In this episode, Chris and Tony make sense of the proposed “ball rollback” that the USGA and R&A unveiled.
The USGA and R&A announced the proposal of a MLR (model local rule) that would allow tournaments and organizers to require use of a ball that conforms to the new ODS.
Listen in for everything you need to know and what it could mean moving forward.
There’s a lot on deck so kick back, watch, listen, or do both! This is No Putts Given.
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35 Comments
I look at it that the cost will trickle down to the average golfer, because somebody has to pay for all those changes. Golf is already expensive. Just make the fairways a little more narrower make the rough a little longer and add a few bunkers in the right places. Problem solved.
Here's a thought. We have metal bats for everything less than the pros'. How about wooden woods. That would change things
DTC are going to love this…..no way can I play a shorter ball. We will be taking this in our pocket books.
I believe that the Masters has been wanting to have a “Masters” ball for some time now. This would allow them to do that.
USGA and R&A are absolutely stone cold NUTS and STUPID. The playing field is level because ALL players have access to the same equipment. If you want to lower scores then just make course set ups like the US OPEN, tight fairways, long rough and firm fast greens. This is INSANE. Athletes are bigger, stronger and more fit and there is more technology in swing advancements and club technology. JUST keep making new stupid rules instead of changing some already stupid rules like having to play out of a divot when you are in the fairway. Going backwards in technology is beyond stupid. Some of the older shorter courses like Riviera, Brookline, Harbourtown and many others don't have super low scores because they are tough courses that you have to play different shorts on and use course management. The USGA and R&A are not making decisions to better the game for the general public or the Tour Pros, they are making decisions to make themselves seem relevant but in reality they are making themselves look stupid. Who was complaining about ball speeds….certainly not the average public golfer or the Tour Pros, so USGA and R&A you can just f*ck off and keep making those insane unjustified high salaries by doing absolutely nothing positive for the game. Just a bunch of rich snobs trying to flex
who cares how far the ball goes? It will always be a level playing field because all players have access to the same equipment. Just let them play for God's sake. Fans like to see birdies and eagles, and it will cost companies millions of dollars to develop new balls, the last 25 years the USGA and R&A have been so worried about golf club COR and ball speeds and that never happened before in the history of the game. Who cares if they shoot -25 or -4 to win a tourney, it is ALWAYS a level playing field. Going backwards with technology is insane. So the Olympic 100m sprinters keep getting faster so do we take away their shoes or cut off one toe or make them run in sand? Just let them play you snobby nosed overpaid idiots at the USGA and R&A.
And the NBA IS RAISING THE HOOP TO 12 FEET…
Courses that are concerned about the distance “problem” should just put or grow hazards across the fairways that force layups. Put un-manicured fescue all around tight fairways, should someone choose to go for it. Build the courses to absolutely punish aggressive play. Modern courses “punish” aggressive play by putting perfectly raked soft sand bunkers around greens. Green side bunkers are one of the easiest shots for pros.
I will definitely start playing a DTC ball if prices start rising to help fund free “tour” balls to tour players. It already pisses me off that we are already paying more so millionaires can have free equipment and balls. This would be the last straw for me.
Hate it
I support these type of changes before they make golf for pros a drive, a chip/pitch/ then putt. Unwatchable. You only need to look at Men’s tennis to see the effects of technology ruin the pro game.
Why can’t we slow it down from here. No sport has seen anything good when they went backwards
Still the ones who hits it long has advantage. So my wedge to 8 iron is still better than your 8 to 6
I think that they should change the golf balls so no one can hit if further than 200 yards with a driver. That will cut down the length of golf courses. They should do the same in Baseball and shorten the fences to 250 feet.
They need to bring back the Guttie. The guttie was made from dried sap of the Malaysian sapodilla tree.
What incentive is there for the manufacturers to make this ball when us amateurs who purchase this ball will never buy it. They will literally be making a ball they never get paid for.
🙀
stop making the golf courses longer put shorter par 4s more risk for reward holes make the players think longer rough softer fairways
Is everyone on tour driving the par 4's? NO, Only a select few, with the skill and physical prowess, due to hard training in the gym, can reach the greens in 1. The rest, drive into the same areas. the course designers hoped they would, give or take 20-30yds. Designers believed at the time, that with accurate short irons and good putting, this would then decide on who would reach the top dog spot.
Not a lot has changed, just the odd pro who stands out, who trains hard, has the extra edge the others can't attain. Do these players win every week? No, they are human, like everyone else. There is no secret to winning, hard work is as true today, as it was in yesteryear.
