In this episode, former Ryder Cup player Oliver Wilson joins Jasper to discuss his career, and his appearance at the 2008 Ryder Cup, and how it’s vastly different from any other golf event.
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[Music] I mean, the game is an amateur game. I mean, the professional side of it, you know, there are idols and heroes and fun to watch them play. But, I mean, if it wasn’t for amateur golf, there would be no golf. You have to remember when you play a golf course and you’re out there for four hours or whatever, you’re only hitting the you’re only hitting a ball for what, 15 minutes of that. So, there’s a lot of time to look around. Welcome to the Top 100 Clubhouse podcast. Uh this week it’s Jasper Miners. Uh James is stuck somewhere between England and Scotland on a motorway and I’ve had to jump on with uh Ollie Wilson. So welcome Ollie. Uh sorry you’ve got uh the the short straw this week, but you’ll have to put up with me instead of James. It’s always good to chat. Yes, looking forward to it. So we we’ve just finished the BMW Championship at Wentworth. Um, obviously state side, no real particular massive tournaments of note, but it’s all eyes towards the RDER Cup. Now, uh, perhaps what we’ll do is we’ll put that to one side. We want to catch up a little bit, uh, with you, know what you’re up to now, see how you’re doing, uh, what you’ve got planned, but then we’ll get into the RDER Cup, uh, fully as we look forward to this, uh, preview from an individual who’s been there and done it. We’ll get to that. So, uh, we know that, uh, you English born and bred. That’s right. That is correct. From Mansfield, Nottinghamshire, right in the middle of the country. Very good. And home golf club from that part of the world. Yeah. So, my home course is Coxmore Golf Club, which is a lovely Heathland course. Um, this it’s actually a lovely area. We’ve got Coxmore, Hollingwell, and Sherwood. Holly is obviously quite well known now. um done a fantastic job over the years of updating the course and staying with the times. Um so I kind of feel like they’re all my home course. My family play at Sherwood. My mom still plays at Coxmore. Uh I’m there a little bit when I can get chance. And Hollingwell, I’ve had so many good times there. I I kind of feel that corner of the world is uh is my home. I think Coxmore is well, it’s either an English top 100 contender or has just snuck in. So yeah, very good golf course nonetheless. So good shut up for them. Yeah. And they’re they’ve done a nice renovation job recently as well. So they’re definitely moving with the times, too. And um it’s it’s been fantastic this summer. Excellent. So you’ve had a bit of play recently. Let’s go back a little bit to your playing career just to refresh everybody’s memories. Um highest ranking on world world ranking. Do you know do you know what you got there? 33. 33. 33. Yeah. So, I mean, that’s that’s pretty impressive. 33. That’s uh Yeah, it was it was great. I look back on it now and go, you know, I’m delighted with it. Um it feels a long way away now. I’d love to get be able to get back and try and push on a bit further than that. But I was in the top 50 for two and a half years, which was great. You know, it opens a lot of doors. It gives you flexibility in your schedule. Um playing against the best players in the world on the best courses. Um, yeah, I look back on those times and maybe didn’t appreciate it as much as I should have done when I was there. You know, you’re always pushing. You’re always in the moment of trying to get better, try and get into the top 25, top 20 and and win tournaments. And um, whilst that’s absolutely right, you know, maybe I could have enjoyed that time a little bit more as well. So, I mean, talking about uh tour wins though, I mean, two things. So top 50 is really big for getting entry into the big tournaments, but uh at least it was then I think uh that that kind of stamp your ticket to get into the major championships. And it’s amazing to me sometimes you look at like well-known household name golfers and even then they don’t necessarily get to play in all of the majors. I played I played couple of masters um which was um awesome for me because I went to college in Augusta so I used to actually live in during my time in an apartment about I don’t know like 70 yards behind the 13th green which you would never imagine there was any buildings back there but there was uh an apartment complex back there and Ray Creek ran through it so it was a pretty special place to go to college. When I first went out there, I assumed going out to Augusta was going to be playing at Augusta National Weekly. I found out very quickly that wasn’t that it wasn’t the case. But we were based at Forest Hills just down the road. Um, and it was a special time for me there. It was by far the best time in my golfing life for developing, being competitive, and just having my eyes open to the world and and what’s c what’s possible. Um, so it was it was pretty good. So to get back and play a couple of masters was a really nice achievement for me. I wish I’d have done a bit better. I didn’t really play that well when I got there unfortunately. But um yeah, still nice to have been there. So Masters 2009 2010 uh US Opens that was your first major championship and I’ve got you down for four of those. So 206 89 and 10. Um Open Championships you’ve had you’ve had quite a run there. I mean, open championships seven, eight, nine, and 10. Then you had a bit of a resurgence there. 2018, it looks like you had another one in. Yeah, Carnusi was fun in 2018, but I actually got injured on the Thursday, so I wasn’t my neck was locked up. So, that was disappointing because I was playing really well that week. But, um, yeah, open champions are amazing. And it was interesting having the gap between there from 2010 maybe to to 18 where wherever that was that watching the difference in the um just like the infrastructure of the open and how much it’s grown in that time was incredible to me. It was really eye opening. Um, but amazing to be part of those tournaments and when you’re out of them, you kind of tell yourself, “Oh, it’s not that big a deal.” You know, I concentrate on my schedule and it gives me a week off. But as soon as you get back into those majors, it’s like what you know what what you thinking. This is where you got to be. You got the eyes, the eyes of the world are there. The best players in the world are there. It’s just a special place to be to be able to spend your time and compete. Um, it’s it’s very very cool. And you know, I