The PDGA has an unfortunate record of establishing rules that are nearly impossible to enforce. According to the chair of the rules committee, discs that have been modified in any way that adds a detectable thickness after the manufacturing process, including hot stamps, may not be used in PDGA tournament play.
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0:00 PDGA Rule 813
1:05 Rule Analysis
3:43 Enforcement Issues
5:35 What do you think?
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27 Comments
If I get a disc hot stamped after I purchase it, how is that different from the manufacturer hot stamping the disc? Embossing a disc with mold/company/weight whether it be and imprint or raised impression from the mold is altering the thickness of the disc so why are stamps or embossing even allowed then? That would basically mean the manufacturers are making discs illegal before leaving the factory by hot stamping meaning they should only be sending out blanks that were purchased by an individual or for resale. This rule is silly and pointless.
Does that mean they couldn't throw a double stamped disc?
I think it's splitting hairs. Maybe in laboratory test conditions one could prove that there is a difference between discs with added hot stamps/paints/inks/etc. and "clear" discs, but let's be honest – during normal gameplay on a course these differences would be neglible. And what about discs with normal wear and tear? They lose the paint from logos and they even lose some weight by losing small amounts of plastic from scratches etc. Moreover, in this way they even slightly change their shape and thus properties of flight which is known as "beating up" a disc. So, as I said in the beginning, I think it's just splitting hair. And somewhat silly rule ;))
In the magic: the gathering community we call the act of trying to call someone on a stupid rule like this to gain some sort of marginal advantage 'angle shooting', it's very frowned upon. I believe that since this rule has such ambiguity (noticeable thickness) that it's completely unenforceable, as is the rules regarding disc tuning and conditioning.
The pdga rules are a joke.
Common sense is needed. A stamp or flat surface i think should be ok. Yah if i would build some sort of dome in example to change flight characteristic INTENTIONALY should and must be banned. Or moved to category of garage56 😀 (analog from Le Mans)
I don't care what they say😂 I'm wiping my putter stamps every time 🖕
PDGA needs to fix this. Has nobody contacted them about it yet?
What about “flattened firebirds”!
the funny thing, is the very next rule is that players are allowed to add material or device for night or snow play. so that makes the above rule a daytime only rule. that's pretty silly imo. the rule should be of a certain amount of weight and thickness. like under 1 gram in weight and 1 mm or less in thickness. that way you can add stickers for night time and hot stamps, but can't do anything crazy like add fishing weights or something.
Yes. Paint, dye and marker are different. I googled it.
The problem I have with this rule is that there is no uniformity to how big the stamp is on a disc. Some stamps are bigger and take up more space and some stamps are smaller and take up barely any space such as Innova's factory seconds. Heck Discraft sales a lot of misprints that are double stamped thereby "doubling the weight" of the stamp. But it says that a manufacturer can add an extra stamp. So why can't a retailer or you personally?
I believe that the major disc manufacturers are supporting this initiatives behind the scenes in order to put the smaller companies who make their living with these stamps out of business. If disc golf were a more main stream sport, this type of regulation would likely catch the eye of anti-trust litigators.
Omg reminds me of this cry baby that I played with in the GBO this year.. dude was being a bitch over the price stickers being on this guys discs still and wouldn’t let it go … what a bitch this guy was 😂💁🏻♂️
The rule(s) are too open ended. Dye and ink change the disc. You can't add something to another thing and think that it's still the same. EVERYTHING is measurable with the right tools. The PDGA needs to come up with much more precise specifications or just kill the ability to make discs unique entirely. As a disc dyer, I obviously don't want that, but they need to do something.
As for hot stamps, I live close to Gateway Disc Sports and have had custom stamps done. The fact that as long as they do it, it's fine, but if I do the exact same thing at home, it's not, is dumb.
Another dumb rule by a controlling organization which is actually collusion between manufactures and PDGA……dumb.
Dumb question but what about glow tape for glow rounds?
If someone tells me I can’t throw my hot dog bandit stamped disc form ARDG I will be very sad and personally hate that person forever.
I want to know what kind of ink you use on your stamps that stay on the disc. Have been looking for a while.
It seems like timhe rule may have been introduced by manufacturers to prevent people from selling their own versions of discs that are more or less stable because of the presence of these stamps. I can sort of sympathize.
I hot stamp (#Discify) and this is ridiculous. I emailed Mike and got into a good discussion with him but he never provided me satisfactory rationale for the discernment. Let me know if you want me to post the full email string 😊.
No thickness added compared to manufacturer. What about double or triple misprint stamps? Those legal?
Microns of thickness added when hotstamping.
My take is this was a bigwig telling PDGA what’s what
I assume tournament stamped discs are okay as the manufacturer is the one putting that stamp on the disc.
rules like this only exist so weasels who feel their success is threatened by cardmates can rat them out and cause issues. It fixes nothing, because it isn't a problem to begin with.
Sorry if this has been mentioned. The example you used painting a disc the guy was using acetone, and dye. Should be perfectly legal.
Is this rule causing or revealing an issue at pro tournaments? Are there crappy players trying to get every advantage they can at C-tiers by calling into question the discs of those on their card? If the answer to both those questions is no, then I really don’t care. I’ve already spent more time thinking about and responding to this rule than is necessary.
If you have an issue with this rule
Applying a coat of anything to anything will ultimately affect the aerodynamics of said object,
Now when it comes to a disk that can only weigh up to a 175g
A coat of paint can definitely affect that
How porous is the plastic they use? As far as I know, the die and ink sit on top and do not get absorbed.