Youth and physical prowess, fades with the years, as evidence and statistics prove. The USGA should not punish everyone, for the physical hard work and dedication of the few. They earned the right to overpower the golf courses. Course managers can use nature, the grass and trees, or water, to fight back against the big hitters, make accuracy the secret ingredient needed to win.
Leave the fucking ball alone ,your boring enough so don’t fuck with the ball ,just dumb down the white man some more .Just make them earn their money by making the courses harder not longer ,all tournaments should play like a US Open to win that kind of money ,
So the pros shoot lower scores. No need to roll back ball, or lengthen courses, grow rough and narrow fairways. Diffference in balls makes no sense.
It sounds like the ruling bodies are considering options. If you look at arcos stats, there is a huge difference in the distance between pro's and amateur's. But is that a problem? Are the governing bodies trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist? I understand that courses can't be expanded forever and it is the pro's making some courses 'obsolete'. I think Jack Nicklaus is right by saying the ball may be too hot for modern tour players. It is certainly way hotter than the wound balata balls he played with. Also keep in mind, his era played with persimmon woods. Despite that, Jack was a big hitter! Bottom line is no matter what they do or don't do, the big hitters will still be the big hitters. Time for everyone to calm down and let the governing bodies, manufacturers, and pro's sort this out.
You two make an interesting point: what if the tour and manufacturers just said 'no, we aren't going to do that'. The usga and r&a really couldn't do anything.
USGA run by a bunch of hacks 🙁
I think the ball manufacturers should just refuse to play ball, pun intended. What are they going to do about the pro’s being fitter, limited gym time, force feeding them doughnuts?
Rolling back the ball would encourage players to try and hit it even further and gives the current big hitters even more of an advantage than they already do. For example, Morikawa goes from 295 driving distance down to 275, Rahm goes from 315 down to 295, still a 20 yard gap, however, 295 over 275 is such a bigger advantage than 315 over 295. Goes right through the bag, continuing the example, Morikawa has to hit a 4 iron from the fairway and Rahm has a 6 iron in with a ball roll back, compared to now where Morikawa has a 6 iron into the green and Rahm has an 8 iron in. Crazy and stupid ideas by the governing bodies, just let the fairways grow a bit more.
1. If the PGA tour accepts the ball, I suspect LIV won’t. Then many of the best players will switch tours.
2. The USGA should have to pay the cost if they want this to happen.
3. I have listened to other golf shows that are claiming that the low speed swing pros (105 mph), of which there are apparently quite a few, are going to lose 30 yards as compared to 10 yards for the big hitters.
4. If the tours choose not to adopt this, the ball companies will not make the balls that meet the new spec. Then what will the USGA do for there events?
5. I could care less about preserving these old east coast courses that the USGA loves. They aren’t required to hold events at these courses. There are plenty of other courses they can use.
If they limit the ball, they will have to limit the clubs too. Drivers are regulated by ball speed. If you lower the performance of the ball, it will give manufacturers more headroom for their club designs. Imagine a driver designed to make up for the 15 yard distance reduction but using current balls? Somebody somewhere will start hoarding 2023 ProV1x's.
I'm glad these cats don't run the Olympics. They'd have sprinters running in weighted army boots. 😂
The whole episode on this topic?
Elite Amateur was a term they used for the "driver length" rule. Basically scratch and pro comps.
Clubs have bifurcated already. I use a long, straight game improvement iron. A pro will use a tiny blade, giving up distance, but gaining control.
Keep the cores. Change the cover…if you add spin…..oh boy then it makes the long bombers slow themselves down when they need to.Only the true shot makers will learn to drop spin and hit further.
Matt Fitzpatrick us am vs pro….anyone can do it.
But as Ive posted elsewhere….Tourney records were set with blades and balatas and more loft….that wont change these boys will adapt.
Seems like RnA is protecting St. Andrews and making everyone else to adapt to it lol.
USGA ALWAYS trying to stay relevant. They dont want to go the way of the PGA of America vs PGA Tour.
The rollback as proposed is messy and expensive. Why not set a standard that prevents future distance gains from where it is today. Courses don't have to keep expanding, manufacturers don't have to capitalize for a special low volume product, and bifurcation is unnecessary. It's a win for all parties. What am I missing?
Come on…. So you're worried about scores being too low because Tour Players hit it too far!
Every equipment rule changes introduces creative manufacturer innovations to circumvent these…. and increasing r&d costs on consumers. Let's simply make all Tour Par 5s into Par 4s…… followed by making Par 4s as Par 3s. That should bring scores down, keep equipment and equipment rules as is and keep consumer costs as is. No added costs to Anybody!!
This proposal is STUPID