while everyone else was at work so it was it was a bit of a failed plan really but there was definitely some good time still pretty [ __ ] interesting though was great like look driving around every day just going out in a different location in

London few sketchy moments but like not bad considering yeah t t’s made like probably not at that point but [ __ ] TS made 10 years before was [ __ ] ludicrous yeah I remember the only the only time that we’ really gotten some Lads followed us you know there’s an

Estate when you ride from Angel down to Houston there’s an coun estate on the left I remember riding in there once and just seeing some guy get hit with a baseball bat and we just like swerved around and doubled back and then these Two Fellas just followed us

For miles on mountain bikes trying to like you know waiting for backup to basically off us but like that that was it really most people keep kep themselves to themselves like if it was going to kick off it was going to royally kick off or nothing at

All it wasn’t like in Liverpool and and up our way you’d get SC kids like you know chatting [ __ ] at testing the water yeah not there it was either all or nothing it was like it was either you’re gonna get your back just taken or nothing at all and I was lucky

It was it was nothing at all 9% of the time so that’s good it winter anyway so people are scared to come out in the winter man even the steel bikes um so then like so roundabout is around this time yeah yeah 2006 yeah and what was like what was the

Idea first one was when I was in London the first one was first one was when you was here yeah yeah yeah because we went a lot there there’s a load there’s a whole section in it where we London features heavily and then we ride um

What you call it the temps barrier and TS me we ride all all the spots that I’d found I took them to okay so you still here for that so that was what was that one okay and then we went you know we went all around the country but when we

When we were in London and a lot of the footage that built up my section was from from London the first and the second one was was when I built up my sections by footage I’d got in London outside of the trip oh all right all right that makes sense yeah because that

Big ra that Ali does that’s in Hackney is it it’s probably right near where you live right next to live yeah in h yeah and what was the idea of roundabout have you seen it recently I watched it the other day I think the only the first

One’s online I don’t the second yeah that’s right yeah I haven’t seen the second one at all but the first one I watched I was like whoa what’s going on here it was like I think like from this is what I think when I yeah when I looked at it

The other day I was like oh so this is like a reaction against like the the sort of punk heavy metal skulls and and and like Dagger of of BMX that came before it because it was so polar to that and I thought these guys are trying to like

Make it brighter and friendlier and like more sort of house music almost you know I think it was I was thinking it was two things I think those colors and everything you’ve just mentioned there is Robin to a te yeah like yeah the graphics like was like really sort of

Kids TV show kind of yeah but that was Robin Robin did a lot of the graphic design Robin did the did the image I think so yeah B but like yeah you know they were both you wouldn’t you wouldn’t say that baz or Robin were synonymous

With like heavy metal or you know yeah yeah of course that’s what I’m saying yeah and then and then Ed obviously that edited it if you think he’d done number 10 number 10 a bit is pretty much the round about trip but just a a scene

Video yeah it did but it didn’t look as like the same feel yeah yeah but then the soundtrack on number 10 is not too dissimilar to the soundtrack of something like roundabout it would use music that was in the charts and it would use classic music and it would use

You know borderline some dance pop music it was like it was I remember number 10 as being quite an indie soundtrack but maybe I’ve got that wrong but I think yeah but there was definitely lots of Indie music in roundabout one and two but it was mixed in with stuff that you

Would hear in the chart which was probably yeah well it would have done at time but like from from what people tell me now and did then and obviously it was free with ride it went down well you yeah and there was all of us lot that were kind

Of like Riders of that time that people had seen in the mag so it was like and we a grp yeah how did you pick them Riders like did you have anything to do with picking or was it they just chose you and you was in yeah it just

Organically happened that we were all friends like Kaleb lived in Hastings baz had lived with Ian was in Hastings for the number 10 years uh Su had always come down from Hastings and obviously I was close allly was always close with Robin because he grew up in Manchester

And he knew baz and he knew me so it was just like yeah perfect I don’t you know if you got Caleb and and then Su like they’re quite complete you know opposite type riding stles but it somehow worked we were just close friends and what was

The like how did that end up on ride and like what was the the background did you know any of that stuff or you don’t know in what sense Robin work there work he was working there okay yeah he was working there okay the first one was

Free the first one was free with ride yeah I remember it yeah and what was the product range t-shirts and sweatshirts or more than that yeah it yeah it was just it was just those two in bright colors yeah that was it I think was

There was no real it was just an excuse to get those group of riders to go on a trip all right really and then obviously after back of that like they baz and Robin could be quite creative in terms of like the you know they gave it a name

And and everything like that really because outside of that everyone that was on that trip would have rode for companies like Caleb would have gone on a metal trip or Ally would have gone on a shadow trip or yeah whereas that was just an excuse for us all to get

Together and go around the UK and obviously we you know hit shops and stuff like that that sold I don’t I don’t think a large amount of clothing was sold really you know it was it was more about just using it an excuse to go

On the trips it was a crew it sounds like it a crew video really yeah it was just a crew video we just obviously use that as as the means to to go around yeah I know what what was it like what was the where did it want to go though

Like did it want to go somewhere else or did was that just it and it just kind of peeed out I you’d have to ask them like I there was never any I don’t think the rest of us had any involvement really like okay it was just like are you into this you

Know it was two close friends that we you know we were good friends with and rad with quite a lot with bar and Robin and they were just doing this outside of what they wanted something creative you know outside of Rob a ride and bar riding for

Red Bull and stuff like that really yeah and Ed Ed filmed it yeah edited it yeah yeah edil edited it yeah so you know like with him doing number 10 and bright and Ain ready and stuff there was quite a lot of it was a quite distinctive way

That he edited stuff that you know coming off the back of the likes of uh voices and and those kind of videos like number 10 was just an extension of it and he worked at 70 so it was all all tied in what did you what was your view

On voices when that came out oh that that was like for us you just heard obviously before the internet you just heard like Rumor Mill of stuff that over the penin because Sheffield’s not far from was yeah you hear Snippets of what stuff people have done some of