missed those those times. I’m still obviously trying to get back to as many as I can, but um it’s definitely where you want to be. Yeah. Seven open championships. So, out of the courses you played on the open road, what uh which course uh stole your heart? Which one do you walk away from and you think actually that that is a proper proper golf course? Oh, Turbury without a question. Really? Yeah. Tbury for me was I mean, they’re all fantastic in their own right. They’re all a little different. St. Andrews was obviously very special for different reasons, but in terms of like actual golf course, um for me, Turbury is the one that makes you stand up and hit the shots more. So, uh you have to take on fairway bunkers, you know, it’s just real Lynx golf. It’s not like, right, I’m going to plop my way around and miss these bunkers. No, you have to take them on. Like, you have to hit driver a lot of the time. Um again, depending on how the course is playing, but to me, that’s just a proper test. and I haven’t been back since it’s been redone. And there’s not many places you go to that go through a big renovation and everybody that goes and plays it comes away going, “Wow, it’s even better.” Um, yeah. And and I have never spoken I’ve spoken to so many people that about Turbury that have been since it’s been redone and every one of them is blown away by how much better it was, and they all agree it was amazing before. So, it’s definitely one place I want to get back to and and experience. Yeah. So I I was up there just uh two weeks ago. So went up uh because Eert’s just done new well new holes really on seven and eight. So now from like 4 all the way pretty much through till 12 you’re right on that coastline all the way out. Um yeah coastline, right? It’s amazing. Um it’s it’s a really good stretch of golf along there. Um the views are spectacular and obviously having like that sentinel of the the lighthouse as you play that like few holes on the front nine you kind of from the very beginning you’re kind of looking at the lighthouse because even at the end of the range now um where you hit your balls out to on the range you’re hitting towards lighthouse. That’s kind of where you’re aiming. So from the time you get to the first te you’re like you’re winding your way around knowing that somehow I’m going to get over there. Um so I’ve been a a handful of times now. I think I’ve played it three times and uh yeah, very enjoyable golf course to play. Um and I can understand why better golfers like it so much. Um I think that the fairways aren’t as rambunctious as a lot of the other fairways on a lot of the other links courses. So maybe you do get a little bit more um rewarded for quote unquote good shots. A fairer golf course, maybe the same same vein as a little bit fairer. Yeah, exactly. I think there’s an element to that. It just felt like yeah, you were you were rewarded for good shots, but you had to hit a lot of them. Like you just had to, you know, when the wind was up and that was in 09, so I’ve only played at that one tournament week and I have a lot of memories from that week. Funny enough, most of the strongest ones are not of me playing. It was watching watching coming down the stretch. There’s a few shots that I remember hitting that I was like, “Yeah, that, you know, that kind of left an imprinted memory of why I love the golf course because you had to hit these certain T- shots in tough winds.” But my best memories of that week was um watching Westwood coming down the stretch trying to uh trying to get his open championship. Um made a a couple of mistakes coming down the stretch, but then that bunker shot he hit out of the 18th fairway bunker was so underrated. It’s like one of the best golf shots I’ve ever seen in world golf. Like people don’t understand how deep that bunker is. To be able to hit that shot and get it on the green was just amazing. Um but I was for him. He didn’t get over the line. Yeah, it’s it’s one of those ones, you know, we we don’t want to go into that, you know, best golf course or best golfer never to win a major. There there’s enough of those conversation. We don’t need to do that now. But uh thinking about that, is there any memorable rounds like where you’ve played with a golfer and you’re like this is like core memory like just being on the same tea? Um you know for you you’ve been around greatness obviously with the RDER Cup team um both the US playing against and then playing with on Europe. When you think back to like that I mean that’s like a top three game that I’ve had. Is there anyone that sticks out just out of interest? The one memory that is probably out of the majors um which I always there’s a little bit of um jealousy there as well but at um Tory Pines in09 so I was playing the group ahead um of Tiger Miklson and Adam Scott and I think it was the first time that they’d gone with the pairings of being like one two three in the world and I think maybe like the top 10 or 15 were all ranking order so that was the group behind me so it’s just mayhem from, you know, from Thursday’s T-shot, first T-shot through through the weekend. Um, but I was playing really well and I was leading after about, I don’t know, maybe 28, 29 holes, 30 holes, something like that. I made a double somewhere and Tiger obviously carried on plotting around. So, we were tied on Friday night. We came in, we’re late on in the in the draw and I’d been basic, it was slow because there’s so many so big crowds um everywhere and so I was watching or we were we’re all watching Tiger and Phil and and Scotty hitting into the greens behind us which was really nice to be able to do. Um but when I got in I realized I’m on the same score as Tiger and I was so excited. So, I’ve gone in the scores. So, I’m on the computer adding it up like, well, there’s no way I can miss him, you know? I’ve got to be playing with him on Saturday. And when the draw came out, I think it was Robert Carlson that got with him. And I I’m still to this day, I’m like, there’s no way that I don’t know how that’s happened. Like, it could not have happened. I’m sure they switched it around. Um so I was absolutely devastated um to miss out playing with him in that tournament as well when I look back and to see how uh historical that tournament was. Um but that you know that kind of I wasn’t playing with them but I watched them a lot. Um and it was very cool to be there and um to watch him win that in that way was pretty special. So that that’s definitely one of them. Um, I also remember playing with Stricker when he was going through a real hot patch, I