It was [ __ ] you know like some of it just came out across it’s like no they didn’t but like a lot of it was just like in the same way you were saying earlier about trajectory like a lot of those those people had just got together

And they were like they were at the level of the Americans yeah in Sheffield so you were just like oh yeah and no one really no those guys have been pretty underexposed as well until that video came up yeah well they’ both they’d all probably been

Um you know not heard of where they’ came from like Marvin Newry and Joe and they would come to Sheffield and it just worked as a perfect melting pot for them all to get like really good really quick yeah was was was there any ever any negativity about that video in your in

Like the people that you knew did anyone ever like go well you know uh the roundabout video no the voices video yeah I don’t see how you could oh I heard people talk [ __ ] on it yeah but I just wondered if you did as well they

Didn’t make it yeah yeah yeah yeah no it was it was it was make it they probably that their scene wasn’t progressing as quickly as theirs was it was pure pure Envy talk but like you know people were young and you expect that but what about roundabout did people uh ever say

Anything to you about that or did not have to me just now I’m sure no I’m sure like I can see how it was my M like definitely I can see how it was but like I don’t know I wasn’t the type that people would like say

Something I wasn’t like I wasn’t on a message board saying [ __ ] yeah you didn’t care yeah I’ve always lucky that I’ve always whenever we’ve gone somewhere like although there would be clicks I’ve I’ve always rode with like I could go to Sheffield and ride with I know all them

Lot you know we go to Warrington and we’ ride with them I could go to Preston and to ride will Jackson and Northern John just because we traveled all the time we knew everybody yeah you know so it wasn’t like he was these coming in trying to do our our spots yeah

Everywhere anyway and especially with like the crowd they were all of my my age so when I moved down to London and Marvin Benson was there it was like great what about Marv he was he was spot militant was he when he came here when

He I always got on with no yeah totally but I I love the fact that he’s so spot militant like I just find it funny how you you got on with him like protective yeah yeah totally what he was spot milting about spots in London yeah yeah ow from

There stories of him locking hand rils and all sorts you know like all that stuff he good man I think it’s funny needs to unlock his bike never mind lock I like it I like you know there’s plenty of people that like a Meek and don’t say anything

Like at least at least you knew where you stood with him yeah no he was probably one of the people that pushed me riding when I lived in London like probably one the only like you said earlier RO with like LM siip and stuff like that but Mar was really

Good so when we would go out we would we would do stuff yeah yeah he wanted to do push me yeah he pushed me it wasn’t like I’m going to go out with someone that’s like not going to do a handrail like he was going to do stuff he was doing on

Voices and tomorrow he work so like I definitely read off Marv during that short time I was there cool and did you end up on the the car heart thing was that when you was in London or was that pre when you was in London so pre before I came to London

Jack got me a hookup with Hurley because he worked at Hurley okay uh was in the East end where it’s where Kart is now or was yeah yeah shortage somewhere I think yeah I remember the offices yeah hawton hotel that area yeah that’s it yeah so

Jack worked for Hurley and got us like a hookup for that during that round about one phase and then when I moved to London the hurly thing stopped and I’d become friends with uh James Fairbanks and he wor so because he at that time we used to ride like we used to

Rideing he didn’t ride street all the time but once a week we’d go to Scots ramp so we go yeah yeah yeah and get the was it the silver link yeah and then ride through the tunnel well the high tunnel yeah you go wage and you ride through the tunnel yeah through the

Watch tunnel and then we weren’t far we used to go every week to start R yeah so that’s that’s how I got to know uh James really and then from that yeah got got sponsored by car again just do like a hookup in in London and then it progressed to

Like the European team so it kind of stepped up to where I was riding for Mike MD because he was like involved with carart the time what was that money a money deal or was that just Stu it came on to be a small amount of money

Deal but yeah like first it was just clothes but those clothes are so expensive I still got coats now like you used to get a set amount of you know like 20 items you could order all right so I’d order 10 coats I’d have like two T-shirts and 10 coats now they’re like

250 quid each like these coach lasted me I me 15 years I remember that being like a remember everyone had well not everyone but a few people had them big car heart stickers on their down tubes I always remember seeing like [ __ ] I hated them I was [ __ ] like [ __ ] off yeah

But yeah it was good that someone yeah I was [ __ ] Marv used to sport him quite a bit as well did Mar ride for carart he must have done because he had them big stickers quite often yeah well there was a time when I

Kind of got Mike MD wanted me to put a UK it was so shortlived like I rode for carart for a while and then they wanted to expand it into like a UK team so I put forward eight nine people and did a load of work got a load of orders put

The clothing in they got like a small amount of stuff and then they canceled it as quickly as that i’ done a lot of work it was it was disappointing really yeah because they’ve had a German team for years yeah yeah there was a whole you know they had flat land and all

Kinds like I went on a few car heart trips abroad with like uh Andy I and Ben henon and stuff like that hanu KS there was loads of people that were on that’s it yeah but then he literally sent me an email saying can you put a UK team together I did that

With everybody from like Alex Don to faren and toar and then within a month sacked it all off and just kept skateb team yeah disappointing yeah they they got they shafted Benny out he went to Barcelona and H himself and then didn’t get him back he had to get him

Home that was that was okay yeah low blow that was Sour yeah yeah it was really because they well had the means to do so and he not to get Ben home so yeah fck that yeah and then like so so then we’re kind of coming up to like

The fit UK team right yeah that would be the four down yeah obviously the four down was established there and fit was with four down so yeah doing the yeah and there was like some pretty good trips to like weird countries in Europe they were really they were the the best

Trips for me was but you so this is around the time that you’re getting injured all the time remember this period right it was like was it after round round about two or something yeah 2006 I had I had my son and then I first Empire dir I blew me ACA

ACL out in practice and then after that got better broke my hand like within two weeks of being back on my bike and then yeah and then I went on the so the first fit trip I didn’t realize I on ACL I Empire dur and then went on the first

Trip to Greece wobbled man was out like day one like literally had to sit in the hostel like day one and then uh second trip in Helsinki tried to do a flip and on the rotated Street and broke minap fractur mini cap open yeah I mean by the by the grand

Scheme of things in terms of like the Gladiators of old like Hoffman and man and DM yeah but I remember it was like CL clack clack clack I remember couldn’t make I couldn’t make the end of a fit trip it seemed like like but then I remember you like just

Going riding and I can’t remember where I was and you just [ __ ] at it like in between all the crashes that you’d had like you just like do and you just at [ __ ] I can’t remember what you’re doing and I was like you know one of them times

Where you you eat [ __ ] and you get up and you’re just like what the [ __ ] like what am I doing it was one of them sort of moments and I just that was in between all the other [ __ ] that was going on and did that ever cross your

Mind think [ __ ] this is not worth it because it just seemed like he was injured for about two years the ACLS were so destroying like I mean the only saving grace I would say of that is whereas if someone does their ACL now that’s young and coming up they’ve got

To just sit there for six months I had a young son I had the business that I worked within so it’s like for me that time did tick by quite quickly but I mean I did my ACL twice and that took me like nine months both times to not being

Able to ride and having to do Physio and stuff so that was so destroying yeah it seemed from a from a distance it seemed like you was out forever like yeah yeah yeah at that time it definitely came if you looked at that period of

Five years like I did both me acl’s yeah broke broke my hand like fractur my kneecap on a trip like it did it it was like I can’t make the end of a fit trip every year that was a one trip that I look forward to that was a can ofon

Wheel trip that was still going and I could have made the end of a trip every time like they look fun as well so yeah they really good yeah Sweden Sweden was good the last one Sweden and then we did one to to France and then they were really good I made

Made a full duration on them so was this like so that was after that you wrote the soul Bowl event yeah download yet that just before I guess right or did you yeah ear yeah yeah it must be 2006 2007 that was no that was it that was 2006 the only

Reason I know that why is I got an invite to the download contest and I get there and I brought brought my Ms with me who’s pregnant okay there’s no room for us there’s not enough room for so I ended up having to sleep in a bed with

Me and my mes and in the next bed was AE Kowski and me m was just like what are you done I couldn’t afford to get as our own hotel room because I wasn’t one so there was three two beds me and M in one and AEM in the other [ __ ] hell that

Was random I should have just got home [ __ ] and you rode that that thing as well right yeah who was it was that Joe Richard was it that one yeah when he did the like big pocket big pocket yeah big pocket Ruben rode it uh it was load

Maybe was Garrett there yeah Garrett was there H who else Zack I don’t think it was one when like Ki craft and bck and all them were there tab I think was there yeah I mean and who who played and what was going on like are you riding

While people are playing or what’s the story it was just like imagine the V like the hot the humongous but I don’t even they must have come over from America it must have done they shipped it yeah yeah if you crashed you had to be let out by one of the corners they

Dropped the corner and you dragged you out that way but yeah it’s just a huge vert ramp tent above it so if it rained you could still ride it and then it was just in the middle of like the middle of the download Festival so you couldn’t see people

Playing from the the decks no there was like um again they must have shipped in the you know all the stands and stuff like that so there was tears of stands that people around but I remember that being like amazing you know like yeah because all those ver contests they when

Did you get Joe and Reuben and and it was weird I don’t know how it came about but yeah it was it was good crap yeah it looked I watched some footage the other day it looked cool yeah who played who played on that um I remember slay I remember Slayer

Slayer played yeah yeah yeah that was about I don’t know I wasn’t up on all those bands I remember Slayer Slayer and sleeping in the same room as aim kelu he misses those are the two things I remember I was I thought I thought he might have slept on the floor

And done the right thing but he just sound like he wanted to wanted to take the bed it was a bit like six cents you know just like she was just like what going on yeah forgive me and then like so after that you got like you got the ride

Flip cover was that on a trip that was on a shadow trip for the second video so I’d gone down to 70s and that’s one of the only times that someone had had ever been sent specifically to film with us so Johnny to the UK to to film a section

All right we did a road trip from from Hastings right up to by where I lived uh Ally was meant to be on the same trip but he’d hurt himself at a contest in America so by the time we got to Chester he was just riding again but he missed

Most of that filming trip it was meant to be me and him yeah obviously and then it Robin came along shooting photos for ride so it turned into like was shooting and then yeah again for me wanting to ride obscure spots we went and Ali wasn’t with us or whatever I

Just went to all random spots you know went to like reservoirs and Milton King that ditch and stuff like that so we W quite a lot in London as well on that trip like when Ro meanwhile and and all around there West West Ham all the spots that

Had I don’t think most of them places are there anymore in West Ham yeah oh really that like drive under the FL yeah I think most of that it’s been fully from what I hear it’s been fully redeveloped down there so I don’t know if that stuff’s there anymore but I just

Tapped into everything of the time I said earlier where no one was about to film I just went back and had all those locations so just went with Devin and went around London and you know that yeah no one’s no one was riding to West

Ham to see what it was to ride back then like no it was like kind of it’s it’s in an obscure place of like no bike scene around it well back then it was anyway yeah well that was the thing when I would just go to West Ham and then go

Down to like Canary WF and just look around there and then occasionally ride ride through that same tunnel I was mentioning earlier meet up with Taliban or yeah okay you just go you’re off off the Beaten Track yeah W and all them places yeah was and all that because no one went

Yeah and like also so also like you’re coming up to like more sort of modern stuff now and he’s like the the lock the canal lock Gap yeah that fil so that was off the back of so obviously coxy was doing the main filming for four down so it was it was

Quite good the fact that obviously with Ian being at the helm and having more of a say so previously we never got a looking to get any footage in a fit video you know van and and those people obviously Ian was pushing for us to get more footage so we put a section

Together for the UK Riders which I think went on the bonus or whatnot yeah that like coxy had come up few times to to to film with us so we just did like a trip where like you know with riders like Benson was up there and there was a few

Other from up farway that Ro so yeah my how the lock came about is uh between 2003 and 2006 before we had our first son my wife was at Union leads so that L leads all right similar to when I was when I was living in