think up in um, winged foot maybe. Um, and he was brilliant. I think he led after 36 holes and it was just a flawless display of just executing shot after shot. Um, that was that was pretty cool. That stood out. Um, but yeah, I mean, you know, you play with so many great players in majors and outside of the majors, it’s hard to to remember each one, each experience, but those are the ones that stand out the most. Um, for me at the moment, I think it’s an amazing thing to me because, you know, as a like a ranked amateur golfer who is a massive fan of the game, grew up in like Tiger Mania, um, yeah, you he he’s such a titan of the game. Like, he almost transcends it. like as big as like Scotty Sheffler is now and Tiger Woods uh and all the the household names that we all know, um it’s like Tiger just somehow still reached like another level that like who knows we’ll ever get to again. And maybe that was just a I sometimes say this like the advent of social media has been good in a lot of ways and terrible in a lot of other ways. Um, but like back in the day if you wanted to watch golf like growing up I had one channel and anyone that was a golf fan had one channel. So you have this massive captive audience that is being fed like one diet of just tiger and like nowadays you could have that on various streaming platforms, you could have on telly, you could have it on radio, you could have it on social media and so depending on what you want you know you can kind of find your own little niche somewhere. But I think back then, like the early 2000s, late 90s, um, like there was this massive wave of momentum just because there was only one channel to find it all on. That’s true. But c can you imagine social media and if Tiger was playing and hitting the shots that he used to hit, like the recovery shots, the shots that stand out that we can all go back and go, “Oh, what about that shot? That shot.” Imagine social media now. I mean, it would be everywhere. like people just being speechless about watching some of that stuff. And that’s the difference between him and Scotty. Scott Scott Scotty doesn’t do that because he doesn’t need to. Like he’s he’s flawless almost. It’s incredible to watch. Um but two very different golfers, but both playing at a level that, you know, certainly out of my reach. I I wish it wasn’t, but it’s uh I actually commentated with him on Scotty at the PGA at Quail Hollow. Um, and then I walked inside the ropes at the open for pretty much 72 holes of his golf and was blown away by just the level of what execution, distance control, um, emotional control, mental strength was just off the charts and he made it look so easy. It was just like this is what I do and you you can’t see anyone beating him and he hence why he’s on this streak that I don’t even know if it is a streak. it’s sort of turned into just the norm. So, it’ll be interesting to see, yeah, how long that keeps going on for, but whatever he’s doing, he just needs to keep doing it because it is a a phenomenal display when you look at the the quality of players behind him and he’s making them look just very ordinary and they’re not ordinary. They are, you know, they’re world class players that are playing incredible golf courses that are set up hard and he’s just knocking out 67s just like it’s nothing. Um it is it’s a special time for sure. I think this is one of those things where like it’s fine for me to be able to say, “Oh, um like they those guys are just so much better than us.” Uh and there’s a lot of people that fool themselves into thinking that ah you know I I did really well at my scratch medal uh at my golf club locally and I’m on a bit of a heater so you know I maybe I’ll go for open qualifying and see how we get on. and and then you talk to someone who is like basically been in the top 50 in the world for years. Um and then gets front row seats to just this exhibition of greatness and you have them saying like that’s just a level of golf that you know I well and and that’s the thing. I mean, you you know, like you see all these golf courses and how how they are at any given time during the year, but I think I was having a conversation with a friend this week about there’s going to be an exhibition match um in at a golf course in Worththing with Marco Penge and a couple of the good amateurs and the club members are thinking, you know, the amateurs are going to have a really good chance. I’m like, “Guys, there’s there’s only the only chance of them having a chance of being close is if, you know, Marco’s ill or he’s just not into it and he’s not trying because it just might not motivate him.” You know, that kind of stuff doesn’t motivate people a lot of the time when they’re reaching such high levels. But in pro golf, there’s so many layers on top. You can go to um a pretty good golf course and amateurs could have a decent round and feel like oh I shot you know 73 74 but it’s like if you go to a tour event and play on the Wednesday or Tuesday Wednesday in practice you know the TE’s are kind of normal the greens and every the course is a little bit softer the pins are in the middle of the green and you go out and you shoot a nice score you’re like oh yeah I can see birdies here but then when a tournament setup happens and as the week goes on The greens get firmer. The T’s are tucked to to positions that make the holes play a little tougher, maybe slightly different angles. They might even move a tee up, but you’ve not, you know, it’s a completely different angle. You got to be able to adjust right there and then. Um, but the firmness of the greens, the speed of the greens, and the fact that the pins are tucked just over ridges, they’re tucked on the corner, and suddenly you’ve gone from aiming at a flag that’s in the middle of the green, and there’s a bit of leeway on both sides to a flag tucked front left with water on the left or a big slope that’s dead. And you have to be able to execute that shot in a left to right wind or into the wind. Like, it’s just this layer upon layer upon layer. And then you have to keep executing it hole after hole for 18 holes, for 72 holes in a row and dealing with all this other stuff of the travel um and all the outside influences and the variables. Like it’s it looks so easy and that’s what’s as as obviously as a player watching someone like Scotty, I came away sort of inspired because he made it look so easy. I’m like, well, all I’ve got to do is this, this, this, which is, you know, kind of what I do do, but he made it look so easy. It’s like, well, it has to be attainable. Um, but then you go and