London I was going all the time to leads and exploring there just the same so I obviously that spot you know I wasn’t new to that spot but like yeah rode Street and seen it and realized you could write it as a quarter but like the more and more I

Looked at it it was it’s not too the similar to the boneyards Channel all right it looks tight though like really tight The Landing is super tight so whereas normally you would go across and like cut the transition halfway up across and just ride it out with a wide

Landing you had to Arch it you had to go higher than the quarterpipe to get the ark all right so yeah that just that just came about we were riding the street one day and I was just like I KN I know that’s there do I bring it up

Do I bring it up as soon as I call it out I’m gonna have to go so and then I was just like yeah let’s go there so that’s why there’s no photos I didn’t tell anyone Benson didn’t have his camera we were just like let’s go and

Look and then the problem is if I call it normally if I called it out I’m going to do it that that that normally what happens I don’t normally back down from it and how how how long did that take how long did that take for you to figure

That out like right this is where I’m gonna I’m G to come through it and I’m gonna take off a nervous like cleanup you know like brushing it down is this I was more I wasn’t worried about falling into the water I wasn’t worried about that I was

More worried about like just crashing into the other side stairs wall just like full Pelt but like I said it is very when it it was very similar to the Bone Channel like and I’ve rode that my whole life how far across was was that channel you

Think I don’t know 14 164 maybe I don’t know big yeah yeah wide as wide as a barges and and then some on both sides yeah but the quarter is perfect it’s like they’re both perfect it’s just because of how narrow it is on the

Side or is it it’s got to be as wide as two barges is it for yeah two barges yeah however why too I don’t know but that’s why there’s only other video footage of it because there was no one had a camera because I didn’t tell

Anyone I was going to do it it was just just like just in the back of my head all day like I know that’s there should I do it should I do it right okay let’s go there and what how many that was obviously one shot like just one how many how many

Run-ups three three or four that’s what I was going to say got two or three yeah I can’t do that anymore cuz then was with no break as well like just so you couldn’t stop if you GNA yeah no break yeah all right yeah yeah that was quite if I was

Going I wasn’t G to stop anyway like yeah something might happen like oh [ __ ] this is not right and you have to stop you know but yeah it worked anyway that’s worked for me sometimes and it’s definitely not worked for me others how I go about stuff and like it

Works and it and then when it doesn’t it really doesn’t yeah can’t multiple thing I can’t do multiple trips I’ll just be like yeah no it makes it it makes it worse yeah you have to make the make the choice yeah yeah that’s why I knew when I I called

It out I’m like I am G to do that I’m not going to go there and not not try it yeah that was quite a [ __ ] that was a good one though man that’s that’s normally like a lot of my sections are that there would just be like one one

One one one off big hit you know out of a section of like mediocre it’s like you know I’ll get just one big clip that I’ve wanted to do they never never it’s never a multitude I’ve never had a film in time where you get multiple big moves

It’s normally just one in one edit one in another edit yeah but your writing’s quite like the other stuff you do strong anyway so like you don’t really need all that multiple like pretty [ __ ] yeah feels good to get those done oh yeah yeah 100% but like the other stuff’s [ __ ] good

So yeah well I would say like ever since having my kid like my riding’s felt the best it’s ever felt really especially in these last five years or so that’s [ __ ] cool man I’ll tell you what I noticed the other day uh a decade over a spine yeah that

Was again I’d learned decades and was doing an interview and was like I’d like to do then not many people did no no that’s right yeah it’s not the cleanest John but yeah oh man I’d say that was pretty [ __ ] good though I was out of

The blue I was like what the [ __ ] he just decaded the spine yeah so I never even seen you do a decade before I learned them on the floor flatl one years ago like I you do a few flatl moves and the decade was one of them and

Then just just remember learning them on like a you know just like a fly out onto the deck yeah and then I haven’t done lots of them just to do them on jump boxes and then and did I’ve done one on a spine I think that’s the only one I’ve

Ever done is that the only one you’ve ever done over a jump or just the jump box as well I’ve done over jump boxes multiple that’s the only one I’ve ever done over the spine it looked like it worked over the spine I thought that was one of them

Where I was like that worked out better than I thought it would for once you know normally ends in a heap but yeah no that was that was that was a good part that that was the old Darwin Park I don’t know if you yeah that’s right yeah was the upstairs at

The Mill thing was it yeah yeah yeah so then we’re like we’re kind of like coming up to date um and uh I wanted to ask you about the obsession for old BMX memorabilia and media always been a bad hoarder of of everything like I used to collect Batman

Comics when I was a kid and like my mom was going to put me forward for you bet once because I you could show me the cover and I could tell you what number magazine it was you know I hundreds of comics and could tell you like that’s what number

Was which uh then the magazine thing really came into it in lockdown so when lockdown worked I was the business was open we sell like cleaning supplies so we supplied all you know key workers so I was just in work every day on my own and I had these mags that were stored

And I realized I can either get rid of them or I looked and was like I’ve got loads that you’d bought yourself yeah always bought the magazines like battered and it was a case of like oh maybe I could fill you know fill a gap

Of and then as soon as that started it was like the old hoarder and me came back and was like he was off and running yeah and then just looking at I’m like for me the magazines are about the riding photo like the bikes and that do

Nothing for me like I get it if that’s what you’re into it does nothing for me that I don’t even know what half the parts on a bike are now like I did a bike check for w it ride on and it was terrible I don’t know what it all was

But yeah I just like love looking at the photos like the photos like and then obviously from that getting the older mags and stuff now it’s just filled in gaps in my knowledge that I know I’ve like got everything from you know official BMX like early 80s and

Newspapers BMX weekly right through to to to new stuff yeah and what what h so say have you got American stuff as well assume you have yeah yeah got everything European American Australian so like what are the from someone who didn’t live in that time period what mags do

You look at and think like these are [ __ ] good like from that from the sort of 80s and up like I can see now why like people have like your generation and stuff have such a strong uh response to go and freestyling and stuff like that because the photos are just