practice and you go back to the next tournament and you know, you don’t shoot those scores. It’s like, huh, it is pretty tough. But the he the way he and many of the top guys are going about it, they’re, you know, they they’re just reaching a level that is is incredible. and more and more poor people, you know, the level of um golfers coming through from college golfers. You look at them now and they’ve had they’ve had four years in college or even five some of them where they are training just like a tour pro but they don’t have all the outside variables to have to deal with that pulls them away from that. You know, their coach is managing the travel, managing the coaching coming in, the workload, the training load. So all they do is just turn up to the gym, they turn up to practice and it’s all laid out for them, it builds brilliant habits and routines and once you do that for four years and then you kind of go out on your own and you have your team and it might not be the same team that you had in college because of funds etc. But it just changes. Um, and you see that coming through and I think that’s, you know, Scott is sort of the first one maybe that’s come through that program where the level of coaching and technology in in the coaching system was there. Like certainly when I was in college, we didn’t have that level of of information. Now they have everything. And it’s it’s incredible to watch the younger guys coming through that, you know, they’re ready to go. kind of digressing there a little bit, but um you know, it’s just funny how it all kind of leads into, you know, Scottish Heffler being the number one in the world, reaching this level that is is incredible and um sort of all inspiring to watch. This episode is brought to you by the Lockhart Travel Club. We believe golf is more than a game. It’s a journey. A journey we’ve made across 34 of the world’s top 100 courses last year. And now it’s your turn. We create bespoke travel experiences for passionate golfers who expect nothing but the best. Membership is limited. So join us at lockerttravelclub.com. Well, let’s pick up on that. So we we talked about this layering. So you go from like local club level county golf to national open championships to college golf PGA tour events majors, but the stage at the RDER Cup is it’s like nothing else. So you you were a seasoned professional when you played in the RDER Cup. Is it it was 2008. So you went in as a RDER Cup rookie. I mean it’s the who’s who. I mean this is like almost the the the golden age of I mean we’re still kind of in it with the the European team, aren’t we? But I mean you had Harrington, Garcia, Westwood, Stenson, uh, Imminis, McDow, Rose, uh, Hansen, Poulter, Casey, uh, and Carlson. Like, I mean, those are those are staples of the European team for for many, many years now. Um, didn’t come out as victorious in the end as a team, but just give us an idea of, you know, you talked about playing in the majors. Is is it is it just a different level again beyond the majors when you get to a Ryder Cup? Yeah, it’s kind of it’s it’s almost like a layer to the side because it’s a completely different animal. Like it’s not an individual thing at all. Um and I always feel like for me when I qualified I was one of the younger I was probably the youngest on the team I think. Um and I knew I had to qualify to get on the team. I was never getting a pick. Um which you know is understandable. Um I think I was only my it was my fourth year as a pro. So you know still kind of played a few majors but not a lot. Hadn’t had a lot of experience in the US outside of college and yeah few majors. Um but the level is different just because of the intensity and you have to it’s definitely a week where you need to be feeling good about your game. Like if you go into it struggling, you know, if you’re one of the players that has qualified early and then kind of struggled and you go in and you might have lost some form, it’s a really hard place to go to. Fortunately, um, fortunately, I wasn’t that in that position and I played well and I I qualified at the end strong, built a lot of confidence. Um, and so it was it was something it was more mental than anything just getting to understand what it was going to be like, especially on American soil. The intensity, the the amount of eyeballs on you in person on TV, like you realize and kind of back to what I was saying about the how the open had grown so much in that space of time, the RDER Cup was like even bigger. Like there was so much um interest in it from a global perspective. Um, so it’s a completely different layer, but you know, you have to be able to break that down to go, well, yes, this is the sort of outside looking in aspect, but I need to be able to pull back and just go, look, it’s golf. We’ve got to just execute one shot at a time. Um, and that’s what we do as golfers. You know, we have to learn to be able to do that in whatever environment, whatever um level of tournament it is. But for me to qualify on that team of um the sort of the European legends was pretty special because I’d grown up watching half of the team on on the European tour as a kid. Um you know and it was like you said it was just a staple thing to see Gimenez and Westy and Harrington in contention winning tournaments. Um so to get on a team with them um was really special. And Westwood obviously is from Nottingham as well, so he’s from half an hour away. He was somebody had been a role model for years. I cadded for him actually when I was 10. He was the he was the county cap. Yeah, he was the county captain and uh I was the um on the junior team. I was number one. So I got to caddy for him and he was brilliant. Um gave him a dodgy club. He he listened to me. I gave him a dodgy club and then I’d lost my privileges after that. But it was it’s always fun to to look back on that and there’s been a connection there and he was one of the players that reached out straight away to congratulate me and give me a bit of a heads up of what to expect and basically like you know what you thinking it’s going to be like well multiply it by 10. And so that’s kind of what I did. You know I like thinking about the first t-shot. How intense could this first t-shot be? And so I kept building it up into something that you know I could only kind of dream of. And then when I got there it actually worked. Like I felt pretty comfortable, but the energy was insane. Like the hairs on your arms are stood up. You there’s so much nervous energy, but it’s it’s just like pure excitement. Um and definitely it’s where you want to