Like they’re better than anything now most of them you know style and the Aesthetics it’s like it doesn’t have to be the the maddest trick it’s just the how it’s shot and things like that and obviously so those and then I don’t know I’m fond I’m fond of

Stuff that’s not cool like there’s loads of photos in BMX plus that I think get massively overlooked because it’s BMX plus but like yeah they’ve had some awesome people that have gone through BMX Plus then gone on to be ride editors or you know done other stuff and some of

The photos there are massively overlooked because the Magazine’s not as cool as as other yeah the editorial was bad in that though wasn’t it that’s that’s probably yeah you’re looking literally just for photos yeah does some crackers you know they went to all the same comps that you

Know the the ride yeah yeah the BS comps and that yeah yeah they’re all they’re all in there and there’s photos of people that because they weren’t the cool riders or whatever that’s where those people Shan you know you look back on and go [ __ ] those people were really

Bad but because they weren’t the main ones that you Associated yeah but yeah there’s I’ve got there just there’s tons there loads of stuff that like even some of like the freedoms and some of the old mags there that you just like f you know some of

The fill some of the gaps in knowledge and yeah all these the thing is like all those people were at all the events so you’re seeing it from you know you’ve got k cloudberg whatever shooting photos for Freedom you’ve got American Brad McDonald and Mark Loi you know they all

Because everyone went to all these events yeah that’s right yeah you see it from a different angle yeah I mean the beauty of me being able to collect them now and lockdown work great for it because Imagine Me Now messaging you and saying do you mind going in your Loft

You’d be like now piss off I’m busy lock down everybody was at home okay going into your Loft and they were like yeah fine so I got hundreds of mags from people that were just eager to give them away or make space or you know abort

Some or whatnot and again the beauty of it is now with there not being as many mags that are still released I used I got all these mags that were in an era before me and it was like getting them fresh when I was a kid again you know in

A letter box and I’m like all this stuff that I didn’t know anything about is all is all fresh to me and you you I find cuz I I wasn’t in that first first era and I find like for them for me them newspapers and them early like BMX action bikes and BMX

Weeklys you could really like learn where stuff came like the next step came from you know when you look at them you’re like oh that’s so that’s why this happened next and you can really like there’s a lot to learn from them things which I think a lot of people don’t

Realize like and the locations you know like yeah the you can tell where the scenes come from yeah you know it’s weird you know there was a whole area where obviously ride was based down in Dorset and a lot of the Southern Riders got coverage but then none of the north

Did but then if you look at BMX weekly in that it was based in Lancaster so like of that era that that got it and then you know there’s everything in between really but like even stuff like you know there’s people that think that certain stuff was like

Pioneered by the Americans there’s so much stuff that got done in in Europe at Europe comps and UK comps that people obviously it wasn’t the internet so they didn’t know all the stuff that had been done at the same time but it’s I get it’s like seeing it all fresh for me and

It’s keeping riding quite it’s keeping riding quite fresh yeah because I’m getting inspired by stuff that is from the 80s could could you see like one of the things I like about that stuff is when it first started and it was like real early like the newspapers you could

See people just thrashing about on jumps and then like it got to like the mid 80s and it kind of became really like sterile and there was just like people just standing in one place on a bike like it was like really weird with like

A full white race suit on he’s like what happened like he’s [ __ ] weird yeah I find they’re full of photos of like kids that have just chucked on anything and gone down the racetrack and they’re just c yeah that’s it yeah yeah they like like like portraits Frozen in Time

Almost of just like people didn’t know what it should look like yeah yeah it’s quite innocent yeah yeah it’s good man I love looking at that [ __ ] that it’s you know actual newspapers like how awesome is that like BM on new weekly as well not like not by B monthly weekly like

Well I spoke to the guy that AB them at that Hall of Fame thing and I was just like how did you you know how did you pull that off really you know imagine how much you’d have to have done you know to yeah if you were chatting [ __ ]

Like to to pack it out well what’ he say I bet he couldn’t even remember right he was just saying that literally like it was all go you know there was stuff happening everywhere and then mean even in our area you know you had like Lancaster moram uh the Lake District

Crew couple you know Wigan Allen’s you know like this whole area of racing that was going off and that was just in the north and Northwest because it was like everywhere yeah it was it was in a big boom period I suppose so it was more

Going on but from the race side of things it was and I like you say Obviously some of it they included just kids throw like you said kids just throwing themselves off off stuff like that’s Timeless is it yeah you can all relate to that even if you started in

This era like yeah you yeah yeah totally yeah but you’ve got to start by launching yourself yeah off something it’s you could learn every trick go and still look back on that first time more fondly yeah and you realize like when them looking at them photos you just

Like that’s that’s why we do it yeah like that’s that’s more relevant to why we do it than some of the [ __ ] that’s [ __ ] on the cover now you know like it it’s kept it fresh for me yeah definitely like getting these mags it keeps it keeps it fresh for me and fresh

Ideas and like relating something I do and mixing up with that because most of it’s been done before yeah yeah totally that’s the thing that you realize when you’re looking at this stuff you’re like you think stuff’s like pioneered in you know 2000s it’s all been done yeah yeah

You can add another one to it in or out of it but it’s all been done yeah it just looked slightly different back then yeah the problem you’ve got now is a lot of these tricks that are like multiple spins and whips you can’t get fot of them yeah

Well they don’t look good even even in wouldn’t be it wouldn’t be an iconic fot would it no not at all it you get someone doing a can can look back or you know a table or something like that or massive fakey it’s like yeah stands out so much more that’s

That’s the thing that I think’s different well there’s a style to a can can look back and a table AR there like and a like simple simple tricks when what do you like for me people just spinning around endlessly is like it’s completely emotionless and it doesn’t

Look any good like it it just does not look any good to me like you’re just wanging that bite round as many times as you can or yourself and then just and it’s just like it doesn’t it just looks chaos there’s no like there’s no feeling

To it there’s noemotion to it just like yep I did an extra one than whatever someone else did and it I’m like man come on is it easier to add another one in and out like rather than being creative I don’t know I don’t know if the thing is if you