be as a professional golfer. Like it’s it is the ultimate. Um but you know, I So let’s get into that a little bit. So like on a Friday, so uh the the captain of your team basically comes to you and says so Faldo comes to you and says right we’re not putting you out Friday. Is there almost like a despite the fact that you’re like I’m here I want to be part of it. I’m showing good form like let me at them. Is there a side of you where you’re kind of like oh good. Oh oh oh no. Oh, no, no, no. Like what? That being being pleased does not get in. Yeah, that he’s like we’re gonna play. I was gutted. Yeah, I was gutted. Um, but I guess that again, it goes to the point of like where you are with your game like um but you know, I was a rookie and there’s so much experience on that team. You kind of expect, okay, I’m probably not going to go out first thing, you know, Friday morning in the foroms. Friday morning. Um, yeah. But you kind of hope, well, hope maybe. Um, but it didn’t happen. So, I actually sat out all the all of Friday, which I was gutted about. Yeah. But, you know, it’s it’s a team and you kind of understand and I was kind of getting the vibe that I probably wouldn’t play um Saturday morning either. Um, really, but yeah. Yeah. Just, you know, there was a lot of experience. Um, Faldo probably didn’t have quite as much belief in me as I had in myself. Um, and but I was very fortunate in that Henrik Stenson, me and Henrik had the same coach at the time, knew each other well. Um, Henrik had played with Paul Casey on the Friday and their games didn’t really match like strategically how they see it didn’t really match. It wasn’t a great pairing. Um, and so Henrik actually reached out to Faldo and said, “Look, I want to play with Ollie Friday morning. We’ll get the job done.” So he told me that and we went in. So I’m like, I’m so excited. Um and uh you know got this all this plan. So Saturday morning forsomes just to set up the scene. Saturday morning forsomes you and Stanson are taking on Phil Mickelson and Anthony Kim. Yeah. So at Valhalla the clubhouse is on top of the hill. You walk out and all you can hear is noise and chanting and you walk down to the range and you’re like now you’re halfway between the clubhouse and the first tea and it’s getting louder and there’s more people. Then you go down a bit further to putting green and then you get to the first TE which is just insane. And that is my first T-shot and Henrik’s you’ve gone through the course. I’m going to be hitting the first T-shot. So I’m pumped. Like you can’t in my opinion you can’t shy away from that. Like that is one of the best things to be able to said you’ve done in golf. Um but then you get on the tea and you’re like, “Oh, okay. I understand. Careful what you ask for.” But but then I al almost feel like it’s such an intense thing and if you look at it over the years, you think back to some of the T-shots at Glenn Eagles, um it’s like well actually it doesn’t matter where I hit this cuz it’s so people are so used to um seeing bad shots um and sending it all over the place. It’s like actually there’s not much pressure on here so I could just hit it is kind of how I thought it and I I flushed this thing down the middle. Like I I couldn’t have hit a better T-shot which felt pretty good at the time. Um after that we were four down through six. So it was like oh no like this is not you know Henrik’s kind of vouched for me. We we were playing nicely. We were level through six and they were four under in foromes around Valhalla. So, it’s not like we’ve done anything wrong, but they got off to a hot start. And uh we were going down the I think it was the sixth fairway, seventh fairway, maybe the par five. And uh we were like, “Okay, we need we need to rethink this.” And we kind of made a plan like look, Mickelson’s amazing, but he is going to hit one or two dodgy shots, and in foroms, that’s probably going to uh end up in a in a bogey. So, if we win those holes and we’ll make two other birdies, that gets us to level and then we just got to hope they don’t make any more so we can get back in this. And we did it. We we birded the par fives. We made a couple of other birdies, I think. And we didn’t make any I don’t think we dropped any shots and uh come on to 17th green and uh had about a 25 footer up the hill. I’d not hold anything all day. We’d had loads of chances and not hold anything. and uh this uphill left to right 25 foot about a foot of break on and I hit it and it was in all the way and as it’s gone in you could just see it I’ve gone mental and as it’s gone in I’ve looked up to celebrate and I’ve looked straight at Mickelson in the eyes like completely by accident and he was like a bit shell shocked he I don’t think he could believe I’d hold it um and they’d obviously gone from being four up to losing um always remember that and then just fell celebrating with with everybody on the green was was pretty special. Um I mean that was interesting when you you guys took that morning session so two and a half points to one and a half points. So that was like part of the push back really because you were you were a bit behind after the uh the opening day. Yeah, I mean if you look at the overall score um I think we did we lose by four in the end. Uh yes. So yeah, that’s it. Um so yeah, you weren’t far off really. Um but we were it was it looks on paper that we actually five it looks on paper that we got hammered but actually there was a time in the Sunday afternoon in the singles that it was really tight like it was actually on um and then I think they just p just I guess they just pipped us to the line and then the games after that kind of flipped and we ended up losing those games I think is how it worked out. But it was a shame. I felt like we just basically got the pairings wrong um the first day. um if we’d have got those pairings a little different, I feel like we would have had a better chance, but you know, that’s that’s kind of part of it. You don’t know for sure. At the end of the day, you got to play good golf. Um doesn’t matter the pairings, but um it can it can help. But just going back to like the the Stenson thing for me I I I feel like the reason that the level of golf in the Ryder Cup is so high and you don’t see that level of golf that much outside of the Ryder Cup especially you think back to like that Rory and Reed stretch was just phenomenal but like that stuff generally doesn’t happen but the Ryder Cup in the pairings the four and four four balls you have a partner that is you know probably top 20 in the world. You have such confidence