Go up where it’s a claim is it I think it’s just a claim I’ve done whatever done seven nobody’s done seven before he’s like yeah but was it worth doing seven does does it look like anyone else wants to do seven maybe the other guy who’s

Going to do nine after you wants to do nine but like it just oh man I don’t understand it I get why people want to be at but like whatever has always has there always been an element of of it you think at a now yeah but I think see for

Me I a 360 looks better than a 720 and a 540 looks better than 900 yeah but a 900 is a spectacle in it and it’s don’t get me wrong I’m not saying that they’re not harder but like if I yeah another one if you think the

Difference is I think between like if you’re looking at from the outside point of view like you know we’re talking YouTube and things like that now you know like Nitro Circus and all that where you know it’s new R special it’s like man yeah I know but you’re if

You’re a Ryder in it like you’re aware of everything that’s I mean that’s the beauty of it now there’s so much you don’t into that like there’s definitely it’s definitely a shame that people don’t ride everything I find that really disappointing that people don’t ride everything they literally Hing in on one

Thing like you know you could get someone that could do like you said five tail whips but you never you never see them go to Trails or ride street or whatever like that that for me when I was growing up we like I said we went everywhere and

We would go to the local skate park and oh do you want to ride our Trails yeah that’s sick and then do you want to go and ride you know let’s go and ride street in this area while we’re here it was just it was just the whole thing

That you didn’t even think tce of oh I’m not going to do that you know I’m only a skatee poot rad you just Roe everything yeah I find I find that element of it dis disappointing because there’s so much to be had by being a well-rounded

Rider I mean if you look back at the the most revered Riders ever they rode everything yeah well that’s there was it was just riding at one point wasn’t it yeah true it wasn’t like oh we’re gonna go and ride this it was just like we’re

Just go riding which I can see how that’s happened but like yeah yeah that’s true but then look at look at someone like Dennis henerson he can ride anything that’s why he’s yeah a lot of riders favorite Rider yeah again he was probably the closest

To what you’re saying is just a ride you put him in front of anything and he’s just good he’s yeah better than anybody yeah I mean there’s a couple of people that are like that sort of level though aren’t there but for the most part not

Many there’s not many no no not many no no no I’m thinking something you know like that’s used to be whereas they used to be everyone was on a fairly High I think for a lot of it people have been spoiled with what they’ve got now so

They that’s why you can pick one thing and go ride it within 10 minute ride of your house you know yeah but is that not what people craved in the 80s to have somewhere to ride so you can’t exactly exactly that but they had to travel

Miles or they had to do what they was you know or they had to make use of a flat piece of ground that was near their house like hence why people did it you know you can’t win though because if you moan no no you can’t yeah yeah yeah

There’s no winning yeah there’s only losing oh though not so um but yeah what um so what about uh this new this new uh Venture that you uh have dabbled in talking about magazines and stuff me next venture yeah well B basically we want to there’s no point having this horde

Just sitting here in in in in a corner of a cleaning supplies business in Chester so we we’d love to like do a project where we get some of these things up online you know it’s not it’s not new there’s people you know have scanned the magazines in before but like

Like just put a spin on it and put like almost datab B database it so you can like search by text and whatnot because you know it it’ be sick you know like to if we’re going to a couple of reasons why I get messages all the time people saying oh

Can you know have you ever got this photo of me because people are stoked you know like oh I had a photo once in this have you got it not I’m really stoked about that because hopefully that’ll get them back out on their bikes if someone stopped riding yeah that’s

The main thing if you can get people back riding that’ll be awesome but then also like people that are mad into the bikes are into it you know they want a spec of building the bike that they want or whatever and also just to let like the newer Riders see what came before

Like I’m saying to you like all this stuff’s been done before and it’s INSP firing like they’re not going to collect the magazines are they yeah yeah they’re not going to see it show what’s come before in their own time without like pushing it down their neck hopefully it’ll Inspire like you know

Originality so what you’re actually doing is you’re creating a database of magazines online old magazines old new yeah everything in between new everything what everything so Nick said he said you’ve been slacking on the scanning though yeah yeah I’m only joking no% Nick Nick if it weren’t for Nick

None of it would come off but like so it’s a passion project like it l project and like we have busy lives you know so we you know we might do a crowd fund or you know something TR and maybe like just get it get the momentum going like

I’ve got a magazine scanner that basically you can you can scan a MAG fairly quickly and then obviously you can digitize it and it can search for the text so you could search by keyword so you know if you wanted to search for ROM you could do that or whatnot and

Just get this stuff archived like you know it deserves it is how iuck damn right yeah it deserves it and you know I’m not you know my emphasis is on the UK to start with because I think that it warrants it and there’s a lot of people

That have put you know a lot of the American magazines that we said earlier go freestyle that are like held in high regard but there’s so much stuff that was done in the UK and still done in the UK that you know is massively influential so that that that’s

Basically what we want to do we want to digitize it it’s been started you know we we want to get momentum behind it to try and and get it done and make it thorough yeah I think think it’s important if nothing else if if nothing else just to Archive what’s come before

Because it it’s awesome basically yeah what what have you got a launch date for this or what’s the story what’s well we not get into that bit no but no we basically put it out there so there’s a kick up the ass to get it get it moving there’s we’ve done we’ve

Done we’ve done some but we haven’t done enough but that’s not to we’re going to launch it and maybe just build on it you know just so we’ve got something there to progress yeah but like like you’re going back to saying earlier like the newspaper era or official BMX right

Through to you know you and Mags like people you know like albian and endless and stuff that you know I’m not just looking at that old school you know you need that scope to to to to draw people in and get people pyed so what they the

Ones that less people are going to seen as well I guess yeah the old ones because Al well albian wasn’t wasn’t that long ago and endless is kind of still about but yeah no you know what I mean G yeah yeah yeah you want to go up there eventually yeah

I’m not going to just like ho the old bikes you know like that only has like if you put the full scope of it yeah yeah yeah but you get you there eventually didn’t you yeah but like Nick says I’m yeah it’s like it’s like Hall of Fame you get there eventually coming