and belief in your partner, it almost takes a bit of pressure off you, but you’re both thinking the same thing. Same thing. So, you’re feeling so good and you’ve got then you got a team behind you who’s got major champions in and you’ve been watching win points in the RDER Cup, win tournaments all over the world for years. You feel like even though the other team is incredible, like you feel like you’re surrounded by heroes and they’ll get the job done anyway. So it almost takes a bit of pressure off you. Um, you know, you obviously got to perform, but it that’s that’s to me what’s what makes it so special. You have this camaraderie with all your players and your your friends and people you’re competing against week in week out, but you have also have such respect for them and know how good they are. Um, I think it just helps reach this another level which is so much fun. Um, and yeah, and and that’s always a question I’ve absolutely uh that’s always a question I’ve had is like how it it seems like on the biggest stages the biggest like and the best come to shine. Um but but it must just be that rising tide that you find a way to ride it as opposed to get sunk by it. I think so. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I get that kind of goes back to my point of if you’re low on confidence a little bit heading into it, I think it can be hard. But you can also use that um but like when you look at the um say for instance the European team going to ride going to America. So when I was in Valhalla there was such noise and obviously I played against Boo in the singles which was really cool. I was going to the time when he would Did he ride his golf club? Was that the time? Yeah, that was that was me when he wrote he he famously rode his driver off the first tea. I I didn’t even know until I got home on the Monday and everyone was giving him some grief about it and I then I looked it up on video and on on TV and was like, “All right.” Like, but he’s he’s a great guy. He was just having fun. Um Kentucky Derby and all that. So, um, yeah, but you know, there was a lot of people, um, obviously booing and just it was just noise and it they’re not necessarily being it’s not a lot of it is personal against you. They’re just pulling for their player, which is fine and you can feed off that because it’s just noise and energy. I do worry about this one at Beth Page because that is going to get personal and so it’s the noise will be so much more intense than it’s been ever. Um, so I had to worry about Do you think this is is this is it a New York thing? Because look, New Yorkers have a reputation. Uh, they’ve got a reputation for being vocal at the best of times. Um, and it’s not something that they shy away from. Um, I don’t think there’ll be a lot of golf claps at the Ryder Cup in New York with Beth Page. Um, but the I mean I I heard some Rory was talking about it, I believe. Uh, and he was talking about um um the fact that you you should be able to try and challenge it. And I think he was speaking about Jovoic. Uh it’s like playing against say Nadal or Federer where in those moments you kind of know that the crowd’s not going to be on your side uh because you’re not the favorite, but then that’s also what he used as like basically motivation or fuel to kind of get it across the line. The interesting thing about that though is is there a tipping point where people can just be so vulgar, um, intense, spiteful that that that they are trying to cross a line just to get you off your game. I think it’s a combination. I think it’s it’s a bit of be careful what you wish for. You know, we’ve been trying to grow the game for, you know, this this sort of grow the game vibe for a long time. Um, but what’s special about the golf fans in general is they know that line and you can pull against somebody all you want and that’s totally fine and the players will use that to feed off on on either side. They’ll use that energy. Um, but we’ve been trying to bring people from outside of golf into golf. We have stuff tournaments like the waste management in Phoenix. We’ve seen some of the live stuff where they, you know, encouraging this almost football mentality in the crowds and then you throw in the New York crowd which are, as you said, renowned for being um brush. Let’s go with brush. Um and then you also the social media aspect of where people like getting on camera and being shown to do stuff that’s a bit different and standing out. I think you bring that all together in the RDER Cup in the Northeast. I don’t see how anyway it doesn’t go over the line. I hope it doesn’t, but I just think it will get personal. There’ll be people shouting on people’s back swing and that’s when it’s too much. Like that’s not fair, not right at all. The only good thing is is generally there’ll be so much noise that it I I I feel like you might not get the silence that you normally would get in golf. might be just more of an ongoing noise, which is actually probably better because there’s no sudden shouting or anything or movements like that. So, you know, I I’m hopeful that it’ll be okay, but I’m excited to be inside the ropes. I’m going to be commentating that week, so I’ll be inside the ropes and and and won’t be getting any grief myself. But to experience it and see what it’s going to be like will be fascinating. Um, but I do worry um that it’s going to go that it’s going to cross the line. But hopefully, you know, there’s enough golf fans there that are in it for, you know, just to be enjoying that atmosphere. And obviously the ticket prices are pretty high that, you know, tends to help a little bit, but at the same time, American ticket prices are extortionate anyway, so maybe not. But yeah, and there’s so much there’s a lot of things going into it. Yeah. That that it’s going to be an interesting thing to watch. I mean, I can’t wait. My my wife is uh she she’s she is a golfer, but she’s not like die hard. But honestly, every time the Ryder Cup’s on, she was like, “Right, we are when is the Ryder Cup this year? We’re not going anywhere or we’re going to go somewhere and we’re just going to watch that.” And she’s not she just loves the the box office element of it because it always always produces. Um so, let’s get into it. Um one question I wanted to ask, you talked about Faldo maybe not getting obviously as things have progressed and moved on. Um Luke Donald got like his praises were sung uh with basically leaving no rock unturned. Now is that is that actually a thing or is it I I just find it hard with with the the scale of the tournament, the enormity