Soon yeah all right all right well we’ll leave that one there then what about the Hall of Fame I saw that you uh you quite enjoyed that yeah I was surprised you know like I was quite surprised I think I think it definitely needs on the freestyle side

Of things it needs more support but I think they’ve got the heart in the right place you know it’s all well and good like Wy was involved like Wy was the main reason I’m like right you know if W’s putting his hand in and putting his

Time in like I you know I don’t know anywhere near as much as Wy but like just took the magazines down there and just got people stoked with it but the freestyle side of things would be it’d be great to to get more support even

Just as a catchup I think going back to what I just said there about archiving the magazines freestyle isn’t really never has been you know pat on the back style like racing has you know they’ve got you know racing you know you you might place

Down to 10th and get a trophy and you know at the end of the year the clubs have you know Christmas Gatherings and stuff like that freestyle it’s not like that I get it yeah but certain people that have given what they’ve given deserve respect in they deserve

Not even an Accolade just an appreciation I think I think I think that’s fair you know like yeah they might be I might not want it but I think certain people deserve appreciation for what they’ve done for for the UK scene and for BMX in general really much more than people

Give them credit for because you see you know the main guys in America but like there’s some people that are payeer a lot of stuff over here as you well know [ __ ] yeah [ __ ] damn right what what’s givas of appreciation that’s the way why do you think it’s not that popular then

Amongst freestyle do you think they’re just not reaching freestylers or what how many people there this year they’re not loads but they’re not freestylers they make no bones about it they’re not freestylers you know like the the don’t know it you know like you do so much for

Something that you don’t know about you know and they’re not they’re not making out that they do you know like hence why they’re asking people to get to get involved It’s Tricky you know to sit down dinner it’s not what you you know you you necessarily associate with

Freestyle but like people of of an age now will you know they don’t want to go and hang around in like a swamp Fest style after party do you know what I mean so it’s I think something in the middle could work better though like that seems it seems for me from the

Outside looking in it’s like it’s a pretty weird setup for me to want to see you know like it seems like if they had more of a like interactive like you had you was there this time with the magazines and like something a bit more like that people

Can go and have a look at stuff and like it’s a bit stiff like the the awards ceremony just looks like a bit like a bit TV show esque you know the problem got is given where we’re at currently like climate wise who’s gonna do it who’s gonna like there isn’t yeah yeah

Yeah no like that looks more expensive doing what got there that looks pricey possibly but at the same time they’re trying to deliver it to people that want something that suits that age group are you with me like I’m not saying it necessarily has three course dinner but like it’s got to

Be of a certain standard for you to Warrant going yeah I just think that looks ramp or like you not ramp I think a ramp wouldn’t work but like something just something a bit like like an art exhibition or something yeah yeah something that would talk to the people

That they can’t get in there because it seems like they can get the racers but not the yeah because they know the races and the races yeah that’s right it’s what you’re saying once a year they had the race club would have a meet where they say you know yeah yeah it’s a

Community it it’s different they’re two totally different things and I get that it’d just be nice to find a middle ground where we can respect the people that have done what they’ve done In freestyle really I think I think it’s a work in progress and I think if we can

Just get people to get involved with it whether it means tweaking it or means it doesn’t work at all do you know what I mean and something else has to be created but I think until you give it a try because it’s not it hasn’t got H presence from us currently yeah there

Wasn’t impact from it needs impact from like some of the people that that kind of know you know like and and they’ve got a few of them now so but it just does look a bit like looks unstructured to me I’m like I don’t really know what it’s what the

Freestyle was doing but like you say it’s new and it’s it’s just getting them people involved so you understand what happens I don’t understand how racing works but I can see like speaking to Wy obviously races as well like that’s how the racing side of things work yeah but

Racing so structured that that would work for racing yeah I think it can work I I think it can work it just like it’s just going to take time to I think it will take time get it going and get it correct yeah yeah so I think the only

Way to do that is from the front really that’s the way I see it I’m not I’m not massively involved it was just a case of like I said to you earlier I’ve got these magazines sitting here how awesome would it be like I went there and people

Were stoked you know that’s what I was gonna say how many people flick through their mags not as many as they should have done but people really yeah be a lot uh yeah some like and the people that were were really good you know were behind me stories and they were filling

Gaps in for me and they were calling friends over being like Oh yeah do you remember this and you know like I said like if if a few if people go away and get out their bike again and ride whatever age they are fantastic like well well worth drudging this bloody

Bookcase down as fighter stairs like you know yeah well worth that’s what you want is it you you want even if it ain’t a lot of people if the people that go they they suck it up and really enjoy it like that’s what you want that’s the

Goal a’t it and like you said ear there’s more pump tracks and and skate parks than ever so there’s no excuse yeah there’s no excuse if you want to get back out and do it and you haven’t done it for years do it if you

If you you’re into it now and you you know your attention spans weing well get back inspired get back out and ride you know yeah so you going again next year you going I think so yeah I just want to try and drum up and and get more of a

Freestyle side to it and more of a buzz on the freestyle side of things really yeah it just needs more it needs momentum it can’t just come up and be like oh why didn’t you come like yeah you got build it people you’ve got people in and be like why should I come

Yeah I would love to go there and hang out with more freestylers like more people I know don’t get to see very often you know if if nothing else I’d be I’d be stoked on that and just have conversations with people like there was people there that I know that obviously

You know crossed over between the two like Chico was there Martin Murray was there you know like there’s a few you know that synonymous with racing but I knew from from from time so from riding Yeah Yeah from riding just riding full stop like you said earli they were just

Riders they rode everything so yeah fingers crossed like you say I think it can only grow or or or adapt and adjust and if it’s not to be it’s not to be and something else needs to come but we’ve got to try because it’s already established and someone’s stuck their neck out already

Someone’s putting the money you know they’re putting the money out there you know it’s not they’re not making money they’re just no no you can tell that’s that’s why I ask that many people are there because I’m thinking that’s that’s expensive that space so it it is so you