of it. Um it would seem like it would be impossible to be a captain of the RDER Cup, have two years to plan for it and not look at every eventuality or are there just some captains who are like, “Well, boys, we’ll we’ll do the pairings on Thursday night. We’ll see how we get on.” Um where he seems like he’s taking a different approach. I don’t I don’t know maybe if he follows way of doing things to Luke’s. I’m not sure if you have that insight but or how much you want to say. Um I I would say there’s quite a bit of difference between the ’08 approach. I mean if you think about the previous Rder Cups to to mine in 2008, there was this kind of building of a of a plan of how we can yeah check off everything, make sure we’re as prepared as possible and it had been working. Um and that goes from pairings you know statistics start to come into it. Um a whole aspect of stuff is understand chatting to the players beforehand to understand well which players do they really like? Who do they want to play with? Who do they not feel like they’re the right pairings to be with? And figuring that out beforehand. All basic stuff really. It’s not like rocket science. Um, and we were building something within the European team and and you know when Faldo did it, he kind of went away from that. I think he wanted to do it more his own way and was much more casual about that. But I think that’s where almost like manpower comes in a little bit. There’s there is a lot to do. Um there’s obviously a massive team behind the captain to be able to action most of that. But when you look at um how you know the pairing, you know, I never had a conversation with Nick before the tournament to say who do I want to play with, who I don’t want to play with. Just stuff like that. You know, what golf ball am I using? What golf ball are they using? Like that doesn’t work. You know, that’s not going to work if someone’s using something other than my Callaway. it it’s it’s something that one player’s got to adjust to which quite often they don’t want to and which is fine. So you look at that how it was done then and then you look since then it was almost like a real wakeup call to hang on we were building this we need to keep doing what we were doing and they went all in and Mcinley was obviously the first one to kind of push even further and bring every aspect of it in. And Luke’s just continued that trait with his own elements of being a former world number one like an amazing player. He’s brought everything that he’s learned all the experience of being on the teams. what what do we need to look out for? You know, what are the are there any young players that need to be, you know, personality types, you know, like doing full-on workups on on sort of psychological profiles, like what does that player need to excel? What does he need to excel? Who fits where? Like, so they’ve got their own opinions. Then they’re going to interview and and ask everybody how that all matches. And basically, they’re getting out a an answer at the end of it. Go, well, this is what the stats are saying. and everyone else is saying and it all kind of lines up. Um, and then there’s backup plans and you know there’s all kinds of stuff going on. And then how do we set up the golf course? You know, what do we need to be doing? What do we need to be working on for this golf course? What do the players need to be working on prior to get ready for Beth Page? What is Beth Page? What are the questions Beth Page is going to ask? Um, and but doing all that so the players don’t even have to worry about it. It’s just like, well, look, this is we’ll talk it through. Yeah, great. And then also like going back to the personality profiling is, you know, as a Rory, what does Rory need? You know, he’s the our number one like he’s our stalwart. He he needs to be leading the team out because that’s where he thrives. He, you know, if you put him in the middle of the pack, it’s kind of the level he’s achieved. It’s kind of devaluing him a little bit. Now, it might be the best thing for the team, and if it is, and it’s sold that way, he’d be all over it. But at the same time, he knows he wants to be number one. Yeah. And there’s a lot of guys do on any team sport. It’s almost like the, you know, loads of people want to be QB, but they uh they don’t don’t have the option because the best player is going to be it be the QB. So, it’s kind of that dynamic, understanding each player, making sure everything is ticked off. Um, and even down to, you know, the families and the wives, make sure they’re all looked after properly. you’ve got your whole team there. Again, back in the day, I can’t remember exactly how long, but you know, there was only you might only be able to bring your coach and you you have your caddy in your coach. Nowadays, every player’s got a team of four, five, six people. Well, they’re all coming because you want that player to feel like whatever they need, whatever they would want if they’re going to turn up to the open with a team or any mage or any big tournament. Well, they need to be at that same, you know, the team need to be there for the Ryder Cup, physio, you know, whatever it is. Um, and I just think that’s what they’ve done. They’ve just gone into ultimate depth. Certainly from a statistics point of view, from um leading into picking the teams, really doing a deep dive there. Obviously, you’ve got the qualifiers. Um, but on from that, like who who do we need? Like, if there’s a player that’s just on the outskirts, but his game just looks like it’s tailor made for the the C the Beth Paige for this year, then he that player needs to be on the team. Um, and then that becomes a balance between all right, we’ve got to decide somebody who’s sort of in those top 12 spots or do we pick someone from outside of it? But, um, there there is a lot to go into it, but again, like you said, you’ve got two years to do it. um and a whole team behind you. So, it’s just kind of putting those things in plan over the last decade or so. The European team have certainly been building something and it’s almost like right, well, pass this on to the next captain. Unfortunately for Luke, he’s he was the pre previous one, so he’s already got all that info and they’re just trying to make the same kind of system work for Beth Page with some tweaks because obviously it’s a different task, a different different um course and different questions will be asked, right? So you knew this was coming um early. So top who’s who’s going to take it? That’s the easiest way to just come out and say it. Who who I I don’t even know. I think uh we’ve got a uh a resident we’ve got one of my mates is an odds maker for the bookies. Um and he would say that the I think he said last time I spoke with him which was last week that the odds makers are putting it at a very slight advantage for the Americans. Um so not much in it at the moment. Um what’s the what’s the word on the street uh from the from the players side of things? How is how’s everybody feeling about it? I mean at the end of the day it’s match play. So you can put all this planning into it and if the guys just don’t play that well, like you lose, you know, that’s it’s that simple. Like it’s quite demoralizing when you break it down like that for all the water that goes into it. But at the same time, you can give better um chances by doing all this stuff. I think the major thing is our team is very settled. They’re very very confident um and they’re very used to being in America, which is all great signs for us. The US team is a great team. It’s less intimidating on paper than it’s probably been in a long time. Doesn’t mean to say they’re not great players, but actually being the intimidation factor is not quite there. Um, but they’ve got the fans, they’ve got, you know, a course that most of them know, although probably it’s probably pretty even between knowing I think the Europeans obviously they’re on a a trip right now. They’ve flown out there and um they’re going to be out there the week the week before just getting to know the course. Um, so I have the European team winning by like a point. Like it’s going to be tight. I I think it’ll be so so tight. It it can go either way. I’d be highly surprised if it was a you know, a white wash on any any direction. Um, but you you know, you’ve got to go with the home advantage in the Northeast. I mean, that would be a tough place to go. So my heart says the Europe, but my my head also I think I think um I’m just going to edge it with with the European team. But either way, it’s going to be awesome contest. I’m very much it. So if we want to uh if we want to listen to to more of your doulit tones, uh it’s Radio 5 Alive. Is that the Five Live? Yeah, Five Live. And it might be on Five Live Extra. I’m not sure exactly the programming. Um, but we’ll be there all week inside the ropes. I’ll be honest with this is my top tip. Sometimes, and this is nothing against the sky broadcasters. Um, but sometimes I will listen to Radio 5 and watch it on the telly. Um, sometimes it always doesn’t match up, but uh, there’s definitely Yeah, there’s there’s a lot of lot of people like to do that. The Five Live team are fantastic. They’re they’re so good at it. just finding the right the right note, a little bit of humor in there, but the the big moments they they paint with such color. It’s it’s tremendous to listen to. Even when you’re there in person, just to listen to, you know, Ian Carter describe it or something is is fantastic. So, they’re a good team. I enjoy working with them. Yeah. No, we’re looking forward to that. So, but we don’t want to take too much of your time. Maybe what we could do is uh just end on a little bit. Um we’d like to know a little bit about what you’re what you’re up to at the minute. Obviously, you’re doing some commentary for BBC at big events like the RDER Cup. Uh but dayto-day, uh how much playing is getting done? And I think you’ve got some stuff on with, uh is it true Lynxswear? That’s right. True. True Lynxwear. Yeah. Um yeah, I’m still playing. I my I lost my card last year, um after a broken ankle earlier in the season, which didn’t help, but I I ended up losing it. And I made the decision this year with traveling so much that I’ve got a young family. I was not going to play quite as much this year. Um I wasn’t going to chase trying to get it back on the challenge tour. I was going to just kind of work on my game, try and if I played well then great. Um but if I didn’t I was going to just sort of focus on Q school at the end of the year which is kind of where I’m at. So I’ve got uh I’m going to commentate the RDER Cup. I’m going to go to the Dunhill after that because I’m exempt into there and then it’ll be Q school on both sides of the pond. So we’ll we’ll go and see where where that takes me. But my game’s been decent and we’re still working away. But at the same time, I’ve uh you know, I partnered with True Links where in the UK, brought them over a couple years ago. Uh for the people that don’t know, it’s a golf shoe and apparel brand, but mainly golf shoes um with, you know, very unique, the only um golf shoe company that actually make a foot a shoe that is complements your foot is a very natural. It allows your toes to work properly. work allows your foot to strengthen and mobilize and and is probably the best blend of uh walking performance and health and golf golf swing performance. Um so the more you wear our shoes, the better your feet actually work as opposed to being cramped and and kind of crushing your toes and hence why so many people get problems with, you know, with their feet over time. I I went down that route and had to uh investigate to try and find a shoe that didn’t hurt my feet after the round and found true links where seven or eight years ago and it’s been tremendous. I felt like I needed to share that story with people. So, we’ve been growing in the last couple years and yeah, things are going really well. So, I’ve been enjoying that side um trying to grow that as an ambassador and a partner in the UK. Brilliant. Oh, it’s great to hear. So, we’re looking very much forward to the the Rder Cup. Thank you so much for sharing um a little bit about your background, what you’re up to now, insight into the mindset of what it means to be a Ryder Cup player uh to play golf at such a high level. Uh I think my takeaway from this is just simply the fact that how you reframe things so well uh instead of being intimidated by the moment uh embracing it and reframing it so that you can get on top of it and stand on it as opposed to being overwhelmed by it. So, if that’s a little bit that I can take to my next, uh, you know, uh, match that I have at the local club, uh, playing for drinks after the round, then maybe that’s it. But, hey, for all of us, no matter where we play, um, is always a way to improve. Just a matter of perspective, basically, work on your game and and just be positive and kind of reframe things as best you can. Give yourself the best chance, and sky’s the limit, really. We’ll let you get on to that. Thank you so much for your time and uh we’ll catch up soon. Thanks Jasper. Enjoyed it. [Music]