Know as much as it might not be ticking the freestyle box props to them for for going and doing it you know that’s that’s the way I see it yeah they’re doing it and I don’t think that you know they’re doing it with any anything other than like you know

The best of intentions really obviously the the the racing side of things they’re always going to take that box because they’re Racers they’re well World known Racers so we just need to have some people that will obviously just yeah it’s gonna take up a little bit to

Build that’s all I think as long as it keeps as long as you get it right keep going and getting it correct it’s going to build and that’s that’s what will happen so and as long as you got the right people putting that input in and will listen them that’s right if you

Ain’t got the right right people it won’t build it will just flop but yeah to get involved yeah well let see what happens not you generally yeah yeah get involved you know yeah yeah put you know stick stick stick your give your opinion yeah yeah man well yeah I’m going to keep me

Eye on it see see how it goes but I quite like what darl’s doing anyway like I think it’s cool um and then the other thing I want to talk about is that recent video that you had which I was which I really enjoyed yeah I was I was chuffed on that

Highs and lows like literally I did that a few weeks ago and then smashed me face in two weeks ago so it’s classic highs and lows of BMX so well would you you smashed your face in after it yeah last uh week before Christmas classic over the anle bars broke your teeth

Everything [ __ ] sake yeah that was it like literally did like move I wanted to do for ages and then classic like take taken out doing a Bunn up but yeah that that uh edit came about just been friends with ant and them for a long time and we’ spoken about more speaking

About doing the open loop because when I did the the full the full loop they came up from Essex oh okay to work you know with the plans are doing it and whatnot and then they they didn’t that day but they ended up taking it back down to

Essex and doing it themselves all right conversations about doing the open loop just back and forth and I was meant to build it up here and it never came off and then they just messaged saying I we’ve built this so it was like right it’s on so how long how long did you

Like ride that day before you tried that Loop all day because you you film that day yeah I went I left my day I left mine at 4 in the morning and got to a six at 9: and then rode and filmed that edit and then at like six

O’clock put that in and then we started working on doing that and then did it and then classic like adrenaline I was like I was going to stay over and I was I just drive back now you know I was just be likeing I just got back home to

Like one day back to work [ __ ] that came out good man I enjoyed that like I like the the variation on a lot of the moves you did in that video like I seen a few for a few years that people have said more than the than the

Open loop really you know just yeah but that’s that’s the stuff I like to do you know just don’t have the opportunity to put it on an edit or whatever like if you come to skate park that’s that’s a kind of stuff I I’ve always like to do

Yeah you you don’t hardly see it to be like you hardly see any just mini ramp footage anymore as well so it was like it really stuck out with something different you know but how long did that Loop take to do yeah how many tries probably

About eight had the mats about eight or nine into the mats and the two that you saw were when we pulled the mats away oh right so that one bail and then like just just go what happened on that first one although it’s a although it’s a flip

You do not pull at all if you pull that’s what happens so you literally do like yeah like the first one I did I pulled into the mats and did a double pretty much like one and a half like without even trying so that it’s like

Like we said it was like the opposite you have to like almost unlearn flips so instead of pulling you you can see you like compress and then pump the top and pump back okay but you can see that as soon as you take off if you imagine

Where you take off you you can see where you’re Landing very very quickly because you’ve done FP soon as you go past you can see oh yeah yeah of course yeah yeah okay the clock it’s like you know it you can see where you’re going and we were

Getting more hurt on the mats than I thought we would without the mats out of the way because we were just stopping and slamming oh okay it was better off we were getting more hurt like me and Calvin that were doing it we were getting more hurt on the mats like just

Take them out the way where were the mats in on the floor or up the [ __ ] yeah we put them like on transition they were the ones that uh I got them at a dside skate park so the skate park in the pandemic got pulled down by JCB to make it into a

Hospital oh yeah I remember the story yeah and they were putting him in the bin so I I went down there and just put them on the van he made it in a hospital they didn’t use or something one yeah no one JC in the day I know I saw it on the

On the like on the web yeah on the wood went away in 10 ginormous skips never to be seen again [ __ ] sake but yeah those Maps went down with the full loop to them and then we just used them for that [ __ ] hell but I would say

That was that felt harder than the full pipe the full loop the open loop it was work it was harder to work out it took longer to work out than the other one the other one was just like just bra where you going and hang on

Yeah I’ve gotta go so and what was that that Loop how many times did you crash that the loop yeah uh took four or five goes with the mats and then I had one good spank doing it properly and then that got easier it’s like the more you did it the more you

Could see the first time was blind like the first time you do a flip you can’t see anything and then the more you could do it you could spot the ramp you knew where he was going okay yeah the key to the full pip was going slower than you

Think you think you got to go fast and that’s that’s what’ll booger you you end up yeah it crumples you in yeah that’s what you just pump the momentum round yeah I don’t know they were just ones that I would love I always wanted to do and it was never gonna have you

Know there’s no budget behind me doing it course yeah yeah was just built in the yard at work in lockdown we just built it in the car park at the business you know the transitioner that one of them cour par would be he looked quite tight no it wasn’t I it wasn’t

No was it eight foot or something I guess it was like 14 foot tall it was exactly the same we got the plans seven yes seven foot [ __ ] yeah exactly the same one as Danny mcal did you know that toy box thing they did we got the

Pl like that exactly the same but yeah it was it was it was natly build it cuz I’ve never built a ramp that goes off so you were putting it and all the beams are on a 45 so you’re building section oh yeah yeah of course you can’t really

Even see that in the video properly yeah weird because you’ve obviously got to set all the beams I think at two degrees so it matches back up that was the hardest bit was me you had to pull the thing together when we built it you had

To drill it to the floor because it was trying to pull apart oh yeah yeah of course yeah [ __ ] yeah yeah them two are the ones that wanted to do that’s good job done mate essic was yeah yeah was good [ __ ] good job on the video man liked it dream dream

Thanks for that nice all right man all right we we we’re good if you’re good with that we we’re good that was [ __ ] cool man absolute privilege to be invited on nice one thanks man hello right so we’ve just got patreon page we’ve been doing this show for nearly

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